Bartcop might be onto something re fat al Qaeda

[Jersey Devil]

From Bartcop at http://www.bartcop.com :

"Have you ever seen Iraqis or Al Qaeda who needed Atkins?
These are some portly dudes - does Iraq have portly dudes? Does Al Qaeda?

Would it be out of line to wonder if those guys are CIA or portly killers hired by the CIA to get the prison pictures off the front page and remind a sceptical electorate that we're dealing with savage killers who must be dealt with extra-harshly and that
George W Bush is the only man for this tough job?

And before you say, "the BFEE would never sanction a murder," let me remind you that they are NOT going to turn power over to John Kerry if the Diebold machines malfunction and actually allow a free and honest counting of the votes.

Right now, they have unlimited money and unlimited power. If they can retain unlimited money and unlimited power by beheading some nobody (apologies to the victim's family) they'll do that without giving it a second thought.

If you're still not convinced, just break it down to its simplest form: Would evil men kill to get or keep unlimited money and unlimited power?"

You can't seriously entertain answering "No" to that question.

[theivoryqueen]

1. every male I know who saw the pix

said the same thing: they are built like americans. This was a totally unprompted comment, and extraordinarily common among guys. I hadn't even noticed the "build" of the monsters.

[ArkDem]

5. How are americans built?

Like Mike Tyson?

Like Don Knott?

Like Kobe Bryant?

Like Rush Limpballs?

Like John Kerry?

I'm confused...

[TheDebbieDee]

10. The average westerner is stocky and robust, very well-fed.....

like the men in the videotape.

The average Arab, or SWAsian, while not emaciated, is very lean, thin.

[ArkDem]

13. Your knowledge astounds me.

.

[TheDebbieDee]

20. Sorry that you're so easily astounded........

I was just voicing my thoughts as everyone else on this board is allowed to do.

[seemslikeadream]

16. Well the ones that work for private military companies look like this

[aquart]

2. Is the weight caused by body armor?

They seem to be wearing vests of some kind.

And, this is becoming my mantra, it is RACIST to assume that "brown people" are incapable of independent thought or action.

I assure you, if our boys had done it, they would have also desecrated the genitals in what they believe would be a Muslim action.

What we were shown, what the Arab world was shown, was the civilized forebearance of the Iraqis, who merely killed the American.

Oh, and the Arabs are Semites who have a body type that absolutely runs to fat. You really shouldn't just watch the lithe young men.

[charlie]

12. Your mantra

has the sweet smell of straw.

No one says "brown people" are too inept to organize a decapitation party. What some people say, however, it might be that they didn't do it.

[Wonk]

15. Those vests look like common AK-47 chest magazine holders

http://www.ak-47.us/Ammo.htm
These are commonly referred to as a chestbag or chestpouch. It is worn strapped around the wearer's chest with the straps crossing in the back. It holds three, 30 round, AKM or AK47 magazines in the three front pockets. The two pouches on each side will hold extra 7.62x39mm ammunition, grenades and/or the oil/solvent bottle.

[girl gone mad]

3. 1. They are wearing baggy clothes.

2. Yes, I have seen overweight AQ members.

[movonne]

6. Where have you seen them...maybe one, maybe two, but all..

of them, does make you wonder.

[Az]

4. Cultural body language and ADHD

Different cultures exhibit different body language. We become acustomed to our own particular language and uncomfortable in the presense of distinctly different forms. The Japanese for example are very affected by individuals that use large hand gestures while talking.

One of the factors that can distinguish western civilization is the higher rate of Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder. Likely due to the prevelance of TV in our societies it results in inability to stand still. Looking around. General discomfort at the idea of standing still.

In fundimentalist Muslim cultures you will find people from the opposite extreme. Having partaken in extensive prayer sessions and other meditative practices they are used to remaining still. Sudden motions and nervous actions become distracting to them.

The motions of the attackers are much more in common with someone from a western society. They exhibit behaviour consistant with ADHD in their inability to hold still while waiting for the document to be read. It is expected that we in the west would pick up on these behaviours.

This is of course supposition. Without further evidence it is merely suggestive.

[webtrainer]

9. I (regrettably) saw the video . . .

and the one thing I really noticed was that the two on either end could not stand still for more than 15 seconds or so, just seemed . . . I don't know, like NOT something a religious fanatic would be doing if they were really believing that they were doing a righteous act in the name of Allah when they performed this brutal murder. I agree about the cultural body language and would like to have an expert in body language and Mideast culture review the tape and make comments. Bartcop may not be the most culturally sensitive individual, but he has good instincts, IMHO.

[Jacobin]

14. Thank you

You said very clearly what I have been struggling to say unsuccessfully.

Something is quite odd about all this.

[seemslikeadream]

7. I don't think those guys are al Qaeda

[htuttle]

8. Did they speak in Russian at one point?

I read a few (English language) forums in Russia, and a number of them are saying that at one point, one of the masked men says to the executioner, "Davay pozhivee!", which apparently means 'Do it faster!' or 'Hurry up!' in Russian. Also, they say that when one of them says 'Allah u Akbar!', they say it with a distinctly Russian-like accent. Not surprisingly, this leads them to believe that it was Chechens on the tape.

Maybe it was freelance Chechens working for one side or another (or no side) in Iraq. Of course, this theory might also be the result of these Russians' own demonization of Chechens. :shrug:

on edit: Changed use of 'Chechnyans' to 'Chechens'. Google says both are used, but BBC uses 'Chechens', so I'll go with it.

[jobycom]

18. Obviously, there are plenty of Chechen Muslims, and

Some of them have been motivated to terrorism recently. As Afghanistan did in the 80s, this invasion has started drawing freedom fighters from all over the place to oppose the evil empire-- which is not the Soviet Union this time.

[doni_georgia]

11. Zarqawi had leg amputated in 2002. Did any of those guys look like

they were missing a leg?

Zarqawi was said to have received medical treatment in Baghdad in May and June of 2002 after being wounded in Afghanistan during the war. His leg was amputated, U.S. officials say, by a surgeon in Iraq.

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/04/29/sprj.irq.terrorist.capture/

[jobycom]

17. More American assumptions based on lack of knowledge

There are Muslims from all cultures, all walks of life. Al-Quieda has become international, and no doubt there are Iraqis who have never met another al-Quieda member who are claiming allegiance to al-Quieda nowadays, since it is one of the most successful opponents of our country.

Think back to Sunday. Was the Chechen President thin? Was Hussein thin? Was Ramsi Yusef's uncle (forgot his name, he looked like Ron Jeremy) thin?

Now look at the one American in the picture. Is he thin?

With these masks, with the body armor, with the bulky outfits, you can't tell how thin these guys are. But even if you could, it would mean nothing. There are as many different ethnic backgrounds for Muslims as there are for Christians, and this "All Muslim men look alike" attitude borders on racist assumption.

[Steven_S]

19. Finally a post I can agree with....

Of all the thousands of "opinions" expressed re this incident yours mirrors my own thoughts.

Thank you jobycom