How much of a role did racism play in American support for the Iraq war?

[_Jumper_]

If the same "case" for war had made against Sweden would the American people have supported the war?

[SlavesandBulldozers]

1. that depends

how's Sweden's oil supply?

[_Jumper_]

3. Not much

But Norway has oil. Let's get those pinko-commie socialists! They hate us for our freedom!

[DrWeird]

7. Pff. Make Stolkholm glow!

Let's go kill them dirty snow niggers!

[_Jumper_]

The cost of inaction is greater than the cost of action

Who knows, maybe they might send their ski team after us 200 years from now!

[noiretextatique]

2. racism is always a factor is america's wars

isn't it?

[Carolina]

11. exactly

the US dropped THE BOMB on Japan but would not have done such to Germany. My WWII vet Dad recalls that German POWs were treated better by American GIs and had more privileges than Black American soldiers.

Racism plays a huge role. Always has, always will!

[keithyboy]

34. And the US never bombed anywhere in the Soviet Union but Grenada.

We tried as best we could to keep Clinton from bombing in Bosnia and Serbia...that's why he was villified...the very idea of attacking white people in defense of Muslims (even white Muslims...Americans don't know the difference).

[Jade Fox]

37. During WWII Japanese Americans were put in camps, but not Germans or

Italians.

Racism/Xenophobia are huge factors in the Iraq war. We would never do that
to a white European nation even if they had oil galore.

[DrWeird]

4. That's how he got the public to support it.

The only reason the majority of americans bought the lie that Saddam Hussein was behind 9-11 was because he was muslim.

[wryter2000]

14. Exactly

My officemate is a great barometer for middle to slightly right America. She admits now that she was so mad about 911, she wanted to get someone. No way would she have felt that way against a non-Muslim country.

The funny thing is she's African American, and she now admits that her feelings were racist.

[plurality]

5. A huge amount

I never really thought about it growing up, but I've noticed it since. As long as I've remembered I don't think I've ever seen a Muslim in a Hollywood movie that wasn't a terrorist. I wonder what effect that could have on a population.

Notice you never saw the groundswell of feeling for invading Israel even though they're in violation of more UN resolutions than Iraq was and have WMDS. (In case you forgot, those were the reasons BEFORE invading)

[_Jumper_]

6. Good points

Hollywod often goes out of their way to portray Muslims and Arabs in a bad light.

I agree about Israel. One of the main reasons the US gives blank-check support to Israel is because of racism and the endemic high level of anti-Arab racism here since 1979 (even though Iranians aren't Arab).

[plurality]

10. that's why I said Muslim instead of Arab

But as far as mainstream America goes, they're all the same.

Seriously after the 20 years of brainwashing most of the public has undergone all someone has to do is say Allah and they're instantly one of those evil terrorist Arabs as far as the general Nascar-dad block goes.

[stepnw1f]

8. Alot

While living in NY, FL, and MA, all I kept hearing was "Towel Heads." So yes, they played on our ignorance and resentment of Arabs to gain public support to go to war.

[_Jumper_]

9. NY and MA

It is tragic--and very telling--that such sentiment is mainstream in liberal bastions like NY and MA.:(

[stepnw1f]

13. That Info-tainment.

I wish it were different, but wishing isn't enough. We have to force the media to be more honest by being a pain in the ass. Until then, nothing will change. News is mainly controlled by conglomerations, so the news is the same in every facet of this ill-informed country.

Come to think of it, we are the new wave of media.

[The Stranger]

12. Excellent, excellent and combustible question.

[Guaranteed]

15. Enormous.

The whole lead-up to the war played on people's ignorance, thinking that Iraqis and Al Qaeda were the same thing. That was the clincher.

[rucky]

16. google the word "ragheads"

and you'll find out.

[Guaranteed]

17. One more thing-

Wed Mar 3, 4:03 AM ET

BAGHDAD (AFP) - At least 117 people were killed and over 300 wounded in the suicide bomb attacks on a Shiite Muslim mosque in northwest Baghdad and the holy Shiite city of Karbala, a senior official of the US-led coalition said, revising down the death toll.

---------------------
Now, while that's not quite as many dead as in the Madrid bombing, it's a comparable size. But notice that you got about a day's worth of coverage of the Baghdad bombing. We're gonna be hearing about Madrid for weeks. This is a "real tragedy."

The racism of our country is very subtle, but undeniable. Iraqis < Spaniards < Americans.

[DrWeird]

19. Damn, another one?

I hadn't heard anything else since that big one a week or so ago that killed 120+.

You could even see the racism at DU. I remember one person who said the saw footage of the after math and said "those people" are uncontrollable and should be left to their own devices. Or something like that.

[Guaranteed]

22. Yeah, that was the one I was talking about

I'm just pointing out the difference in coverage between the two.

When people hear about Iraqis getting killed, I think that, subconsciously, it's the same thing to them as a robot or a dog getting killed. Iraqi lives literally have either very little or no value to Americans. Spaniards have slightly more value- somehow we're connected to them because they're European, and their skin color is closer to ours. They have more money. They ride a train. Yes, we know that. We relate to that. Of course, they don't speak the same language (that's a minus- sorry, Spain).

