What is your understanding of how legislation is created? And how it is

[Psychoblues99]

ultimately passed and becomes law?

Even simple no-brainer legislation sometimes takes years and hundreds of meetings and negotiations to finally to bring to a vote and enact. And sometimes, nay many times, that simple no-brainer bill never becomes anything other than another item in the trash bin of proposed legislation that will never see the light of day. On the other hand, many bills that should have never seen the light of day flourish and are ultimately enacted. Go figure?

It matters not whether it is a local issue, city, county, state or national issue. They all operate similarly. What is your personal understanding of the process, pitfalls and technigues involved?

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,,.,,.,..,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,,....,.,,...,,..,.,,.,.,,.,.,,,.,.,,.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

1. Not true anymore

I am very aware of how policy is enacted in my state and the public meetings accompnying most of that policy.

On the other hand, policy such as the Homeland security act started out at 38 pages and ballooned to over 400 in a matter of weeks.

The Patriot act was over 200 pages long and passed in a matter of DAYS.

That is policy sitting around in a think tank being handed off....with NO DEBATE ON THE IMPACT of the policy.

[Psychoblues99]

6. Well, kinda, nsma, but we now know that the HSA had been in various

stages since 1998 and because the pukes so despised the Big Dawg they refused to allow it to even be debated or brought before the body. Suddenly, post 9 11 it became an emergency and we know the rest of the story, or do we? To say it was only weeks in the making, however, is misleading to say the least. It and the Patriot Act were distorted beyond any reasonable expectation and passed in record time, but the original legislation had been proposed years before it's enactment.

Thanks for your thoughts, nsma.

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,.,.,.,.,..,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,,.,.,,,.,.,.,.,,,.,,.,.,,,.,.,.,,,.,,,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,,.,,.,

[Liberal Veteran]

2. Here ya go!

Boy: Woof! You sure gotta climb a lot of steps to get to this Capitol Building here in Washington. But I wonder who that sad little scrap of paper is?

I'm just a bill.
Yes, I'm only a bill.
And I'm sitting here on Capitol Hill.
Well, it's a long, long journey
To the capital city.
It's a long, long wait
While I'm sitting in committee,
But I know I'll be a law someday
At least I hope and pray that I will,
But today I am still just a bill.

Boy: Gee, Bill, you certainly have a lot of patience and courage.

Bill: Well I got this far. When I started, I wasn't even a bill, I was just an idea. Some folks back home decided they wanted a law passed, so they called their local Congressman and he said, "You're right, there oughta be a law." Then he sat down and wrote me out and introduced me to Congress. And I became a bill, and I'll remain a bill until they decide to make me a law.

I'm just a bill
Yes I'm only a bill,
And I got as far as Capitol Hill.
Well, now I'm stuck in committee
And I'll sit here and wait
While a few key Congressmen discuss and debate
Whether they should let me be a law.
How I hope and pray that they will,
But today I am still just a bill.

Boy: Listen to those congressmen arguing! Is all that discussion and debate about you?

Bill: Yeah, I'm one of the lucky ones. Most bills never even get this far. I hope they decide to report on me favourably, otherwise I may die.

Boy: Die?

Bill: Yeah, die in committee. Oooh, but it looks like I'm gonna live! Now I go to the House of Representatives, and they vote on me.

Boy: If they vote yes, what happens?

Bill: Then I go to the Senate and the whole thing starts all over again.

Boy: Oh no!

Bill: Oh yes!

I'm just a bill
Yes, I'm only a bill
And if they vote for me on Capitol Hill
Well, then I'm off to the White House
Where I'll wait in a line
With a lot of other bills
For the president to sign
And if he signs me, then I'll be a law.
How I hope and pray that he will,
But today I am still just a bill.

Boy: You mean even if the whole Congress says you should be a law, the president can still say no?

Bill: Yes, that's called a veto. If the President vetoes me, I have to go back to Congress and they vote on me again, and by that time you're so old...

Boy: By that time it's very unlikely that you'll become a law. It's not easy to become a law, is it?

Bill: No!

But how I hope and I pray that I will,
But today I am still just a bill.

Congressman: He signed you, Bill! Now you're a law!

Bill: Oh yes!!!

[Psychoblues99]

7. Good one, l_v,!!!!!!!!! Not wrong but a little on the 3rd grade level

isn't it? And NO, I'm not trying to ridicule you at all. Your observation and poetry are valuable and basically true. We'd all be better off if legislation were that simple, IMHO. Thanks!!!!!!!

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,.,.,..,.,.,.,,.,.,.,...,,,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,..,..,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,...,..,.,

[bearfartinthewoods]

10. it was written for third graders and on the tube for a looong time along

with such classics as conjuction juction...what's your function.

they ran it during saturday morning cartoon breaks as the required educational content.

[Liberal Veteran]

18. They were good content though.....

I can still recite the Preamble to the constitution by singing it in my mind.

[Liberal Veteran]

12. Well, I can't take credit for it...

It's from Saturday morning cartoon series called "Schoolhouse Rock".

[Psychoblues99]

13. When I was a kid they were cutting Elvis off at the waist and claiming

"rock" was a fad from the devil's own hands. I'm glad it changed, aren't you?

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,..,.,.,.,,.,,.,.,.,.,.,,.,,.,,.,,.,.,,,.,,.,,,.,.,.,,.,,.,,.,,,.,,.,,.,,.,,.,.,.,,.,.

