Please Post Your "My RW Pal Just Saw the Light" Stories Here

[Stephanie]

I just LOVE to read the threads about Matcom's education of Dadcom, and the wingnut coworker who announces he's going ABB, and the military folks who think that Bush LIED, and the repub relative who informs a DUer that she'll be voting Dem this year.

I need some cheering up. I'd like to see all these stories together in one place for my reading pleasure.

And I think they would make a nice collection for our visitors to peruse. Anecdotal evidence of Bush's coming defeat is so inspiring.

Thanks to all of you who've made it your mission to bring a friend over from the dark side. Each one teach one. :)

[Kamika]

1. well here's a semi one

I showed the racist hate mail Margaret Cho had got from reublicans, to my parents who are korean religious fundies and just love Bush..

Anyway Dad told me he would not vote for the reps after that...

But I dunno.. Mom and Dad are in extacy about the amendment crap

[sadiesworld]

5. Tell your parents the truth about the amendment...

it will not be passed and all the repugs know it.

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

92. Out of curiousity, Kamika

What do your parents think of Reverend Moon? The reason I ask is -- I am always curious about why the Fundies accept him and don't mind his support of Republicans when he represents the absolute opposite of their beliefs. And since your parents are Korean, they must know more about him than most.

[x-g.o.p.er]

2. Here's my story...

You have a reply in the original thread, but no one has replied yet, and since it is my goal to spread good cheer....here you go

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1069573

[madmax]

4. That's a great post x-g.o.p.er

:hug: My cousin lost an arm and leg in VietNam. He's always voted Republican - defense you know. Anyway, he likes Clark and Kerry and said ABB will get his vote.

Welcome to DU x glad to have you. :hi:

[Stephanie]

9. Thanks, I love that thread

That's the kind of story that really warms my heart. It is my fervent belief that the American people are intelligent, thoughtful and good-hearted, if only they didn't hear LIES day in and day out. Once they hear the truth, they have no use for Bush.

[Red_Viking]

3. Ex-husband, Naval Reservist

This guy is dyed-in-the-wool military, and until recently, staunchly Rethug. He went to Qatar for a year. At the beginning of the Iraq war, we had screaming fights on the phone about the reasons for war and the aftermath. He felt it was justified; I, obviously, thought it was a sham and merely a method to enrich the campaign contributors. Not too long ago, he called to ask who I was supporting for President in 2004. Yes, he was asking about Dem candidates. We actually had a discussion about the candidates (this was when they were all still in the running).

At the conclusion of our call, he told me he just can't vote for Bush. It's the war, and the way it's being handled.

If he's voting Dem, there have to be thousands of military switching sides. I never thought he'd come into the light, honestly!

I hear more stories like this every day. I have immense hope we will boot the assclown who's currently illegally occupying 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

:dem:

RV

[mdmc]

6. I date Republicans

Most of them have warmed up to Edwards (God, did they hate Dean!).

Here is more:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x1160124

[Stephanie]

8. Excuse me? You DATE Republicans?

How is that working out for you?

[mdmc]

10. well, she is from a liberal gop family

and is registered "not affiliated with any party". She keeps me on my toes and helps me to hone my message. She is also a great campaigner, beautiful, and funny.

My ex claimed to be a feminist, but then I found out that she voted against Hillary! It was over. She is a registered Dem, but dumb.

[Hippo_Tron]

43. James Carville is married to one, seems to work out fine for him n/t

[mantis49]

78. Yeah, I'm married to one too.

And sometimes I'd like to have a chat with Carville to find out how they make it work.

Gets pretty tense here sometimes.

Although, hubby was saying he might vote for Edwards in the primary. Then when Nader declared, he said he might vote for him. (He doesn't agree with anything Nader stands for.) That would work for me. At least not a vote for *.

I think my husband is disillusioned with *, but he won't come out and say so. May be afraid I'll gloat and give him "I told you so." I would try to restrain myself if he did.

[peacebuzzard]

58. Do you yawn and think of getting home early? Or order doubles?

I would have to do both and flirt with other people. Yuck.

[liberalitch]

63. I admire your sense of charity....

I could never do that....
As soon as they fell asleep the gas can would have to come out.

