"Democrats have become the doves of class warfare."

[Q]

Bill Moyers on the Politics of a Struggle

3-18-03

There was a news report in Washington this week about how Democrats and Republicans in Congress conspired to close down the investigation of an alleged abuse of power by a leading member of the House. Now we'll never know the truth of the matter. The story reminded me of a conversation I had many years ago with a constitutional scholar who said the most important function of one political party is to keep the other party honest. "No party investigates itself," he said, "so the public safety depends on each party shining the spotlight of scrutiny on the shenanigans of the other." Once upon a time, this happened quite often. Both parties could be counted on to mock the deceit, hypocrisy, and pretensions of the opposition, while they cloaked their own vices in the warm pieties of patriotism and altruism. They also challenged one another's belief systems with the two-fisted ferocity of street brawlers. Such spirited partisanship wasn't a pretty sight for children, but it offered choices, got the public's attention, and aroused a robust and sometimes ribald participation in democracy. Politics mattered.

Things have changed. Republicans still love a good brawl - they could appreciate the movie the GANGS OF NEW YORK. Because they will claw, scratch, jam their knee to your groin and land an uppercut to the jaw after the bell has rung — and if they don't finish the job their partisan press will do it for them: Rush Limbaugh and the Darth Vaders of talk radio; the pamphleteers at the WALL STREET JOURNAL, FOX NEWS, and a host of publications aided by big business.

But where are the Democrats? As the Republicans were coming back from the wilderness - lean, mean and hungry - Democrats were busy assimilating their opponents' belief system. In no small part because they coveted the same corporate money, Democrats practically walked away from the politics of struggle, leaving millions of working people with no one to fight for them. We see the consequences all around us in what a friend of mine calls "a suffocating consensus". Even as poverty spreads, inequality grows, and our quality of life diminishes, democrats have become the doves of class warfare.

Then there's the other war that's about to happen. Whether you are for or against it, invading Iraq is a reckless diversion of resources and a huge distraction from what ails us. But Democrats signed a blank check over to the President last fall because their leaders wanted 'to move on to more important things,' namely the mid-term elections, which they lost anyway. Now Democrats in Congress are so deeply divided and impotent that Ralph Nader is thinking of running again. Maybe third parties will eventually invigorate politics. But what I wouldn't give for a revival of that old-time religion, when both major parties locked horns with the devil - that is, with each other. An Irishman once asked - "is this a private fight or can anyone get in it?" Well, Democrats could answer that by crawling back in the ring, and duking it out. Who knows? They might even save the Republicans from themselves.

http://www.pbs.org/now/commentary/moyers20.html

[mhr]

1. Class Warfare - "Bring It On"

Ask yourself a simple question.

If the ultra wealthy are taxed too much and the ultra poor are taxed too little, then why has the income gap between rich and poor grown?

The answer is simple, the ultra wealthy are not taxed enough and the ultra poor should pay less.

Ask yourself another simple question.

If the millionaires and billionaires can fight for their economic interests, then why can't others fight for their interests as well?

The answer is simple. The ultra wealthy and right wing don't want this to happen because it would force them to defend the indefensible, the US tax system.

Finally, ask yourself this.

If a person or company benefits from living and working in the US should they be required to contribute for that benefit?

The answer is obvious. Of course! Further, those that have benefited the greatest should be required to contribute the most. Without proportional reciprocity, the ultra wealthy will continue to reap the greatest reward with the least sacrifice.

Let the wars begin!

[papau]

9. Gee - yr 2002 IRS stats show Payroll +FIT- top 1% pay 28%, bot 99% pay 26%

I posted the sources and the math in DU's econ section

I wonder how steep we crazy liberals want out income tax to be - eh?

And the 2003/2004 will have the top 1% drop about 3% - so they will be well under the bottom 99% as to rate of tax taking.

[BiggJawn]

2. The Republicans defined the rules of engagement.

They will kick you in the nuts and rub salt in your eyes, but cry to the referee if you even LOOK like you're thinking of sticking a thumb in their eye. and the Democrats just lay there and take it, lest they be labelled as "Angry" or a "Tinfoil-hatter".

Nader's right about one thing. Wealthy Democrats have no more desire to upset the apple cart and kill the goose that lays gold eggs by "redistributing wealth" any more than their Bush Ranger counterparts on the other side do.

Bush's tax cuts didn't just go to rich ReTHUGlicans, the "Limosine Liberals" and Volvo Families got just as much, too.

Which is why I have maintained all along that when it does come to revolution, We are not gonna waste time checking your voter registration cards.

[KissMyAsscroft]

3. This article articulates what the Dean "phenomena"

as the media so cutely put it, was trying to accomplish. It was trying to give the party it's fight back. That's why every other candidate had to adopt Dean's message.

But, while Kerry will be an improvement, he will not address the fundamental concern which is our party's spinelessness.

Working people are getting screwed by every Republican written bill that passes and it's going to come to a head one way or the other.

[The Backlash Cometh]

4. Kick

All the responses to this thread were also helpful. Thanks everyone for your thoughts and ideas.

