Mumbly-Jumbly Fundie Speak: "Mighty Mountain..."

[BeHereNow]

He couldn't do it- he could not appear publicly
without inserting his mumbly-jumbly-secret-coded-message
bible verse to his X-tain voters.
"We've climbed the mighty mountain. I see the valley below, and it's
a valley of peace."
Now my fear is, in the light of the neocon invasion and
occupation of the M.E., his reference to the "mighty mountain"
is a reference to God taking Moses to the mountain and
showing him the promised land. Moses died and chose Joshua
to lead the Israelites to the promised land. (Joshua and Jesus
are the same name in different languages, by the way-
one Greek and the other Hebrew) One little problem
they had to overcome first though was defeating nasty
heathens, or the NOT chosen people. (The mountain metaphor
goes all the way back to God's covenant with Abraham.)
It is sort of complicated to explain all of it, but know this:
Joshua is the BLOODIEST book in the Bible, and has been
THE number one "biblical" defense of all crusaders.
Millions have been slaughtered by crusaders using the
Book of Jushua as their road map.
To understand more about bush and his mighty mountain
the signifance of his reference and code-speak to the
fundies who think this is a holy and just war read this:
http://gbgm-umc.org/umw/joshua/may7180.stm

"We can begin with the Crusades. During the Middle Ages, European Christians launched military campaigns to take the Holy Land from the Muslims. Early on the Crusaders took Jericho. Following the example of Joshua 6, they marched around the city led by clergy carrying sacred banners and pictures of Christian saints. When the walls did not fall down as expected, they attacked and overran the city. Then they massacred the inhabitants. Jews were locked in their synagogue and burned alive. Even some of the Crusaders were horrified by the slaughter. (10)

The Crusaders could have argued that the Bible was on their side. After all, Joshua commanded that "the city and all that is in it shall be devoted to the Lord for destruction" (6:17). The writer reports that they did just that -- killing "by the edge of the sword all in the city, both men and women, young and old, oxen, sheep, and donkey" (6:21). "They burned down the city, and everything in it" (6:24). For the Crusaders, the Book of Joshua was a blueprint for their military campaigns."

To understand more, go to an online bible text source
and read Joshua. I prefer King James Versions myself.

You will understand why the so called "Christians" that
worship Bush will not blink an eye if we wipe out
every living Muslim soul in the M.E..
It is truly frightening to think that Bush actually believes
this- If he is only using it to justify the whole-sale slaughter
of civilians because he is not actually a Christian, then it
is a brilliant political ploy. If he actually believes it and
is certain that he is to carry on for Joshua, that is equally
terrifying.
I am not sure which is worse to tell you the truth.
But make no mistake, the book of Joshua is the
chosen recipe for civilian slaughter by crusaders
through out history. Of course the end result is
supposed to be peace. Once all the "non-chosen" are
killed that is.

BHN

[grasswire]

1. I thought for a minute....

...he was channeling one of those televangelists. It was really, really weird.

He did slip into bits of his stump speech now and then. That was probably from the one he gives to fundamentalists.

[MadHound]

3. No, this is a bit that he had in his acceptance speech at the convention

Bush has always slipped in fundie code talk into virtually all of his speeches. If I remember right, this little snippet is out of Exodus, and was included in his acceptance speech for the convention.

He is constantly slipping in fundie code words, "crusade", "good vs evil" etc etc. I think that Salon did an article on this recently.

[BeHereNow]

6. I listened to the whole thing

and as they neared the end, I thouhgt,
"What, no message for the 'true believers?'
And then , blam, there it was.
I couldn'y hear the whole thing though
because my dogs started barking just as he
was going off- but I looked up the transcript
from a link another DUer provided and
sure 'nuff, there it was.
And yes, it is as if he is "channeling."
He truly scares me. I think he is delusional.
BHN

[anarchy1999]

22. BHN, He's not just delusional, he is a mental basket case.

I spent an hour on Thursday with a Vet for Peace, a psychologist, doctor of theology, who was teaching in India when 9/11 happened. To top it off it was on my birthday. He was very moved by "Bush on the Couch" author and was surprised by the depth of what I knew.

