Sierra Club alienates would-be Democrat NASCAR voters

[Yentatelaventa]

Environmentalists and community activists are also opposing this project because of the adverse impact on wildlife, the air and noise pollution generated by auto raceways, and the congestion that will be brought to nearby residential areas.

Greater Baltimore Sierra Clubs members attended a recent Baltimore County Planning Board hearing to testify against the proposed zoning changes that would allow the racetrack to be developed on the parcel, which is currently zoned for manufacturing.

The Maryland Chapter Executive Committee has voted to oppose the track and has designated funds to be used in a possible legal battle.

http://maryland.sierraclub.org/archive/1997/Fall/Articles/raceway/raceway.html

I doubt this will help bring in NASCAR voters. I could be wrong.

[wuushew]

1. How big is this so called "Nascar vote"?

Is it a myth? Racing man just need his beer and tv, he no need to vote.

[Yentatelaventa]

7. Graham hopes NASCAR sponsorship boosts presidential bid

NASCAR dads (in contrast to soccer moms) emerged as a new demographic group during the 2000 campaign. They are white, working-class men inclined to support Republicans but who could vote Democrat if the issues are right. NASCAR has an estimated 75 million fans, primarily in the South and Midwest.

http://www.thatsracin.com/mld/thatsracin/6266738.htm

[Feanorcurufinwe]

2. So the Sierra Club should compromise it's principles to win votes?

So the Sierra Club should compromise it's principles to win votes? Aren't they an organization that advocates for the environment? Or should they just support whatever's popular?

[aquaman]

8. No doubt.....

Pollution is cool as long as we get a few democratic votes.

[Wonk]

3. Alternate headline: NASCAR alienates Sierra Club members. nt

[Terwilliger]

4. FUCK NASCAR voters

they're a bunch of rednecks...maybe the energy used to run a NASCAR event could run a small city for several days.

Maybe it's time to wean Americans from this insistence on dangerous and unnecessary "sport"ing events. It's almost like a religion.

[Yentatelaventa]

11. Terwilliger, start your weaning...

Election battles feature Cooter, Elvis, spouses

In many ways, it was an odd Election Day.

Ben Jones, the former Georgia congressman and actor who portrayed "Cooter" on TV's Dukes of Hazzard, crashed in his comeback bid Tuesday like Boss Hogg's cars always did while chasing the General Lee.

Jones, a Democrat whose TV character was a down-home mechanic, lost to incumbent Republican Eric Cantor in a traditionally GOP Virginia district that stretches from Richmond to the Blue Ridge Mountains.

But Jones, who described himself as a "NASCAR Democrat" and formerly represented a suburban Atlanta district, was hardly struck silent.

Indeed, despite the defeat, he was picking and singing with "Cooter's Garage Band" at his own "Victory Party" at a Holiday Inn.

In Indiana, Republican Bruce Borders, an Elvis impersonator and former Jasonville mayor, faced Democrat Alan Chowning for a state House seat vacated.

In North Dakota, Paul Murphy and Marina Spahr -- who are married to each other -- were running against each other for Foster County prosecutor.

http://www.sptimes.com/2002/11/06/Election2002/Election_notebook.shtml

wean at your own risk.

[DS1]

13. eh, first

NASCAR fans are unlikely to give a shit about what the Sierra club things.

2, a single trans-atlantic 747 flight uses more gasoline than a 500 lap Nascar race. go figure.

[wuushew]

16. yes but look at the per person fuel economy!

5 gallons per mile ain't too shabby considering you are going 500 miles an hour and are able to travel across entire continents.

A Boeing 747 can carries 57,285 gallons of fuel in their enormous tanks. The Boeing 747 burns off approximately one gallon of gas every second, and five gallons of gas every mile. During flight, a plane is burning 0.01 gallons of gas per person, per mile. This affects the flight economy because these rates per person make a person pay more money for a ticket. When prices of things go up then less people want to buy it or use it. If we can make a more fuel-efficient commercial plane then we can reduce are need of jet fuel lowering costs of tickets.

http://nan.nashua.edu/moreyl/Transportation/communityeconomy.htm

[Yentatelaventa]

17. I beg to differ

NASCAR fans might flip out if the SC prevents them from getting a racetrack they really really want.

[Wonk]

19. There just aren't enough tracks where you can turn left, then left again,

then left again, then left again, then left again, then left again, then left again?

