Is Chavez a good guy?

[ButterflyBlood]

I'm sad to see there are actually people attacking Chavez here, using bullshit propaganda sources. But hey, there are also people who attacked Aristide. I bet if it was the 70s we'd have people bashing Allende.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

1. Don't know enough

South America's never been a strong point of knowledge for me.

[redqueen]

2. All of which says something about the 'left' and democrats in the US n/t

[DinahMoeHum]

3. I don't know enough to say whether he's good or bad. . .

but if he came into office by legitimate democratic elections, that's really none of my business. Or the US government's.


:kick:

[Minstrel Boy]

4. And if it were the 1980s, the same people would be

smearing Nelson Mandela as a terrorist.

I stand with Chavez.

[TinaTyson]

5. Can someone provide me with John Kerry's position

on Venezuela?

A google search for 'Kerry Venezuela' turns up nothing substatial. Or I missed it. The first link of the search is from gopusa.com so I really didn't bother with that one.

[markus]

6. Not a binary question

The issue is: is he the democratically elected president of the country, and did the opposition meet the legal requiremetns for a recall.

[Ms. Clio]

7. At least one of them also shilled heavily for the Iraq war

Coincidence? I think not.

[ButterflyBlood]

8. kick

:kick:

[Cocoa]

9. this way of thinking is a trap

I think it's an impeachable scandal that Bush and the neocons are undermining the governments in Haiti and Venezuela, but this has nothing to do with my thinking Aristide or Chavez is a "good guy."

I agree with your statement that it's bullshit the way some people are attacking Aristide and Chavez, but I also think your poll question is a trap.

[arcos]

12. I agree with you...

I think Chávez is sort of a good guy... but some people here at DU are totally closed to the idea that he can, and has made mistakes. They just don't accept ANY criticism of Chávez, and if you dare to do so, you are automatically a neocon...

[dpibel]

16. Is this true?

Seems to me that there are people who are totally closed to the idea that there's some middle ground between overall positives and sainthood. They seem to believe that if they can point to any action of Chavez they can call "bad," then they have no reason to feel compunction about the US supporting a coup (whether or not the current effort at recall is a coup, the US clearly supported the earlier coup attempt).

To me, this is whose ox is being gored analysis. There are many right here in this forum who would agree that our Fierce Warrior Chieftain falls somewhere slightly below the sainthood standard. Would they then support an effort by Venezuela to destabilize our government? Perhaps so, but I doubt it.

It just seems to me that folks ought to try the other shoe test before pronouncing on what "we" should do in other countries. Being the biggest and baddest doesn't confer special rights. It should confer special responsibilities, but I respectfully suggest that those responsibilities don't include making sure that the benighted have the correct form of government. I don't think anyone rationally argues that Chavez was not elected by a large majority.

As to the recall movement: If it is in fact indigenous, fine. If, OTOH, it's fueled in part by CIA money that's a different matter. We have laws in this country against politicians taking foreign money; we think that other countries ought not play in our political process. If we're not willing to play by our own rules, what does that make us?

Of course, the additional irony is that the great spreader of the gospel of democracy is messing around with somebody else's democracy because they got the wrong answer. The lesser countries are entitled to democracy only if they get it right. Kissinger said it outright, but it's always been the policy of the USofA.

[arcos]

10. he is a good guy, but not a saint

Some people at DU consider him a saint, and he is not... he tried to overthrow a democratically elected government too.

[AP]

14. I don't care what his personality is really like. I only care that he ...

... persues policies which ensure the flow of economic, political and cultural power as broadly as possible, which is exactly what he's doing.

Nonetheless, if you have seen The Revolution Will Not be Televised, it's hard not to come to the conclusion that he's a pretty good guy.

He's really well read, and all his conversations are peppered with literary references. He has a personal relationship with the soldiers who guard his palace (which might be a big reason they stayed loyal). There's a scene where he goes to small town and sings a song with a developmentally disabled boy, and it's incredibly tender. The boy's mother tells Chavez that he met the boy years earlier. The whole moment is really incredible. He has an office where people send him letters and they catalog all of them and try to answer them. The things that people write him are really incredible. You're left with no doubt that the guy is running his country to make the lives of the maximum number of people as good as possible.

So he comes accross as a pretty decent guy.

Especially when compared to the coup plotters who stole from the palace safe before they fled, who tore up the constitution, who had people arrested on the street, who shot people in the head and tried to pretend Chavez supporters did it, who threatened to bomb the palace with everyone in it if Chavez didn't resign, etc etc etc.

[ieoeja]

11. I voted Yes.

From what I have read the President of Venezuela is FAR from a Marxist revolutionary type. He appears to be more mainstream and FDR like. I get the impression that he, as a career military man, wants to introduce New Deal type of reforms to help make Venezuela stronger. The New Deal hardly turned the United States into a powerless nation, did it?

[arcos]

13. as a military man...

he has weakened the separation between military and civil power, and that is not good IMHO.

[AP]

15. It's hard to break the grip of the fascists and transition a society to...

democracy.

But, just because it isn't easy doesn't mean it isn't a worthwhile goal.

[never cry wolf]

17. The more I read about him

the more I like him. Besides, anyone that calls bunnypants an asshole is ok in my book!

[tom_paine]

18. Just because the Busheviks are Bad Guys doesn't automatically

make Chavez a Good Guy.

It's very possible, even probable considering the precedents set by 6000 years of recorded Human History, that they are BOTH BAD GUYS.

I do agree that the Imperial Pravda is so thick concerning Chavez that it is impossible to make an informed assessment.

Like trying to make an informed assessment of the Jews using Nazi "News" as source.

It just can't be done.

[Bridget Burke]

19. If Bad Guy means: let's invade & overthrow him!

I'd vote for Good Guy....

[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

20. I used to think so. I dont anymore

He is trying to screw with that referendum. I think he's just a caudillo with a Peronist/left rap.

[AP]

21. I think the oppostion is trying to undemocratically screw with him, and

I'm starting to think they're just a bunch of fascists who belong in jail.