TheSmokingGun.com.....doctored Iraq Picture?

[No2W2004]

APRIL 19--A soldier has told Marine officials that an offensive photo of him in Iraq has been doctored, leading his commanders to ask Navy criminal investigators to examine the authenticity of the picture, which has been widely circulated on the Internet. The image being examined purportedly shows Lance Cpl. Ted J. Boudreaux Jr. posing for a photo with two Iraqi children while holding a sign claiming that he had killed one boy's father and "knocked up" the child's sister. Boudreaux, a 24-year-old Marine reservist whose New Orleans-based infantry unit was deployed in Iraq from last May to September, has told superiors that the snapshot "has been altered from the original," according to a statement released this afternoon by Marine Forces Reserve officials. As a result, Boudreaux's superiors are "retaining the assistance of the Naval Criminal Investigative Service" to "conduct a thorough and complete investigation" of the questioned image, a copy of which you'll find below. In the picture--which came to the attention of military brass last month--Boudreaux and two unwitting boys are seen smiling and flashing the thumbs-up sign for the cameraman, who has not been identified. It is unclear how--or why--the photo got into circulation, or who might have Photoshopped the image.

[Juansmith]

1. It's possible...

The "FUCK IRAQ" picture was obviously photoshopped...

[Merlin]

2. I think it's genuine. Typical warped GI humor in a war zone.

I know plenty of guys who would have done something like this in Nam.

Besides, they are going to be able to tell absolutely if there was any doctoring. And it doesn't look to me like there was, because you'd need to match exactly the lighting, shadows, angle, and color of the cardboard. Very difficult--even for a pro. This guy's going to jail.

[DoNotRefill]

9. Ummm....on what charges? Playing a practical joke?

Where's the crime? Or did they make poor taste a violation of the UCMJ?

I've seen copies of the other picture. I think it's possible that it has been photoshopped, because the other version looked just fine, too. They'll find the original, and should be able to tell.

[parasim]

11. more humiliation than practical joke...

as far as I am concerned.

I know there are articles in the Geneva Conventions that prohibit humiliation of POWs, but I don't know if any apply to sons and daughters of enemy combatants.

Whether or not it is a crime, to me, it sure should warrant more than a slap on the wrist or simple reprimand. Even if it a "joke", it is a message. and it is one sick and barbaric message at that.

If it is a photoshop job (as well it could be... I'm a photoshop jockey who could make it look real enough quite easily) then I hope they are able to find out who would have done such a thing.

As for whether the guy in the picture did it (joke or not), they should be able to figure it out easily enough through handwriting analysis if he doesn't cough up the original.

One can only hope it was a cruel joke by someone on the internet someplace (and not this guy) and that the original sign said "Thank you, America!" or something on it.

[DoNotRefill]

12. the alternate pic on Snopes....

reads "LCPL Boudreaux saved my father then rescued my sister" or something to that effect. If that was the original message, then obviously no crime was committed.

If that's what it really said, then no crime was committed on anybody's part. The photoshopping would fall under the first amendment right to satire. If it was photoshopped, it's possible that a tort was committed, but doubtful that there would be any recourse.

Remember Larry Flynt's Campari ad in Hustler magazine with Jerry Falwell talking about doing his mother in the outhouse?

[parasim]

28. yeah, I saw that later...

I agree, if that is indeed what was originally on the sign, then no harm was done by the soldier. And they should be able to get to the bottom of it with the investigation.

If the the offensive version is true, however, I think the idea that it should be thought of as simple satire is completely asinine.

This is from the Marine Corps Times:

( http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/story.php?f=1-292925-2810106.php )

-snip-

One Arab-American Marine who teaches culture to fellow military personnel called the photo “deplorable” and said such behavior is a serious issue to be addressed.

Gunnery Sgt. Jamal Baadani, the president and founder of the Association of Patriotic Arab Americans in Military, is on a one-year tour in the Middle East. There, he gives cultural lessons to newly assigned personnel and is Chief of Host Nation Training Support Coordination.

