A film on PEAK OIL that EVERYONE here must see!!!!

[sandboxface]

The End of Suburbia: Oil Depletion and the Collapse of The American Dream

I watched this movie for the first time last night and it BLEW ME AWAY. YOU CALL HAVE TO SEE IT. OUR FUTURE DEPENDS ON IT.

Movie website:
http://www.endofsuburbia.com/

Preview Clips
http://endofsuburbia.com/previews.htm

You can either purchase the DVD online or attend a free screening in your area. Check the website for details. There is a free screening of this film in Oakland, CA this Sunday. Here is the email I sent out to my friends:


“In the US and North America, we consume 10 calories of hydrocarbon energy for each calorie of food we eat, not counting transportation and cooking.” -Michael Ruppert


So what’s all the fuss about? Are we really at the beginning of the end of the age of oil?

The End of Suburbia is a film everyone must see. Why? Because Peak Oil affects us all. The real situation we are facing goes way beyond the Bush regime’s agenda. Our civilization is built on a nonrenewable resource that has hit it’s peak, not only in supply, but in output growth. Once we’ve hit the peak, every barrel of oil becomes more expensive and requires more energy and resources to extract out of the ground.

Think about food for a moment. How does oil affect our food supply? Here is what Michael Ruppert (fromthewilderness.com) has to say:

“Not only are all fertilizers made out of natural gas, all commercial pesticides are made from petroleum. Not to mention the energy used for planting, harvesting, pumping the water for irrigation, packaging the food, processing the food, transporting the food, etc.”

And forget hydrogen fuel. It’s bogus. Hydrogen production requires an immense amount of electricity. Where are we going to get that from? In most cases it requires more energy to make hydrogen fuel than the actual energy the fuel provides.

To find out more, join us on Sunday for a free screening at the Parkway Theater in Oakland, followed by a discussion with Richard Heinberg, author of Powerdown: Options and Alternative for a Post Carbon World.

If you don’t live in the Bay Area, you can attend a screening near you or purchase the movie online at http://www.endofsuburbia.com/


What: Free Screening – The End of Suburbia followed by a discussion w/ Richard Hienberg
When: Sunday, September 26th at 3PM (come early to reserve a seat)
Where: The Parkway Theater in Oakland, 1834 Park Boulevard near Lake Merrit


The new FFWM DVD is out. Find me there to get your copy.

Event Information
http://www.picturepubpizza.com/special-events/sunday_salon.html

The Movie Website
http://www.endofsuburbia.com/

Preview Clips
http://endofsuburbia.com/previews.htm

More information on oil depletion and its implications
http://www.postcarbon.org

Learning to live in a low energy world
http://www.globalpublicmedia.com

Michael Ruppert’s Speech to the Commonwealth Club in San Francisco
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/PDF/Commonwealth.pdf

[Dangeresque]

1. The Hydrogen Economy

We *can* move to a hydrogen economy, but we have to get over our irrational fear of nuclear power. Nuclear power is really the only way out of the energy bind we're going to find ourselves in in a few years.

[mhr]

2. Wrong! Hydrogen Has A Negative EROEI

Hydrogen is not the answer!

[Dangeresque]

3. No sh*t

We know that. That's why you have to use nuclear power, to get past the hydrocarbon/solar cycle. Who cares if the return on energy invested is less than 1.0, if the source fuel is non-hydrocarbon?

[mhr]

4. Who Cares - Everyone Cares

eom

[Dangeresque]

5. Serioulsy...

*Think* about it for a moment, willya?

[mhr]

6. Whatever Point You Are Trying To Make Is Lost On Me

Our only way out of the energy coffin we are now in is massive conservation, massive energy efficiency, and development of alternatives.

Until the waste problem is solved, nuclear is not a long-term viable solution.

[Dangeresque]

8. The waste problem was solved decades ago...

We know how to store and/or dispose of waste safely. Vitrification, storage in stable sites such as Yucca Mountain, or disposal in ocean trenches...it's not hard. The only obstacle is people who flunked basic science in elementary school who are afraid of anything 'nuculer'.

[sandboxface]

11. Lets backup for a second

I don't think there is an alternative energy source as diverse as oil. That's the problem. In terms of keeping things relativly on par with what we have now, nuclear isn't going to cut it.

[jdj]

16. OH bullshit.

The obstacle is corrupt politicians cutting disposal corners and wanting to store this stuff in landfills.

Look what devastation they are wreaking with mountaintop removal, and with nukes we won't even be able to see it.

[sandboxface]

23. Politicians are PART of the problem

I agree, but the picture doesn't stop there. Nuclear energy is more difficult to transport than oil energy. We will need at least 2 decades to come up with viable storage solutions for nuclear energy. (We're essectially 3 decades too late in even addressing the problem) Then you have all sorts of practicle questions, like: how much will it cost and who will be able to afford it? Not everyone, for sure. Switching to a new energy resource costs everyone money. Can afford it? Can our economy afford it?

[NickB79]

32. Why dispose of it at all?

As NNadir has pointed out over and over again on this board, you can reuse the spent fuel in another fission cycle and generate even more energy from it. Do you throw out a log when only 10% of it has been burned in the fireplace?