This man moved me more than I've been moved in many months. He affirmed all I know to be true, and this was coming from a man of great knowledge and strength.

He fears for our country.

[not systems]

2. It was code for "I will trigger the end times."

His followers understand his apocalyptic mystical ranting.

[DeepModem Mom]

4. Sounded like Nooner to me -- attempt at a Reagan moment...

like shining city on a hill.

[foo_bar]

24. good catch

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewPolitics.asp?Page=%5CPolitics%5Carchive%5C200409%5CPOL20040909c.html

[Lars39]

5. If it's any consolation, the Southern Baptists

are occupied with finishing the Great Commission. They just kicked off a 40 day program. All tied in with their Kingdom program, though, and that one is pretty scary.

[BeHereNow]

7. What? Tell me more!

I haven't heard about this.
BHN

[Lars39]

10. It's at their website.

I go their every couple of days to keep track of 'em. The Kingdom thing is creepy. Hard to explain unless you know fundyspeak. Franklin Graham is involved(Big conference in July IIRC). In a nutshell it is about establishing their kingdom here on earth, ie worldwide theocracy. It's being done under The Great Commission.

SB is very quietly sending missionaries off to places that SB has never been before. Missionary BIL and wife and 2 yo left last week for India. Damn fools, imo.

[BeHereNow]

11. Oh yeah...It's the Joshua Crusade

FOR SURE.
Damn, this is really getting scary.
BHN

[Lars39]

12. I think they pulled it! I read it about 2 days ago.

I went looking for it and couldn't find it. I'll keep looking for it. I really need to start saving them. I consider the SB Convention to be the leader of the fundy pack. :shudder:

[BeHereNow]

13. There are ALL sorts of

related web sites.
These folks are nuts. Truly nuts.
BHN

[skygazer]

8. Mountain of bullshit, if you ask me

Yeah, he seemed to think he was Jesus on the Mount there for a moment. Then he went back to being Chimpy on the Block.

[BeHereNow]

9. Remember the Isaiah Blasphemy?

The day he stood on the boat and quoted Isaiah 61?
Same verse Jesus read to the Church of Nazareth
in Luke 4 to assure to them he was the one prophesied
about in Isaiah.
I fell off my chair that day. It was if
he were declaring himself as the Messiah.
We had a BIG old thread on that one.
I fear he DOES actually believe he is
fulfilling prophecy.
If it is a ruse, then the fact that so
many x-tians believe it is REALLY alarming.
They will back anything he wants to do,
including the genocide of Muslims according
to the Book of Joshua.
BHN

[Sophree]

29. I remember that thread.

The day he quoted Isaiah- the Mission Accomplished speech, right? I also remember the sinking feeling in my gut when I read your thoughts and went back and read Isaiah 61 and Luke 4.

Other (basically conservative) Christians I showed the thread and the speech to didn't think he blasphemed. I think that even if he didn't TECHNICALLY claim himself to be the second coming, he sure danced daintily, too closely, around it.

My question is- would Ralph Reed write something that blasphemous?

[BeHereNow]

30. Well, here is what is really astounding-

Given the Isaiah quote, the reference to the mountain
as it pertains to the ark of the covenant, Moses and Joshua
and Revelation 19...in context with the topic of the debate
where he blithered it, well...who knows what's coming next.
Do I think Ralph Reed would pen this tripe?
ABSO-FUCKING-LUTELY!
Do I think Bush believes he is on a mission from God
based on OT? I am afraid so.
Is he appealing to the rapture ready rabble?
Oh yes.
BHN

[Sophree]

33. I believe he wrote the mountain/valley of peace

thing, too. I wouldn't be surprised.

But I was wondering about the May 2003 speech- I'm pretty sure Ralph Reed wrote it, but what I can't figure out is if he would write something so blasphemous, to intentionally claim or even imply that B*sh is the second coming.

