Richard Perle just declared himself a Democrat...

[Flubadubya]

:wtf: Just now on CSPAN, this creepiest of the creepy declared he is a Democrat! How in God's name can that be? Gag me with a huge ladle. Ack! Ack! Ack! :grr: :mad:

[displacedtexan]

1. Satan would claim to be a democrat, too.

Beware.

[renegade000]

2. WTF?

:wtf:

[spanone]

3. Fuck him, as a lifelong democrat I refuse to acknowledge him.

Lying fool. Arrogant Shit. War Criminal.

[nolabels]

19. Ah but you know they must be getting close to the end of something

Acts of desperation are always seen in people who are getting close to wits end.

[MessiahRp]

48. Here Here!

:toast:

[Spazito]

4. If Perle is a democrat, he is a Lieberman democrat...

which means a repub in demo clothing, assuming the lying liar is telling the truth and I very much doubt that.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

13. Agreed. Think also about the connections between this NeoCon...

...faction of the Democratic Party and the most conservative political factions in Israel. Now think about how our foreign policy has been steered by Perle and the rest of the NeoCons, virtually in lock-step with the desires of Israeli conservatives like Sharon.

Additionally, I know that I'm going to get flamed for this post, and I know that those flames will be framed by charges of anti-Semitism. Nothing could be farther from the truth...but facts are facts.

[Toronto Ron]

26. Not anti-semitism, but:

(I posted this in another thread yesterday: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1559870 )

It is conceivable that PNACers have Israel's interests in mind. For some, perhaps it is primary. However, the real controlling powers are the corporate oilmen overtly and covertly in power. It's all about the black gold. The oilmen don't give a rat's ass about Israel per se. PNAC merely spits out foreign policy that is compatible with the oilmen's goals, at least in the short term. In fact, I'm starting to believe that the PNACers, particularly the Jewish ones, serve as useful bogeymen to deflect attention from the oilmen. That this is working is quite evident here in DU, where so many bright people eagerly blame all our mideast-related ills on Israel.

[Dees]

31. Richard "PNAC" Perle a Dem? And I'm

George friggin Monkeynuts Bu$h too. Lying Neocon hose job. Super Chickenhawk.

[calimary]

35. And I'm the Queen of Kennebunkport.

EEEEEWWWWWW! I sure as heck don't want richard perle in MY party. What a poisonous putz.

[readmylips]

28. I agree....Lieberman in repig clothes...

Look I'm not anti Jewish...I feel like crap having to declare this stupidity before I post...

The Jewish organizations are the strongest lobbyists in the US. When they first began, they pushed for a state of Israel. As they went along they pushed for even more. When they did not achieve many of their goals, they personally injected themselves into politics. They did not care if they were democrats or republicans. They gave lots of cash to both parties, just like big corporations. Lieberman's goals and loyalty is to Israel and so is his wife's. In bush, the dem-repigs found a pot of gold. What they could not get Prez Clinton to do, bush was going that long extra 500 miles for Israel's cause. It was the bush family who supported Sharon into power again.

Don't ask me to apologize.

[fujiyama]

5. Wasn't he

part of that Henry "Scoop" Jackson wing of hawkish democrats? Many of them eventually left the party.

I think Wolfowitz may have been a democrat at one point also. I'm pretty sure the same with Woolsey.

[Tinoire]

46. Lots of them were and STILL are.

Look at the unhealthy liason where we have Republicans signing various DLC manifestos and Democrats signing various PNAC documents. We even have our own version of PNAC called PPI and a PNAC signatory advising our Democratic nominee.

Richard Perle is a Democrat. Joshua Muravchik, resident scholar at the AEI (parent org of PNAC) is a Democrat; there are many others at AEI, Heritage, Manhattan, Hudson, etc, all founded by the same people. Go to mediatransparency, sit down and get ready to hurt.