[AndyTiedye]

10. Hydrogen + Solar/Wind

No nukes. none needed.

[sandboxface]

12. Hydrogen + Solar/Wind Won't Produce Enough Energy

I'm telling you, wath the movie.

[jdj]

15. These dipshits can't even maintain superfund, and we expect

to be able to trust them with nuclear waste?
so sorry, that one ain't gonna fly.

Nukes are not the answer and they never were, and I am really sick of people slipping this marketing b.s. in at every opportunity.

[HysteryDiagnosis]

7. And forget hydrogen fuel. It’s bogus.<< Uh uh uh......

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/chronicle/archive/2000/01/29/MN76411.DTL&type=printable
The breakthrough, by scientists at the University of California at Berkeley and the U.S. Department of Energy, would make possible the commercial production of hydrogen gas by photosynthesis in tanks, ponds or the open ocean.

[Dangeresque]

9. The good news keeps on coming...

...we'll be able to give the Saudis the finger in no time.

[sandboxface]

13. This SOUNDS great, BUT

is still has to filter into our daily lives in order for it to have validity. This is an experiment done in lab. Making it a reality is much different.

There are just too many problems with hydrogen for it to be a real alternative to oil. Do you want to drive an automobile packed with compressed hydrogen gas? And how much is it going to cost in terms of money and energy? The same people who control our energy resources today want us to buy into the hydrogen plan because this is yet another way they can charge us for energy we cannot produce on our own. The same shit that is happening today (middle east, south america, etc.) will continue to happen in its own form under hydrogen.

We need a REAL alternative source and a new way of life.

[HysteryDiagnosis]

18. Answer....

There are just too many problems with hydrogen for it to be a real alternative to oil. Do you want to drive an automobile packed with compressed hydrogen gas? And how much is it going to cost in terms of money and energy?<<

You've got it all wrong. The Chrysler van the Millenium... uses a gel that won't offgas hydrogen until a metallic catalyst is inserted into it... hydrogen technology is SAFE. Carbon nanotubes absorb hydrogen and hold it at room temperature and pressure quite nicely... see a tiny bit of this information at

www.milleniumcell.com

they make the fuel system or at least the storage system for the Millenium van.....

[rman]

21. but can we get enough hydrogen production and infrastructure in time?

as of yet there is virtually no hydrogen production and virtually no suitable infrastructure, and we've got like 10 years at most till oil depletion will be a very serious problem.

[sandboxface]

24. I'd say 10 years is a generous estimate. EOM

[NickB79]

33. The link you posted is dead

Nothing there, only a domain name for sale.

Assuming the Millenium Cell delivers safe hydrogen storage, we also have to look at energy density issues. As I recall, hydrogen only has 1/4 the energy density of gasoline. This means you would either have to carry much more of it to get the same range as a conventional engine, or find a way to store it more compactly. What is the energy storage capacity on the Millenium Cell? How many miles per fill-up does the cell get?

[sandboxface]

14. I hope you all make an effort to see the movie

I thought it was great, and very disturbing. You don't find this topic being discussed anywhere. It's probably the most impending problem we have. I mean.. how can this be? You start talking about how corporations own the government and media, etc., which is all true, but really.. how can this topic be completely ignored? It affects everything we take for granted.

When I think about this, a word keeps standing out in my head: Mind Control.

I have these impressions that mind control is some sort of sci-fi fantasy, but now I'm beginning to think it isn't so far from reality. It may even be that most of our shared social reality is nothing but mind control, where you have corporations and politicians competing for your attention in the hopes that you will buy into their reality.

America is free
America is a democracy
America is a super power

Buy a house
Have children
Raise them right

Sure, we have our own thoughts, at least to a certain extent. The question I have is how much are our own thoughts influenced by 'their' reality?

[jdj]

17. I sure would like some serious attention paid to WHY it works so

well, as in what are the drives we share as a species that make us susceptible to all these kinds of conformism.

We're too busy being the ultra-sophisticated legend-in-our-own-mind homo "thinking man" sapien to really devote much energy to self-reflection.

[Beam Me Up]

19. Are you "open to suggestion"?

Everyone seems to be, and perhaps that is the problem.

Whoever controls your perception of reality controls you.

Look, PEAK OIL is a reality, there is no doubt about that and this reality will become increasingly clear as we move forward in the coming ten to twenty years. Will we develop alternative energy sources along the way? Of course. But will these new energy sources allow us to live in the completely irresponsible way that American society has been structured for the better part of the past half century? The answer is ABSOLUTELY NOT.

One way and another, to one extreme or another, the next few years are going to see SIGNIFICANT changes in our economic system and social infrastructure. THAT IS A FACT. The questions we need to be asking is, how are we going to address these problems -- and precisely WHO among us are we going to allow to make the policy decisions that DO address them.

Currently those making these policy decisions are nothing short of psychopaths. Their analysis appears to be THIS:

Peak Oil? What are you talking about. The problem isn't that there isn't enough hydrocarbon fuel sources. The problem is population growth, especially among brown, black and yellow races and impoverished countries without these resources. That is very easy to fix. Reduce the population density by 75% by starvation, war and disease over the next half century and the "oil problem" will be solved for the rest of us.

