Does anyone else not care about all this flu hype by the media?

[Selwynn]

I went to browse my RSS news headline feeds this morning and it was the same as it has been for about a week or more now - stories about the flu were 2 to 1 to stories about Iraq or the elections or the economy.

What, did the flu suddenly appear on the face of the earth this year for the first time?

I don't remember there being all this hysteria over flu shots when I was a kid - this to me seems to be a recent fad, but now the media acts like we're in the words medical crisis of the 21st century.

I've never had a flu shot. Growing up (and I'm not that old, so just a couple decades ago) we never heard about "flu vaccines." Avoiding the flu was something you did by common sense - wash your hands regularly, be polite when you sneeze or cough, keep a good distance from those who are infected.

I guess what I'm saying is that I'm really sick and tired of hearing about the flu when so many other important things are going on. It feels like a weapon of mass distraction RIGHT when we are coming to one of the most CRITICAL times in our country's history - the 2004 election.

If I'm being overly insensitive I apologize and please feel free to educate me, but I've never really thought flu shots were really that big of a deal, and the flu's been around for a long time. Does it really deserve a media blitz?

[Texasgal]

1. One word.....

NO.

[Selwynn]

4. No what - no you don't care, or no I should care?

[Texasgal]

12. You didn't ask me if I cared....

You asked : " Does it really deserve a media blitz? "

I say No.

[Selwynn]

13. Gotcha!

I was confused. :P

[Texasgal]

15. Not bad for a newbie, eh?

:P

[pauliedangerously]

31. Hey!!!!

Stop with the awesome food images...you're making my stomach growl.


:9

I say "no" too.

[XanaDUer]

2. It's taken on a new significance

Because it demonstrates just how nonready we are for a bioterrorist attack, and due to an aging population, just how vulnerable they are to dying from the 'flu.

This is big news to me. We need to keep the pressure on Chimp about this.

Many times Republicans don't care if it does not happen to them. The 'flu could potentially harm them.

[Selwynn]

6. Understand I'm not saying "I don't care because it doesn't affect me"

I'm saying that I didn't realize it was a big deal. I don't remember it being a big deal. In my life time the flu was never more serious than a nasty cold where you threw up a lot. I've had the flu more than once and it sucks, but its not the end of the world.

Now, I realize that I guess the biggest concern is over the elderly and weaker population -- maybe I was too young to remember that there were flu vaccinations and shortage problems and suck back in the day. But it seems to me like its kind of more a fad that has caught on lately as more americans have found something NEW to be afraid of....?

Again, its not that I don't care - its that I didn't realize it was a big deal...

[XanaDUer]

11. I know you did not say that.

Did not mean to suggest you don't care-I assume, as a Dem/Lib?progressive, of COURSE you care!

It is a big deal, though. While right wingers yammer on about "terrosism coming to our shores", something quite a bit more insidious and potentially dangerous, that comes around every year, was botched terribly by Bush and his minions.

It was no longer a big deal ('flu was a big deal in the past) because of modern health medicine and that our government's usually successful efforts to protect the public health worked.

Add on to it that Bush is 1) Blaming Clinton, 2)Blaming lack of tort reform , which is dumb because 'flu makers are not subject to lawsuits, 3)and is the perfect demonstration of the "free market" in health care causing a disaster, it needs to be paid attention to.

[Selwynn]

14. very interesting - thanks :)

[Dorian Gray]

27. I agree....

Never in my life have I gotten the flu vaccine, and I think I've only had it twice in my entire life. (That doesn't count the years that I was too young to remember.)

Anyhow, I understand that this is a dire problem for the elderly and for the very sick. (Particularly those with immunity deficiency diseases, like AIDS.) For them, it's deadly serious, and I am mad at all those people who are lining up, fighting for those shots. (My mother, at the beginning of the debacle, was at a Rite Aid in NJ when they were offering the shot. She got one (healthy 61 year old.) I yelled at her when she told me, as she's really healthy and rarely gets sick. But, she said that NOBODY was there to get the shot.

I just wish that everybody who was healthy would do the right thing. It frustrates me all the media attention that is dedicated to this story. It isn't warranted, and it's just scaring people (people who never get flu shots) into fighting to get their "fair share" of the flu shot.

[tblue37]

42. A lot of people do not realize that

flu killed more people in 1918 that WWI did in its entirety. The flu pandemic that years was the single most devastating pandemic ever.

