The psychic cost of the closet

[dsc]

I am posting this due to the idea that "gays can hide it" or even that "gays should hide it" appearing to take some currency here at DU. It really isn't as simple as that.

Keeping the fact you are gay from the people who know and love you necessitates telling many lies. It means changing pronouns of lovers, not telling books you have read, movies you have watched, plans you have made, and a host of other things.

Imagine never wearing your engagement or wedding rings. Imagine never mentioning the love of your life to your friends. Imagine never bringing him or her to a Christmas Party at work. Imagine never mentioning whom you are dating. Imagine never introducing your spouse to your parents. Imagine no pictures on your desk or cubby. Imagine making up false love interests of the opposite gender.

All of the above and more are part of being in the closet. Not only that, but you have to be perfect. You can't ever slip up. You can never have a misplaced he. You can never stare too long at that cute guy. You can never have a well meaning gay guy mention you are gay by mistake. You can never leave a matchbook, magazine, or message where it might be found by mistake.

Trust me it isn't easy. I know I have been there, and I was pretty good at it. But the hardest thing, is knowing that every day, in ways little and big, I plotted to lie. I created a false identity for myself. No one knew the real me. The guilt and shame were toxic.

Yes, we can stay in the closet. But it is costly. I hope this post has made that clear, even if my writing leaves something to be desired.

[knight_of_the_star]

1. Where have you been seeing this on here?

I must not be seeing it, because it never really has seemed like that idea ever had much credibility on here. Can you provide any links to threads to back your assertion up?

[dsc]

2. not and be within the rules

This has come up a lot in threads in which Civil Rights for African Americans to those of gay Americans.

[slinkerwink]

3. yep---it's those who say that gay marriage is wrong, and that us

gays who are for gay marriage shouldn't be pushing this issue this election year because it "might" hurt the Democratic Party.

[drkedjr]

4. OUT in New Hampshire

I'm having a hard time determining how this one got going, but in today's mail was the new issue of
"The Advocate." The final article is by Christopher Rice (yes, Anne Rice's gay son) and he describes one
of the Bush's overlooked - the young, gay and proud. Gay youth today, are really going to be pissed
off when someone finally whacks 'em up side the head and fills them in on the current state of affairs.
Even high schoolers who can't vote, could have mega influence on their parents, relatives and older
friends. Let's not overlook this huge group of future voters!
http://www.nhstonewalldems.org

[newyawker99]

5. Hi drkedjr!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[tigereye]

6. It is very unfair that anyone who is gay should feel like they

have to hide whom they love and all of it's aspects. I hope that some day our culture will increase it's tolerance. I have sometimes thought that straight people ( I am straight) should have to do an exercise where they are unable to show their love for their partner, lie to others, etc, think about what it would be like to be persecuted or harmed for this, to see what that would feel like. Good luck and prayers to anyone who is struggling with being more open about whom they love.

[Q3JR4]

7. You know it

makes me angry to see those words. Gay individuals account for 10% of the Democratic vote during the primary season. We also have $500 billion of disposable income.

I for one thought the Dems. stood for equality. If those principles are sacrificed for votes, it makes me wonder about the future of the party.

[Deja Q]

14. It's all politics and timing...

And, yes, it will hurt the Democratic party because of the timing.

Bush* is clinging to the gay issue, because he's got no credibility ANYWHERE else, in case people hadn't noticed...

So, yeah, it is an issue.

A big one.

One he's going to exploit with his fellow fascists.

I am gay.

And I openly and proudly shout "You selfish couples should wait for a non-election year! You've waited millions of years already, what's a few more months?!" Why should your "marriage" help * win?!

What is so wrong about December 31, 2004 to have started this gambit?

[dsc]

15. Please state the name of the gay or lesbian

on the MA Supreme Court. They made the decision last I checked.

[sweetheart]

16. awaken the hollywood monster

Who do you think makes all this propaganda... the frikking gay
community.

AWOL ain't seen nothing like the lashing he's gonna take the rest of
this year from the "liberal" media... maybe not news media, but
rather "MEDIA" (read: Gay written; directed; and acted).

He picked the wrong enemy. It was stupid of him, and hes gonna lose
and its our job to crush them for even attempting to use the
constitution to repress civil rights in this great nation.