[BeHereNow]

34. Have you seen the Yurica Report?

They absolutely believe that Bush is GAWD's designated leader:
http://www.yuricareport.com

Look up the article on the home page called
"The Despoiling of America"

BHN

[Sophree]

36. Yes, I have read it.

It's incredibly frightening. And infuriating. And frustrating. WHY are so many people fooled by that horrible, horrible man?

[BeHereNow]

37. Rev 13

As well as many other NT verses warn us of this deception.
What I think though is this:
Bush is the first beast- the real trouble will start
with the second, who as you may recall, is given the
authority of the first.
Given the recent decimation of all human rights, rule of law
the Constitution etc...just imagine what is coming.
BHN

[Sophree]

38. I haven't read all of Revelation since I was a teenager.

And I've only read bits and pieces since I came to Christ as an adult. I'll have to read it this weekend.

Thanks for everything, BHN. :-)

[BeHereNow]

14. Night Crew Kick

"Here come the crucifiers..."
Excene Cervenka

[Sugarbleus]

15. I am a life long BUT RECOVERING Fundie/evangelical

I can't speak to the accuracy of your biblical assessments posted here (though its very interesting).....but IT'S TRUE that the Radical Xtian right DOES believe these are the "END TIMES". They DO believe that Whorge Bush is sent by and "Blessed" of God. Bush knows they think that and uses it to his advantage. I do NOT believe that Bush knows the first thing about spiritual matters....

Some fundies are more radical than others. The more radical of them might very well believe that wiping out Muslims is the appropriate thing to do because their religion "is false" (sic) Other Fundies will argue that "God loves everyone and wants them to know Jesus" so they will take the avenue of insisting that we "free them" so unbelievers (muslims in this case) can actually have the opportunity to "come to know Christ" (Samaritan's Purse and missionary works in general world wide).

Either way, the radical and the moderates both want to control peoples daily lives completely. Somehow they get this idea that "The Great Commission" is to "FIX" the world BEFORE thier savior returns. That is false but their teachers keep spouting it to them and will not let the people think for themselves. Most fundies are kept in line by FEAR. Fear of failing God, of going to Hell. Fear fear fear..it held my family in it's grips for YEARS. It almost paralyzed my daughters entire life.........the stories I could tell.

Yes, most assuredly yes, Bush uses that code speak. It's extremely obvious to me since I lived that life. I KNOW it's BS, but those brainwashed fundie followers are something else and YES, it's dangerous..on so many levels.

[VOX]

17. Thanks, Sugarbleus. It takes courage to reveal this part of yourself...

And it's much appreciated. I'm pretty far from being an atheist, but Christian belief has been rather tainted by the extreme fundamentalists in this country. It is very destructive, and has nothing to do with the core beliefs of basic Christianity: love, humility, forgiveness, healing.

Best to you -- :hi:

[Pobeka]

20. They are most afraid that they are wrong.

This is my basic thesis, that the fundies are really truly scared (deep down in their rational subconscious) that the basic premise of their belief is a lie. But they act on this contradiction in a perverted denial -- if they can only force the rest of the world to accept their own belief, then that will be an external confirmation of their belief.

And if they have to kill to get that confirmation, it won't stop them one bit.

--
I contrast that with many fine people (of any faith) I have known who are comfortable in their faith, and have no personal need to convert others, but instead engage in that dialogue in appropriate settings, and are very able to not discuss it at all if it's clear the discussion is causing friction.

[BeHereNow]

26. Tomatoes...

You just made me think of those delicious midwest
tomatoes! I would kill for a plate of those right now! LOL
But back to the topic at hand...
I agree with your assessment and want to add further
to your thought about the need for confirmation.
Again, this need to be "right," is what I consider part
of not only a fundie condition, but an American
neurosis. The combination is partcularly UNChristian.
No true Christain could ever assume such a cloak of self importance
or take any credit for their salvation. Ephesians is very clear
about who gets credit.
Good to hear from you-
Stay clear of that Helen, ya hear?
BHN

[BeHereNow]