We are due for another pandemic of a serious flu. Normal flu isn't that big a deal, because it kills "only" (!) 36,000 people a year in the US. Big number, but nothing compared to what a mutated flu or a particularly serious flu of even lesser magnitude could do.

Pigs can catch both avian flu and human flu. Thus the human flu can combine with avian flu traits in pigs and then carry those to humans. Severe respiratory ailments can kill quickly.

Think of SARS last year--a sudden acute respiratory illness that killed even healthy people within days, often despite the best medical care. In fact, the doctor who first identified SARS died of it himself.

A particularly virulent flu is way overdue by now, and with modern travel what it is, it would spread rapidly to all parts of the globe.

The flu vaccine won't protect us from a new mutation, though it might lessen the severity of the disease. But if the variety that goes around in any given year is one of the varieties the vaccine is tailored for, then those who get the vaccine won't get the flu.

There is a lot of guesswork involved in the vaccine, but it does provide some protection under some circumstances, and a lot of protection under other circumstances. If 36,000 people die in the US in a normal flu year, can you imagine what sort of death rate a bad flu year would produce, especially without vaccine, and what a particularly virulent virus, like the one that caused the 1918 pandemic, would do?

It is just a matter of time before a really nasty flu gets loose. In the meantime, the best we can do is vaccinate against the known versions of the flu virus.

The total disarray of the vaccination process this year is evidence that if we ever did have a real bioterrorism atatck, we would be royally screwed.

[AngryAmish]

67. Read the post above

People say "I never get the flu". Wrong. You are just lucky.

Everyone who says they don't think the flu is a big deal is wrong, ignorant and foolish.

[Strelnikov_]

56. INFLUENZA Is A Respiratory Illness That Even In Healthy People

will lay them out for one to three weeks. It is a fairly serious illness that kills 36,000 per year and results in 200,000 hospital admissions.

So, I guess that if you think that government incompetence that places millions of our fellow citizens at risk is 'hype', so be it.

For myself, I think the 'flu vaccine' story resonates a hell of a lot more with the general public as one of the Boosh admin failings than a lot of the crap hyped here on DU.

[dorktv]

3. I am immune from the flu so I do not care.

I could see making sure those who would die from it getting shots but not the rest of us.

[tblue37]

44. How are you immune from the flu?

And how would you know if you were?

If it's that you have never had the flu, that is no guarantee you won't get it. Maybe you've never been exposed to it because people you have come into contact with have been vaccinated.

If you had some sort of magical antural immunity to this killer virus 9and its innumerable mutatiosn), you would probably be used to study natural immunity in order to develop treatments for flu.

[DuctapeFatwa]

5. I've been following the story, it's definitely interesting

I'm not sure what the motivation is, well, rich men want more money, but what the auxillary goals are, I guess we won't know till the flu season gets underway.

[aden_nak]

7. It's bad for Bush, which I like.

But I never get a flu shot. I always end up getting the flu anyhow, and that's after feeling like shit for two weeks after I get the flu shot.

Besides, I've already HAD the flu this season. I actually got it on the same day that they warned of the shot shortage.

[htuttle]

8. Well, I'm concerned about it

I work in the taxi industry, and we normally set up free flu shots for all our drivers. This year, we had to cancel it because we can't get any vaccine.

I can guarantee that as a result we will have dozens of sick drivers this winter (thanks to sick passengers). And as a result, those drivers will get a LOT of other passengers sick.

There are a lot of people who normally get the flu shot not because they are more vulnerable to the flu, but because they act as a disease vector due to their job (taxi drivers, school teachers, etc...). None of those people can get shots this year, so the flu is going to spread much quicker and farther than in recent years.

[Selwynn]

10. Thanks for the perspective!

[candy]

20. There are those that call a heavy cold the flu---

I worked with people who would use anything as an excuse to stay home sick. The flu sounds more serious than a plain old cold.

The flu shot hysteria in the media is driving me nuts.

[htuttle]

21. In our business, if you don't go to work, you don't get paid

...So drivers often work while sick and spread whatever they got to the general public. There's no need (and no point) to have an excuse to stay home sick.

That's why we usually provide the shots for free.

[legally blonde]

9. I think that it shows how crappy our health system is

but it probably doesn't deserve the media hype. Most people don't need a flu shot, so unless you are immuneo-compromised, elderly, or work in the health care industry, it's not that big of a deal if you don't get one. The most important thing to do to remain healthy, by getting enough sleep, exercising, taking vitamins, etc., and wash your hands frequently.