But, Iraqis, you know, those guys without shoes who, in our minds, live in villages and go to market everyday to peddle their oranges and hanging, plucked chickens (live worthless lives), they don't matter. They get blown up, no big deal. They weren't really human, like US, anyway.

It's a scaler of human value. Blatant, yet so subtle, racism.

[Karenina]

24. Naa, Duuu...

:hi: :loveya: :hi:

[_Jumper_]

31. Excellent observations

Can you imagine the outcry if the UK is attacked? The UK is considered #2 on the "food chain" (I actually saw one conservative use that term) by Middle America. Spain is probably barely in the top 20.

[smcmike]

18. Some

I'll say "some," in that I do believe a significant portion of the population that supported the war (i say supported because i really do think that it is a decision that has already been made, we have to get over it and figure out what to do with the future) hold rather nasty racist views about that region. I don't really know one way or another if we would have invaded if they were "white." Having said that, in some sense i guess i have to question why it matters. The hawks certainly have plenty of other reasons for war, if we can't attack them directly we have already lost the argument.

[DrWeird]

20. It doesn't matter that it was a racist war?

What are the "plenty of other reasons for war?"

Obviously it wasn't about WMD. Since Iraq didn't have any.

It wasn't about making the world safe from terrorism. Since Saddam wasn't a terrorist and he was no threat to anybody outside the no fly zone.

It wasn't about saving the Iraqi people, since we've killed more Iraqis than Saddam ever did, and hundreds of people are getting blown up everyday thanks to the US.

So what are these plenty of reasons?

[smcmike]

27. There you go!

That is my point! we CAN debate them on their terms. It seems like racism is a side issue here.

[Classical_Liberal]

42. How is a side issue when racism relates to ignorance

? Americans were mislead and no other population was because we are simply can't tell one arab from another. Most people elsewhere knew Saddam the secularist was an unlikely friend of Osama.

[smcmike]

52. Hmmm

Yes, Americans, in general, are fairly ignorant about the world, and racism certainly played a role in their willingness to invade Iraq. However, I think that the true architects of this war simply used this racism for support, but had more "intelligent" reasons (like "he tried to kill my daddy"). I also think that democrats can't win any points by telling the american public that the only reason they supported this war is that they are a bunch of racists. Instead, we should try to combat racism, and debate the war on the basis of the "real reasons" which the administration gives (and which seem to be constantly shifting). I'm not saying that ignorant, racist americans aren't a problem, and one to be addressed, but i still think they are not the point at which we should attack the war effort

[StopThief]

21. None

nfm

[DuctapeFatwa]

23. Without racism, there would be little support for anything the US does

It's what makes it all possible, and the answer to all those questions about why there is not more opposition to this or that.

[Karenina]

28. Ding-Ding!!!

.

[JohnOneillsMemory]

46. Master Race identity, aka Superman Jesus in a Cowboy Hat Syndrome.

(This seems like another good place for my response to a thread about American's sense of superiority. One poster wrote that Americans were rapidly getting wise to how bad things were. I disagreed.)

Americans don't know what the Bill of Rights is or why it is an important protection against tyranny.
They don't know history, geography, civics, science, or politics.

Around 50% still think Bush* is trustworthy! Given that everything he's said publicly for years has been a lie, why is this?

Perhaps because Americans have been raised to believe that they:
1) live in a democracy.
2) compete in free markets.
3) share equal opportunity for all.
4) see their government spreading democracy and protecting the innocent around the world.
5) inherited the status of Best in Show Among Humans in 1776, 1945, 1991 and 2003 by winning the Revolutionary War, WWII, and both Iraq Wars I and II.

These are all lies taught to American children in school and then reinforced every day in movies and on TV for the rest of their lives. There is a welldefined historical narrative that describes America as the strongest and most virtuous moral force in the world ever. So surely the President of these United States must embody all that is good about our country.

I call this Superman-Jesus-in-a-Cowboy-Hat Syndrome. Ronald Reagan fit this movie-role-as-national-identity perfectly for many Americans who didn't realize that he was a senile figurehead for a cabal of murderers who successfully portrayed the poor as lazy thieves and secretly armed terrorists against foreign governments in the name of democracy and freedom.

Here is how Americans have been led down the path to a Master Race group-think that accepts as both inevitable and just that domestic policy should be eugenics and foreign policy, imperialism:

Ever since the US lost the Vietnam War, the social atmosphere here has been very similar to post-WWI Germany. The hyper-nationalist German people were told in the summer of 1918 that they were winning World War I. But in the fall, they were suddenly informed that they had lost. They were stunned and angry as the victorious Allies raped them economically and their orderly society imploded into chaos. They looked around to find who among them had betrayed them and robbed them of their much-deserved victory over their inferiors. They demonized, assaulted, and killed Jews, labor unionists, socialists, Gypsys, and homosexuals.