When you examine the links between the new kid on the block (PNAC) and the older ones -- New Paradigm Society, DLC, Coalition for a Democratic Majority, Committee for the Free World, the "B Team" "intelligence" assessment on Soviet economic and military power, the Committee on the Present Danger, Social Democrats-USA; all the spawn of Dem senators Scoop Jackson and Pat Moynihan -- along with their sources of funding,

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:f2hMb_21NYIJ:forums.alternet.org/guest/motet%3Fshow%2B-ui3RS1%2B-ilad%2BThe_War%2B28%2B-25-+neoliberal+perle+wolfowitz+democrat+scoop+jackson&hl=en

things start adding up real quick.

[anarchy1999]

6. Welcome to Kerry World.

Thought you knew.

[Flubadubya]

8. Kerry world?

No, I didn't know about Perle being a democrat... to me the two are anathema. But what does Kerry have to do with this?

[Media_Lies_Daily]

15. Good question...you beat me to it.

[Catholic Sensation]

18. this is what he means:

because Kerry isn't a Marxist, he's a PNACer. It's stupid, but that's probably the only reason someone would equate a senator who voted with the Bush Administration a smaller percentage of the time in 2003 than any other democrat with a war criminal fake conservative like Richard Perle.

[Tinoire]

50. Vote for Kerry but do so with eyes open

Go here. Halfway down the page. Start with Tom Paine's post. It's rough stuff to face but ask yourself what kind of party you want, what kind of country and morever, what kind of world.

When Chomsky said that Nixon was, in many respects, the last Liberal President we had, he's absolutely correct. Our party has done nothing but go to the right over the last few decades. Globalization? NAFTA, FTAA, WTO? Welfare reform? Telecommunications Act? The list is shameful.

Both parties have been taken over by this cancer and supporters on both sides refuse to examine that and take our party back.

Yeah it's rough. It's ugly. Money owns our politics in this country and the interests of money are the same on both sides.

===

Congress passed a resolution in '97 or '98 calling for regime change
in Iraq, endorsed by Clinton, that used language identical to some of
that in PNAC papers. That resolution, like 2002's IWR, was supported
by most Dem as well as GOP senators, the DLC, and Kerry; as well as
PNAC.

The Syria Accountability Act was/is supported by Bush, Kerry, the DLC,
and PNAC. Perfectly consistent.

Plan Colombia, implementaion of the Brzezinski strategy in Latin
America, was a Clinton creation, supported by the DLC and Kerry, and
PNAC and Bush.

The worldwide Carter/Brzezinski geostrategy was implemented by Carter,
Reagan, Bush41, Clinton, Bush43, and is supported by Kerry, the DLC
and PNAC.

Clinton's force-theory guru Bobbitt articulated the precise grounds
for both permitting the Rwandan genocide and justifying the invasion
of Iraq. Kerry, Bush, DLC and PNAC; again in agreement.

PNAC thinks the occupation of Iraq should continue; permanent bases
should be established and maintained, etc. So does the DLC and Kerry,
with Kerry calling for more troops, and expanding the US military
permanently with 40,000 more combat troops.

PNAC supports Sharon's policies of assassinations and ethnic cleansing
and apartheid and a growing arsenal; so does the DLC and Kerry.

Perfectly consistent, in so many areas, with the only disputes amounting to differences of style, not substance -- but in those stylistic differences, the greater skills and smarts of the DLC in diplomacy, PR, the military, intelligence and foreign policy establishments, and economic stability ("stability": skill in maintaining the savage inequalities of neoliberalism without generating irresistable popular opposition in the US), lie the reality: Kerry is likely to be a more successful imperialist than Bush.

The DLC is much smarter than the PNAC bunglers about implementing the philosophies of Leo Strauss and Fred Hayek, as well as the techniques of Edward Bernays for engineering "consent".

<snip>

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:f2hMb_21NYIJ:forums.alternet.org/guest/motet%3Fshow%2B-ui3RS1%2B-ilad%2BThe_War%2B28%2B-25-+neoliberal+perle+wolfowitz+democrat+scoop+jackson&hl=en

[wyldwolf]

37. just another lame attempt to pin the label "neocon" on John Kerry

Sad and pathetic.