[DemBones DemBones]

29. Because YOU don't need a flu shot does not mean it's no big deal to ME!

I need a flu shot and can't get one.

I know terrorists could attack at any time. I don't worry much about it since there is next to nothing I can do about that.

The flu season is coming. Due to my medical situation, my doctor says I need the shots. Until this year, I've been able to get one, though it's always poorly managed, with my doctor never having enough vaccine for all his patients. I have had to go to a doc-in-a-box a couple of times for my annual shot. So far this year, I haven't been able to find a place where I can get one. My doctor was sent no vaccine this year, despite having many elderly and chronically ill patients.

Now I'm having to wonder if I'll get the flu and develop complications, requiring me to be hospitalized (200,000 are hospitalized in the U.S.every year, and that's in years when there's plenty of flu vaccine to protect the high risk population.) It's possible that I could even DIE ( 36,000 die per year, when there's planty of flu vaccine).

See what a big deal it is when you're in MY shoes and know the statistics on influenza morbidity and mortality?

Telling people who are already suffering from chronic illnesses to "remain healthy" isn't very helpful advice.

[donheld]

41. Welcome to DU

:hi:

to all of you/us
I suppose if any of us get the flu this year, and especially if anyone we know dies from it we'll care more

[stray cat]

16. My parents have a better chance of getting killed by the flu this year

than a terrorist attack.

[XanaDUer]

17. Exactly. And that is what we have to hammer home to Bush

supporters.

I have been. I told them, you have a better chance of winning a lottery, statistically, then being killed in a terrorist attack.

However, you have a pretty good chance of getting influenza.

They cannot argue with that.

[Dem2theMax]

51. BINGO! Now THAT should be the headline on every front page.

Think they'll bother to point that out? Yeah, and pigs fly. I know. I'm :crazy:

[BlueNomad]

18. It's never been a

big deal because our country in recent times has not been totally caught short of the vaccine. Last year we have 36,000 flu related deaths. That's alot of deaths and that's with folks getting vaccinated--mostly, high risk and teachers and health care providers who work with the young and infirmed. What you don't want is to have an outbreak that cannot be contained and certainly not with the health and teacher populations. I have never receive such a shot in my life but I am self -employed. We do however have a type one diabetic child who ahs yet to have his shot and yes he could die if a virulent flu struck.

I get the news attention and welcome it because as I have said for ten days, it underscores, the greed, stupidity and lack of foresight so rampant in our nation now. Leadership is completlely lacking. You have companies that are loathe to produce the vaccine because of the perceived paltry profits; you have extreme anti-government sentiments at play which make it easier and easier for health care and environmental regulations to get short shrift and you have a sort of have and have nots situation afoot as well.

[Eloriel]

19. I don't much care -- but then

I don't expect to GET the flu (haven't in years past) and I don't trust pharmaceutical drugs anyway, perhaps especially not vaccinations these days.

I do understand that there are vulnerable populations, and that the flu can be deadly to them especially, but I think anyone who's reasonably healthy and takes even normal precautions need not fear.

There are many natural remedies that can be helpful, and I personally always prefer that route over pharmaceuticals when at all possible.

The herb Echinacea ("ek-i-na-shah") -- Echinacea purpurea and/or augustifolia -- is a wonderful immune system booster, completely safe except for people who have auto-immune disorders, and widely available even in grocery and drug stores! It's something people can take daily for avoidance of problems, or take it if problems arise. Vitamins C, A, zinc, and others can be helpful too.

Colloidal Silver, available in most healthfood stores, is a wide-spectrum anti-microbial and I have had fabulous results with it when a cold or something is trying to happen. Oil of oregano and Olive Leaf are also supposedly good for some things but I don't have a lot of information or experience with either. Grapefruit seed extract is also a powerful anti-microbial (used especially for candida) which could be helpful. These are just the ones that come immediately to mind.

There are also many different herbs that can help with all sorts of concommitant problems (lung and sinus congestion, mucous, coughs, general whole-body tonics, etc.)

And oh, yes, homeopathic remedies, which I don't know much about except that I've taken them now and then (given to me by my chiropractor) with very good results and others who use them regularly swear by them.