“This picture and sign directed towards a Muslim family is inexcusable,” he said via e-mail. “Inexcusable because if this lance corporal was given a basic class on Islam, he would have known that remarks such as ‘knocking up’ a Muslim Arab woman is not tolerated and violates the honor of a Muslim woman and her family.

“If it was a local Iraq Arab that did this, he would have been shot by a family member on the spot for violating their family honor,” he said.

-snip-

[Zero Gravitas]

31. Exactly

Doesn't look like a photoshop job to me, but then again they could be just very good at it. More likely the guy is just trying to cover his butt. Sure its in very poor taste and not exactly a PR victory for the Military, but come on! its just a juvenile joke. I don't see what the big deal is.

[redqueen]

35. He said it was a fake

Is lying to your superiors about something under investigation not a crime?

[fob]

46. I have very little knowledge of military rules but Conduct Unbecoming

comes to mind.

Article 133—Conduct unbecoming an officer and gentleman

“Any commissioned officer, cadet, or midshipman who is convicted of conduct unbecoming an officer and a gentleman shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.”

(3) Examples of offenses. Instances of violation of this article include knowingly making a false official statement; dishonorable failure to pay a debt; cheating on an exam; opening and reading a letter of another without authority; using insulting or defamatory language to another officer in that officer’s presence or about that officer to other military persons; being drunk and disorderly in a public place; public association with known prostitutes; committing or attempting to commit a crime involving moral turpitude; and failing without good cause to support the officer’s family.

If the K/K sign is the real one but is a joke, then I think Article 133 applies.
If K/K is also true then further charges should ensue.

If the S/R sign is real but a joke, then Article 133 applies

If S/R is also true, look for bush* to fly in with medals(Warning; this may also happen if it's NOT true but bush*co thinks they can get away with pretending it is)

[Vickers]

47. Lance Corporal is not in the officer ranks (eom)

[redqueen]

49. Are you in the military?

What about lying to your commanding officer on a matter under investigation? Any rules against that?

[Vickers]

50. I was in the military for 8 years. I never lied to my CO

Sorry!

[fob]

61. OK, how about a gentleman? So Article 133 may not apply

in letter, but he sure broke the spirit. As I said I claim no great knowledge of military law.

Although I did look through some of the other Articles and 99 and 104 could apply. I won't go into what there is about them as I am not anti-military, but I don't like stupid. Stupid is as stupid does in this case, and this Lcpl has stupid all sewn up, IMO.

Either way you look at it, this is NOT part of military training and there should be repercussions, not as harsh as Article 104 allows but something. This guy better hope they find a father/daughter that claim he saved/rescued them so he gets a medal with his reprimand instead of something worse.

[Vickers]

64. Enlisted pukes aren't required to be gentlemen

Sorry, that's just the way it is set up.

I was enlisted: can'tcha tell?

:P

[fob]

67. Sir, Yes Sir!

Now move it maggot!

[morgan2]

41. going to jail

getting a little extreme aren't we? The picture is hilarious. Could some people take it the wrong way? yes.. The guys over there fighting a bs war, let him blow of some steam. He didn't harm anyone.

[redqueen]

42. This pic is hilarious, to you?

Wow. That's really jaw-dropping. *sigh* whatever...

As to 'didn't harm anyone'... maybe he personally did not, however that doesn't change the fact that this picture DID harm our troops in Iraq, by fostering even MORE hostility towards our troops.

He can blow off steam a lot of other ways - actively sowing hatred while troops are in harm's way is NOT a method I take lightly.

[morgan2]

44. some people takes things a bit too seriously

if he had really killed his father and knocked up his sister, then you would have a point. It was a harmless joke. I doubt he had any intention of it to be circulated all over the internet.

[redqueen]

48. Obviously it's not a harmless joke

I wonder if this situation could have been prevented with more education about the consequences of one's actions. Intentions are fine but won't alleviate the damage caused by his 'joke'.

[mike_c]

3. well, it would have to be someone...