25. Recognizing Code Speak...

Is VERY valuable these days.
I am so glad that you are sharing your experience
and knowledge of the fundie culture.
I would love to hear your thoughts on some of his
scripture twisting. I think he is speaking to the faction
that is quite comfortable with the idea of exterminating
those they deem to be "un-chosen" people, which you and
I both know is as UN-Christian as it gets. Resorting to OT
continuously denies Grace so their whole mission in
an oxymoron! That is what I find most disturbing/dangerous
about the dominionists. I also find the other sect of Fundies
equally offensive, the ones you refer to as wanting to
convert others instead of just killing them off.
Either God is omnipotent or He is not- they can't have
it both ways. If He is omnipotent and Ephesians 2:8 is
truth, than does He really need us to convert anyone?
I find that incredibly arrogant, and in the case of Americans,
part of the collective psychosis that we are somehow
"special." I can't deal with non-Christian Americans who
think they are "special" because they are Americans.
Combine the self-righteousness of X-tian Americans along
with the general arrogance of being an American and
I am looking for a puke bag. Seriously, I find either
fundie camp completely delusional and relying on
their own understanding, which usually furthers their
sense of SELF-importance as "American Christians"
rather than the wisdom promised by justification which
I know you know, requires complete humility, not
self aggrandization.
Anyhoo- thanks for checking in on this thread and
like I said, I would love to hear your thoughts on
the mumbly-jumbly code speak as it relates to
the particular topics the prezteldent applies it to.
I saw this particular message relating to Joshua
due to the fact that so much of the debate was
over our illegal invasion and occupation of
a sovereign nation, which just happens to be
full of dead civilian Muslims.

BHN

[Liberal_Andy]

16. truly scary, this guy!

:nuke:

[anarchy1999]

18. Thanks BHN. We love you lots in Texas and are glad to see you back,

but damn, I didn't need nightmares tonight. You are so dead on, on this issue.

May God or whatever higher power there is please forgive us all.

Oh and by the way, did I mention YOU ROCK!!

[anarchy1999]

19. Thanks BHN. We love you lots in Texas and are glad to see you back,

but damn, I didn't need nightmares tonight. You are so dead on, on this issue.

May God or whatever higher power there is please forgive us all.

Oh and by the way, did I mention YOU ROCK!!

[BeHereNow]

27. I think the nightmares

Are my way of adjusting my conscious mind
to just how far the shift has gone. I think it is why
you and me are thinking about getting out of here.
It is all too much for the conscious mind sometimes, so I
guess our dreams become another way to adjust to
the horror of the reality that our country has been taken over
by facsists and fundies.

Please give my hugs to the Dallas DUers if you see
any of them, I had so much fun with you guys
at our gathering there.
Thought I might be there for Christmas, but
now I think they are coming here instead.

BHN
BTW....
:yourock: :hug:

[RareLubbockDem]

21. Nice job.

You spent some time on this. Well written, well researched.

[BeHereNow]

35. Thanks, but I can take no credit...

I have been watching as advised, that is all.
BHN

[anarchy1999]

23. Deserving of a kick back to the top!

n/t

[Sophree]

28. You are so right about that.

"You will understand why the so called "Christians" that
worship Bush will not blink an eye if we wipe out
every living Muslim soul in the M.E.."

Which is frightening in and of itself.

"It is truly frightening to think that Bush actually believes
this- If he is only using it to justify the whole-sale slaughter
of civilians because he is not actually a Christian, then it
is a brilliant political ploy. If he actually believes it and
is certain that he is to carry on for Joshua, that is equally
terrifying.
I am not sure which is worse to tell you the truth."

I think about this all the time. I'm not sure which is worse, either.

[bobthedrummer]

31. That reminds me, what's General Boykin been up to lately?

:eyes:

[BeHereNow]

32. Oh, he is probably training troops

in the finer art of crucifying?
All in the name of "Jeebus for Jews?"
After all, can't have no rapture until the
promised land is returned, right?
Check out a modern day map with the map of Exodus...
BHN