I'm also a firm believer in assisting the body's elimination when illness threatens, as most alternative health practitioners advise. There's an herbal cleanser I wouldn't be without called "Experience" from the Awareness Corporation (you can google it). It helps clear toxins from cells, tissues, organs and intestines (much more than a laxative, but a laxative too). Excellent product, a little expensive but worth it IMO.

[GoldenOldie]

25. 1918 Flu Pandemic - 25 Million deaths world-wide

There was 500,000 deaths in the US alone with millions left with affects that would be revealed in later years.

It becomes an even greater threat as each flu season and with the new antibiotics, the bacteria adapts and changes so we might have an even more potent form of flu. Populations to include our military are continually on the move, therefore allowing even faster movement and spread than 1918. We have been fortunate that Influenza has been controlled through the immunization process but we must understand that it is there.

A good read is: Americas Forgotten Pandemic. The Influenza of 1918 by Elizabeth Ann Fenn

Notice that the DC crowd all received their immunizations?

[LosinIt]

47. Influenza is a virus, antibiotics work against bacteria

and as far as herbal and other holistic options, they may be fine against your run of the mill rhinovirus (a cold), but would do little but fatten the pockets of those who sell them if we experience another pandemic. It killed 25 million mostly because it spread so quickly because of WWI. Imagine what it could do with today's global travel. Wash your hands.

[diamond14]

22. some people just walk by the sick and dying....they don't SEE them

and don't care....you would have to actually care about people to take any interest....and many Americans are just cold hearted cruel..."walk on by" and pretend that this flu issue is really just some kind of media stuff....the FLU KILLS MILLIONS OF PEOPLE world-wide, every single year that YOU have been alive....

it's really cruel to "walk-on-by"....I cannot imagine how you can justify that in your conscience....

every single year, since 1968, the "average" number of hospitalizations are estimated at 142,000....over 36,000 Americans DIE every single year from the FLU.....and YOU likely know someone affected by the FLU and walked-on-by....no help from you....

seems that YOU are proud to write here on DU about your "walk-on-by" attitude, and majorly complain about "good samaritans" who are TRYING to get the word out about getting vaccinated....perhaps you'll live your whole life as a 'walk-on-by' person, until, one day, a disease/disability will affect YOU...guess what...90 % of all Americans will have the opportunity to actually suffer a disability (permanent or temporary) at some time in their lives, either through accidents, diseases, or old-age....there's a high probability that YOU will get to see OTHER people 'walk-on-by' as YOU suffer....and I hope you remember your cruel words here at that time....

[MacDo]

23. Somebody can have mine.

I'm really tired of having to get the Flu Shot every year. In the Military it's mandatory. Getting mine this week.

[NJmaverick]

24. I sat in a meeting with public health officials

THey had to decide who to give the flu vaccine to and who to turn away. The tough part was realizing that some of the people that they had to turn away would probably die. This vaccine shortage is a major issue. If you are elderly or of frail health, this vaccine is a life savior. It may not mean much to healthy adults other then missing some work and a week out of your life, but to the weaker people the flu can be a death sentence. Plus there is not enough to go around to cover the police, fire and EMS. What do we do when there is a fire and all the firemen are sick with the flu? How do we patrol the streets? How do we defend ourselves from terrorists? The Emergency service people are just the tip of the iceburg when you talk critical people that we can not afford to have out sick enmass just because they didn't get the flu shot.

[madfloridian]

26. It is a huge issue. Of course it is.

I can not believe you don't think so. I have no words.

[Bridget Burke]

28. I care.

I care that thousands die from the flu every year & it's accepted as "normal". I care that even more might die this year because of a shortage that could have been prevented.

Of course, those at risk are very old, very young or they already have health problems. So I can see why some people would not care--even at DU, unfortunately.

And, since one of Bush's main campaign points is that he'll "keep us safe"--I wonder why we aren't using this massive failure in the public health system against him.

(Note: Influenza is not that bad cold that goes around every winter. It is not the "stomach flu" either.)

[DemBones DemBones]

30. You use same talking points spouted at me by an ultra-RW fundy today

What's up with THAT?

Have you ever heard of the 1918 Global Influenza Pandemic? In the U.S. more people died from flu in that year than died in WWI and WWII combined.

Epidemiologists believe we're overdue for another flu event of great magnitude. If this year should happen to be the year for a particularly virulent influenza virus, coinciding with the vaccine shortage, we could again see mass deaths, quarantines, and a disruption of our lives as well as negative effects on the economy.

