Poll for DUers who oppose same-sex marriage.

[truthspeaker]

Please pick the motivation for your position.

[Screaming Lord Byron]

1. I don't hate gay people, I just want to withhold legal rights from them

to shore-up my flagging ego. That, and if I'm not getting laid, no one else is either. :evilgrin:

[lumpy]

29. Why do people think being gay is

just about sex ? Is being heterosexual just about sex ? What does love have to do with it ?

[bryant69]

2. Yep

That covers the range of possible reasons people might have for opposing same sex marriage. You'd think there'd be more possibilities, but nope, there's only two. If you don't support gay marriage you are either an amoral political opportunist or a hate-filled bigot.

Simplicity itself.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[truthspeaker]

3. I can't think of any other possibility. Can you?

[bryant69]

4. Or, to put it another way

"Here, climb out on this limb so I can saw it off behind you."

I can, but I see little point in discussing with someone who is already clearly made up their mind and is going to ascribe any disagreement with the official party line to a flaw in my character. I mean, life's too short.

Bryant

[WillParkinson]

6. Well, I haven't made up MY mind...

Let me know what you think, please.

[bryant69]

9. My own opinion is eliminate all marriage

No marriages for anybody; everybody, both hetero and homo sexual has to have Civil Unions. Marriage is, in part, a religious ceremony and so should only be preformed by religions. If Church A will marry homosexuals, that's fine, and if Church B won't, than that's fine too. And if people want a civil union without a church marraige, than that's fine too. To each their own.

There are a lot of objections to Civil Unions on practical grounds, I contend that if everybody had to live under a civil union system, those problems would be fixed in a relatively short order.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[truthspeaker]

13. that's your suggestion, but what is your opposition to same-sex marriage?

I applaud you for suggesting a fair and just course of action (although I don't agree with it because as far as I'm concerned "civil union" is the definition of marriage from the government's point of view). But the poll asks, why are you opposed to same-sex marriage?

[bryant69]

17. Hmmmm.

Because I'm a bigot.

I don't think I am really, but it's just easier than giving a long discussion of religion and the intersection of personal belief and public policy, which would end up convincing you I was a bigot anyway. It's pretty clear what you think of people who don't support same-sex marriage.

I think you too quickly dismiss the implications of the Government using the Word Marriage to describe Civil Unions. They aren't the same thing. Marriage has been historically a religious ceremony with a number of meanings; civil unions is a more recent term, and has a more precise meaning.

Bryant

[AntiCoup2K4]

10. I agree with that statement, but what does it say about Kerry himself?

Kerry has made statements from both sides of the fence on this one. If I remember correctly, he was opposed to a national constitutional ammendment against gay marriage, but in favor of one in his own state, which would have been just as bigoted. If Kerry isn't a hate-filled bigot (and I don't believe that he is) then why should he pander to the bigot vote?

This is just one area of many where the Democratic candidate should cut the Repukes no slack whatsoever. There's no excuse for bigotry, and no excuse for making ANY group of Americans into second class citizens. And no excuse for the Democratic party to continue supporting such apartheid.

[Wickerman]

5. I don't know why you can't be more like the Republicans and respect

the foundation of our society - family values and the sanctity of marriage. Insert your own Dole, Reagan, Rush, and Gingrich jokes, its all too damn easy.

[malatesta1137]

7. this has GOT to be the dumbest poll ever

but it's Friday anyway.

Whoever is against gay marriage is in a colliding course against history. It's going to happen, it IS already happening, regardless, the same way interracial marriage became legal some 30 years ago.

on edit: how can you count gay DUers out of any gay-related issues?

[truthspeaker]

15. because I don't know of any gay DUers opposed to same-sex marriage

[onehandle]

8. The second choice should have been labeled....

"I'm a troll"

[DeadHead67]

11. A disturbing lack of options !

I HATE GAY PEOPLE?!!!! What the fuck kind of shit is that on a 'progressive' forum???!!!!

[Blue-Jay]

12. It's the kind of shit designed to provoke a lot of response.

You know....the "T" word...

[Deja Q]

27. "T", as in "Talk"?

Okay, you do mean Trolls...

These posts merely bring out the best and worst in people.

[truthspeaker]

16. I seriously cannot think of any other reasons besides these two.

If you've got one, I'd love to hear it. But I cannot think of any other reason to oppose same-sex marriage.

