Official 9/11 Investigation Thread #3

[indigo32]

discuss here.
previous thread here
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=1278137&mesg_id=1278137

[BootinUp]

1. Gorton fishing for ammo

to use against Clarke.

[Vadem]

2. and to blame Clinton....n/t

[robsul82]

3. Geezus.

"Your government failed you - Clarke" should be the headline on all papers across the nation.

Later.

RJS

[underpants]

5. Dammit I missed the beginning

DAMN!

[proud patriot]

17. Clarke's opening statement brought a tear to my eye

and gave me goosebumps .

[Cush]

4. Subs were off the coast of Pakistan

ready to attack at a moments notice

[BootinUp]

6. Clarke is not afraid

to say exactly what happened and name names. Just stated it Tenet's decision not to go after hunting camp in 99

[Nashyra]

8. Groton is trying to cover *' ass big time

Clarke has the guts to apoligize to the victims families and the American people and this f*&^er is being patently partisan.

[Cush]

7. Side Scroll on CNN

Bush/Cheney will only meet with the Chair & Vice Chair of the Commission. Clinton/Gore will meet with THE ENTIRE COMMISSION

[livetohike]

9. Bush and Cheney

believe they are above meeting with peons. Their arrogance makes me ill. What laws in our country can stop this lunacy?

It just looks bad for them, imo.

[Catherine Vincent]

16. These arrogant pricks forgot those same peons put them in office!

Well, the Supreme Court did, but that's another issue!

[Kahuna]

34. The people didn't put them in office. So, they're not accountable..

to the people, you silly goose. :crazy:

[Skip Intro]

55. bush said himself that he didn't feel he had to explain himself to anybody

a while back, can't remember what that was in reference to - and I think he finished that remark with something like, "some people may need to explain themselves to me.."

damn, now I gotta go google...

[indigo32]

10. Wow

I didn't realize they were going to going to testify at all.

[annxburns]

11. More details please

... for those of us at work.

[Vadem]

19. Ben Veniste questioning now:

Focusing on the role of the NS advisor and his role in the Clinton admin. as opposed to the Bush.

Clarke: Similarity: I was told by each of the four NS advisors with which I worked, that if I ever had reason to believe I needed to act on something, I had an open door to act... The difference between Bush and Clinton is policy development. I worked directly with the advisor in Clinton and worked with deputies in Bush admin.

[Lalena]

29. Got a radio? My local NPR station is broadcasting it. (n/t)

[rusty charly]

15. !!!

big ben

[Melinda]

33. They aren't "testifying" - only *meeting*. No oaths for Bush* or Unca Dick

They will not swear or affirm to tell the truth; they are above that sort of thing. :grr:

[leftchick]

12. he is fearless!

I love this guy! I wonder if chimpy* is watching... Nah, probably taking his nappy...

[Cush]

13. he just went after Congress & the Media

says their profiling of failed covert ops missions damaged the CIA

[Cush]

14. Ben-Veniste is up

[rusty charly]

23. ben veniste's

the applause getter

[BootinUp]

18. Clarke just explained

how we might have nipped AQ in bud. Said human intelligence eviscerated in late 80's early ninties. Layed some of it on R. Gates former CIA Dir, NSC. Says Cia is risk averse, because of congressional pressures.

[Emboldened Chimp]

24. Remeber, late 80's, early 90's

in other words, Poppy Bush eviscerated the intelligence community, not Clinton.

[The Backlash Cometh]

39. They closed down embassies that are now being reconstructed 100

a year at a time after 9/11. The embassies were closed in the 1980s because they became a target and liability. The congress claimed they closed them because of the cost, but it was really because it made terrible press whenever they were attacked and we had to evacuate. But when they were ordered closed during the Reagan-Bush era, the main criticism was that we would lose the opportunity to put people on the ground that could develop relationships with the locals and get human intelligence. I believe there is a great archived article about this in the Washington Post but I couldn't tell you the year it was written.

[BootinUp]

20. Clarke getting a round of applause

for apologizing to America.

[Cush]

21. Ben-Veniste thanks Clarke for his apology (gets applause)

says he was the first to do so

[robsul82]

22. Ben-Veniste credits Clarke's apology...

...brings up that it's the first such apology from anyone, to sustained applause for Clarke.

Later.

RJS

[Catherine Vincent]

25. I missed it. Why the applause?

[Vadem]

32. Ben Veniste thanked Clarke for his apology and said he was..

the first to do so (re 9/11).

[Cush]

26. Summer of 2001: Threat Level was the highest I've seen (Tenet as well)

[Spazito]

27. This man comes across as sincere and has the details...

the inquiry needs. He is very imposing, imo.

[BootinUp]

30. Its the motherload

of information coming out now. No politics.

[BootinUp]

35. Clarke: incomprehensible that FBI information

didn't get to him.

[SoDesuKa]

28. Applause for the Apology

I wasn't aware until Ben-Veniste said so, that Clarke's apology is the first time that anyone in the government has done that. The room broke out into applause, as it does every time government stonewalling is mentioned.