[Yentatelaventa]

22. The problem with recursive racetracks

There are not enough pitstops to prevent a track overflow.

[jagguy]

47. thats part of what makes it interesting

.

[jagguy]

39. you would be surprized

there is very strong support for conservation. One major driver has his own conservation organization perserving huge acreage. Others supply great support for the original DU (Ducks Unlimited) which has securred many thousands of acres of wetland from development on the major flyways across the US. They also led the effort to negotiate with the Canadian native population to desist the practice of taking of Canadian Goose eggs for sale to the Japanese (I'm talking taking ALL the eggs, seriously). They are the only ones allowed to take eggs as they were originally a part of tribal custom. Turns out that the Japanese thought that they were beneficial in a sexual way which explains the veryu substancial pricves that they were willing to pay.

But I digress.

Perhaps you should take the time to actually meet us, talk with us. Or you can continue to pontificate and all.

Your choice.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

40. I am still laughing at that pic :)

[Terwilliger]

67. an airplane is assisting economic productivity

nascar is stupid people watching to see which machine is tweaked just right, or which sponsor has enough money, or which driver is lucky enough to escape serious injury in one of the many accidents

what the FUCK?! Talk about ABSOLUTELY UNNECESSARY!

[Yentatelaventa]

21. More NASCAR democrats for your copulating pleasure...

‘NASCAR Democrats’ race after rural voters

FORT MADISON, Iowa – The hamburgers had been eaten, the speeches given and Gene Fraist and his fellow Democrats were busy posing for pictures with their famous new friend from North Carolina.

Sen. John Edwards had come to their Saturday night cookout to tell them that he was a presidential candidate who cared about the economic struggles that go on every day in rural and small-town America – including in this little corner of southeastern Iowa.

Fraist, a family farmer and state senator, said his constituents need all the attention they can get from White House wannabes. “A lot of factory workers are out of work in this area, and it’s tough for farmers to get a good price for their crops and livestock,” said Fraist, 71. “My own sons say, ‘I’m out here seven days a week – long days – and I’m barely scratching out a living. Plus, my wife has to work to help support us.’”

With the rural economy in shambles, this year’s crop of Democratic presidential candidates sees an opportunity to win back a group of voters their party has all but ceded to the GOP in recent national elections.

Some have dubbed these rural and small-town voters “NASCAR Democrats.” Others call them “red state” residents – a reference to the TV networks’ maps from 2000. States won by Republican George Bush were red; Democrat Al Gore’s were blue.

Whatever their moniker, they represent about one in four American voters and could play a decisive role in Iowa, New Hampshire and South Carolina – sites for caucus and primary votes that have traditionally winnowed the presidential field.

“It’s a voting bloc that’s ripe if we pay attention, if we let them know they matter,” said Steve Jarding, a rural issues consultant who once worked for Edwards but now advises Sen. Bob Graham of Florida. “To our peril, we’ve neglected these voters.”

http://www.montanaforum.com/rednews/2003/05/26/build/political/rural-demos.php?nnn=2

I don't make this shit up.

[Terwilliger]

68. No bigger or better reason to slap the right-wingers in the Dem party down

I'm tired of having to act like a freaking Republican in order to get a liberal back into power. FUCK THE DLC!

[FoxNewsIsTheDevil]

25. Enjoy being in an irrelevant party

[Terwilliger]

66. hahah

"fuck with my American bullshit buddy, and I'll teach you bout yore comma-nist dictatership"

Like, right out of a bad movie.

[Corgigal]

5. I don't think they exist

media is really pulling things out of a hat here.

[Walt Starr]

6. I think they do exist

and I think they probably went something like 99.46% for Bush in 2000.

[JohnKleeb]

10. and the other .54 to Pat Buchanan?

[Lugnut]

14. This NASCAR fan....

Voted for Al Gore as did the rest of the NASCAR fans in my family. :)

[jagguy]

33. I exist

and so do the guys I go to the races with. You could not be more wrong. We may not be the chablis sipping sorts of dems you are familiar with but we are out there and frankly a little surprized that we've been noticed.

Best not to make blind conjecture. Perhaps some people actually went out and did some research insted of sitting around yakking on the internet.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

9. Nascar drivers alienate the tax paying public

The extension of the road, which would bisect the site, would cost taxpayers up to $70 million.