[sweetheart]

8. There are more than gays in that closet, my friend.

It is also true about being a:
feminist,
not-a-racist,
a non-christian,
a cannabis smoker,
HIV positive,
non-white
and a host of other "fringe" lifestyles that are socially repressed.

It forces these communities to isolate themselves for protection
from persecution, and for their life-voices to be drowned out by
the lies they must tell to pretend to be "acceptable".

I'm a cannabis smoking non-christian feminist. I'm as buried in the
closet as any homosexual. I can't celibrate with non-cannabis
smokers for fear of persecution and have to be wary and cagey about
all people i meet, with a similar veil of lies to what you describe.

Some UK economists were looking in to what makes an area economically
successful, and the PRIMARY factor was tolerance of alternate life
styles. It is the Bay area gay community that gives silicon
valley its fire, not wall street. It is the LA gay community that
gives hollywood its capability, not movie studios. It is the NY
gay community that runs the fasion and finance businesses, not
the republicans.

If we all came out of the closet together, hand in hand, we'd
outnumber the scum-republicans 100 to 1. The only way to keep an
apparent majority is to whip us all in to the closet. I'm not
gonna take it anymore... all you closet repressed folks... don't
get depressed, get even. Write letters to every fricking person on
the planet about how evil the bush nazi's are and lets turn the
tables on this war against civil rights.

[dsc]

11. true enough

being different is always dangerous.

[davsand]

12. I've been in the broom closet a long time

I have never come out to my family or in my local community. While I'm part of the whole straight world, I'm still an outsider and I'm still hiding.

When I first began reading the books about goddess worship I remember feeling almost furtive about it--like I was doing something wrong. I'll grant you, this was 20 some years ago--but it took a long time before I'd leave my copy of Womens' Book of Celebrations out on the bookshelf if any of my family was coming over.

I agonized over the proper time to come out to the man I finally married.

Nine years ago when I got married, it reared its head again when my father threw a fit over a Unitarian wedding. I waffled and got married in the United Methodist church I went to as a kid--but even that had its moments--like in the pre marital counseling session when the Minister asked what role the church was gonna play in our marriage...

Fear of self expression is an awful thing no matter what it is you are afraid to be open about. I'm more open now about this aspect of my life--but it will always be a difficult subject for me.

Does it play a role in my political activities? SURE it does. I will never vote for someone that wants to burn me, and those like me, at the stake.

I can only think it is equally if not more painful for someone who is gay.

Pax to all of you, my fellow closeted ones.


Laura

[arcos]

21. do you have a link?

I would really like to see that study by UK economists, it would have been very useful in some discussions I've had on other forums. I'm 99% sure that is a fact, and that's the reason a lot of countries are doing so bad economically.

[sweetheart]

28. Here, i found it !!

This is an academic paper getting to this subject

http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=cache:k3u1l5gOVMYJ:www.essex.ac.uk/ECPR/events/generalconference/marburg/papers/5/2/Clark.pdf+correlations+gay+tolerance+economic+development&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

I read the results in a UK newspaper some time back and remember
having a "i always knew that intuitively" chuckle.

I'm sure if you dig the dirt more, you'll come up with a plethora
of academic focuses on the keys to economic synergy.

[arcos]

29. thanks!! n/t

[TexasBushwhacker]

25. Closeted Democrat at work

I'm here in Texas and used to work for a business whose clients were all related to BIG OIL in one way or another. That pretty much describes half of the working people in Houston, even after all the layoffs in the oil industry.

I worked for 5 years for a small company that had less than 25 full time employees. I was the sole admitted Democrat. I didn't really see what the big deal was. I didn't care that my boss was Republican. There were actually lots of issues that we agreed on and I told him that ultimately, I was fiscally conservative, but socially liberal and on a national level, it was the social issues that were the "deal breakers" to me. As the owner of a small business, he said that those issues were what made him vote Republican. I didn't agree with him, but I accepted his viewpoint. However, he COULD NOT accept mine. During the last election, he even put a flyer from the NFIB on my desk. If Gore hadn't been ROBBED of the election in 2000, I'm sure I would have lost my job. My boss just couldn't handle it.

