Does TKennedy need to cap his pie-hole...me thinks so

[digno dave]

It's my opinion that the comments about nothing changing in Abu Ghaib prison since Saddam was disposed was a bit extreme and over the top. To me, and most Americans i would think, this is political slumming at it's worst. I have been appreciative of most of the derogatory comments he has made about Bush and the war but i honestly believe these comments do no one any good. He can decry the action of the military intel gathering techniques without making such exagerated comments.
The soldiers who are there doing an admirable job would be offended and upset by these remarks and i can't say that i blame them.
Also, JKerry will automatically be associated with these comments becasue of his close ties with Kennedy and that can't do him any good.

For those who are going to jump my ass for saying this, these comments are akin to the political grandstanding that someone like TDelay would make if circumstances were reversed. Would we not be a tad bit upset with him? And no, i am not comparing Kennedy to Delay.

[Alerter_]

1. Saddam was supported by Rumsfeld

So what if it's true?

[radwriter0555]

83. KENNEDY ROCKS, he needs to YELL MORE OFTEN!

I LOVE that guy!

[el_gato]

2. why don't you provide some quotes

that way people can judge for themselves whether or not to "jump your ass"

[digno dave]

6. quote

I don't have the EXACT quote so i am not going go there.
It was widely broadcast a couple of days ago...i am sure most of us here have heard it. Someone.....
If you are implying i took it out of context, no, i don't believe i did.

[wtmusic]

26. this is pointless

hearsay...without a quote this thread is a waste of time

[el_gato]

30. no shit! If you can't even provide a quote why talk trash?

[digno dave]

107. quote

"Shamefully, we now learn that Saddam's torture chambers have re-opened under new management -- United States management."

[Screaming Lord Byron]

113. What's objectionable about that?

We've seen the photos. Those Iraqis were tortured. Hence, it's a torture chamber.

[el_gato]

116. nothing objectionable about it, since it's the damn truth

I thought when Saddam was gone there would be no more torture! LOL!

[immoderate]

3. I have never been impressed

with Kennedy's brilliance. His main virtue is he can reliably deny that senate seat to a Repug.

--IMM

[napi21]

4. Yes he was grandstanding, but sometimes there has to be

someone on our side to return the punches with the same force they were delivered. Teddy does get carried away sometimes, but I think he's expected to do that, the same way Delay and several other Pubs are expected to do so.

We all know them.. When you see some particular faces approach the mike, you groan and say oh boy, this idiot again.

Let Teddy go. sometimes over the top remarks allow the rest to settle down to the more reasonable midpoint.

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[CatWoman]

8. God didn't make little green apples

and it don't rain in Indianapolis

In the summer time..................

[Gynerrhagia]

13. I love those pictures of your kitties.

Now where is my wok?

[CatWoman]

22. whatcha gonna cook in it

your goose?

[Gynerrhagia]

37. You're witty and I like that.

Rather than get all outraged at my comment, you responded in the joking spirit in which it was made.

God, I love women who can give it back.

[thebigidea]

43. venereal disease: the gift that keeps on giving

[thebigidea]

49. venereal disease: the gift that keeps on giving

[sangh0]

66. That's because

you've never heard her cackle.TMOT

[CatWoman]

68. ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:hi:

*cackled CatWoman*

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

33. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Gynerrhagia]

62. "His" name?

What's the prob, honey, etymology not your forte? You don't think women should be allowed an outflowing of emotion, rage, or what have you? Got to be creative, sweetcakes. -rrhagia meant as a figurative term (that means not necessarily literal).

As for my sig line, you don't like Nader? Is that it?

And finally, my don't we make sexist assumptions? "his"

[Name removed]

Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[digno dave]

74. Appasrently, assumptions are quite commonplace on this board...

makes me wonder.

[Gynerrhagia]

81. Yep.

A lot of assumptions. Not a lot of critical thinking

[gratuitous]

58. Hey, I'm in charge of gratuitous input around here!

Looks like this comes under the heading of my department . . .

{Adjusts hat, saddles up Topper}

[CatWoman]

60. hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

:hi:

[Flubadubya]

90. No slight intended gratuitous... LOL!!!

More power to ya! Go get 'em Sheriff! :evilgrin:

[gratuitous]

98. I figured that

It's only people who want to get on my good side who use the term "jerkwad."