Used to be I only expected innuendo void of facts from the far right.

[Chicken George]

7. Most of the NeoCONS were/are indeed Democrats.

They came from the Trotskyite radical left.

[Catholic Sensation]

11. neocons are ex liberals not "new conservatives"

[Media_Lies_Daily]

16. "Ex liberals"??? Right. Just like the Nazis were liberals.

[Catholic Sensation]

20. ex liberals means they're some new idealogy

they spend like the stereotypical liberal, have the morals of Pol Pot, and the cowadice of Tom DeLay. Basically a Scoop Jackson Democrat without any moral fiber whatsoever.

[Catholic Sensation]

22. just like some of these neoliberals aren't new liberals but ex cons

[LoZoccolo]

24. It's actually true.

See my post in the dupe thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=1562695&mesg_id=1563040&page=

[Catholic Sensation]

25. you forgot to mention the entitlement spending ;)

granted it goes to corporations mostly, but neocons seem to be unbelievably reckless with their spending, like the worst nanny-state supporting liberals.

Otherwise, great post :)

[Chicken George]

17. Clinton did it. And for that I thank President Clinton.

He would not do their bidding and take our country to war (I hope I am not branded an anti-Semite) for the safety and security of Israel. Clinton instead tried hard to bring peace between the Israelis and Palestinians through negotiation and the NeoCONS were pushing for "regime change" both in Palestine and Iraq and among other Muslim/Arab nations. Remember that James Woolsey is a NeoCON and managed to get himself installed as CIA Director. He only lasted two years. I think we know why his tenure was so short.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

41. They were considered Neo liberals in the 60's

[drumwolf]

9. Oh, I believe Perle started out as a Democrat

As the poster before me pointed out, many neocons originally started out left of center and turned rightward. I'm sure that, unlike the rest of his fellow neocons, Perle probably just never bothered to re-register himself as a Republican.

[deepcover]

10. welcome aboard dick

i welcome him with open arms, i'm sure he has much to tell us about what really happened behind closed doors. if he won't talk then....
we'll know

[Cheswick2.0]

12. yeah, him and Russert and that Redneck judge in Florida

who sided with Bush. When do we make a law allowing us to kick their asses out of the party.

[Catholic Sensation]

27. the same day we make a law saying all dissent is illegal

:eyes:

[MGKrebs]

32. Oh please.

Membership in a party is not equivalent to "all dissent is illegal".

[burythehatchet]

14. ah yes, the fascist wing of the democratic party

[xchrom]

21. it is true true that neo-conservatives/pnacers,

some of them, grew out of a kind of liberal think.
it turned quickly into a kind of fascism heavily influenced by corporations and israeli protectionism.
there's a whole history about america versus the u.n. as the carrier of democratic principals, human rights, etc.
it gets really convoluted when you get strains involved.

[rman]

55. the only thing that is certain

is that today's neocons once called themselves, and mingled with, far-left circles (Trotskyits (sp?)).

To me it seems obvious that all things neocon are in fact not political; they will align themselves with whatever political movement they see fit in order to further their goal of total domination of the world.

Also it is certain that neocons now prefer to call themselves neo-Reaganites. ofcourse we all know what an exemplary democrat Reagan was...

[Guava Jelly]

23. If pearl is A Democrat

I am a racist neo religous nazi koolaide drinking retarded sheep

[Crunchy Frog]

29. I watched him say that on a C-Span panel

months ago. He said it was out of respect to Senator Henry "Scoop" Jackson, a Democrat of whom many of the neocons were proteges.

[Skittles]

30. Richard Perle lies for a living

as easy as he breathes

[robertpaulsen]

33. Richard Perle makes Zell Miller sound like a Kennedy.

Anthony Kennedy that is.