It's evidently never occurred to you that many people you come in contact with regularly each year have had flu shots and that helps protect *you* from being exposed to flu. You won't have that protection this year and many more people will be sick, unless we luck out and have an unusually light flu season.

Finally, it's not a weapon of mass distraction. People need to know about the flu vaccine situation and, ideally, to understand why the Bush* administration must take part of the blame for the crisis. They ignored warnings. Remember what happened in 2001 when they ignored warnings?

Go to http://www.winningargument.blogspot.com and get some talking points to
help you see why this should hurt Bush*. Seniors are already angry and this could take their votes away from Kerry. (Please don't tell me Kerry already has the senior vote because he doesn't have it all. I'd like him to increase his part of it.)

[Selwynn]

68. I'm just asking an honest question about a subject I don't know much about

...probably why it sounds like a right wing talking point.

It's funny how no one can even ask a question about here that deviates from the dogma without at least someone rushing in to respond like an ass.

[pauliedangerously]

32. HEY Selwynn...I AGREE WITH YOU

I've never had a flu shot either. I was a little kid in the late sixties and seventies. I don't think you're being overly sensitive to this sensationalism. Sure, it warrants discussion, but it's been over reported...IMO.

[DemBones DemBones]

60. Are you proud to be ignorant of the facts? Many reasonable voices in

this thread have explained why it is a big issue, and why this is an issue that can hurt Bush*. Perhaps you want Bush* to win? Perhaps you don't care if thousands die needlessly? Perhaps you just don't read carefully enough?

[Selwynn]

69. STOP CALLING EVERYONE WHO DISAGREES WITH YOU A FREEPER

That's basically what you've done now - twice. I post a question, so hey I'm using right-wing talking points. Another guy disagreed with you, hey he must WANT Bush to win.

Jesus, get over yourself.

[Susang]

33. It's important for a lot of reasons

One, we do not have a cure for influenza and complications from it (such as bacterial pneumonia) are a major killer (# 5, last time I checked the CDC stats). The people who will be most affected by this are the poor, as they no longer have access to affordable healthcare. Prevention could literally mean the difference between life or death to them, as it has been shown that people in that situation tend to wait until their illness has progressed far beyond simple treatments.

Second, if you recall, the baby boom generation is starting to enter their senior years. Who does the flu affect most? The very young and the very old. We have the largest segment of our population entering their "golden years" with absolutely no thought or plan as to how to manage their health care. This is inexcusable.

A third reason is asthma. I don't know if you're aware of this, but asthma is on the rise in every major city in the US. The flu is particularly damaging to people with respitory illnesses such as asthma, particularly children who have asthma. No vaccines means a greater chance of asthma sufferers, particularly poor asthma sufferers dying from their afflictions.

I've got quite a few more examples of why this is an important story, like our obvious lack of responsiveness to bioterrorism, the fact that no US company wanted to manufacture the vaccine, as it did not turn enough of a profit, and the fact that our government knew about this situation about six months ago and did nothing to prevent the current shortage.

[thanks jon]

34. flu shots equals life insurance

on the subjects of interest scale. Id rather dig a ditch than think about it. I never get a shot or the flu. Seems to get a lot of play on the local news though. you asked.

[sr_pacifica]

35. Flu is a killer and the uninsured and underinsured are going to be

getting into even more debt if they come down with it and then experience complications like pneumonia. So, yes, it is worth the media blitz because there are people I am sure who are going to die this year who perhaps would have gotten a shot if there were not a shortage. And the shortage is due to poor leadership in our government.

[Dilligent]

49. Flu Shots

I am new to posting but have been around for years. I just have a question. How is it the government's fault there isn't enough flu vaccine? The government doesn't make the vaccine nor do they buy it for the country,I don't think. It is all private companies that make it and distribute it,right? There evidently aren't enough companies that make it. Until we get universal health care I don't see how the government can do anything about it. Am I missing something?

[sr_pacifica]

50. Here is an excerpt from a WP article

It's not the best article on the subject, but one I could access the fastest. The whole article basically describes how flu vaccines are not a money-maker for pharmaceutical companies. And after describing the difficulties of making the vaccine and the woes of the drug companies, the article (finally) touches on possible solutions:

"But technology and science aren't the only things waiting to mature in the world of flu vaccine, experts said. So is social policy.