...who knows him-- how else would they know his name? Un less, of course, the sign really did make specific reference to him. e.g "Lcpl Boudreaux liberated my village and gave me this shipping container!"

[DoNotRefill]

10. the other sign reads:

"LCPL Boudreax saved my dad then he rescued my sister."

If that's what the original sign said, I have a very hard time seeing that the photo was even in bad taste, much less somehow criminal.

[VolcanoJen]

4. FWIW, Snopes has a good article, and dubs the legend "undetermined."

http://www.snopes.com/photos/military/boudreaux.asp

There are some excellent DU threads about this topic in the archives, complete with Photoshop trials, expert opinions, and what-not... I'm still unsure, but I'm leaning toward "authentic," personally.

Excerpt from Snopes:

Some news accounts have implied that, although the message written on the pictured sign does not reflect anything Lance Cpl. Boudreaux actually did, the photograph is indeed real and was a poor attempt at humor on Boudreaux's part:

During his deployment in Iraq last year, Boudreaux was stationed in Al Kut, the capital of Wassit Province, which runs southeast of Baghdad to the border with Iran. His duties there with a headquarters unit kept him largely confined to the big concrete hangars at an air base on the outskirts of the city, and he had little contact with locals. The photo, which shows the trio in front of a ramshackle hut, could have been taken at one of tens of thousands of locations in Iraq, including a shed outside the back entrance of the airfield where the Marines would buy soda, tobacco and trinkets such as prayer beads and head scarves from locals.

Boudreaux could not be reached for comment. His commander during the 3/23rd's Iraq mission, Lt. Col. David Couvillon, called the photo a sophomoric attempt at humor.

"Look, he didn't actually do what that sign says," Couvillon said. "This is stupid, lance corporal stuff that he thought was cute. But it's not, and I was informed the commandant of the Marine Corps had it and the Marine Corps will deal with this."

[No2W2004]

6. Thanks for the link!

I tend to think it's a poor attempt at humor on Boudreaux's part.

[rocktivity]

33. So the question is, has the WRITING been doctored?

The writing on the "knocked up" version looks more consistent.

:headbang:
rocknation

[BigMcLargehuge]

53. side by side comparison

I think the real version is "saved" and "rescued" for the following reasons.

The text appears to have been sharpened on the "killed" and "knocked up" image, also, the text color is a little different in this version, suggesting that the photoshopper couldn't match the original text color well and thus used the magic wand tool to select the text and paint-bucket the change. That would also account for the sharpening.

The shape of the "e" is inconsistent in the "killed" and "knocked up" image, the eye of the "e" is too large on the "killed" and "knocked up" version.

the cardboard background appears to have been cloned under the "killed" and "knocked up" text, this is visible under magnification. The background appears slightly more pixelated.

Here is the photo comparison I made.

[muriel_volestrangler]

70. Plus the 'u' in 'rescued' matches

the two in 'Boudreaux' (no down stroke on the right) where the 'u' in 'up' has a down stroke. That's not a slight change in shape - it's a fundamental difference in how you write the letter.

[anarchy1999]

5. It is genuine. " Lance Cpl. Ted J. Boudreaux Jr"

It is real. "New Orleans-based infantry unit" , it's how you treat dark people in the south, don't you know. No doubt in my mind. Real, Real, Real, no photo-shop here, why would there be?

[leanings]

15. Oh please.

He would have done the same thing to Bosnian kids.

[anarchy1999]

16. probably.......

bad attitudes........

[Ripley]

19. Wow, just had to get a south bash in huh?

What would your excuse be for this soldier's "combat humor" if he was black? Or from California?

Ask a black Vietnam Vet what he called Vietnamese when there.

[gasperc]

23. yes, it's real as admitted by his senior officer

He may not have committed the act written on the sign but by the statement below owns up to the actual writing on the sign. It sounds like the "saved my dad" stuff was photoshop, otherwise the statement below would have read, that's not what was written on the picture it was saved my dad, etc

"Look, he didn't actually do what that sign says," Couvillon said. "This is stupid, lance corporal stuff that he thought was cute. But it's not, and I was informed the commandant of the Marine Corps had it and the Marine Corps will deal with this."