On an unrelated note, I marvel at what some people will do when the carefully constructed fantasy they've surrounded themselves with comes crashing down around their ears. Well, at least they're just trolling internet message boards instead of shooting up neighborhoods.

{Pats Catwoman on the head, kisses horse, rides off into the sunset}

[gratuitous]

20. Hrrr, hrrr, hrrr

Objects in mirror may not be as clever as they think they are.

[thebigidea]

10. comments of your sort just serve to fuel more Bush atrocities

[RoyGBiv]

12. Well that's absurd. n/t

[alpizzy]

46. Rainbow - physics 101

red
orange
yellow
green
blue
indigo
violet

[Jacobin]

15. Comments like yours emboldened the american army of

empire to conquer more countries for their resources and in the process create more atrocities.

Why do you think its dangerous in america right now for a senator to tell the truth?

Is it better to live a lie?

[Gynerrhagia]

77. That's right

Our goal is to make Iraq our 51st state.

Gotta love the 'imperialism' folks. Sorry, but this ain't the Spanish American War. Your argument would have had some validity if it were 1898.

[thebigidea]

87. your argument would have validity if PNAC, Halliburton, and Chalabi...

... somehow didn't exist. You might want to peddle your nonsense elsewhere.

Godblessmerica!

[ima_sinnic]

16. yeah, that's a good way to stifle criticism <sarcasm>

... any criticism of what's going on in Iraq can be painted as "giving more propaganda to al-Qaeda." so let's stop speaking out against whatever The Naked Ape has wrought there, okay? </sarcasm>

btw, the REALITY of the Iraq MESS is fuel enough for al-Qaeda, don't you think? they don't need to listen to TKennedy sound-bites for their material.

[Gynerrhagia]

91. I just think of that poor beheaded boy and his family

And the professed Al-Queda rationale for committing this horrible crime. These are the thugs that did 9-11, remember? Why on earth would we like to provide them with moral cover for their hideous deeds?

[el_gato]

95. The whole thing stinks to high heaven

Why the hell are you spewing this "moral cover" line? It's bullshit.

Now as far as Al Queda is concerned, it sure seems to me like they conveniently help bush when he needs it most.

Remember when bush went over to visit tony blair and londoners toppled that statue of bush? Well, whatayaknow, Bombings in Istanbul at the exact right time.

This berg video smells funny if you ask me. Especially considering he was being held by the FBI right before it happened.

[Mandate My Ass]

101. It's a fallacious argument

Cut from the same idiotic cloth that if you were against the Iraq invasion, you are a supporter of Saddam Hussein.


Boring and predictable.

[ima_sinnic]

120. I have my doubts about that

--the whole world was sympathizing with Iraq after the Abu Ghraid photos and angry at Bush/USA. Why would "al Qaeda" (I use the term hypothetically since I don't really know what or even IF it is) wantonly turn that anger toward themselves? As a Middle Easterner noted in one of the news articles summarizing Arab-world reaction to the beheadings, "it benefited only Bush."

Other anomalies: a Russian speaker among the murderers, saying "do it quickly" or some such in Russian as the knife was drawn, the orange (US-issue) jumpsuit, the lack of thrashing or involuntary drawing away by Berg, the scream dubbed into the tape, the LIE by the US (FBI?) that Berg had not been in US custody, the knife used and style of cutting was NOT Middle Eastern, lack of blood that would go with a true beheading, speculation that Zacqawari (sp?) has been dead since March. I believe that Berg was murdered sometime before the prison photos were released (he was missing before then) and the thing was a psy-ops fake al Qaeda staged "murder by beheading." I think he was beheaded sometime after his death and his body conveniently dumped at the right time to distract from the prison photos. Poor Nick Berg was nothing but damage control for Bush, in my opinion, as well as further incitement of hatred toward anybody Middle Eastern/Iraqi.

[maggrwaggr]

21. Oh God. Aren't you on the wrong board?

Puh - leeeeez

Oh, I know. You're being sarcastic. :eyes:

[bobbyboucher]

59. Gawd, what horseshit. You guys sound

like a broken record. This will aid the enemy. That will give Al CIAda motivation. Why don't you just say what you really want every American to do, just let the Bush cabal kill whomever they want whenever they want, steal whatever oil they want, overthrow any government they want and keep shopping.

