Is this timeline worth anything or even related to itself as it goes???

[1jfuddle]

Someone is trying to use this against me in an arguemnt. Is this more than a disconnected array of random and arguably accurate historical facts that leads to a dead end. I just don't see a point.

Also, if you have anything that you can refute in here, let me know...






Late 1940s: Great Britian forms Iraq from its land holdings. There was no "Iraq" before. There were no historical ties or common traditions. Multiple dissimilar religious and ethnic groups were thrown together.

Early 1970s: * Saddam Hussein comes to significant power (this was a subtle multi-year process
that we are going to lump together for ease of reference) through the creation
of the Baath party, murder etc.
* Formation of OPEC (Oil Producing/Exporting Countries) and their rise to power/control of oil
production and pricing. Their control led to the disasterous U.S. recession and economic
turmoil of the 70s, and it led to a change in U.S. policy toward the middle east

Late 1970s: * Overthrow of the Shaw of Iran (strong U.S. ally) by a radical religious group of
Sh'ite Muslims led by Ayatolla Komeni.
* U.S. Embassy overrun and the Americans taken hostage and held.
* New Iran is perceived as both a threat and an opportunity to Saddam Hussein. The threat
is that 2/3 of the Iraqi population is Sh'ite Muslim and considers the Ayatolla their spiritual
leader, and if the Ayatolla said so Saddam would most likely be deposed/killed. The
opportunity is that due to political turmoil in Iran he might be able to make a land grab.
* War starts between Iraq and Iran

Early 1980s: * U.S. weapons are sold to Iran to broker the release of the U.S. hostages (This later
becomes known as the Iran/Contra Scandal)
* The Soviet Union starts to back Iran militarily in its war against Iraq.
* In response to the USSR backing of Iran, the U.S. sells weapons and weapon technology
to Saddam. This is the time where he starts to acquire WMD capabilities.

Mid to Late 1980s
* Saddam starts to use WMDs(like Sarin gas) in missle attacks on Iran.
* US scales back its weapon sales to Saddam.
* The Iran/Iraq war ends in basically a stalemate.
* Saddam looks to replenish money reserves, and expand his power. His army is now
considered the 4th largest in the world.
* Saddam attack Kurdish villages in northern Iraq with nerve gas.

1990 August Iraq invades Kuwait (the occupation of Kuwait would provide a convinient deep
water port for the transfer/transport of crude oil to international shipping
Aug-Dec US sends military to Saudi Arabia in Operation Desert Shield

1991 Jan Commencment of Desert Storm. US liberates Kuwait and wipes out Iraq military.

mid 1991 Saddam is left in power in a cease fire agreement. His airforce is left intact. With the airforce
he exacts retribution on peoples in the North of Iraq by bombing/ straffing villages.

Early 1990s * A UN food for oil program was started in which oil could be sold internationally for food and
humanitarian items (ie medical supplys). Due to massive corruption in the program (the UN
Secretary General has been accused of recieving over 2 BILLION in kickbacks) Saddam just
got richer by pocketing money for his elaborate palaces, and hundreds of thousands died
every year from starvation.

1992 * In response to Saddam's bombing of Iraq's civilians and his continued hostile posturing
toward Saudi Arabia the Northern and Southern 'No Fly Zones' are created by the UN. The
US is put in charge of patrolling the zones forcing the US to remain in the Saudi bases.
* William Jefferson Clinton elected to the office of president with significantly less than 50%
of the vote (remember Ross Perot?)

1993 * Van Bomb is exploded in the garage of the World Trade Center. The critical issue here is
that this attack is the first significant terrorist act by foreigneers on US soil. It shows the
organizational skills of a budding group of terrorists later known as Al Quaida.

Mid 1990s * US still has to occupy bases in the Muslim holy land of Saudi Arabia (Medina and Mecca are
Muslim holy cities and are located in Saudi)in order to patrol the no fly zones. Billions are
spent yearly in this costly operation.
* Saddam's military regularly targets US airplanes and fires missles at them. This is against the
cease fire agreement and against UN resolutions (the UN does nothing).
* Taliban takes over Afganistan in a multi-year civil war. Afganistan becomes a haven/training
ground for Al Quiada.

Late 1990s * No fly zone hassles continue.
* Osama Bin Ladin is now identified as a major player in international terror. His influence is
spread by his massive wealth and construction projects that benefit poor Muslim
populations. His rallying cry? Get the infidels out of our Holy Land! In a land of 40%
unemployment (Saudi Arabia) bored, going nowhere middle class kids ralley to his call.
* UN weapons inspectors are kicked out of Iraq.
* Al Quaida bombs 2 US embassys in africa.
* Sudan offers Bin Ladin to Saudi Arabia, and the US. Caught in the middle of a blowjob, a
distracted Bill Clinton gets confused and declines the Sudan's offer.
* In different attacks in different years, in different countries, the US bombs Iraq, Sudan,
and Afganistan with Tomohawk cruise missles. Inneffective at killing the terrorists or Saddam
the bombings inflame anti-american sentiment in the muslim world.

