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NewJeffCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 12:01 PM
Original message
Huge church group slams Bush!
This is good... the National Council of Churches is slamming Bush's record on the environment.

SEATTLE, Washington (AP) -- A national group of Christian leaders is sending a scathing letter to President Bush to coincide with Earth Day, accusing his administration of chipping away at the Clean Air Act.

The National Council of Churches argued that planned changes to power plant regulations will allow major polluters to avoid installing pollution-control equipment when they expand their facilities.


http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/science/04/22/churches.bush/index.html
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Wapsie B Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
1. But, but
those aren't the true believers. They're just a bunch of librul heretics!

:evilgrin:
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Kazak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. At 50 million members strong...
I don't care what they are...they're significant.
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liarliartieonfire Donating Member (448 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
2. Watch out for those lightening bolts, George!
The heavens are not happy with what George has done to planet earth.
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NewJeffCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. Fundie logic?
I thought part of the fundamentalist logic is that God is so powerful and benign that nothing we mere humans do and/or create could ever truly harm our planet earth? So, if God truly wanted to stop mercury poisoning or carbon monoxide emissions, he would not allow that?

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Must_B_Free Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. James Watt from the Reagan Administration
expressed these sentiments.
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bobbieinok Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
3. conservative 'christians' think Natnl Council is communist, non-christian
Edited on Thu Apr-22-04 12:07 PM by bobbieinok
There's a long history of the right attacking the Council.

Years ago there was a 60 Minutes show on the Council. I don't remember the content, context, etc. But I DO remember there was a major controversy about the program - and the Council - for months.
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noonwitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Conservatives christians
Anyone who disagrees with their interpretation of scripture is not really a christian. I personally would prefer to follow Jesus' teachings than be a "real christian". Especially the Sermon on the Mountain, which I take very seriously. Conservative christians are modern-day Pharisees-they sit and worry about the letter of the law and forget about the spirit of it.
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LynzM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Jesus was a liberal :)
I might put that bumper sticker on my car, and up my insurance :)
It makes me so angry at the stuff that is done and said by "Christians"... how can you call yourself that while blatantly ignoring the teaching of Christ???
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. I have that bumper sticker
Jesus is a Liberal. It's right over my Darwin fish.
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AlFrankenFan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
9. Heard it on CNN
I just had to laugh - this is wonderful :)
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
10. Yeah, and it's not just liberal Christians who are slamming him.
There are conservative groups who are conservationist as well.

Would Jesus love a liberal? You bet!
http://www.geocities.com/greenpartyvoter/liberalchristians.htm
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dr.strangelove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 01:47 PM
Response to Original message
11. Democratic Christian
This is my first post here, so let me begin by saying hello.

This topic presents one of my personal favorite issues, christianity and politics.

I'm surprised that the mere condemning of Bush by a christian group is in fact surprising to many Democrats. I'm not going to get into the validity of the groups criticism (simply because criticizing the bush regime for its environmental policies is just too easy). I'd like to talk about the "surprise" I think most of the left feels when reading that christians criticized the President.

During the 2000 election, Vice-President Gore received 50,996,116 popular votes to the bush's 50,456,169. If you believe that none of the 50,996,116 people who voted for Gore consider themselves christian, you are kidding yourselves. My mom is as Roman Catholic as they come and she voted for Gore (there is a very funny and tragic family story about my mom's vote that I'll tell you all someday).

There are christians in the Democratic party. There are christians who would proudly put a bumper sticker on their car that proclaims Jesus was a Liberal. If we are to take back the White House, we need those same christians, within and without the Party, to vote for Kerry.

In another thread someone opined that Bush is the "Beast" in Revelation and this was ironic since all the christians are voting for him. I got a chuckle out of this one. Bush certainly displays all the bible's characterizations of the devil in that he lies, cheats and is clandestine like a serpent. However the first statement is very far from reality, all the christians are not voting for bush. If they were, the election is over before the fun even begins.

There have been several studies on the religious population of the US. Some studies were commissioned, or performed on behalf of, religious groups, so the numbers must be taken with a grain of salt, but are still useful. The Pew Research Counsel (the name indicates its bias) conducted a survey of 2002 random Americans in March 2002 and concluded 82% of the US self-identified as christian. In my opinion, the most accurate survey on religious self-identification was performed by Professors Barry Kosmin and Seymore Lachman with the Graduate City University of New York in 1990. Although older than the Pew study, I put a little more "faith" in it for purely personal reasons (like their survey pool was 115,000 Americans rather than 2002). There study concluded 86.2% of the country self identified as christian. Kosmin and Lachman published a follow-up in 2001, based upon a reduced sample of 50,000 people, that
Concluded 76.5% of Americans self identified as christians.

These numbers are probably in the ballpark. I'm going to pick 80% as an estimate, but it many be lower or higher. If 80% of Americans are christian, and all christians are voting for bush. Its going to be a massacre in November.

Lets also be clear, christians, and lots of them, recognize that providing access to medical care for all Americans (including the homeless and illegal immigrants) is the responsibility of the government. They recognize that providing AIDS medication to African nations to halt the spread of this terrible plague is not only the government's ethical responsibility, but will benefit the people of this country.

We need to recognize that people like my mother, who are devote christians much like Kerry is, are indeed a significant part of our Party. They support the ideals of the party. They may disagree about abortion and the right to physician assisted suicide, but they support targeted tax relief for the middle and lower class, ensuring the future of social security by rolling back the bush tax cuts on the top wage earners, and most importantly believe that good christians must help those who need help.

It may have been meant as a joke, but I believe many members of our party would proudly support the proposition that Jesus was a Liberal.


O8)
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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Hi mjf3!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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CatWoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Mjf3
if this is indicative of your future posts, I say right the hell on!!!

:hi:

welcome to DU, and great post!!
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NewJeffCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. welcome to DU
And, growing up in New England, I know there is a strong tradition of working class Irish & Italian Catholic Democrats... however, I did find it surprising that a Christian group was so vocal in their criticism of Bush when most "public Christians" (Robertson, Falwell, Terry, Reed, Moon, etc) are Republicans.

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Donating Member ( posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. Couldnt' have said it better myself-another Christian Democrat
and I know others, too. Great post.
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Tatiana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 07:39 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. Amen, Hallelujah, and Praise the Lord!
Welcome to DU, mjf3 :hi: I concur with your sentiments!
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LiberalManiacfromOC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-22-04 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
18. And he said God chose him to be president!
Well i guess God wanted a little amusment but now he sick of him! now he just needs to be hit by a car (preferably Laura bush, it wouldn;t be her first car killing)
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