[Sapphocrat]

19. I can think of two other reasons...

...or rather, two groups of anti-gay factions with their own reasons:

1. Christians who are convinced that if they, personally, fail to "save" us sinful homos, they're going to hell right along with us. You know, the whole "love the sinner, hate the sin" thing. (I'm sure many of them really do hate us, and hide that hatred under the veil of religiosity, but it's impossible for me or anyone else to know what's really in a person's heart.)

2. Straight people who secretly fear that we'll do a better job of marriage than they've done. These people, I believe, are just generally insecure about absolutely everything.

Hey, I'm not saying these two groups are in the majority -- but Group 1 has a lot of subscribers, and the existence of Group 2 has been suggested by a few of our straight aliies who aren't afraid to admit that the "sanctity of marriage" argument against same-sex marriage is a total joke.

Then, of course, there is a large group of folks who don't really hate us, but just need to have something (in this case, legal marriage) to lord over us, in order to maintain the perception that they are at or near the top of the social heap. Queers, in this case, are just the most convenient target.

[gator_in_Ontario]

20. Yup

"Then, of course, there is a large group of folks who don't really hate us, but just need to have something (in this case, legal marriage) to lord over us, in order to maintain the perception that they are at or near the top of the social heap. Queers, in this case, are just the most convenient target."


Man kicks wife, wife kicks kids, kids kick dog....etc etc.
At least I'm better than somebody!

[Beloved Citizen]

14. I have nothing against same-sex marriage

Why should heterosexuals be the only ones to suffer the depredations of this archaic institution?

[Misunderestimator]

18. Oh, please.... a biased poll....

Either you're for it, but you don't give a damn about it, or your against it. Come on.

On edit... Now I read the thread title.... Sorry :) :hi:

[mellowinman]

21. I forbid liberals to be dumbasses

How in fuck can a liberal be against gay marriage?

Here's the deal:

If you're against gay marriage, go ahead and join free republic.

Dumbasses.

Sorry, but this makes me sick.

"I have a moral obligation to obstruct other peoples' rights."

Man, FUCK you!

[louis c]

22. Can't we try

a new approach, as Democrats. How's this suggestion? We attempt to make major changes AFTER we win an election.

[foreigncorrespondent]

23. How about...

... we strip you of your rights, and not return them until AFTER we win the election?

Willing to wait are you? That is a serious question, and one you cannot just answer off the top of your head without giving it some really deep thought first.

You are asking people who have been waiting for bloody years for rights they were BORN with but stripped of later in life, to wait a little longer. How dare you!

[louis c]

24. Read Barney Frank's opinion on this subject,

it's the same as mine. I'll take his over your's. You see, I want to win the war that will make you free forever, rather than win the battle and lose the war that gets those rights taken away. There will be no U.S. Constitutional amendment under a Kerry administration.

[sallyseven]

25. Don't you just love Barney.

He is my second most favorite Congressman. Jim McGovern is my first. He doesn't support a hate amendment.

[foreigncorrespondent]

28. Barney Frank doesn't actually...

...represent the entire community. He is one man with an opinion. Want an accurate account of how the LGBT community feels about waiting? Go into it and ask. The majority will tell you they are tired of waiting!

BTW nice of you to avoid my entire post, and talk about Barney Frank. That was a cop out to the tough question I asked.

On edit: Oh and also, there will be no same sex marriages under a Kerry government! Think we don't realize that? Think we are so bloody stupid? Believe me, I know lots of queerrs (including my own partner) who are gonna be holding their noses when they cast their votes for Kerry. So don't even go that route, without knowing how the community feels about it.

[sffreeways]

30. Yep

"gonna be holding their noses when they cast their votes for Kerry"

I am sick of it, sick to death of voting for the one that only wants to strip me of a little of my human dignity rather than all of it.

What's a homo to do ?

Bush must go.

[Deja Q]

26. I know a Democrat who hates gay people for real. Big-time.

Which is why I quietly broke off the business relationship, though I hardly used the gay card for that reason.

His brother told me my health would likely be in jeopardy if he found out.

And yet I don't hate him for who he is and what he stands for (he's African American and is big into the Islamic religion and is a dedicated father. All things considered, he's a decent human being.) I'm just angry that he'd consider physical violence as a solution as that diminishes his good qualities (which are very good qualities).

[Bluebear]

31. How can he be a 'decent human being' if he hates gay people "big-time"?