[Yentatelaventa]

12. In politics, NASCAR is driving force

“THEY ARE MIDDLE- to lower middle-class males who are family men, live in rural areas, used to vote heavily Democratic but now usually vote Republican,” explains Larry J. Sabato, director of the University of Virginia’s Center for Politics. “That’s the definition of a NASCAR dad, and there are a lot of them.”
And the National Rifle Association, as well as U.S. Sen. Bob Graham (D-Fla.), are staking considerable sums on the belief that if NASCAR can sell its fans on Pennzoil motor oil and Budweiser beer, why not the Second Amendment and the next president of the United States?

The NRA, whose billboards now adorn a half-dozen NASCAR speedways, sees stock-car racing as a means of bypassing the mainstream media and appealing directly to the Americans who support its agenda.
Graham, whose presidential campaign fields the “Bob Graham for President” NASCAR truck, sees auto racing as a way of forging a connection with rural voters by tapping into the passion they feel for American-made cars and the hardscrabble racers behind the wheel.

http://msnbc.com/news/947356.asp?0cv=CB20&cp1=1

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

26. Oh please. It's a fucking hobby!

Cities and municipalities are coming up with bucks to finance their corporately owned football stadiums. If I can't have healthcare, why the fuck should they have a friggin raceway?

I understand the pool shooting, burping farting sports crowd doesn't like the Dems but maybe THEY are the ones that NEED you to wake THEM the fuck up.

Why don't you go post on a NASCAR fan board and ask them if they can afford medical and dental and which is more important.

Right wing nuts have abandoned us in droves too. Should we work harder to appeal to them? Just asking.

[Yentatelaventa]

28. Other than eating and breathing

What ISN'T a hobby? Are we mice or men?

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

30. Are we talking intellect or body habitus?

I have NO issue that they enjoy their sport. To the point of voting against their own interest and not just their own interest but guaranteeing their children a life of indentured serviude...sorry..THEY NEED TO WAKE up...Clinton was PAYING DOWN THE DEBT. The INTEREST on the debt since Bush took office will be a built in tax on the poor and middle calss for the next generation. IF a VROOM VROOM is more important than that...THEY HAVE ISSUES NOT ME.

[Wonk]

36. Hi Teena. It's worth remembering (I have to remind myself sometimes, too)

that half the population is average or below average intelligence.

Care to bet whether that MORANS guy is a NASCAR fan? I wouldn't be surprised at all if he is.



I think part of the appeal of NASCAR and other pro sports (and even politics, for some people) is that they are finite games and relatively easy to understand. When someone passes the finish line or when the final buzzer goes it's over and someone wins, and some in the crowd get a vicarious rush because "their" team won.

http://www.wvu.edu/~lawfac/jelkins/imagine/carse.html

I think you'll find this link interesting, and maybe some NASCAR fans will find it enlightening as well. Ignore the bit at the top about it being for lawyers. It's excerpts from a book, "Finite & Infinite Games".

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

38. Well this certainly explains foreign policy under the current admin!

:D..thanks ;-)

[jagguy]

53. and a hobby that brings a lot of money to the locality

and thanks for the warm regard with which you dis the MANY working class DEMOCRATIC folks that save up for that race or two a year to have a little fun at.

Is the view nice from the Ivory Tower ?

[jagguy]

50. and the drivers have what to do with this ?

it would appear that the track developers are the ones for you to direct your wrath at. The drivers just drive the cars.

[oasis]

15. New Bill Maher book:Ride with NASCAR and you ride with Osama

;-)

[willyjixx]

23. while not a NASTYCAR fan.....................

i happen to be an avid 4 wheeler who treads lightly so i dont see the feather ruffling of it? id rather see a race in a controlled environment then in my downtown street.


so from a statement earlier....are democrats not supposed to believe in the second amendment?

[oasis]

29. Democrats not only "belive in" they are in a constant struggle for

the preservation of rights guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution.

[jagguy]

54. oh dear, don't tell the Sierra Club about the 4-wheeling

that is credited with a great deal of habitat ruin.

But it IS fun.

[Desperadoe]

18. This Story Just Doesn't Make Sense

First of all, why would Nascar be interested in another venue in this part of the country? Dover is only about 1-2 hour drive from here and they are having a problem trying to keep 2 races a year at Dover.

Second, there are quite a few areas that are trying to lure Nascar into various new venue areas of the country with already existing tracks. Nascar had made it perfectly clear that it isn't interested in anymore expansion in the northeast and this area is what Nascar considers the northeast.