Didn't Richard Perle write a book with fellow PNACer Bob Frum (might have the name wrong) advocating that Bush should spend his second term waging war against Syria and Iran? I'll try to find the link to it. Any way you cut it, he's as Democratic as Ann Coulter.

[robertpaulsen]

36. Sorry, David Frum. Here's the link.

The book is titled An End to Evil. I haven't read it, but it sounds incredibly scary. He advocates, along with "regime change" in Syria and Iran, a Cuban Missile Crisis-style blockade of North Korea backed by planning of a pre-emptive strike on its nuclear sites. Some Democrat. Even Miller and LIEberman don't go this far. Yet.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1400061946/commondreams-20/103-9838607-0408644

[nightperson]

58. Here's Buchanan's

"bunker-buster" review.

[leesa]

34. This will be their way of blaming this fiasco on "liberals"

Because these monsters...Perle, Wolfowitz, etc were working for hawk Jackson when they were young, they will try to bill it as a "liberal" problem to save their sorry neocon asses. Buchanon tries this all the time...I wrote to him a couple years ago to complain about this BS sham. These are conservative ideals, nothing to do with progressive ideals.

This is what conservative Republicans wanted and they put these monsters in power.

[FlashHarry]

38. So is Bob Novak.

Personally, I don't give a rat's ass. A dangerous asshole is a dangerous asshole.

[nightperson]

39. I don't know what's up with Perle,

but here is a related article. I don't think it's harmful to remember how involved so many Democrats were with Vietnam. It may surprise some here that this hardcore Kerry supporter has very Vidal-like non-interventionist foreign policy leanings. This is a very strange time. The Republicans are so into big government, social engineering/regulation, and global entanglements that the Democrats are now by far the more libertarian party, but that could eventually change. Gotta stay alert. :shrug:

[rman]

56. "non-interventionist foreign policy" my *ss

I know what's up with Richard "Prince of Darkness" Perle.

Here's a quote from one of the most powerful people in the world today, Richard Perle, close adviser to Bush who is also known in Washington as the Prince of Darkness:

"If we let our vision of the world go forth, and we embrace it entirely, and we don't try to piece together clever diplomacy but just wage total war, our children will sing great songs about us years from now."

"just wage total war" hardly seems to be "non-interventionist foreign policy"

[nightperson]

57. Sorry if there's some confusion.

Correction No.1: the "hardcore Kerry supporter" with perhaps surprising interest in a "non-interventionist foreign policy" is myself, one of the few here with a Kerry avatar etc. pre-Iowa, and No. 2: that quote is from War Against The Terror Masters author Michael Ledeen . GD2004 Primary Season, man.... I can't remember, maybe you're a vet of it too, if not, ask veterans more weathered than myself: we have a right to refer to ourselves in the third person :cry: :tinfoilhat: :shrug: :silly: ;) .

[jonnyblitz]

40. The DEM party is full of wingnuts. n/t

[SarahB]

42. Odd and creepy

:wtf:
And the biggest question- WHY???

[x-g.o.p.er]

43. And my dog just declared he's a cat...

Doesn't make it so.

[JHB]

44. He was a staff member for "Scoop" Jackson

He and a lot of the neocons originally hooked up with Democratic hawks in the early 70's. But once Reagan came along, most of them jumped over to republican.

Perle may claim to still be a Democrat, but I'm willing to bet you wouldn't be able to tell that based on who he votes for.

[tritsofme]

45. Zell Miller is a "Democrat" too...nt

[Fenris]

47. Quite so. But I think his current endeavors make him a DINO.

[Cat Atomic]

49. He mispronounced it, that's all. He meant "fascist war profiteer".

.

[Radical Activist]

54. This made me inhale my soda and almost die laughing!

[Th1onein]

51. Yeah, right. And I'm Santa Claus.

[Hubert Flottz]

52. No, that bastard is a Traitor!

And a Bush enabling Nazi pig!

[Zorra]

53. democrat with a small "d" maybe?

Either way, it doesn't fit.

[roguevalley]

59. doesn't surprise me. they are extremists. One extreme or the other.