[Cush]

31. Clarke: I thought/felt the threat was here in the US

others felt it would be in Saudi Arabia or Israel

[Cush]

36. Clarke says he wasn't informed about Moussaoi

[Vadem]

37. Was info re Massoui ever related to you? Clarke: No. ...

Asking about flying planes into buildings;

Clarke: The info re AC using planes as weapons--info was old (5 or 6 years old)"



So much for Condi's lie about using planes as weapons.

[Cush]

38. Clarke asked the FAA to spread the memo about the possible hijackings?

[Cush]

40. Oh boy, Kerrey is up

[Emboldened Chimp]

41. here we go...

thanking clarke for his sincerity in a very insincere manner...

[BootinUp]

44. lol

[BootinUp]

43. Babbling

Can't he thank him more gracefully?

[Cush]

42. Clarke: I knew what the price would be (for speaking out)

[underpants]

45. Damn that was on the mark

:thumbsup:

[rusty charly]

46. b. kerry

just loves the sound of his own voice

[k in IA]

50. My god - would he ask a question and shut up!

[Vadem]

47. Kerrey up now; thanks Clarke for his sincerity in his apology....

Kerrey tells him to not take it personally for all the press attention directed at him (wha??)

Kerrey: we must have honest disagreements, where we have common ground; you almost always provoke a good argument. I disagree with on the Galinda project; I believe Galinda would have necessitated war.

Kerrey Warmongering again!

[displacedtexan]

It's "delenda"

as in "Carthago delenda est," Carthage must be destroyed. Cato the Elder believed that destruction, not containment, was the only recourse after the Third Punic War.

[Cush]

48. Kerrey: You're not supposed to give your opinion here

you're supposed to ask questions

[BootinUp]

49. Clarke eyes him suspiciously

[RoundRockD]

53. Kerrey hasn't yelled at Clarke yet. Is he afraid of him? n/t

[BootinUp]

60. Clarke so calmly answered the ham

that Kerrey couldn't go anywhere. Clarke is great!

[Rockholm]

66. Kerrey Is Auditioning For VP!

[Vadem]

51. Is that the Gore report he is speaking of or the Hart-Rudman...

or are the reports the same (I forget) regarding airline security?

[Cush]

52. Clarke brings up TWA 800

and how there was a Presidential Commission to look into how to upgrade scurity. Most were programs were carried out, but others rejected due to cost and Government Bureaucray

The Secret Service wanted programs, but the Budget/Treasury Dpets rejected it

[Cush]

54. Thompson accuses him of being a flipper flopper

Clarke brings up the Time 2002 article

[revcarol]

63. What's that about?

flip/flop/Time

[BootinUp]

56. Clarke just explained his recommendations

for aircraft defense in DC and Airport security. Some implemented, most unfunded.

[Catherine Vincent]

57. Clarke talking about Time article now.....

[underpants]

58. Thompson:Book or press briefing which is true?

Clarke says it is disceptive. HE is now citing the TIme article.

[underpants]

62. He did a press background to diminish the Time article

as it hurt the administration.

[Cush]

59. Bush People were concerned about the Time 2002 Article

so they worked something out (a release) to lesson the criticism at the WH

[SoDesuKa]

61. NY DU'ers: Is This Televised Here?

I'm listening to WBAI, but I don't know if it's on TV.

[Stephanie]

112. It's on C-Span 3 and CNN - not on local TV

It's on WBAI and WNYC

[Spazito]

64. I love Clarke's tone, it is even, not agressive or defensive...

even when the asshole that is fronting for Bush just did Rove's bidding.

[Catherine Vincent]

72. I like his tone also.

NO theatrics or anything. The repukes are trying to get a hysterical reaction or something out of him but he's not budging.

Good on ya, Clarke!

[Cush]

65. Clarke: I was asked to make a case to the Press

So I did it...I've done for several presidents

[Emboldened Chimp]

67. Moving right along....

[SoDesuKa]

68. Horrified Reaction is Unwarranted

That's part of the job, isn't it? The president tells you the official line, and you support it. Happens all the time.

[livetohike]

69. Yeah, accentuate the positive

eliminate the negative, or something like that :-)

[underpants]

70. I was told to highlight the good things and not highlight the bad

as I have done for other presidents.

Thompson:"Ooookay" smart ass.

[SoDesuKa]

77. Thompson Not Naive

Thompson's been a government executive. He can't really think that subordinates are allowed their own spin on policy, can he?

[SoDesuKa]

86. Condi Lied

Condi said not Al Qaeda plan was in place; Clarke says there was.

[displacedtexan]

91. Big Jim Thompson was Gov of IL when I lived there.

What a creep!

[RoundRockD]

78. The Bushies must have forgotten that Clarke is a republican...

He knows how to get tough right back at them. He seems to be beating them at their own game. Thompson is so obviously partisan.

[kiahzero]

81. Breaking news

Politician is shocked... SHOCKED... to hear that an administration might spin the facts.

[hexola]

97. I think that NUKED Thomson ! -

He tried to come out and wack Clarke...but that exchange made Thompspon look like he was grasping at straws...

about time...