[Stephanie]

45. "It's the war, and the way it's being handled."

Well there you go. No one likes being USED.

BushCO has shown no respect for our military. They use them like pawns.

It's a Betrayal of Trust.

[Stephanie]

7. Here are some of those most excellent threads

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x1161692

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x1161288

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=1159878&mesg_id=1159878

[mdmc]

11. Also

I got a call from my machanic. He told my friend that he would work on my car, but called me and refused to work on a car with Howard Dean stickers on it! He was just joking, but he is a neo con that has turned against the pResident.

[berry]

104. Why would a neo-con turn against *Bush?

Just wondering...

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

12. Got an email from a fellow I didn't know

He sent it to our local peace groups mailing list. It told about a meeting about 'what to do to get rid of Bush'. My husband and I went, expecting to see the other folks who demonstrated with us last year. We saw two. The rest of the folks were older, mostly retired, and over half were Republicans. They had come together to make sure Bush wasn't voted into office again! They are having meetings and intend to call people, register them to vote, and make sure they get to the polls on election day.

[Stephanie]

15. Wow!

What was motivating them? Any particular issue?

[union_maid]

13. Can't take any credit for this one

But my husband has done good work with a co-worker. Had him all about Clark. Now I think he's ABB. The best story I have is about someone I haven't met, though. It's a judge and my sister knows him through her work. Rock solid, Republican, conservative. He's voting for the Democratic nominee. The reason: This administration's incompetence. He hate the way they've screwed up everything they've touched.

[Stephanie]

28. "they've screwed up everything they've touched."

That's the bottom line. They can't do anything right. Even their warmongering is a miserable failure.

[cally]

14. Huge to me

My parents always vote Republican. My relationship with my dad has been difficult after we had a huge blowup over Bush and Nazi ties. I know it was not my best moment. Anyway, my dad is home alone with a back injury that may prohibit him from driving so I've been checking in. He brought up Martha Stewart and asked if I have been following it. I have in a very distant way. I ask why he thinks she's in the news. His take:


"Because she is a prominent, successful woman. They're targetting her when others have done far worse"

I couldn't believe he said that. Never before has he ever thought that women were targetted. I'm still stumbing from this statement. I bit my tongue and didn't mention that she supports Democrats.

[Stephanie]

16. Your father might enjoy reading the O'Neill book while he's laid up

It's by a republican, after all.

[DrBB]

18. Susskind's a Republican?

Sorry, had to nitpick. But Susskind's the author; O'Neil's just his major source. Kevin Phillips's book though--I gather he's now registered as an independent. But he was a major, major Republican. And it's an anti-BFEE manifesto.

[Stephanie]

19. Well if you really want to nitpick, it's Suskind

:)

Of course you're right. He's a dynamic speaker, BTW. Did you happen to see him on C-Span? Quite a performer.

[salin]

21. Didn't Susskind write for the wall street journal?

not exactly a left leaning rag... ;-)

[JHB]

53. The WSJ news pages and EDITORIAL pages...

...are like night & day.

REPORTING in the WSJ is usually good, sometimes outstanding.

OPINIONS/EDITORIALS/COLUMNS/OP-EDs in the WSJ are direct from the heart of darkness.

[rockymountaindem]

17. My friend

who I think I've mentioned before is a little older than me and will be eligable to vote for the first time this year. He's an interesting sort. The first time I met him I thought he the ultimate Christian repub. I was wrong about that but he is undoubtedly a conservative. I can't think of a single time he said anything good about the Shrub. He can't stand the jerk. For example, he likes our two Repub. Senators, but he just despises W.

[ignatius]

20. Three of my co-workers, all major league repugs,

have seen the light. Actually all three are intelligent,witty and kind people..they are fairly young,late twenties to early thirties, and were "raised" Republican. I honestly think since life has been so kind to them, they never really thought much about politics or world events. But that has all changed.

One is now a definite ABB, the other says he will not vote at all(I am still working on him) and the last, a young,single mom says she is so sick of war and red alerts that she is definitely not voting for Chimpy.

