If Bush is elected, I'm not sure I want to live in this country.

[LZ1234]

My husband and I talked about moving to Canada but I don't know if we would be welcome there. It would be hard to live in this country with the kind of people who stand behind this incompetent, self-serving, arrogant leader. What kind of nation are we that supports this kind of leader? I would feel ashamed. I used to be proud to be an American - Bush and his administration took all that away. It's not the America I once knew.

[librechik]

1. lots of threads on this subject over the last few months

the natives are restless

Me? I like New Zealand, just in case.

[loudestchick]

2. I'm right there, too.

We have relatives in Portland...and I hear the western provinces are more temperate...my 10 yr old has asked if we'd REALLY move if * wins...my response is "if it's close we'll fight..if he runs away with it, who knows, I don't know if I'll be able to stomach 4 more years of *'s destructive policies.

[Bridget Burke]

3. Canadian Immigration....

Here's the official site. Valuable skills and/or money are needed.

www.cic.gc.ca/english/index.html

[JuniorPlankton]

4. Very true

Sigh

[qwlauren35]

5. If you leave...

you are less likely to help create change.

So, even though it's tempting to leave, I've worked too hard in this election not to believe that I have learned things which would help me do even more next time.

Less than 50% of the American people support President Bush. It was true in 2000, and it's true now.

You need to hold onto that truth. And if it doesn't get demonstrated in this election, then we have to think about how we can help people have voices to raise in protest.

[realFedUp]

6. My Republican mother says the same thing

It's not just Dems, Greens and Indies looking
at four more corrupt years of Bushites if "selected"
again.

[Burma Jones]

7. IF, and that's a big if, the Chimp stays in the White House......

It will be by the thinnest of margins and he will have a Democrat Senate to deal with. He will also have about half the population that HATES him with the sort of passion formerly only seen in Right Wing Loonies. We will have to start working like the Right Wing Loonies did back in the 60's and start building the base from which we will regain the clear majority.

Now, if there's the sort of shenanagans that occured in 2000, and I'm sure there will be, then we will have to really work to regain our democracy. This will include things like buying up media outlets, staging boycotts and protests, and perhaps even a General Strike by all Democrats.

[onenote]

8. I woke up feeling that way this morning too

Thinking that retiring to the islands and working in a scuba shop
would be better than sticking around here...

onenote

[metis]

9. Invest in Manitoba

http://www.gov.mb.ca/itm/invest/pnp-b/faq-pnp.html

[sinkingfeeling]

14. Why won't Canada allow US citizens to retire there? I have to

go all the way to Ireland and the Euro vs. dollar, is going to kill me!

[Carson]

10. Why don't we see Freepers posting this sort of message

on FreeRepublic? I scan that site ocassionally (yeah, I know, but I think it's heathly to know where evil lurks) and never have I seen "If Kerry wins, I'm gone."

One would think, with their rabid hatred of Liberals, one would see posts like that often.

Anyone have any guesses why?

Anyway, LZ, if the unthinkable happens, I'd hate to lose a Dem that would help us fight to regain our country, but I wouldn't fault you either.

[tanyev]

12. Where would they want to go?

Canada and Yerp are evil because they're so librul. :eyes:

[onenote]

13. france?

[tanyev]

16. Now you're evil!

:evilgrin:

[democratreformed]

20. I actually heard one say it. Kind of floored me. My reply was "Yeah,

many of us feel the same way about Bush getting re-elected".

[tanyev]

11. Been thinking about that, too.

Hubby is Canadian, so we could probably get in, but this Texas gal would have a really hard time dealing with the weather.

It's not so much a fear issue of what would they do if they got four more years. If that's all it were, we definitely need to stay and fight. I am just so profoundly disappointed that even after everything that has happened in the past 4 years that nearly 50% of my fellow Americans will vote for *. Even a lot of my friends and family, while admitting they don't agree with him on everything, are still leaning that way. How can you look at the record of the past 4 years and not be horrified??? Sometimes I feel like I don't belong.

(And then I come to DU for some fortification and go back out there fighting!)

[SudieJD]

15. I'd Rather Fight, Then Leave.

I'd second generation in this country. My Grandparents fought hard to come here, my grandmother and grandfather in a cattle boat from Hungary.

I could never push aside what they went through. I'm fight before I leave.

Sudie in MN

[democratreformed]

17. Won't you be proud to be from "the land of the invaders" and "home

of the conquerors"? It makes me sick to my stomach thinking about it.