Gregory Poland, of the Mayo Clinic, favors a system of incentives: Vaccine makers would make a given number of doses of flu vaccine for the private market at their own risk; a given number for government purchase; and an additional amount that the government would agree to buy back at a specified price if there were unsold stocks at the end of the season.

Other experts agree that only some form of direct government incentive is likely to solve the problem of a small and vulnerable manufacturing base."

Full article:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A38776-2004Oct16_4.html

The shortage of flu vaccine has been a problem for many years. And when I mention lack of leadership, I mean this administration has done nothing to try to solve the problem.

[DemBones DemBones]

64. The government has responsibility for public health issues, like

preventing epidemics. They have plans drawn up and ready to herd us into stadiums and other large facilities if a quarantine becomes necessary due to a bioterrorism attack but aside from depriving us of civil liberties (potentially without it being necessary) have little else in mind.

[Kimber Scott]

36. It's all a ruse. nt

[DemBones DemBones]

63. Why don't you READ and INFORM yourself about what influenza can do?

I'm betting you've never had influenza, though I'm sure you've had other viruses. No comparison!

[ronabop]

37. Here's why it matters more than some people realize:

First of all, a flu outbreak can kill more people in one year than AIDS currently does.

That achy, tired, slight fever, congested, feel like crap sickness that knock you on you ass for a few days? That's *not* the flu. That's a cold.

Influenza leaves people bed-ridden, dehydrated, dangerously (brain damage danger) feverish, they can't keep food down, usually runs 1-3 *weeks* long, and kills all but the fairly healthy (or best kept for) of people.

It's a killer illness, and our medical system simply doesn't have enough hospital beds to handle a serious, national, outbreak.

Second of all, the mass vaccinations aren't just to stop weak individuals from getting it, they're to stop healthier individuals from *spreading* it.

If a perfectly healthy person is vaccinated, and they come in contact with the flu, the spread stops there. If they aren't vaccinated, not only are they now at risk, but so is everybody who comes in contact with them... vaccinating only the weakest people means that there may be less death, but there still can be a massive outbreak, massive illness, and major shutdowns of industry, transportation, etc.

Want to know what the folks in bio-terror stay awake at night thinking about? The superflu. Specifically, a fairly strong variant that hasn't been vaccinated against. It *is* a WMD, not a distraction.

-Bop

[Robeson]

38. THANK YOU

Thanks for a real post. Those who aren't worried, what, are you living on Neptune? Old people may - or may not - be able to get them this year, and some infants, or those with health conditions. But many of these won't even be able to get them.

I'm 40 years old, but have got one every year for 20 years. I may not be able to get one this year. Those like me may not be able to get one this year. It spreads geometrically people. If I get the flu, someone else will get the flu, and so on and so forth.

I heard an economist today talk about the potential impact on the economy alone, if the work force starts coming down with the flu 'en masse'. Think this is a joke? This is our country people.

And if all of this does not come to pass - at the very least - why would anyone on the board give this President a pass on an issue with less than 2 weeks before an election! Hell, we need to be wringing his neck with it.

Shew. Thats my two cents anyway. Now as bartcop says, I need to go take a shot of chinaco!

[LeftyMom]

39. It worries me

I'm worried that so many people are buying the hype about the flu vax.

99% of the elderly recover from the flu without hospitalization, whether they have had the flu vaccine or not.

Standing in a disease-ridden hospital corridor swapping germs with all the other old and sick people to avoid the flu is dumb. Scaring the shit out of old people for profit is fucking evil.

[ronabop]

45. 99% recover without hospitalization?

Scaring the shit out of old people for profit *is* evil.

Letting them die or suffer for weeks because it's politically inconvenient, or because people don't actually understand diseases, disease models and social resource drains, is much worse.

According to the CDC:
http://www.cdc.gov/flu/keyfacts.htm
200,000 (average) a year were hospitalized from '79-'01, *without our current vaccine shortages*. In 97-98, there were 430,960 people hospitalized. (http://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/qa/hospital.htm).

But hey, no skin off your ass if *only one percent* of those who are hospitalized (in those "disease ridden" corridors) die. (Two thousand people, using the average, not the peak). If the infection rate and hospitalization rate doubles (to four thousand people dead), no problem, right? If the hospital death ratess are a tiny bit larger (say, 2%, with twice the prior rates), and eight thousand people die, no biggie, don't worry, sure, a 12 dollar shot could have cut this, but that's life

Exactly how many people would have to die before you thought it was worth being concerned about? How many million people would have to be sick, and not working, before it was an issue?