[tinanator]

26. why would anyone fake it is the main question

the answer put forth by staunch defenders of this conspiracy theory was "to make the troops look bad" or "frame the lance corporal".
uh. yeah. of course.

[rooboy]

7. Ted just has to produce the original and we're finished with the issue. nt

[redqueen]

36. Exactly, if this is a fake, provide the original

Gee, how surprising that this hasn't been done, eh?!

What a stupid, stupid thing to do.

[wtmusic]

8. If you were an Iraqi who found out about this, what would you think

about our intentions there? This is beyond vulgar.

[fujiyama]

13. I doubt he did what the sign says

but I do think it was a poor attempt at humor. It seems very possible that someone would write stupid shit like that in a war, when they are bored.

Ahhhh... Aren't we doing a fantastic job of "winning the hearts and minds" of the people of Iraq?

[drfemoe]

14. Wow

when I saw the thread at DU showing both pics, I thought the "saved and rescued" was the authentic one. But if you enlarge the photos at snopes, it looks like those are the words that were altered. "Killed and knocked up" look like the original. What a disappointment. Actually if this guy wanted a picture, he should have avoided the sign altogether. That's poor taste no matter WHAT it said.

[comsymp]

17. Well, somebody must have the original, right?

You'd think it would be pretty easy to clarify...

Looking at the 2 pics at Snopes, it does look like the saved/rescued one looks like the fake.

[Vickers]

18. Folks are forgetting: GIs *do* kill dads and knock up local girls

So he made a joke about it, big deal. If you've ever been in a combat zone, you've seen worse, and you know that the humor there is not the humor you see on network TV.

Poor guy is just blowing off steam, and makes a joke at the expense of some kids who CAN'T READ THE SIGN. In fact, that IS the joke.

Jeez.

[JohnyCanuck]

20. Blowing off steam in a way that will get GI's killed

This is from Stan Goff's latest piece at: www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/042004_goff_timeline.html

The same day, a photograph taken by a Marine gets published and circulates throughout the Arab and Muslim world. A cocky, smiling Marine has two Iraqi boys pose with him for the photograph, holding a sign they can't read that says, “Lcpl Boudreaux killed my dad then he knocked up my sister.” The photograph had the effect of pumping pure oxygen into a blazing fire.


The picture will only reinforce the stereotype the Arab and Muslim world has of Americans as being a bunch of self-centred, selfish heartless, God-defiling heathens and further stir up the will to resist and support for acts of terror against the US. But hey, F***em if they can't take a joke, right?

[Vickers]

22. Hold the doggone phone...

You think those folks are mad at us because of a PICTURE?

:eyes:

Oh wait:

:think:

Bwahahahahahahahaha!

Man, I thought you were serious at first...good one!

:toast:

[JohnyCanuck]

24. No it just reinforces what they already suspected.

And maybe tips a few thousand more of the dwindling group that said, "let's give them a chance" into the group that says "I'm gonna kill me one of these assholes if it is the last thing I do."

[Vickers]

25. Honestly, you need to go to the site you linked

and look at the other pictures. THAT'S what they are pissed about.

There are no fine distinctions that you allude to remaining, sad to say. I understand your point, but I disagree with it.

Still :pals: though.

[JohnyCanuck]

27. Well Stan Goff has been around the block a few times

as he spent a large chunk of his adult life in the US Army Special Forces taking part in operations from Viet Nam to Haiti.

Here's a brief synopsis of his background in an article he wrote after 9/11 detailing some of the problems he had with the "official" 9/11 story.

I'm a retired Special Forces Master Sergeant. That doesn't cut much for those who will only accept the opinions of former officers on military matters, since we enlisted swine are assumed to be incapable of grasping the nuances of doctrine.