The thing is, all the political talk went on at the lunch table almost every day. These people still think it's a bigger deal that Clinton got a BJ in the Oval Office than GWB starting a war over imaginary WMD's. PEOPLE ARE DYING, and they still spend their lunch hour BSing about the "liberals" and the "Democrats", etc. etc.

Eventually I just started eating out every day or snacking at my desk. I wasn't going to get into an argument over this stuff. You can't have a battle of the wits with an unarmed person. Personally, I think things like politics and religion (oh, the boss was a big Jew hater for some reason too) shouldn't be topics of discussion in a workplace, but it's awfully hard to fight a battle when you're outnumbered.

But they fired me last month, so what do I care?!

[TexasBushwhacker]

9. Guilt and shame can be deadly

Remember the religious cult "Heaven's Gate" in San Diego? Their leader, Herf Applewhite, was a closeted gay man who felt so much shame about his sexuality that he denied it by marrying and having children with a woman, by studying for the Presbytarian ministry where he was taught that homosexuality was an abomination, by having a celibate partnership with Bonnie Nettles (known as The Two, Bo & Peep and Ti & Do), and eventually having himself castrated. The unbelieveable stress of not being able to accept his sexuality, the self loathing, the shame, caused numerous bouts with mental illness.

Oddly enough, he was the choir director at my church; First Unitarian in Houston, TX. The Nettles family were members and that's where he met Bonnie originally and later they got to know each other better at a psychiatric hospital where she was a nurse and he was a patient. I was in the junior choir at the time, probably about 12 or 13, in 1969 and 1970. When the news of the Heaven's Gate suicides (39 people) hit the news in 1997, his name at first sounded vaguely familiar. I happened to be at my mother's house at the time when we saw the news on TV, and we both went "Herf Applewhite? ..... OH MY GOD, HERF APPLEWHITE!!!"

In 1969, there were few gays out of the closet. I didn't really even know what being homosexual was, but I knew that "Mr. Applewhite" wasn't like the other daddies. He was just "different". Also he thought the junior choir was beneath him and he was rather moody; friendly and encouraging one week and snapping at us the next.

In retrospect I wondered if he was gay and I asked my mother what she thought. She said, "Good grief! Of course he was!" I asked her if the church had any problem with it that she remembered Most Unitarian churches welcome gay people with open arms and have been perform marriages for same sex couples for decades. My mom said, "No, the only problem we had with him was that he wanted to be paid full time for a part time job!"

The thing is, even though our church accepted him, he never accepted himself, at least not for very long. I don't know what exactly he was hospitalized for, but my guess is that he was bi-polar (manic depressive). Keeping your stress level managable plays a big role in controlling bi-polar illness and keeping those mood swings within normal range. But when someone is manic, they can be VERY charistmatic. Well Herf was so charismatic he eventually convinced 39 people that it was time to "leave their physical bodies". I can't help but wonder if all of that wouldn't have happened if Herf had been able to just be gay, be open and be happy.

[dsc]

10. wow I had no real idea

I knew he had mental problems, of course, but had no idea just what they were. What a total shame. I pretty much drank like hell which is its own problem.

[dsc]

13. kick

[Rowdyboy]

17. The stresses of living in the closet are unimaginable...

I, too, went through years of carefully selected, impersonal pronouns when discussing my personal life. Thankfully, I was out to my friends, only closeted to family. At work, everyone knew that I lived with the same man for 15 years and never mentioned a woman. No one ever asked for details and I never offered, except to a few selected co-workers.

Why do you think the suicide rate among gay teenagers is so outrageous? Self-hatred, caused by being forced to deny your true personality, encourages feelings of worthlessness and increases depression. No wonder they chose to opt out early.

[dsc]

18. Yeah it sure is brutal

I watched Boy Meets Boy which was the 'relatity' show that had a guy picking a guy with the catching being some were straight. It was so interesting to see the toll being in the closet took on those straight guys for a week. All I could think was "hey bud try it for a few years then start whining."

I strongly considered suicide twice while in the closet, not once outside of it, and that was with a portion of that as a practicing alcoholic.