2000 * George W. Bush is elected President of the US.

2001 Sept 11 WTC destroyed in barbaric attack thousands die
Airplane rammed into the pentagon people die
Airplane taken over by terrorists in Pennsylvania, passengers attempt to re-take the
plane. The plane crashes without hitting its terror target, all passengers die.

Oct. President Bush spells out the anti-terror policies saying that if your harbor or aid terrorists
you are a terrorist and we will come for you, he also states that it will be a long hard
conflict in which many people will lose the vision.

Late 2001-
Current
* Afganistan is invaded to oust the Taliban.
* Iraq is invaded in Febuary of 2003 and the regular Iraqi military is quickly overcome.
* Saddam's two sons killed in a firefight
* Saddam captured hiding in a hole

Early 90s-
2003
* France benefits from ultra cheap oil contracts with Iraq. Billions of barrels are bought for
pennies on the dollar.
* France sells banned technology to Iraq, including tunneling equipment and military platforms
* Germany sells banned tech/services to Iraq
* Russia sells modern banned high tech military equipment to Iraq and transports them there
on "humanitarian aid" flights
* China installs moderns comunications systems for the Iraqi military (Chinese embassy gets
bombed)
* US ally Jordan sells weapons and munitions to Iraq only days before war starts.
* Saddam systematically eliminates ANY person capable of politically leading Iraq, even close
family members die.
* Saddam and Sons continues to be open for business, they offer services in rape, torture, murder, kidnapping, and genocide. Tens of thousands are political prisoners, thousands dissappear only to later re-appear in mass graves (that are opend only after US invades).


Ok, that is the timeline. Now we can debate the widsom of the politics of the decisions of various US administrations.

[NMDemDist2]

1. you forgot we (the CIA) armed and trained OBL in Afghanistan

so he could fight the Soviets

[Minstrel Boy]

2. And that Saddam obtained his chemical weapons from the US

and other Western countries. And you omitted a whole lot more besides.

What are you trying to say?

[shraby]

3. George Bush

wasn't elected..he was selected by the Supreme Court. Also, I believe the U.S. was instrumental in putting Saddam in charge of Iraq.

[Cleita]

4. Late 1940's Iraq was formed? Wasn't that Israel in May 14, 1948?

Between 1918 and 1932 the British controlled Iraq under the mandate of The League of Nations. They installed a king then and later established Republic in 1958.

[WMliberal]

5. the moran leaves out a lot (conveniently)

like BFEE profits enormously from Saddam in 1980's.
President Bush pardons everyone involved in Iran-Contra, including the man now appointed to be Ambassador to Iraq.
Saddam gasses Kurds, U.S. does NOT condemn the attack.

Where is his supposed link between Saddam and OBL? The two never met? Never vacationed in palm beach together? Never went to a baseball game together?

[1jfuddle]

6. The link

As far as I can tell, THERE IS NO LINK!!! He is as full of shit as I've ever seen someone.

[SEpatriot]

7. A note on the Clinton administration and terrorism

For your brain-dead and history ignorant friend:

President Clinton’s justice department arrested and convicted the first World Trade Center bombers (Ramzi Yousef, Abdul Hakim Murad and Wali Khan Amin Shah – all currently serving time in Federal prison thanks to the Clinton Justice department) President Clinton ordered strikes against Sudan and Afghanistan and was praised by that liberal icon, Newt Gingrich who remarked: “The President did exactly the right thing." President Clinton (who was elected twice, by the people) gave standing orders to two U.S. submarines in the region to assassinate Osama Bin Laden. These orders were rescinded by Bush the younger upon assuming office.

Clinton tripled the FBI's anti-terrorism budget. He gave funding to other agencies and organizations to be used against al Qaeda and other terrorist groups. He also sought tough anti-terrorism legislation, although the bill presented to him was not as strong as he originally wanted. Clinton had ordered the stockpiling of vaccines for smallpox and anthrax, which became very important after 9/11. Another law signed in by Clinton was an airport security bill. There were many other policy changes that Clinton brought about to fight terrorism, even though Congress fought against Clinton's anti-terrorism efforts whenever they could.


Sudan did not offer to give up Osama. This has been widely discredited.The man with the offer was not an official representative of the Sudanese government and was found not to be credible by the CIA operatives involved.