But I wasn't just in the army. I studied and taught military science and doctrine. I was a tactics instructor at the Jungle Operations Training Center in Panama, and I taught Military Science at West Point. And contrary to the popular image of what Special Forces does, SF's mission is to teach. We offer advice and assistance to foreign forces. That's everything from teaching marksmanship to a private to instructing a Battalion staff on how to coordinate effective air operations with a sister service.

Based on that experience, and operations in eight designated conflict areas from Vietnam to Haiti, I have to say that the story we hear on the news and read in the newspapers is simply not believable. <snip>

http://www.narconews.com/goff1.html

Apparently Goff isn't quite so blasé about the whole affair as you are as he likens the widespread publication of this photograph in the Arab/Muslim world to: the effect of pumping pure oxygen into a blazing fire. Check with the next fireman you meet and ask him if he was in the middle of fighting a raging fire how'd he take it if some goofball turned on a pipeline that fed oxygen into the heart of the blaze he was battling to bring under control. Hugs back at you :pals:

[redqueen]

37. This guy is pouring gasoline on a fire

It's stupid and wrong, no matter what justification or excusemaking is done. Sure, there are other reasons for them to hate us. This, however, does the OPPOSITE of helping, and THAT'S what he's SUPPOSED to be there for.

Yeah, we got our money's worth training THAT moron.

[Vickers]

39. I didn't say it was right. I said it happens.

But hey, you knew that.

"That moron," eh? Nice.

[redqueen]

43. No, you said: "big deal"

Yes, it is a big deal, as all empirical evidence proves.

What besides a moron would endanger his fellow soldiers by fostering more hostility among the Iraqis when he's supposed to be 'liberating' them?

[Vickers]

45. It's not a big deal, trust me

In the grand scheme of things, this is NOTHING. When you consider all of the things that are going wrong in the M.E., this is a grain of sand.

Get over it, or enlist and go win the hearts and minds of the Iraqis yourself.

[redqueen]

51. To YOU it is not a big deal

To IRAQIS and other Arabs it apparently is.

I guess you think your opinion should supercede theirs? Interesting.

And why the F should I go there? I like how you insinuate that it's a big deal to me. What's a big deal to me is the IDIOTIC defense of this MORONIC action being displayed by some on this board. Please.

[Vickers]

52. You're already back from the recruiting office?

I knew they needed folks, but DANG that was quick.

Anyway, enjoy the military, and TRY NOT TO HAVE FUN!!!!!

[parasim]

30. Uh... yeah.

Please see my post (#28) above to see what the Marine Corps times article has to say about it.

It's not just a "picture" it's a message. Perhaps the soldier didn't mean to send a message, but he sure did. (If of course, he did indeed write those words)

Just imagaine if those kids end up learning what was on the sign, do you seriously think they're going to easily forgive his actions? I seriously doubt we'll have won over their hearts and minds.

[Vickers]

38. I give up

Hey, you win, cowboy. You are exactly right, a sign is much worse than bombs, bullets, fucked up M.E. policy, war in general, the whole thing.

I apologize.

[parasim]

60. I deserved that.

My comment (#34) was along those same lines. I take it back with apology.

However, I did not say that the sign (if it is indeed authentic) is worse than bombs, bullets, etc. I would appreciate you not putting words in my mouth.

I would say that I think that that kind of behavior is a by-product of that fucked up M.E. policy as well as war in general, however. Not worse, but not really evidence that we are becoming more civil towards one another, either.

But, I haven't been in combat, so what would I know. All I know about war is what my dad, a veteran of two wars (WW2, Korea), has related to me. Based on the flashbacks I witnessed him go through, I do know that war, with certainty, is hell.

[parasim]

34. Oh yeah, you're right, I forgot...

... and here I keep thinking that the human race is evolving.

[Vickers]

40. Yup, that guy is much worse than Georgie

He actually showed up in a combat zone.

[parasim]

63. I apologize for my flippant remark

But, I did not say that the guy is worse than Georgie.

However, I do believe that perhaps Georgie's mindset is rubbing off on the dude.