The one old guy who was dancing around during the shock and awe attack(it was a sickening and disgusting display) is even pissed that no WMD's have been found. I believe he is wising up to the fact that America has been had by a snake oil salesmen from Texas.

I don't know how he will vote, but at least he is thinking somewhat.

I work in a fairly small office,there are 12 of us. 2 are dems,1 thinks he is libetarian, the rest are repugs. 3 out of the nine are not voting for Shrub, 1 is undecided, and the rest have become very, very quiet...which I think is a good sign. When their lips aren't moving, I am hopeful that their brains are working..

[Stephanie]

46. "so sick of war and red alerts"

That's me.

Really. I am exhausted from the TRAUMA bush* has put me through.

If only he had PAID ATTENTION to the warnings, maybe the last two years for me, and your friend, and the 9/11 families, would not have been so traumatic.

*edited for brevity, and too much information ~S

[Stephanie]

22. Here's a very sad one

from an article Mari333 just posted:

http://www.channel4.com/news/2004/02/week_2/10_iraq2.html

<snip>

Pat Collins from New Jersey is 38. He took shrapnel though his neck in Baghdad and is in permanent pain.

"I was injured on patrol in Baghdad. Couple guys ambushed us. I've got nerve damage. A lot of pain. I took a lot of morphine. Readjusting. Getting my life back on track. I'm not going to do what I did before. Time to move on and find something else to do. I'm not going to what it was I did before."

His anger is, in some cases, producing political transformation.

Pat: "I was a Republican ... I'm going to be incredibly active in the Democratic Party once I get out."

And who's his democratic preference, we asked?

Pat: "Kerry."

It was at this point that we were asked to stop filming. Other members of the group had grown uneasy that things had taken a poltical turn.

[calimary]

59. I saw that one, too. Almost went apoplectic.

I know handicapped people. Married an amputee. I know what it's like to have to live with that, even while I myself am not physically disabled. It's a struggle, EVERY DAY. That one just made me crumble. I saved the link. THIS one definitely gets sent around, if ever I get another one of those nauseating "let's all do a group hug around our wonderful president, st. george" emails.

By the way, another one - my elderly mom's equally-elderly boyfriend has turned. He commented, one evening, that he and ALL his friends are so sick of "all this politics" and were looking at John Edwards with quite a bit of interest. I savored that one all the way home.

[Zero Gravitas]

23. My Father

Voted for * the last time but won't vote for him again. He's a "hands off my money" pro-business type, not a "social conservative", so he doesn't really have much in common with the present day GOP anyway.

He listened to Bush & co's reasons for attacking Iraq and concluded that their case for war did not add up. He is dismayed by Ashcroft, Gitmo, the "PATRIOT" act and the rest of this Administration's attacks on civil rights.

Seeing that many moderate Repubs & Independents are realizing just how bad Bush is gives me hope, not just for this election (as vital as it is to win) but for the future of our country. I hope that some of the people duped by the foaming hate from Limbaugh & Fox "News" etc wake up and think for themselves. They won't all agree with us here on DU, but maybe we can move beyond the divisiveness the RW propagandists foster and the whacko right depends upon.

[Stephanie]

94. "...concluded that their case for war did not add up"

Your Dad's a thinking man. I wish more GOP voters paid that kind of attention.

[sugarcookie]

24. My father...

He is an Korean War veteran...Silver Star and a Purple Heart. Although he is a Democrat, he was convinced GW was right about the war and we should support him. He thought I was being disrespectful in my opposition to the war and refused to discuss it with me. I talked to him last week and told me he realizes all the lies now.

[Stephanie]

25. That's great. The way Bush betrayed the country's trust

will never be forgiven. Bush lied and our soldiers died.

[Ilsa]

26. My dad's Baptist social group in East Texas...

a few of them were having coffee and dessert and none were voting for *, and this county went heavily Repuke in 2000. One called him a warmongerer. The ones that had lived through The Great Depression are worried their kids and grandkids will have to do the same because of Shrub's spending sprees.

[x-g.o.p.er]

Wow!! Baptists against Bush....

If Southern Baptists aren't going to vote for Bush I'm surprised. They are some of the most ardent kool-aid drinkers.