[Rowdyboy]

19. My response to the closet was 20 years of grinding my teeth in my sleep

After I met my partner, it stopped. I currently need about $25,000 dental work.

Alcohol abuse was another aspect of my repression. Never seriously considered suicide, just not an option.

[dsc]

20. wow that is a lot of grinding

It really does lift a weight off when we finally tell people. The sense of freedom is pretty terrific. Not worth the pain but still great.

[Puglover]

22. I have been so incredibily lucky...

I came out when I was 26 (1980) to my friends....to my family around 1983 or so. The only thing my brother was pissed about was that I told my sister-in-law before him. My mother now gone commented "well I already have enough daughters in law." Both with friends, at work and with my family I never had a ripple of a problem When at work I sometimes hear homophobic crap come out of peoples mouths and I ALWAYS challenge them. (I have somewhat of a sharp tongue :)
And believe me I work with ALOT of straight white consertive men.
I wonder sometimes if it has helped that I 6'2, built like a brick shithouse and act like a "regular guy" whatever that means. All that being said it makes me sick that kids have so much trouble and so much adversity to go through when growing up gay.
As far as the closet is concerned I decided early on that I was damned if I was going to sit at work and listen to people go on and on about their familys and act as if mine did not exist.

[dsc]

23. That is great for you.

My parents were mixed. Dad great, mom mediocure. But you also probably made some of your luck. I think people like confidence which you seem to have. I probably over internalized the bad things people said. In any case, keep up the good work.

[dsc]

24. kick

[radfringe]

26. OUT in PA

and although it's not recognized by any legal authority -- my partner and I had a unity ceremony last year

we've been together 6-1/2 years

my last relationship was for 17 years and I lost my partner to ovarian cancer

[dsc]

27. I am sorry for your loss

but glad you found another wife. What part of PA are you from. I am up by Erie but just across the border.

[radfringe]

31. Am living just outside of Wilkes-Barre

very small town called Lehman

how small is it? It's soooooo small the sign coming into town says "Welcome to Lehman" on both sides, and the sign is only 3" thick

last population census had us at 527, more cows than people

I moved here about 7 years ago from WESTERN Massachusetts - the part of Massachusetts where we do pronounce our "R's" :)

[dsc]

33. wow

Kind of the Alabama part of PA. I heard you have a competitive Congress critter race in your neck of the woods. He have one here too. Hope things to well out there. Say hi to your new wife for me.

[foreigncorrespondent]

30. Beautifully said my friend.

I was in the closet with my family for a while (like all of us.) They knew I was a lesbian, just I never came out and confirmed it.

What I would do is send out little feelers here and there, so I could get their take on gays in general. My mum was cool about it. My dad is nothing more than an obnoxious old drunk who wouldn't know how to love his kids if he fell over the instruction manual. My sister, was always great. She had worked for a gay couple for years, and loved every moment of her job with the boys.

It was very hard for me to finally find that one woman I had been searching for all my life, and not share my love for her with my family.

I couldn't tell them why I was making trips back and forth to the U.S. I couldn't tell them why I was trying to immigrate to the U.S. I couldn't include my family in any part of that part of my life, because regardless I was still scared. I was scared that they would turn their backs on me.

I finally came out to them and confirmed their suspicions about my sexuality. And everything with my mum and my sister is still the same.

They have met Sapph several times now, and realize just how damn happy she truly makes me. They are happy that I have her in my life, and they are happy I finally living my life freely, the way I was born to live it. My dad however is another story. He is a homophobe.

People don't realize that we are in a catch 22 situation on whether or not to come out to family and friends and the world. If we come out, we face a world of discrimination. If we remain in the closet we face not sharing the most important parts of our life with those we are close to.

[dsc]

39. I had no idea

I would have never thought you had stayed in the closet while doing that long distance of a dating. That is really amazing. I hope your dad comes around someday. Also am very glad to hear of your relationship in the present tense. Is that the hopeful sign I think?

[foreigncorrespondent]

42. Yes it is.

We are working through everything. Just taking one day at a time. :)

My dad probably will never come around. He moved from Perth to New Zealand a few years back, and so I have no way of contacting him anymore anyway.