[roughsatori]

5. Thanks for posting the great op piece: KICK NT

[Q]

7. The Democratic Black Caucus gets it...

...but they've been marginalized by the 'new' Democrats since the 2000 election...when NOT ONE Democratic senator would stand up with them and seek redress for civil rights violations. And yet...the Democratic party still expects Blacks to vote for them without question?

- We're facing a real problem here in that The Party has taken us for granted and have the nerve to expect our vote. They need to understand that Democrats will indeed turn out in record numbers to GET RID of Bush* in 2004...but they shouldn't consider that a mandate for any GOP-lite programs or policies.

- Whether we win or lose in 2004...the Democratic party must return to their roots and oppose the entrenched ruling class and corporations that have taken control of our government.

[Q]

6. Both parties have become insulated...

...and protected to the point where they simply expect their base to vote for them...even if they don't represent their interests.

- Of course it's necessary to get rid of Bush* and his blight on OUR government...but the 'anyone but Bush*' mentality could be setting us off in the wrong direction. Few in the Democratic party are actually FIGHTING Bush*...instead expecting our votes simply because they're NOT BUSH*.

- The 'third way' Democrats have given up on representing and protecting the poor and working class because there's no money in it. They've joined the Republicans in representing and 'protecting' the ruling class and give only lip service to the ideal of representative government.

- We either learn to fight...or get used to being a minority party placeholder in government. We have to fight Bush* and his Banana Republic...not praise and compromise with them as Daschle and others have done for the sake of their OWN political futures.

"As the Republicans were coming back from the wilderness - lean, mean and hungry - Democrats were busy assimilating their opponents' belief system. In no small part because they coveted the same corporate money, Democrats practically walked away from the politics of struggle, leaving millions of working people with no one to fight for them. We see the consequences all around us in what a friend of mine calls "a suffocating consensus". Even as poverty spreads, inequality grows, and our quality of life diminishes, democrats have become the doves of class warfare." (Moyers)

-

[MrPrax]

8. Thoughtful comments

I am guessing you are probably somewhat despaired by the voracious anti-Nader...

Strange indeed that so many attack Nader, and in doing so, play down some of Nader's platforms ; the monolithic structure and shared self-interests of those running the two parties, lack of income re-distribution, bankrupt environmental policies, corporate hegemony that threats the foundations of a free society, homelessness, 'privatization', lack of a serious health care debate, growing police powers, etc etc)...

BUT...virtually no debate on what the (fill_in_the_blank) nominee should actually do...

A lot of these folks indeed suggest you have to be on the 'inside' in order to make any changes.

And surprisingly the same folks generally were attacking Kucinich and Dean (to a less extent) for bring up the same issues from 'inside'...for those two the arg. is then...'oh they're too idealistic and not pragmatic' or 'they are not electable'... (as if a moron like Bush, on paper, would have been considered 'electable')

Personally I am getting sick of listening to liberals and having them try to explain that picket fence stuck up their asses.

...they seem to have talked themselves into an idea that having no real principles is necessary to be flexible enough to 'capture the electorate'--unfortunately this has not happened at all.

I do indeed question some of these people who insist on an ABB slogan, but provide no real 'slogans' to motivate democrats to take back the Congress...

So what if Kerry/Edwards is Prez, if the Pukes control the rest...it will simply be '96-'00 again--a besieged democratic Prez having to explain his himself on alleged improprieties and too afraid to veto anything...

[Q]

10. Republicans abandoned conservatives...

...just as the Democrats have marginalized 'liberals/progressives'. We're advised that we can't appear too mean towards the Bush* regime and his corporate cronies because that would turn off the 'swing voters'. The traditional Democratic voter base (you know who they are) have been taken almost completely out of the equation.

- We've come to the point where Democrats simply expect the votes of the traditional base...without offering anything of substance in return. But the base can see what's going on. They see their how government oppresses their unions, sends their jobs overseas to slave labor and gives their payroll taxes to those who already have more than they need. Corporate Welfare is well-funded and social welfare is losing ground to corporations that control both parties.

[sangha]

13. Two loads of bull

Of course the Dems play down some of Nader's platform! They are NOT Nader; They're Democrats, and they stand for things other than what Nader stands for. However, the differences are not as great as the Naderites like to think they are, and the Dems have a long history of doing more than Nader has when it comes to the list of issues you gave like homelessness, the environment, and monopolism. The "no principles" rant is only for those who haven't acvhieved nearly as much as the Dems have on those issues that liberals care about. I would argue that even the Repukes have done more on some of those issues (ex homelessness, health care, etc) than Nader or any third-party

--Q, it wasn't the Democratic Party that marginalized liberals; It was Democratic voters, most of whom are either moderate or conservative.

--Very few people have said we can't be mean to Bush*. You take the words of a few to slander many, possibly because you have no argument to make.

--And again you are confused and self-important enough to think that liberals are the base of the Democratic Party when they make up just one small minority in a party that has historically been a coalition. More than 90% of black voters vote Dem, but I never hear you argue that they are the base. For some reason, you think the ones who despise and threaten the party are the base. The overwhelming majority of Dems disagree with you, but I guess you know who the real Dems are.

[PROGRESSIVE1]

11. Democrats to must "love the fight"!

It's the only way to win against these tyrants!

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

12. No way, Dems are class war hawks

They are just on the other side.