Quit with the parrot bullshit, its annoying.

[lojasmo]

127. sniff sniff

I smell a troll. This is the same crap all the right wing pundits are trying to cram down our throats. Why don't you visit freerepublic.org ? Your views will fit right in there, sport.

[Q]

7. Bullshit...

...if our representatives don't speak out...then no one will. It would seem that some don't want any criticism of this president...even if that criticism is based in fact. What Kennedy said was true. Bush* attacked Iraq...in part...to 'close down' the prisons that tortured prisoners in Saddam's name. Now American troops are torturing in Bush's* name. What the fuck is the difference?

- I'm proud of Kennedy for speaking out and not being afraid of the fascists running this country.

[digno dave]

11. There may be SOME truth in his words...

but beleive me, it doesn't help Kerry to have his closest buddy up there saying shit like that.

[Q]

17. You're the one...

...that's 'saying shit'. That you give a shit what the RWingers think is besides the point. Kennedy has the right and responsibility to say these things. The corporate media sure isn't going to point out the obvious.

- Why would the words of others hurt Kerry? Few here will fall for this guilt by association gambit.

[cosmicdot]

18. how do you know that it doesn't help?

He's exposing the hypocrisy of the Iraqi Operation ...

I wish more Senators would be as bold as Senators Byrd and Kennedy ... we've been asking for voices since the Coup of 2000 ...

[JI7]

19. Kerry put up Kennedy's last anti Bush speech on his website

so i'm not sure if it hurts kerry in any way.

[FreeSpeechCrusader]

44. From what you've posted about his comments...

I find them to be truthful, and I do not see them doing harm to Kerry. Someone has to point out the ironic nature of our "liberating Iraq" while still doing atrocious deeds to the citizens that we are supposedly "liberating." And with Kennedy doing it for Kerry, Kerry can continue campaigning positively.

[Gynerrhagia]

23. You are essentially saying the tortures represent overall US policy

which you and I know is ridiculous. These atrocites were caused by a group of rogue soldiers coupled with inattention from commanding officers.
Tell me what service Kennedy's remarks perform? Do they assist in the safety of the vast majority of good people in Iraq? Do they help or hurt the cause of Al-Queda?

[CatWoman]

32. rut roh

the "rogue soldiers" meme is taking off.

ZOOM...............

[thebigidea]

39. Its just a few bad apples!

And when I say there were absolutely no orders given to treat prisoners this way, I'm saying that there were a CERTAIN AMOUNT of orders given.

[library_max]

128. The "few bad apples argument"

is like saying that the 9/11 bombers were just a few bad apples and not representative of Al-Qaida as a whole.

[sangh0]

134. Only illiterates use the "few bad apples" argument

because it's full meaning reveals that those "few" bad apples end up making ALL of the apples go bad.

If they were truly literate in English, they'd use "bottom of the barrel"

[Flubadubya]

35. Anything that will hasten our departure from Iraq...

will be for the good of the Iraqi people. It will likely even help in our fight against Al-Qaeda (provided this misadministartion's attention is finally focused there... and not on plundering Iraq)!!!

[Bridget Burke]

45. Can SOMEBODY supply a link to Kennedy's remarks?

From what I've heard from him in the past, he was probably quite correct. You apparently fear that they might hurt the cause of your little president. Good for Senator Kennedy.

And where did you get your name? It sounds like some especially vicious STD.

[City Lights]

99. See post 93. n/t

[Webster Green]

47. How do you know it was a bunch of rogue soldiers?

Because uncle Rummy said so? This kind of shit happens daily in our own correctional facilities, so its not a stretch to imagine it is widespread in Iraq. Keep in mind that these soldiers have been brainwashed into thinking they are actually fighting terrorists who attacked us on 9/11.

[Bridget Burke]

50. Can SOMEBODY supply a link to Kennedy's remarks?

From what I've heard from him in the past, he was probably quite correct. You apparently fear that they might hurt the cause of your little president. Good for Senator Kennedy.

And where did you get your name? It sounds like some especially vicious STD.