[wicket]

71. For the cube rats here...

What is he saying about the Time article???

[htuttle]

80. I think the Bushes made a strategic error waving it about

Clarke says that the Bush admin asked him to counter a previous press piece by talking to Time about the 'positive' things the administration had done about terrorism, and to minimize the negative things. Clarke says that since the President's office asked him to do it, he did it since he worked for them.

In other words, BushCo is attempting to criticize Clarke for doing what they asked him to do -- spin a bit in their favor in Aug 2002. To my ears, it made BushCo look pretty shallow on this (worried more about image than substance...as always).

[ewagner]

108. Nobody asked????????????????????

Who in the Bush Administration asked him to spin/lie?

I watched that and he studiously avoided saying who ordered him to give that press briefing.

That's the next biggie folks!!!!!!!!!

[The Backlash Cometh]

101. He said the Time article was sensationalized.

So the Bush Administration asked him to do a press release which would accentuate the positive things that were done by the Administration. Words were used selectively in the press release. For example, he would claim something was "approved" but the reality was that it was never funded. Or he would say something was "approved" even when it only made it through the two lower levels of the executive branch, and Bush had not yet seen it.

[Emboldened Chimp]

73. Anyone HAVE the Time article?

[RaulGroom]

75. Here

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,333835,00.html

[Emboldened Chimp]

76. cool...thanks!

[RaulGroom]

79. no problem... hope you enjoy myself

[Cush]

74. "It is unusual when you are told every day that there is an urgent threat"

on the 8 months it took to get things approved

[Cush]

82. Deputies reworded his plans

Replaced "Eliminate" with "Erode". Eliminate was to bold

[Catherine Vincent]

83. oooh, Clarke says in so many words that Thompson is acting obtuse!

hahaha! Thompson looks pissed.

[xultar]

84. BAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke:

[Birthmark]

90. Yup. Thompson through a big ol' roundhouse right.

And whiffed! Big time!

[Cush]

85. Clarke: You just seemed concerned by the tone (to Thompson)

meaing, you're upset that I'm not kissing Bush's ass

[BootinUp]

87. I think Thompson is about cry or somethin

Clarke said it bothers (the tone in the book) him but that as a staff member he makes Prez policy look good in Time article, Thompson said with all respect a lot of this bothers him.

[Cush]

88. Clarke: We gave the new Admin two plans

[ellie]

89. That was hilarious!

Paraphrasing here
Clarke: I think that what is bothering you is the tenor and the tone.

Silence

Thompson: More than that is bothering me. blah blah blah

[displacedtexan]

95. See my above post re "Big Jim Thompson"

He's an A-1 Asshole!

[Catherine Vincent]

100. My vcr is recording this session with Clarke.

Along with this am's Washington Journal. I think I will keep this one on file for a while instead of taping over it. LOL!

[BootinUp]

92. Clarke might need SS protection

I'm worried for teh guy. He is layin it all out there. :(

[Cush]

93. Clarke: There was no plan to use US Forces to remove the Taliban (?)

is that what he said?

[RoundRockD]

96. Off the subject. Is Clarke appearing on Larry King Live tonight? n/t

[BootinUp]

99. Paula Zahn with Ken Starr

[Catherine Vincent]

104. What?

Who gives a flip about Ken Starr?

[BootinUp]

109. just sayin its Clarke vs Starr - don't shoot me :)

[Catherine Vincent]

102. Yes.

[SoDesuKa]

94. Gorelick Pissed at Condi

She's giving Clarke opportunities to Condi-bash. If Condi wants to reply, she can raise her right hand and testify.

[Spazito]

98. Whoa, talk about straight truth...

Clarke just shot Condi down, big time!!!!!

[revcarol]

107. OK OK

What did he SAY? Come on, for cube dwellers.

[Spazito]

113. Gorlick read out a statement quoting Condi in which she stated...

what comprised the bush plan for going after Al Qaeda and then asked Clarke if it was an accurate statement and Clarke simply answered "No, it is not"! It was great!

[Mike Niendorff]

110. bigtime.

Gorelick: "Is that statement {Rice's characterization of Bush anti-AQ strategy} accurate?"

Clarke: "No, it is not."

-----

wow.


MDN

[emalejim9]

Just made Yahoo...news

Ex-Adviser: Terrorism Not Urgent for Bush


This is great!!!

[SoDesuKa]

103. Body Bags

"This country needs body bags before it takes threats seriously . . . "

[SoDesuKa]

111. Clarke: "They Called Me Obsessed"

They told Clarke to stop being so obsessed with Al Qaeda. We're big and mighty, and they're small and puny ... Lighten up!

[ellie]

105. Attacking the

DC mindset that "needs" body bags to change policy.

[Cush]

106. He just named Congress

they wouldn't give them programs they wanted.

Says only body bags make a difference.

He was aksed why were you so obsessed with Al Qaeda? only 35 people have died? What's the threat?

[emalejim9]

114. Rate this story......before it gets freeped

Ex-Adviser: Terrorism Not Urgent for Bush

[indigo32]

115. New Thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x1279827