The same thing happened in the US after Nixon was disgraced and the Vietnam War was revealed to be a quagmire of atrocities which had also ruined the economy. The Republicans have cleverly exploited this petulant atmosphere of entitlement denied to bring us to where we are today, mired in a culture war against liberals, feminists, blacks, homosexuals, and dangerous Middle Eastern foreigners, pretty much the same targets as the Nazis.

Ever wonder why 'liberal' became a swear word? Now you know.

In fact, there is a name for this late 20th century fascist movement brought into the early 21st century: Dominionism.
It is an alliance between Christian fundamentalists, Cold Warrior Fascists, and the Military Industrial Oil Complex, just like the rise of the German Nazis who, by remarkable coincidence, were also financed and supplied in their day by many US corporations, including George W. Bush's financier grandfather, Prescott Bush.

It all rather makes sense, doesn't it? Military and financial powers work hand in hand to reinforce and protect each other by keeping people starving and fighting each other over worthless things like flags and uniforms. Meanwhile, the powerful swell up like ticks on the blood of the people they fool into doing the fighting and reward them with not much more than parades, plaques, and brass bands.

Some Americans see through this and have evolved past nationalism and racism but lately it seems that a majority have not. And there is an alliance of media corporateers and fascist politicians who are determined to prevent Americans from finding out how this scam works. If you have figured out anything about life in America, consider sharing it with your fellow Americans so we can all evolve a little faster and find better things to do than march to brass bands."

[Astarho]

25. More than anyone wants to admit (nt)

[noiretextatique]

26. check out the recent use of the word "thug"

hussein, mugabe, chavez, and artistide are all referred to as "thugs." funny how often it happens right here at DU.

[Karenina]

29. I do NOT understand how anyone

could look at Cheney or Rummy and not clearly see what unprincipled THUGS they are. Man... that white skin some powerful mojo indeed.

[DrWeird]

30. Isn't it a bit of a racist term anyways?

Weren't the "Thugs" the Indian equivalent of the chinese Boxers?

[bicentennial_baby]

33. I think so

There was a piece on NPR a few weeks ago about race and language, specifically referring to the US gov't's use of the words thug and assassin.

[_Jumper_]

32. Great point!

Notice how Milosevic is described as "brutal dictator" instead of a "thug." That word is also loosely thrown around by conservative regarding rappers (Of course, Eminmen manages to usually escape being branded a "thug"), even though they worship the likes of Cheney and *.

[bread_and_roses]

35. If England had bombed Ireland in retaliation

for IRA terrorist bombings in England, what would people in Boston would have said about blowing Irish babies to bloody bits?

[Character Assassin]

36. None. Racism, in this case, is a kindergarden explanation

Things aren't always so black and white, or even that dark grey.

[_Jumper_]

40. None?

You don't think it was a factor, that Sweden would have gotten the same treatment?

[Character Assassin]

47. I think that is a is a false comparison. There is simply no evidece

of any racism, latent or otherwise.

[leesa]

38. A lot! We would have never done what we did to either Iraq or Afghanistan

had the host country containing the handful of alleged criminals been white, or wealthy, or armed.
Americans appear to be drenched in racism. Doesn't bother them one bit to blow up brown Muslims. They don't even hesitate or question if our government blames it on those pesky "Muslim terrorists" even if there is not one shred of concrete evidence.

It's like the phenomena of driving while black.

[Character Assassin]

39. It's of the most paramount, critical importance

To think your own thoughts.

[Classical_Liberal]

41. It was 'THE FACTOR"

Americans don't know one arab from another, are completely in the dark about the rest of the world, didn't know that Saddam was a secularist and therefore an unlikely ally of Al Qaeda and they wanted to get Arabs. Nuff said!

[Character Assassin]

44. Wrong.

Please support your ridiculous contentions.

[Orangeone]

43. It's the same

mentality as lynching. Americans didn't care that Iraq had nothing to do with 911, they wanted to go get some Arabs.

[doubles]

45. Jumper, you hit the nail on the head with that question!

The reason Repugs criticized Clinton's Yugoslavia war against Milosovic was that we were bombing white Christian people. Racism has a lot to do with it. I guarantee you that if Iraq looked lilliwhite like Sweden, we would not even have considered war!

[SarahB]

48. People fear what they don't understand

When there is fear, it becomes too easy to demonize, hate, and kill. Perhaps if every simple minded "I don't want to understand any other culture" person just took an hour out of their life to try to understand something outside their own petty little lives, it might not be so easy to justify murder and/or genocide.

[Kimber Scott]

49. I agree with George Carlin when he says

we only bomb brown people.

It's much easier to demonize people, if they don't look just like you. Sad, but true.

[tobius]

50. How big a role did it play when we bombed iraq in 1998?

Or kept bombing all over the no-fly zone?

[democratdemagogue]

51. ridiculous

none, and that assertion is ridiculous. The war was supported because people feared WMD and a terrorist attack. Now that that is not the case, support is diminishing. But the people are still arabs/iraqis.

[_Jumper_]

53. None?

Are you saying it played zero role in drumming up support among "Middle America" for bombing a non-white nation?

[democratdemagogue]

54. yes, none

Prez was hell bent on bombing, so he didn't really need public support. But now that there are no WMDs, support has waned. What do you think and why?