[Vickers]

65. Thanks for the apology (both, actually)

I apologize for putting words in your mouth...that wasn't my intention.

This issue for some reason gets my hackles up: seems like all the folks who are upset by it were never in the service, or never in a bad area. I was in both, and some of the things that military folks do for fun is pretty shocking.

The only thing I can compare it to is if you are friends with any surgeons, they can have ghastly senses of humor.

Sincerely,

Vickers

[parasim]

68. and I appreciate yours as well.

I fully understand the ghastly sense of humor that can rear it's ugly head in a warzone.

What gets me all up in arms, is that the military establishment teaches hate without even a glimpse of compassion. I do not blame the soldiers themselves for not having the personal discipline to keep that type of humor in check. I put the blame squarely at the feet of the Brass who seem to teach nothing but hate.

I know that it is probably too idealistic to think that wars can actually be fought with compassion. But it bothers me that so many people fail to see the deep-rooted hatred that must be present to compel someone to conjur up a "joke" about killing the father and raping the sister of two young boys.

peace,

parasim

[EV1Ltimm]

21. let's start up the third version...

i was thinking "I joined the military to serve my country and all i got was duped by bush and thrown in the middle of a desert." -- but that wouldn't fit on the board.

[alfredo]

29. Here is a photoshopped version of the picture posted in the

originating post.




Note the cardboard texture from the underlying corrugation.

[0007]

32. After scrutinizing the photo for hours Red Fox sez it is without

a doubt a real photo!

[FreeState]

54. A Graphics designers opinion

I edit images all day long everyday. I know how to spot a doctored image - and from playing with this image in Photoshop, Id say its real.

There are no repeated artifacts on the cardboard any were. Typically when you erase some part of an image you need a source to place on top of the old image. In doing this you always get patterns- here we have none. Unless the image a different one placed on top of an old one- but there is no evidence of that and the shadows disprove that.

[parasim]

62. I concur

I've been using Photoshop for 2 decades now, so I've done my fair share of image editing. I've also been playing around with these two images and from what I can tell, the saved/rescued one is a copy of the killed/knocked up version and modified. The extra jpeg artifacting evident on the s/r version certainly would suggest that.

That said, however, *both* of them could very well be fakes taken from the original photograph.

Hopefully, we'll learn the outcome of the investigation.

[mccormack98]

55. It looks doctored ...

See for yourself: right click on the picture and choose "Copy." Then paste it into viewer/editor of your choice such as PhotoShop or PaintShop Pro. Then zoom in on the sign. The cardboard area around the letters looks all squirrely - a classic pattern when an image has been doctored.

As we all know, the original has the name "Bush" in place of Beaudreaux's.

[FreeState]

58. Not so (Edited)

"The cardboard area around the letters looks all squirrely - a classic pattern when an image has been doctored."


This is only true if the image has not been made into a low grade jpg- such as this one has been made for the web. JPGs make all text have the squirrely lines. Its the nature of image compresion.

Look at the kids shirt for instance the same thing is happening with the letters on his shirt.

[ObaMania]

56. To me, the doctored photo is the "saved" one

In the example below, the "saved" one looks more pixellated, which means someone did something to it to have to save it, creating pixel degradation (*EDIT* making it grainy).

Also, I am not a hand writing analyst, but the s in "saved" is different than the one in "sister", plus the d in "saved" is slanted which isn't consistent with the one in "Boudreaux" and "Dad".

JMO.

[mccormack98]

57. Both look doctored to me ...

[BringEmOn]

59. Could be from a sign generator site similar to this:

http://www.captioncity.com/army.php

[mccormack98]

66. Good catch

[drfemoe]

69. Vote Here

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com

Other polls >>

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/static.php?f=view.php

Active force strength is now about 1.4 million. Also, of the 1.2 million National Guard and reserve troops, 154,600 are now mobilized. Is this enough manpower to meet current demands?

Yes 17.53 % (1,281)
No 75.10 % (5,488)
I don't know 7.38 % (539)
Total votes: 7308