Calling them "Nazi's" isn't merely an extremely insulting figure of speech. Actually, it is quite an accurate match. This is what the ELITE's of our country have in store for the rest of the world, and a significant portion of our own population. Now that mechanization has taken command THEY NO LONGER REQUIRE THE WORKING CLASS.

All they need now is to implement the MYTHOLOGY which will become the HISTORY that future generations will use to understand what happened between our "now" and theirs.

EDIT TO ADD: 9/11 was the FIRST STEP in the creation of this MYTHOLOGY.

[robertpaulsen]

28. Some DU thoughts on mind control & peak oil, sandboxface.

You've started a great thread here, sandboxface, and very interesting that you would bring up these topics that I have seen discussed separately frequently, but rarely together.

I haven't seen the movie you described, but it sounds great. I did see Truth and Lies About 9/11, a film of Michael Ruppert's speech to Portland State University in November of 2001. In blaming dimson's misadministration for 9/11, one of the primary reasons he cited for their motivation was peak oil. I believe he said 2007 was the year he expected this to start affecting the economy, but it might have been 2012. I can't wait to read his new book Crossing the Rubicon, which should be coming out in October. I know he puts the blame for 9/11 squarely on Cheney.

Here are some DU threads on mind control:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1414094

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1917237


And some DU threads on peak oil:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1196017

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1209474

[sandboxface]

34. Thanks for these links!

Check the main thread to find a clip from the movie I added.

[sandboxface]

35. View a clip from the moive here - Hydrogen Fuel?

Clip:
http://www.aeschatech.com/medialibrary/endofsuburbia_hydrogen.mov

I'm telling you folks. Get the movie and screen it with your friends, family and neighbors.

http://www.endofsuburbia.com/

[sandboxface]

36. BLANK

20. Why tax breaks and low interest rates to buy huge SUVs now?

There should be RAGE. People are being sucked into this!

[UNIXcock]

22. See!

These are the issues we should be promoting

[lectrobyte]

25. Just kicking this one, I've seen the movie and while I thought it was

a little over the top in some places, I am convinced that peak oil will be *the* issue from here on. Definitely worth your time to seek this out and give it a viewing.

[Beam Me Up]

29. I've seen the movie too, and I highly recommend it to everyone.

No reservations about it. When you put this together with, say, "Hijacking Catastrophy" and/or "Uncovered" and "Outfoxed," they make one HELL of a Pollitical combination.

This is the new paradigm we're facing.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

26. a book everyone MUST read: "The Last Hours of Ancient Sunlight"..thanks...

for the post sandboxface!

btw i love your handle :7

[HootieMcBoob]

27. No screenings scheduled for NYC?

That's a bummer but in a way I can understand it. We don't drive cars everywhere the way that the rest of the country does. Maybe I'll have to suck it up and buy a DVD.

[robertpaulsen]

30. Keep this thread flaming! Read the Ruppert pdf link.

And if you're interested in more on Ruppert, here's a link courtesy of Minstrel Boy of a chapter of Ruppert's upcoming book Crossing the Rubicon.

http://www.newsociety.com/News/rub_war.pdf

[Tight_rope]

31. Kick for the ""TRUE" American Dream...."TO BE IN DEBT"

[sandboxface]

40. Thanks for the kick!!!

[sandboxface]

37. View a clip from the moive here - Hydrogen Fuel?

Clip:
http://www.aeschatech.com/medialibrary/endofsuburbia_hy ...

I'm telling you folks. Get the movie and screen it with your friends, family and neighbors.

http://www.endofsuburbia.com /

(Sorry for the double posting. I lost track of the message I was on.)

[fedsron2us]

38. Yes Peak Oil is coming but no one is discussing it

Apart that is from the endless threads on DU; the various Yahoo Energy message boards; ASPO; the numerous peak oil web sites; books by Heinberg, Roberts, Goodstein et all ; copious newspaper and magazine articles; programs on the BBC etc.

All you need to know is that we are running out of fossil fuels and no amount of hydrogen technology, bio mass fuels, wind, wave or solar power is going to save us. You just have to accept the fact that there is going to be a massive die off that will kill the bulk of the worlds population. Ultimately, the world will be brought back to its natural carrying capacity of 2 billion, 1 billion or 200,000 people (choose which you prefer). This mass slaughter will of course delight all the neo Malthusians who think there are far too many humans (that is brown, black and yellow people) on the planet. It will leave the Earth free to be enjoyed by the descendants of the super rich. They have been keen on the idea ever since they formed the Club of Rome and the Bilderberg group in the 20th century.

[Deja Q]

39. The wealthy elite know this already.

Big tax cuts, irresponsible debt, infinitely more irresponsible wars.

They refuse to be mature about it, nor do they want to lose their lifestyle.

Result? We are their cannon fodder.

Let's hope Toutatis does hit. The direct hit would be preferable to a lingering aftermath, in which we'd slowly freeze to death.