[el_gato]

Do you honestly believe this invasion has anything to do with helping Iraq

quite naive at best

Saddam was a U.S. sponsored puppet that went rogue just like Noriega.
He was the perfect bogey man given the corporate propaganda that has been shove down the throat of the American people for the past 12 years.

It's kinda funny that when Saddam was actually accused of gassing the Kurds it was Bush Sr. and Rummy who were defending him. It wasn't until he decided to play his own game that this group in the WH turned on him. They didn't give a rats ass about the Iraqi people back then and they don't now.

Here's a good historical primer if you want to start to acutally get informed:

http://fas.org/spp/starwars/congress/1992/h920224g.htm

[el_gato]

54. This invasion has nothing to do with helping the Iraqi people

Saddam was a U.S. sponsored puppet that went rogue just like Noriega.
He was the perfect bogey man given the corporate propaganda that has been shove down the throat of the American people for the past 12 years.

It's kinda funny that when Saddam was actually accused of gassing the Kurds it was Bush Sr. and Rummy who were defending him. It wasn't until he decided to play his own game that this group in the WH turned on him. They didn't give a rats ass about the Iraqi people back then and they don't now.

Here's a good historical primer if you want to start to acutally get informed:

http://fas.org/spp/starwars/congress/1992/h920224g.htm

[bobbyboucher]

64. Wrong again, buffalo breath, it IS policy and you know it.

So GFY.

[atreides1]

72. "Rogue Soldiers"

Here we go again with the "rogue soldiers" gambit. Do you really believe that what they did wasn't countenanced by the chain of command.

So 6-8 Army Reservists, none of whom had any experience with the cultural norms of an Islamic people, knew what to do to shame these
men and women. All by themselves they sexually abused women and children, it was their idea to use dogs, which are considered unclean
in the Muslim world, to frighten the prisoners.

The problem with your idea is that LTG Sanchez at the recommendation
of MG Miller, the former commander of GITMO, issued a Fragmentary Order placing the MI Brigade in charge of the prison.

MG Miller was sent to Iraq by Dr Cambone, the SecDef in charge of intelligence, to implement the use of intelligence gathering that
he used while commanding GITMO. MG Miller was there during the time that these abuses took place.

This shows a direct line from Abu Ghraib to the Pentagon, yet only
the reservists are being court martialed, and most of the higher ranking officers only received a slap on the wrist.

As for what Senator Kennedy said, as far as I'm concerned he's right, and he has the right to say it. That's what free speech is all about.

[DenverDem]

9. In your opinion the prison has changed substantively how?

There is no way that Ted could ever compete with the reprehensible, prevaricating, treasonous "political slumming" of the wrong wing radical anti-American corporate globalist traitors apologizing for our military's immoral abuses.

[digno dave]

14. well, theoretically speaking, i would guess that

fewer people have been killed in that prison in one year than the number in that same time span would have been killed by Saddam. Just an assumption.

[Q]

24. If we're the 'good guys'...we shouldn't be killing anyone...

...especially those under our protection. What the hell is wrong with America when we have to apologize for the Bush* cabal?

[Toucano]

48. Right again, Q!

What the hell does the quantity have to do with it?

It the systematic way it happened.

Murder, rape and torture aren't judged on the "golf scale".

[el_gato]

28. Saddam was installed by the CIA and supported by Reagan

so you can't hide behind the "Saddam is a bad man" routine.

[gulfcoastliberal]

79. You're Good at That

Making unsubstantiated "assumptions" So you assume Saddam would've killed 10,000+ innocent Iraqis over the last year?

[Webster Green]

85. Great!.......We're better than Sadaam......

Seems like the bar has been lowered quite a bit since chimpy got selected.

[library_max]

129. A pretty wild-eyed assumption.

Based on "facts" provided by the administration that lied to the UN about WMD and still won't even count the number of civilian casualties in Iraq.

[birdbrain]

136. There you go again.

Why do freepers insist on using Saddam Hussein and/or Al Qaeda as a standard for comparison, i.e., the "at least we're not as bad as Saddam Hussein" argument. What does that make Bush - Saddam Lite?

How many people SHOULD the US government have abused/tortured/killed in Abu Ghraib? Zero! It doesn't matter what anybody else did.

Poof! Be gone!