How many people would count if it was *you* who had their life on the line?

-Bop

[REP]

48. Evil and Expensive

As I wrote in my post, not only is preventing the 'flu the right thing to do as it prevents misery and death, it's also the 'cheap' thing to do as vaccinating people costs a lot less than hospitalizing whatever percentage of the 200,000+ each who are either Medicaid or Medicare patients, or uninsured. It's the right thing to do even if it didn't cost less, but as is usually the case, the right thing is also the cost-efficient thing.

[sr_pacifica]

52. I can see drug companies making profits on antivirals

That will be what comes out of this vaccine shortage. More money for pharmaceuticals. The antiviral drugs will be pushed as the solution to our flu outbreaks.

[depakid]

58. Well, anti-virals ARE part of the solution

in fact, if we were smart, we'd be amping up production NOW, not just for the likelyhood of many more A strain cases, but because there's a very real possibility of a pandemic brewing in Southeast Asia as we speak.

http://www.who.int/csr/don/2004_09_28a/en/

Thus far, tamiflu is the only known treatment- and it has to be administered in the first 48 hours.... and there'll be no vaccine for that one anytime in the near future.

[sr_pacifica]

72. Right they are but my very suspicious mind wonders

if that's why Bush and Co. aren't too concerned about the vaccine shortage---his pharmaceutical pals will be enriching themselves with the anti-viral sales.

[ever_green]

40. I don't care either

I'm not getting a shot, I never have. I'm healthy. Anyways, there are more important issues to me.

[REP]

43. If It Doesn't Affect You, You Probably Don't Care

If you're young and healthy, getting the 'flu isn't that big a deal. To the chronically ill, the very young and the very old, the 'flu can kill. It's a virus, so antibiotics are useless against it; if it does lead to an opportunistic bacterial infection, such as pneumonia, it can be very hard to treat in someone who is very old/very young/chronically ill and weakened by a viral infection - not mention there are lot of antibiotic-resistant strains of pneumonia, and the pneumovax vaccine only protects against one strain.

Each year, something like 36,000 - 40,000 people in the US die of the 'flu, and more than 200,000 are hospitalized. This is the part that affects young, healthy folks - some of those 200,000 that are hospitalized are either Medicaid or Medicaid patients or have no insurance at all, which means we all pay, one way or the other. Keeping as many people as possible 'flu-free and out of the hospital isn't just the nice thing to do - it's the fiscally responsible thing as well.

[Selwynn]

71. Like I said up top, its not that it doesn't affect me

I expalined why I had questions within the first 10 posts, including explain that it has nothing to do with me not caring because it doesn't affect me.

[REP]

73. Rhetorical Device. Read My Post.

[ronabop]

46. Use a condom.

My last post in this thread, as some folks seem to think they're "healthy", and don't need a flu shot.... I find this totally baffling.

If you're healthy, you don't need to use a condom, because you can't possibly catch, and spread, HIV/AIDS.... (huh?)
If you're healthy, you don't need to use a condom, because if you get the clap, you can be cured...(er... yeah, but...)
If you're healthy, you don't need to use a condom, because you can survive your diseases... (uhm..)

...and if you're healthy, you don't need to use a condom, because even if you spread a disease, it's just plain not your problem anymore, it's somebody else's problem.

This is insane.

-Bop

[sr_pacifica]

53. All I can say is there's a lot of ignorance out there

Which I guess is understandable if you've never been seriously ill or know anybody with a chronic illness---why bother yourself with learning about disease and public health, right? I'd probably be as ignorant too, but I've had respiratory illness most of my life and understand how something as seemingly "benign" as the flu---and thank you for the description of a real bout of influenza as opposed to a cold---can disable a person and turn deadly.

[DemBones DemBones]

65. Well said, Bop!

:yourock:

[Jawja]

54. I care because it

demonstrates just how incompetent the * administration is and this is an issue that hits home with ALL Americans.

My 81 year old mother cannot get a flu shot. That matters.

If the media is talking about a shortage of a vaccine that we have taken for granted, they are NOT talking about issues that don't matter.

[depakid]

55. If you'd ever contracted influenza, you'd understand

why the story IS a big deal.