[flobee1kenobi]

18. It might possibly.....

deter a few illegal immigrants if they see Ameircans hopping the Mexican border going in the opposite direction :-)

[democratreformed]

19. He he. Now, that WOULD be funny, wouldn't it? n/t

[Malva Zebrina]

21. Let's assume Bush is elected

how would anyone who stays and "fights" carry out this fight?

I don't want to sound negative, but take a look at how he and his gang have already trashed our rights. What makes anyone think they can do anything to him or his regime at all? He will barge on, trampling on everything in his path--there will be NOTHING to stop him. There will be no free speech--or there will be a contiuation on a larger scale, of free speech zones, just to make it look good. I am inclined to think that rounding up dissidents and putting them away in camps is not beyond his course of action.

I am inclined to think it will be a hundred times worse than what we have seen so far.

There will be NOTHING to stop him.

The media will be his to do with what he likes. The churches and religions will be his to do with what he likes, and many are already, not to mention the impending persecution of atheists or agnostics, which most certainly, if he is elected, I am certain he will tyrannize.

Many people, from what I read, are just not motivated to protest.

Something sad has happened to the spirit or the soul of Americans over the past thirty or so years.

[Ravenseye]

26. How will we fight?

Out in the streets.

Protesting, marching, and doing things to buck the system.

Sure it might not seem like much, but the best thing we can do is keep talking to people and getting them to see the light.

Educating new voters, the poor voters who don't vote, and even your in-laws and that brother in law with the camaro on the front lawn.

Calm, informed, talking points, brought to the people will work.

We can fix what is broke, but we can't if people leave.

If you want to give up on this country, then leave, but you won't have my respect. I'm an American, and pride in this country isn't restricted to the conservative or the ignorant. We've done great things, and we can continue to do so as a country. Yes Bush and his legacy will be a blight on our nation, but we can't just up and abandon it, or not only will it get worse, but it will eventually come back to haunt us.

We have to fight for this country just like the founding fathers did against King George.

Live free or die, not Live free or move to Canada.

[WildEyedLiberal]

29. We hold these truths to be self-evident...

Amen!

I love this country, and the neofascists cannot and will not take that away from me. They can't take away the promise of freedom that our Founding Fathers fought and died for unless we roll over and let them. Thomas Jefferson said, "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with inherent and inalienable rights; that among these, are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness; that to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed; that whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles, and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness."

THAT is the country I love; the idea of America that has been a beacon of hope to the world for over 200 years. We MUST take this country back. I do not believe Bush is going to win this election, and that gives me great hope in the people of this nation. But **IF** he does, or if he manages to steal/cancel the election, WE CANNOT GIVE UP WITHOUT A FIGHT! My ancestors left their homeland and uprooted their family in search of a dream of a better life, and that dream led them to America. Because of them I enjoy a comfortable life with the freedom to live and believe as I wish. This is the eternal promise of America; that one day everyone will be recognized as equal.

The best and only things of value in this life are worth fighting for. I can nothing of nothing more valuable than liberty and hope. That is why, in the event of the unthinkable, I will not let them win; I will not let them take my country from me with their fascist police state. Now, come Nov. 2 we won't have to worry about this because the people will speak and our man will win. But we can never surrender when we are fighting for the soul of our country.

[Malva Zebrina]

35. fight as you will,

we have been fighting all along. No one has dissolved the free speech zOnes. No one has demanded they do not be arrested for protesting inside a rally for Bush and no one has successfully infiltrated the corporate owned media. Yes there are a few people such as Sy Hersh who are speaking and writing against the regime, but it going nowhere as far as power goes or as far as taking over the dictatorship of Bush goes.

Since Bush stole the election, all has been flaccid and impotent as far as dissent goes and there are several reasons as to why that is so.

That fifty percent of the people support him, is testimony to this lack of power.

Not to mention the abandonment of the Democrats in congress.

He waqed war and killed thousands and thousands of innocent people, on lies. If there was anything that would disgust a normal human being with normal ethics and morals, it was that. But, he got away with it and continues to get away with it, and further has half the country supporting it!

I find it unbelievable and incredible that the race, according to the polls, is tight and tied.

If we cared to in the past four years, or since he invaded and went on a killing spree, we could have protested. I did before the war, and the minute he invaded, the protests were over. People just refused to keep it up. Why? Because people did not want to look anti American, and did not want it being said about them that they did not"support the troops"

It is testimony to the well honed propaganda machine of Bush's White House. People stopped protesting out of guilt or perhpas fear and because they bought the "support the troops" fallacy.

What would be protested, if Bush does win the election? What would people take to the streets over? His election? Would it make a bit of difference? What could protests change about Bush's regime, should he win and at last has not a thing in his way on his road to fascism and totalitarianism. Who would remove him due to protests? The Republican congress? The Supreme Court, which he would have seeded with his appointments?