[Racenut20]

25. I can remember people worried about Teddy speaking out

Just because he was seen as wealthy.
He probably has a pretty good idea as to where his retoric goes and what effect it might have. We need about 10 more speaking out against the wHouse criminals on a daily basis.

[Hotler]

29. I don't always agree with Teddy,

but, he's one of the few Dem's on the hill that isn't afraid to stand up to those crackers on the other side of the isle. He's had some good speeches in the past. He's allowed to blow one once in awhile.

[digno dave]

34. agree

Like i said, for the most part he has been right on when blasting Bush but i think this satement was over the top and miscalculated.

[Q]

36. How the hell did he blow it?

- Can you dispute what he said? The fact remains that the very prison that was notorious for torturing Iraqi citizens is now being used by American forces to...torture Iraqi citizens.

- Sometimes the truth has to be said...even if it's painful.

[ibegurpard]

109. relax

it looks like we have some tag-teaming going on.

[maggrwaggr]

31. Tell me how this picture is better than what Saddam did

Sarah Haider, a wounded eight-year-old Iraqi girl, sits in a hospital bed after her house was destroyed in an overnight air strike, which killed her both parents, in Najaf, May 12, 2004. U.S. troops killed at least 20 militiamen loyal to rebel Shi'ite cleric Moqtada al-Sadr in fierce fighting in the Iraqi city of Kerbala, a senior U.S. military officer said. REUTERS/Faleh Kheiber

&e=4

Feel free to rate the picture. Everybody should see what we're doing in Najf

[digno dave]

40. good point, but I thought we were discussing the PRISON ABUSE ISSUE

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[dmr]

41. Those soldiers would probably agree with Kennedy

Haven't you been listening to the soldiers who are brave enough to speak out? THEY HAVE NO LEADERSHIP!

Kennedy isn't political slumming - that's the Bushco* forte.

I for one WANT Kennedy and our other elected leaders to shout at the top of their lungs. I, as an American am screaming! There are no exaggerated comments as you suggest, this whole scenario is painfully real.

[Spoon]

42. Equating Saddam's mass murders and the humiliation

of SOME prisoners by a few of our soldiers is wrong and offensive. "Over the top" for sure Dave, and very disrespectful of the 99.9% of our troops that are serving with honor. I know this is a Bush admin line, but it's one I unequivocally agree with.

[Q]

55. What the hell is going on at DU?

- First of all...the title to this thread is very offensive...telling one of the brightest Democratic Senators to shut his 'pie hole' is insulting to all Democrats and democracy itself.

- Some of you are distorting his words and making it sound like something he didn't say. Stick with the facts. The same prison that was used for the purpose of torture is still open and under the control of American forces.

- I don't blame this on all the troops. I blame it on those who performed these vile acts and their friggin 'COMMANDER IN CHIEF'...the chickenshit that loves to order people into (illegal) wars but was too cowardly to fight in one himself.

[Bridget Burke]

63. They're getting nervous.

And thinking we won't recognize the talking points.

Some achieve a tombstone immediately; for others, it takes a while.

[Spoon]

80. I guess you have no family in the military, Mrs Burke.

I'm against the war, but support the troops. I abhor comments such as TK's - It's politiking at it's worst...

[Screaming Lord Byron]

86. Why? The truth is the truth, no matter how unpalatable.

Shouldn't we condemn and in doing so, defend the honor of decent, ordinary soldiers?

[Spoon]

97. How about "I condem the the mismanagement

of the Bush Admin and the actions of a few of our troops", not the ugly blanket statement? What Hussein did and what has occurred at the prison in the past year do not equate, period. It's statements like his which will cause shit being thrown at soldiers returning home from Iraq. Do any of you care???

[Screaming Lord Byron]

102. They do equate, I'm afraid. I see no difference.

I don't see how we can be held responsible for what others may do to the troops. I won't be flinging any shit.

[Webster Green]

96. ANY criticism of ChimpCo Inc. is labeled "playing politics"...

by the right wing nut jobs.

It is pretty stupid to "support" the troops, regardless of what atrocities they might commit.

[Bridget Burke]

125. My cousin is in the Navy.

His father served in the Navy after WWII & had a career in the FBI. His other son is now in the FBI.