The area in question is adjacent to Aberdeen Proving Grounds or at least fairly close from the map that I looked at. I would really question the environmental impact to an area that is now a testing grounds for military explosives, especially since the impact of any Nascar race is limited to one week a year.

This whole story seems to be blown out of proportion. A Nascar racetrack is not, in any way, an environmental threat. I have supported the Sierra Club for 30 years but sometimes they are a little off the mark.

[MidwestMomma]

31. This is not even a current issue

Bottom of this page says Last modified: 10/15/97

From this article appears this was a dead issue in 1998..

http://www.sunspot.net/news/local/bal-ar.laurel24mar24,0,2674336.story?coll=bal-local-headlines

From article:

"When NASCAR wanted to build a race facility in 1998, residents ran the plan off the track."

So everyone can settle down. Maryland is safe from the evil that is Nascar!

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

32. Thanks! BEGS THE QUESTION AS TO WHY IT WAS POSTED

then

[Feanorcurufinwe]

41. yeah no kidding

[Yentatelaventa]

42. To prevent future slapdowns

Nascar fans have a long memory.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

48. Riiiight....Yeah I believe that

:eyes: That is the most intellectually dishonest thing I have ever heard. You posted it with a comment that it was a current issue that you HOPED wouldn't cost the Dems votes. YOu posted it under the GUISE of a current issue....my hint is the PRESENT TENSE IN YOUR THREAD TITLE.

Uh, like your idol says..."fool me uh...I'm a fool."

I always wondered why you have nothing but SHIT to lay on Dems...thanks for clarifying.

[Yentatelaventa]

61. Don't hate me because my vision is better than yours and my NASCAR fans

This 1997 tragedy for NASCAR fans is one that should be remembered and heeded. Bad mouthing NASCAR dems like myself and your monolithic vision of what a Dem must be to suit you is not going to help the party.

Your cute little disguised shot at me with your "idol" remark shows there is a fool here and it isn't me.

Laying your hateful SHIT on NASCAR fans is very clarifying...thanks for nothing.

[Democat]

62. Copy and paste from some right wing site?

A lot of that lately.

[Yentatelaventa]

65. You're saying that http://www.thatsracin.com is a right wing site?

Care to put up some proof to back up your uninformed accusation? Do you really need to make up false accusations when the subject is one you don't care for? Why disgrace the handle "Democrat" with lies like that?

You sure don't speak for me and a large number of other Democrats. Honesty is something that should be honored and not made a mockery with bullshit accusations.

[Wonk]

37. *snarf* thanks... I didn't read it all that closely and missed that. nt

[w4rma]

20. I agree that the Democratic Party shouldn't alienate NASCAR voters

But the Sierra Club isn't the Democratic Party.

[MidwestMomma]

24. Hey, ease up on the Nascar fan bashing

Talk about your prejudice. How many actual Nascar fans do you know? Pretty insulting to state, 'Racing man just need his beer and tv, he no need to vote.', don't you think?

My sister and her husband are Nascar fans AND loyal voting Democrats. They have many of the same political concerns as you do I bet. But what, are they not good enough for the 'party' because they like to drink beer and watch racing? Or do they have to give up racing to prove they are good enough for the Democratic party?

People wonder why the Democratic party has lost so much of it's voting base. Maybe because not many people can live up to the high standards set for being a Democrat/liberal these days. It seems that if you do not fall in line with every single issue of the left, you just don't measure up. So what's an imperfect being to do?

Way to win the hearts and minds.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

27. It was not my intention to bash NASCAR fans but they have families

that need the services that are being cut right now thanks to the fact that we no longer live in the Clinton economy. While I hate to alienate anyone, to suggest that we should run rampant over nature and create 70 million in debt for a community at a time when people may not be able to AFFORD to entertain themselves much longer nor have the health to do it is just ludicrous.

I really want them to have their fun.

Should it BE a political concern...hell NO!!! I am sure they consider themselves homeowners who need bankruptcy protection, families who need health insurance and citizens who need police on their forces before they consider themselves sports fans.

If they wish to not be mocked then maybe THEY need to take a little look at what THEY are considering important at this space in time.

I would certainly like to have a conversation about PRIORITIES with them.

[jagguy]

46. do you know the financial benefit that racing brings ?

do a little research and see why communities are falling all over themselves to attract racing.