My question is, what would you fight with? I have talked to people who are convinced that Bush is a great leader and refuse to see any different. I have written letters, to no avail. I have protested only to have it peter out.

I will not stay here under a regime that would be hell bent on more slaughter, war and devastation with such complete control, that there is little anyone can do about it, or change it.

Now the founding fathers fought against the British troops as a militia armed with hunting rifles and little else. Maybe a few cannons. But this cannot be the same situation. WE would be fighting at home against our own troops.!

We can have rifles, or even automatic weapons and many ,many would be slaughtered by the high tech weapons that Bush has under his control and by which our own troops would be firing upon us!

I will do everything I can to see to it that Bush is not elected as far as I am capable , but if he is, I will not lend my name to slaughter anymore.

[Rex_Goodheart]

22. My first post on DU...

Here to say...

DON'T LET THOSE BASTARDS TAKE OUR COUNTRY FROM US.

Stay here. We need you.

[Ravenseye]

25. Welcome and good point

[newyawker99]

32. Hi Rex_Goodheart!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[in_cog_ni_to]

23. This web site is a GREAT resource for finding info

on places to live.

http://www.escapeartist.com/efan/efan.htm

[Zorra]

24. I left when Bu$h was proclaimed dictator by the Supreme Court in 2000.

I'll be back only after Kerry is elected.

In the case of the unthinkable happening, I will be part of an underground railroad that will help kids evade the draft, and will also be helping American refugees flee the Bu$h fascist police state.

[forgethell]

27. If we are all so confident

of winning, and I must admit that I am not, then why are there so many threads on this subject?

Perhaps if would be a good thing/ If all the bright, intelligent, people left the USA, then it sould soon lose its dominance over the rest of the world.

But in any event, why be ashamed if you have done the right thing??

[Javaman]

28. I'm going to stay right here and fight the good fight.

As screwed up as this country is at the moment and as screwed up as it could be if moron is reappointed, I will stay. I refuse to back down. Go to another country if you wish, but I refuse to let them beat me down.
Did my uncles and cousins fight and died in wars just to have me abandon my country when it needs me the most. Not all battles are fought with guns.
If we back down now at the mere thought of gov't oppression, then what would the founding fathers think of us?
It's always the middle class and the poor that fight the battles, this time is no different.
We show such spirit on this website, who's to say that spirit dies if moron is in for another 4 years?
Think about it, if you are pissed now, think about if he's back.
Protest, voice your opinion, speak out, question authority, don't take their lies as answers or even the truth!
I'm just to stubborn to give up on a dream.

[Hobo]

30. Stay and fight the battle.......

they can kill us, but they can't eat us.

Peace

Hobo

[B3Nut]

31. I'm stayin' put.

I'm proud to be an American, I love my country, and I love my state (Wisconsin). I'm deeply ashamed of the things the sitting administration has done, I'm ashamed to have voted for Bush in 2000, and am voting to take my country back from the neoconservative terrorists who have hijacked it. I sincerely hope that we win this thing in November and begin the long hard task to regain our former position as a beacon of liberty and respect for humanity, a position the Bush administration has toiled tirelessly to decimate and obliterate.

I'm not giving up without a fight.

I'm Todd Phipps, and I approved this message. :D

TP

[Placebo]

33. I Don't Think I Could Concede America To The NEOCONS!

As much as it would pain me to stay, there would be no way that I would leave. I couldn't give America over to the Neocons, they don't deserve it.

[ANewDem]

34. --

Good job, just give up if the guy you want doesn't win. If you love this country so much, you'd stay and fight for change. Not run away.

[Pretzels]

36. Gawd, I hope not

If Shrub gets another term, I'm going to be totally disgusted! Not only will I be disgusted at the fact that an self-serving, arrogant, war-mongering, pro-rich bigot has a 2nd term in the Oval Office.....I'll be completely disgusted at the American people for not seeing this guy for what he is.

Shrub is the absolute worst pResident we have ever seen....and his henchmen Cheney, Rummy, and Ashcroft are the true axis of evil! I'm appalled this is even close! I'd take Nixon over this idiot in a heartbeat!

[Skittles]

37. I won't give up on my own country because of those neocon bastards

not now, NOT EVER

[autorank]

38. Understand frustration but please stop this. It makes the rest of

us look bad. If it's not worth fighting for over the short to mid term, what's the deal. Screw them if * is elected. I'll stay here and just be as DEMOCRATIC as I can. We'll get them in 2006!