Two other uncles served in the 8th Air Force during WWII & stayed in until retirement--one commissioned, one not. My father was also in the Mighty 8th. He was called back to active duty when I was 6 weeks old & died in a plane crash more than 50 years ago.

I support the troops. Those who did wrong must be court martialed. But the chicken-hawk fuckers who got them in this situation must pay the price, too. If a loss in November is the worst they have to face, they're far too lucky. If politicking is what it takes, then I say we politick. And Ted is an old pro.

[ibegurpard]

92. Yup

don't buy it. It's like playing whack-a-mole. they think we're as stupid as their fellow freepers.

[Spoon]

75. The Quote

"Shamefully, we now learn that Saddam's torture chambers have re-opened under new management -- United States management."

http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&edition=us&ie=ISO-8859-1&scoring=d&q=Kennedy+Abu+management.&btnG=Search+News

[Screaming Lord Byron]

78. I approve that comment wholeheartedly. Anyone else?

[birdbrain]

137. It IS shameful.

Where's the lie in that sentence?

[CatWoman]

56. Not as offensive as the thousands that we bombed into oblivion

Drop bad habits -- not bombs.

[library_max]

130. What mass murders are those?

You mean the Iran-Iraq War, Desert Storm, or the Kurdish uprising? Or are you just buying any horseshit that comes out of the Bush administration these days? We know they lied despicably about WMD - any reason to think the "mass murder" stories are any more true?

[displacedtexan]

51. Ted is destroying rightwing talking point #1

which states that JK is even MORE LIBERAL than Kennedy!

By allowing JK to take a stand TO THE RIGHT OF KENNEDY, THAT TALKING POINT IS MADE MOOT.

Thanks for playing.

[digno dave]

52. interesting point, but made valid only

if Kerry publicly distances himself from those comments. I doubt that.

[CatWoman]

65. Dave -- you confuse me

are you this critical of Zell Miller or Joe Lieberman when they publically suck Bush's dick?

Do you think they should shut their "pie holes" when they do that?

And they do it a lot. They seem to actually enjoy it.

[Name removed]

70. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[digno dave]

82. actually, Lieberman COMPLETELY lost my respect

with his comments at the Rumsfeld hearing last week...when he wondered where the apologies were from the "terrorist".
Miller, well, he's a lost cause so i don't concern myself with him. I expect better from Kennedy, however, and maybe that is why is chose to pick on him.

[Bunny]

88. Holy Christ Catwoman!

"publically suck Bush's dick?"

I just spewed salad all over my monitor and keyboard! You gotta warn someone when you're gonna say that! :7

[CatWoman]

108. bwahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

:evilgrin:

[el_gato]

67. this whole invasion was immoral and wrong

and now u.s. forces are torturing people

how can you defend that?

This whole affair has destroyed U.S. credibility on a global level and has put a very ugly face on U.S. foreign policy.
Not only that, but in terms of the realpolitik definintion of credibility, (i.e. "defy us and we will crush you"), the U.S. has blown it. Now we have our military being sucked down a black hole and other actors on the global level do not feel so afraid anymore.

As well, I don't give a flying fuck what some right-wing crybaby thinks.

[Dees]

53. Ted can speak for me any old day. He's

been an outspoken thorn in the side of Repukes for decades. Rave on Ted. Better Kennedy than Joe "wrong party" Lieberman and Zell "knee pads" Miller.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

57. HELL NO!.....scream it from the fucking rooftops! I'm sick of the repuke

talking points be disseminated here....and letting Sean Insanity and O'Really and Rush Cycistass dictating what our democratic reps should and should not be saying

fuck me twice i am so angry!!!


........okay OKAY ....i will now take slow deep breathes

[Lou_C]

61. The right wingers hate Kennedy and he has a big mouth

I hope that he uses it and we all need to speak up.

Why should we shut up now?

[Q]

69. That's exactly what the RWingers are attempting to do...

...shut us up with threats and accusations of 'helping the enemy'. Once again I say bullshit...the Bush* cabal has finally been exposed for the immoral bastards they are and we're not going to let them escape accountability THIS time.

- NO MORE!

[Junkdrawer]

71. Limbaugh DEMANDED an apology yesterday....

:eyes:

[Name removed]

73. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ibegurpard]

76. Thank God there are a few Democrats left who don't listen to such advice

Otherwise we'd be left with NOTHING but a party of daschleweenies.