A hint: What is the only major sport that is expanding ?

Having said that, there is always the need to do the due diligence to find the best place to put a track. Perhaps this site is not the best available in the area. The locals will sort this out.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

51. Fine

There's also plenty of places to put a track that aren't sensitive wetlands.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

34. So do NASCAR voters even remember what happened in 97?

They may have sobered out since then.

[Yentatelaventa]

43. Cute

real cute.

[Trajan]

35. Democrat Party alienates would be democratic Republican voters .....

IF we would just renounce EVERY policy that the Democratic Party holds dear, and embrace the Republican Party platform: ...

We would have ALL those republican voters voting Democrat, .... er ..... maybe: ... unless they decide to vote GOP anyways .....

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

44. Machinery going in circles.

Are people who enjoy watching machinery decorated with confederate flags go in circles, making lots of noise, and polluting the air more likely to vote Democratic or repugnican? Or, are they more likely to be found squashing beer cans on their heads on election day?

A question for the ages.

[wrkclskid]

45. Question for the ages

Why do my colleagues on the left make fun of regular, hard working good people because they have different hobbies, and then not understand why we are viewed so negatively?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

55. What makes you think your colleagues on the left

aren't regular, hard working good people with different hobbies? I worked since I was 15 until I retired. Everything from dishwashing to ditchdigging to teaching.

Most of the avid NASCAR fans I've run into are conservative republicans - if they pay any attention at all.

[wrkclskid]

58. Well I don;t know what would make me think anything

That I didn't say, but when you criticize a whole segment of the population as somehow low brow becuase they like nascar or drinking beer you are essentially making fun of a lot of hard working,good people. Just becuase you don't enjoy nascar does not mean those who do are apathetic about poltics and just spend their time breking beer cans on their foreheads. Even if they are conservative repukes it doesn't mean they are bad people, people disagree, many are well intentioned. I am past that phaze where I think everyone who represents a conservative viewpoint has some sort of evil intentions or is ignorant. I just disgaree. Has far as hard work, I am currently working to pay for college and my father works two full time jobs. I grew up working class with nascar and when i got odler, beer. One of dad's job is farming tobacco, and I grew up with the values of a fmaily farm values. Hope farming tobacco isn't too low brow for you. When you take shots at people who liek nascar it is nothing but condenscension plain and simple.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

64. Spare me.

When I was working in construction as a laborer I got a lot of ribbing about reading Steinbeck, going to college, and being a socialist who actually liked classical music. Big deal, I learned to shrug and kid back.

My father was raised on a farm in Arkansas and fled that poverty to become a longshoreman in San Francisco. My mother was an Irish immigrant from County Mayo - the poorest part of Ireland. My father was blacklisted from the docks in the '30s for being a "red" union organizer. At times we were homeless. I grew up on a mix of Hank Williams, Karl Marx, cheap whiskey, second hand clothes, Irish rebel songs, and fried chicken - when we could get it. So spare me the lectures on the nobility of poverty and hard work.

As far as tobacco farmers - bless 'em. I just put out a marlboro.

[Yentatelaventa]

49. "...the way of truth and love has always won."

I see no sign of that "fact" in your post.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

52. I see no sign of truth in this thread which is from a 6 year old story

[Yentatelaventa]

63. Nobody is forcing you to read it

This isn't LBN in case you didn't notice. Your failure to find your truth in this thread is something you'll have to work out for yourself. For myself, the truth is so obvious it has no contrast.

[jagguy]

56. and which NASCAR vehicles sport the Stars and Bars ?

if you're unwilling to educate yourself then perhaps you need to hold your tongue. You clearly know nothing on the subject.

[wuushew]

57. Well its not on the cars but......

DAYTONA BEACH, Fla. -- The flag is beaten down, soaked by an afternoon rain, but Okeechobee native John Pfennig is eager to stretch it straight for the world to see.

The red, white and blue Southern battle flag from the Civil War has words written in black across it: "IF THE SOUTH WOULD HAVE WON, WE WOULD'VE HAD IT MADE."

http://www.tennessean.com/sii/00/07/01/flags01.shtml

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

60. You may be right

I was under the illusion that those daredevil millionaire machinery operators were tough. Seems like they and their admirers are mighty thin skinned.

[Forkboy]

59. Oh well

I'll side with the Sierra Club on this one.