[noiretextatique]

32. a timely post, dsc

i came out in 1981 when i was 21. my parents still think it's a "phase," but they have always been accepting of all my friends and partners.

a friend is struggling with this closet issue now, and i tell you...it's not just taking a toll on her, it's taking a toll on everyone who cares about her. i won't go into detail...suffice it to say, she is paying a very high price for her belief that pretending to be straight is beneficial to her. i just keep telling her: the costs far outweigh any benefits. the bottom line: she has to adress her internal homophobia and self-hatred before those false beliefs destroy her.

as someone who loves her...it's heartbreaking to watch.

[dsc]

37. It surely is

It is very hard to watch someone make the exact same mistakes you have made. The security of the closet is such a temptation as we both well know. I hope she figures it out soon for both her and for you. God speed.

[noiretextatique]

38. thanks, dsc

it's a really difficult situation, and i do know what she's struggling with, so i am just trying to love her through it. and as you said: to difficult watching someone make the exact same mistakes you have made.
i have been there. it's a process that requires more than just saying "i'm gay"...that's for sure.
thanks for giving me a place to unload...this is weighing heavily on my mind.

[Andy_Stephenson]

34. Hiding was always the hard part

Stepping out of the closet was very liberating to say the least.

Now...who wants to help me write a stump speech?


Andy

[hippiegranny]

35. out in AZ

altho, formerly from PA! Hershey area.

My take on this is that we ALL need to be out unless there is a surefire life threatening reason not to be. Who do we think we're kidding anyway? Everyone who is closeted and starts coming out to their family and friends is almost always surprised to find out that most people suspected anyway, but they figured if the gay person didn't want to talk about it, it was because they were ashamed. Being out AND proud is the surest way to kill our own inner homophobia, and it is such an education for people who never thought they knew someone gay, much less liked them! dsc is absolutely correct - living life of lies IS toxic. The public perception of gays as equals begins within each of us. We are the ambassadors.

[tom_paine]

36. Man, I'm glad I never had to deal with that

An accident of genes and enviroment that I am most pleased over.

Not because there is anything intrinsically wrong with being a homosexual, but the added psychic pain had I been gay in addition to all the other bullshit of growing up must be horrific in ways that Straight Guys can't imagine.

[Andy_Stephenson]

43. You have no idea how hard it is. Growing up gay that is...

plus I grew up in Texas. I was always ashamed of who I was. Until I came out of the closet. I did not have to lie anymore.

I can understand gay teens angst and why some commit suicide. I was lucky in a way. I had a boyfriend of sorts in highschool. He was my first love. We never consumated the affair...he actually was my best friend and I spent as much time as I could with him. It was difficult to tell him, I did, we are still friends.

But many teans are alienated...God I wish I had had a role model. Now the government is coming out against us...People we thought we could trust. Personally I could care lees what straight America does in bed or who they marry. So why do they dictate, who I can marry?


When you get right down to it...even here "Straight America" has severe prejudice against GLBT. It is not always overt but it is here none-the-less. Perhaps GLBT are the true minority...because there are more people against us than for us.

I appreciate your pathos.

[Karenina]

40. When I got to conservatory in'68

still near-pristine and clueless, my good boys 'splained it all to me.
My "good old days" were our forays on 7th Avenue South, doing poppers and dancing the night away. They carefully taught me how to spot liars and WHY I needed to understand and RESPECT this "strange" TRUTH of their lives. The idea of "strangeness" proved itself to me to be no more than a cultural construct. I had SUCH FUN!!! My meat was NOT on the market while I got schooling about "transactions."

I lost a close friend to suicide. He was a brilliant pianist. Simply brilliant. We thought nothing of curling up together as the sun rose to sleep it off. He'd been "outed" to conservative Texas his family and the shit hit the fan.

THERE WAS NOTHING I COULD DO TO ALLEVIATE THE PAIN. NOTHING. I have long since forgiven, but I will NEVER FORGET.

We ARE who we ARE, each and every one of us. In the words of Rodney King, "Can't we all just get along?" How long should psychic abuse be tolerated?

[dsc]

41. that is a crying shame

one has to wonder how many songs have remained unwritten, diseases remained uncured, students remained untaught, and so many other things undone just due to this kind of thing. I hope he is in a better place.