[digno dave]

Ironically, the Senator who has impressed my the most during

this whole thing is McCain. I guess to some on this board that is tantamount to treason. The SC Senator(JAG Officer dude) has handled it well also, but i still am leary of his true motives.

[ibegurpard]

94. Not surprising

eom

on edit: the senator from SC? Are you talking about Lindsay Graham? One of the prominent Clinton cock-hunters? That senator? Your choice of senators to admire is quite telling.

[digno dave]

104. as i said...I still question his motives

You can argue, however, that Graham has been as forthcoming about examining the abuse as most anyone. Last i saw, he wanted ALL pics made available to the public.

[Q]

100. McCain was one of the main driving forces behind...

...the illegal attack on Iraq. He suggested that it would be a cakewalk. He's a RWing apologist who has twinges of conscience now and then and says something appealing. But he's still a traitor to our Country and Constitution for his support of wars of aggression.

[Sparkly]

84. I'm glad he's speaking in strong terms

about this. However, I'd like to see a direct quote. Anybody have one, or a link?

[spanone]

89. I support Senator Kennedys outrage! Scream on Ted!!!!

[City Lights]

93. Kennedy quote from Crossfire transcript:

"Shamefully, we now learn that Saddam's torture chambers reopened under new management, U.S. management."

BTW, Senator Kennedy doesn't have a "piehole."

[Sparkly]

103. Totally appropriate statement, imho

[IHaveADream]

105. Kennedy rules.

He is the conscience of America!

[el_gato]

106. Kennedy is correct on this one

Bush has totally blown any pretense to the moral high-ground.

They all whined and cried about Saddam's evil torture, not that
they actually gave a shit (the historical record proves otherwise).
And now, they are over there doing the exact same shit they
where whining about.

It is always the case that Bushco does exactly what they accuse others of.

[CWebster]

110. I'll bet the DLC doesn't like it when Kennedy speaks out either.

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0512-14.htm

Surely Kennedy never had to struggle with the question. And you?

[Octafish]

111. LMFAO. That's just what Karl Rove thinks.

Kennedy's done more to advance the Constitution of the United States than anybody involved in making those stacks of naked men or posing for the photos. Same goes for the turds of the BFEE who ordered them to do so.

As for mentioning Tom DeLay: FUCK HIM, TOO!

[Zorra]

117. Lol - yep. Did this topic come from rushlimbaugh.com?

Because if you googlenews "kennedy torture chamber" it is the first item in the googlenews list - from rushlimbaugh.com.

[Octafish]

121. VRWC is very up on using "catchy phrases."

That helps the turds of the BFEE cover up all the truth, let alone people, they kill. Must be part of the giant brainwashing thing.



SENATOR ISELIN
There's just one thing, babe. I'd
be a lot happier if we could just
settle on the number of Communists I
know there are in the Defense
Department.

Mrs. Iselin gives him a withering look as he sits down to his lunch of steak and baked potato.

SENATOR ISELIN
I-I mean, the way you keep changing
the figures on me all the time,
it-it makes look like-like some kind
of a nut, like-like-like an idiot.
The boys are even startin' to kid me
about it. Why, just yesterday in
the cloak room, they said: "Hey,
Johnny!"--

[Wapsie B]

112. In the words of the Honorable Senator from Iowa, Tom Harkin,

Bullshit. For the longest time we've had many getting after Dems for not holding chimpy accountable and not standing up to the repugs.
I say not only does Teddy NOT have to shut up, his voice needs to lead to a chorus of Democrats standing up to and going toe to toe with the repugs on everything. The time for playing nice has long since past. We need to take our country back.

[Room101]

114. If more Democrats were like Kennedy I would be a DEM

I don't agree with him all the time but more often than not he speaks the hard to hear truth!

[the_real_38]

115. I think Kennedy's people in Massachussetts really like him...

.... he reminds me of the Yankee version of Strom Thurmond, without the hypocritical white supremacy thing.

He's just a guy who says what's on his mind, and people like that. And I wonder if a lot of this 'over-the-top' stuff he has said, like Iraq being "a fraud cooked up in Texas" and "George Bush's Vietnam" aren't going to turn out to be true.