"The Flu," to use the diminutive, isn't given the respect it deserves by most people- they think it's just like a bad cold. Well, I'm here to tell you that it isn't.

I picked up a nasty A strain back in 98- at a time when I was 35 and in in top physical condition from obsessive mountain biking and weight training. My Ex got vaccinated- I didn't think I needed tp.

My sister came out for Christmas that and was exposed to influenza on the plane (of course, she didn't think she needed the vaccination either). On January 1st, I awoke with sweats, chills and dysphoria which soon erupted into a 104 fever, complete with migraine headaches, bone and joint aches that felt like I'd been beaten all over with a stick. The next day, I was delerious, and so weak I had to crawl to the bathroom. Then came the pulmonary involvement.

I could hardly breath- it felt like my lungs were on fire. I should have gone to the ER... but stubbornly wouldn't. It was ten days before I could get out of bed- and it wasn't until somewhere around mid-April that I finally got most of strength back. During that time, I developed a secondary bronchitis infection that had me coughing up phlem for weeks- walking pnuemonia it's called- and that didn't clear up until I finished a course of anti-biotics.

Influenza is nothing to make light of, believe me. If I'd been older or even in worse shape, I'd probably have died... I was so sick that that actually have been something of a relief.

And my ex? She didn't get so much as a sniffle.

Every year since, I've looked at the survellience reports from the Southern Hemisphere- and if they look iffy, I get my jab. I NEVER want to risk getting that again. This year, unfortunately, WHO has taken over (and trashed) the flunet site, so it's hard to figure out what's about to be coming our way (even then, of course, we can get taken by surprise- A Fujian hit like a ton of shit bricks last year... and it wasn't included as one of the components of the vaccine).

This year, it's much harder to find information on the incidence of the "normal" influenza strains, because everyone is so freaked out about the possibility of an H5N1 Avian influenza pandemic.

So this year, for better or worse, I'll be going bare- and I'm not at all pleased about it- and neither should you be. Playing the odds isn't very wise when the consequences can be so severe.

I hope you never have to find that out the hard way.

[Strelnikov_]

59. About The Same Story Here, Got My Dose '97

Changed my whole outlook on the 'flu'.

[DemBones DemBones]

62. I wish you'd repost this as a thread to inform people how bad

real influenza is. We live in an age when many call every cold "flu" and since everyone has had colds, these people foolishly dismiss flu as no real threat to them.

Influenza means fevers of 102-104 degrees, with accompanying hallucinations and chills, headache and muscle aches that won't quit. It means being so weak you're unable to do anything for yourself.

But you described it so well, why should I repeat?

[mmonk]

57. 36000 deaths a year & government disinterested carelessness

[ibegurpard]

61. Never had a flu shot and never will

Not unless they can guarantee that it will keep me from catching the flu.

[greekspeak]

66. Yes. It underscores yet another failing of ShrubCo, and it resonates well

with average people. My two cents on the flu virus situation are as follows. I am persuing a PhD at a state univeristy. I ALWAYS get a flu shot, or at least I have since last I got the flu. Now I am not able to get one. Why does this matter? I am almost assured of getting the flu. Why?

1) I am shut into poorly ventilated rooms filled to capacity for hours at a time. A breeding ground for flu

2) Because I am in a very demanding program, people whom I am around sacrifice their health for their work. So, they get sick much easier than others. This is especially true of one of my profs, who was sick at least 4 times last school year.

3) As a corrolary to the above situations, because of deadlines and attendance demands, people I am around come to school sick as dogs because they HAVE to. You just cannot miss a class if you do not want to get behind.

This is a recipe for disaster. I am not looking forward to it. Since two people have already been knocked down with flu this year, it is only a matter of time. A simple flue shot would take care of this. But no.

[Selwynn]

70. Thanks for the responses - I was asking about something I don't know..

..much about. Most of you were capable of just answering my question with good things to think about. Of course there are always a few who just feel the need to flame anyone who doesn't see something exactly their way.

For those of you who realized that I really don't know much about this subject, which is why I was ASKING the questions in the first place - thank you.

I must stay, I still believe that the media is over hyping this issue and that it serves as a distraction from things like Iraq, economy news (boy we didn't even hear about those jobs numbers for two days) and so on. But, I do understand a little more about the history of flu shots, etc. :)

Thanks, I'm out.