[buddhamama]

16. Psychoblues, you are darling!

and observant. you nailed schoolhouse rock as third grade and you were right. :loveya:

[Psychoblues99]

19. A big 'ol hug to my very favorite

(((((((((((((((((((((buddhamama))))))))))))))))))))))))

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,...,.,.,.,,.,,.,,.,,.,,.,.,.,,.,,.,,,.,,,.,..,.,.,,,.,.,.,,,.,.,.,.,,.,,.,,.,.,,.,.,,,,.,,.,.,

[goobergunch]

3. Congressional procedure

Legislation is first introduced, usually in the House, by a congressperson, sometimes at the behest of constituents, lobbyists, or the Administration. The bill is referred to committee. Most bills are not heard by the committee, but a few are reported by the committee and considered by the full House. If passed by the House, a bill (now called an act) will proceed to the Senate, where it will go through committee and eventually make it to the floor if the committee approves. The committee can be bypassed if the matter is especially important. The Senate will amend the bill and then vote on passage. If the bill is not amended by the Senate, it is sent to the pResident to be signed into law or vetoed. If it is amended by the Senate, the House can either accept the Senate amendments, thereby clearing the measure for the pResident, or disagree to the amendments and ask for a conference. Controlled by the committees of jurisdiction in both houses, the conference will either work out a compromise and both houses will vote on the "conference report", which can not be amended, or will be unable to reach agreement and the bill "dies in conference". When a bill is cleared by both houses, it goes to the pResident. It becomes law unless the pResident vetoes the bill, in which case both houses may override the veto by a 2/3rds vote, or the pResident takes no action and Congress has adjourned sine die.

[Psychoblues99]

28. Thanks, goobergunch!!!!!!!!!!!

But I was looking for the more obscure circumstanses that are behind all successful legislation. But you are correct.

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,,.,,.,,,.,,.,.,.,,.,,.,,.,,.,.,.,,.,,.,,.,,.,,.,,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,

[DuctapeFatwa]

4. A rich man from a corporation gives a rich politician some money

Then the politician makes some deals with other politicians, some of them want some of the money. Sometimes he has to go back to the corporation guy and get some more money. Then the law is passed.

[Psychoblues99]

9. I always wondered how Social Security or the Voting Rights Act were

enacted.

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,....,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,..,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,..,.,,.,,.,.,,.,,.,,,.,,.,.,.,.,..,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,

[DuctapeFatwa]

14. If it comforts you to believe that either were done from pure altruism

Please be assured that I respect all faiths, and the American political process is every bit as much a matter of faith as the Prophet's Journey to Al Aqsa or the Assumption of the Blessed Virgin.

I will not presume to tell you that either is or is not true.

As Bible, Koran and John Stuart Mill agree, you have free will to believe or disbelive what you choose :)

[Psychoblues99]

15. The American political/legislative experience is NOT faith based.

It's a matter of work, perserverence, and more work. That has been my experience. Although I may have had "faith" in the success of my proposals, my proposals were never, not once based on "faith" as you describe.

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,..,,.,.,,

[DuctapeFatwa]

20. You have stated articles of your faith

That is your belief, just as others may believe that their vote counts, that votes are counted accurately, that politicians are men of principle and honor. All are articles of faith, and to attempt to dissect them, refute them or proselytize or convert is the job of evangelicals and metaphysiscists, not respectively, and not me :)

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Psychoblues99]

27. And just where have I stated these "articles" of which you speak?

I don't think that I have done that at all.

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,,.,.,,.,.,.,,.,,.,,.,,.,,.,.,,.,,.,.,.,,,.,.,,.,.,,.,.,,,.,,.,.,.,,.,.,,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,,.,..,,,.,,.,.,

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

5. Corporations write the legislation, pay Congress members to pass it

Literally, corporate lobbyists have the legislation drawn up in advance, and then present it to the Congressmen on their payroll. Congressman proposes the bill to Congress, there is debate and rewriting and more campaign bribes, er, donations, and voila - the best democracy money can buy.

[buddhamama]

8. my response was going to be something like this

i'll add that not all legislation is enacted this way sometimes citizens do actually have a say; in the iniation of legislation and the drafting. and yes, it can take yrs.

i had on occasion the opportunity to observe this when i was younger in my hometown state's capitol building.

[Psychoblues99]

11. In 21 years of elected office I was never approached by a lobbyist

with a written piece of legislation/bill. I was approached many times but never with anything like what you are saying. Where did you serve when you were approached in this manner?

Psychoblues

Dems Gotta Keep On Truckin'.,.,.,.,.,,,,.,.,.,.,.,..,.,,.,.,.,,.,.,.,.,,..,,..,,..,.,.,,,.,.,,,.,.,,.,.,,.,.,.,.,

[sangh0]

17. Read "Master of the Senate"

"The LBJ Story" by Robert Caro. It goes into a lot of behind the scenes detail concerning how bills get passed in the Senate.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

22. bottomline?>>>>lobby

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[DuctapeFatwa]

26. and I'm sorry for double post, it told me it didnt take, code threw up

evildoer spirits who hate posts got into the forum code.

[slackmaster]

29. I'm very down on the process right now, especially in California

Most laws (and we have more than any other state by a large margin) are written for political reasons, basically posturing and pandering, and have little relationship to pursuit of the public interest.

[MercutioATC]

30. Everything I know I learned from Schoolhouse Rock.....

"I'm Just a Bill"...