The guy's got rocks, and he's on the right side (the left one).

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

118. He saw 1600 pictures that you didn't. You are assuming facts not in

evidence..BTW...did you happen to catch McCain on Letterman last night? He was a prisoner of war and said nothing like this had ever happened to him....does he need to cap his pie hole too?

Our soldiers are over there WAY too long...some are doing admirable jobs..others are just turning into the animal their full potential will allow them to be.

I think the only pie hole with unfounded accusations of grandstanding happens to be the one that started this thread.

There are reports of soldiers posing with a dead body where the face was undistinguishable....

Can you say without a shadow of a doubt that MORE people would have died over the last 14 months in Iraq than if Saddam had remained in power? I can't.

[ParanoidPat]

119. So his speaking the TRUTH bothers you because..................?

:shrug: I see it this way, we've been in Iraq for just over 1 year. In that time, we've killed at least 10,000 innocent civilians who's only 'crime' was that they were born into a country that lived under a repressive regime. How many innocent civilians did Saddam kill in any given year?

While we've been in charge there, we've rounded up thousands of men, woman, and yes, even children and held them without charge because they might harbor a different political ideology than our own. Saddam used to do the same. Published reports claim that at Abu Ghaib prison alone we've held up to 20,000 people, and according to the Red Cross, some 70% to 90% of them were erroneously taken into custody. How many people a year did Saddam arrest without charge and hold in prison?

While holding those people in prison without charge, at the very least, 25 have died in our custody. How many people a year died in those prisons while under Saddam's care?

It's been proved that while being held in prison without charge, some of the innocent people in our care were subjected to rape, both physical and psychological torture, and even death, by the more radical elements of our armed forces simply because they were perceived to be 'the enemy'. The same used to happen under Saddam.

So tell me, to those innocents who we rounded up, held without charge, beat, raped, tortured and even killed, do you think that they see any difference on the ground there between our forces and Saddam's other than that under Saddam, they had intact homes, jobs, businesses, functioning water and electrical systems and no terrorists operating in their country?

Try putting yourself in their (the victims) sandals for a moment and ask yourself, do they see any difference between our forces and Saddam's? Do they feel like they're better off now than they were 2 years ago? :(

[Old and In the Way]

122. Me thinks not.

I don't understand why Republicans hate America so much. Maybe you can explain why:

a) Republicans are not demanding impeachment of a pResident who did nothing to stop 9/11 and the killing of 3000 Americans.
b) Republicans allow Bush to blame 9/11 on Iraqi's, knowing the facts say Saudi Arabia.
c) Republicans support Bush's lies to Congress, the UN, and the American people on WMD to justify this invasion.
d) Republicans support torture of Iraqis at the hands of Americans, further destroying our international reputation.

Why do Republicans support a compromised, morally deficient pResident over the interests of our country? Why do Republicans hate America so much?

[Fla Dem]

123. Go Teddy Go !!!!

Been a Kennedy supporter since a teenager in Massachusetts. Have a picture I took of Ted and his then wife Joan in our town's 4th of July parade. Ted has always been like the kid in the family that continues to get into all sorts of trouble, but in the end is the one with the heart of gold. He has always stuck his neck out for what was right, whether it was civil rights, the unions and working people, health care and education. This is a man who dearly and deeply CARES about America. He wears his heart on his sleeve. Ted can say anything he wants. It's too bad we don't have more like him in government.

[Selwynn]

124. Kennedy's comments are dead on, however -

...I don't trust his reasons or motivations for saying them.

[indigo32]

126. Teddy Rocks

I hope he remains a huge thorn in the side of Republicans for many more years to come.

[Nimble_Idea]

131. I think someone else needs to cap his pie-hole.....

And it ain't me and Kennedy.

:puke:

[Bridget Burke]

133. I think you're right!

Of course, it would be impolite to name names....

[Media_Lies_Daily]

135. Bingo! Well said!

[corporatewhore]

132. So bush's rape rooms are better?And no the soliders are not doing an

admirable job there.They are rapists , one of the lowest scum of human beings,over there.

[genius]

138. Kennedy was right. This needed to be said.

I think it is disgusting that centrists and right-wingers want to silence our more brilliant Democrats. Kennedy was right. The truth needs to be said.