[Stephanie]

40. Someone should buy that domain name right now

www.baptistsagainstbush.com

[ignatius]

27. Wow!! A Baptist group from Texas turning anti-shrub..that is

excellent news!!!

[eissa]

77. Baptists in East Texas?!

That one amazes me and gives me such hope.

Well, here's mine: my boss, an Arab Muslim who has voted republican ever since he came to this country over 20 years ago. In fact, some of his friends in Florida organized a get-out-the-vote drive at their mosques in Florida for *. NONE OF THEM will be doing that this year; almost all will be voting dem :-)

[Cleita]

29. I wish I had a success story but I don't.

Republicans in my area are plain stubborn, but the fact is they benefit from Bush's policies because most of them are well off white people.

[Stephanie]

30. Do they have children? Do they love their children?

Because I honestly don't know how anyone who loves their child could support Bush*.

Kyoto. The Deficit. The Debt. The Draft.

If you wish to see the next generation survive at all, you have to want Bush out.

[Cleita]

34. They do but they also have horses and ranches and

truthfully where I live is very safe (except for earthquakes and nuke power plants) so it works for them. Also, very nice blonde people honestly think that they got where they did with hard work. They can't even think of the possibility that they got to go ahead of the line because of white privilege. Being Republican works for them.

[Stephanie]

47. They won't be safe from the new ice age, brought to you by global warming

and the destruction of the Gulf Stream.

I honestly think these repubs believe they can insulate themselves from disaster if they only have enough money. It's so insane.

[Brewman_Jax]

54. Same here

and the hammer of truth doesn't work on truly stupid and/or partisan individuals.

One is my father, who has watched his retirement benefits go down and costs go up after a crappy early 90's (Bush Sr.) economy forced him into early retirement. One has kids who are 9 yrs old. He knows that Bush* is stupid, but he doesn't like any of the democratic candidates, so he'll vote for Bush* again. Another is a chickenhawk who doesn't like the idea of Kerry coming back and protesting the war, so he'll vote for Bush. They just rarely talk politics around me because they're tired of defending indefensible beliefs--or they buy the next round to make me shut up.

The ones who will vote against Bush* are the ones who have been personally affected in this crappy economy, the ones who jobs are going overseas or just gone, period. And it is sad that it has to come to that.

[LEW]

31. Talked to a fellow co-worker yesterday

who is also on the local school board. Said "I have been a life long republican, have always supported and voted repulican, but I will not be voting for B*sh, because of no child left behind." She says it is a complete disaster and has brought nothing but grief to the schools and school boards.

Yeah!!!!!!

[DINTENNESSEE]

32. This is my first post

and I am very excited about being here and to let you know that my Father and brother have never before voted Democrat, yet this year they have both voted for Chandler ( a dem in Ky.) and are going to vote Democrat for President. My brother is a Superintendent of Schools in Ky. and he as well as his administration are so very upset about No Child Left Behind.

DinTennessee

[jbm]

33. welcome to DU!

I love your first post.:)

[DINTENNESSEE]

36. Thanks

I have been reading this forum for a couple of years, but am kinds shy about posting. I am now getting so excited about beating Bush that I think I am going to speak my mind to everyone I see.

[lcooksey]

50. Voting for Dems in Kentucky

Your story is music to my ears. Welcome to DU!

[calimary]

61. Excellent!!! WELCOME to DU! Bless your heart!

A job well done. Glad you've stepped up to the plate. You obviously have lots of valuable things to say.

[wellstone_democrat]

35. Welcome to DU!

Its a pretty diverse place but good hearted overall you'll find.

Welcome!

[Stephanie]

38. Now that's what I'm talking about!

Welcome to DU, DinTennessee! It's great to have you here!

That's the second post on No Child Left Behind. I had no idea formerly republican educators were turning against Bush* based on this issue. Very interesting news. Thanks!

[Hamlette]

48. speaking of no child left behind. . .

you all read about the Utah legislature screaming about it. They finally got a watered down bill passed overwhelmingly (after Bush sent the strong arms out to get them to tone it down.) What the bill says is the State will pay not one dime to support it but will take the federal dollars. What you might not know is the Utah legislature is more red neck than you might even imagine. (They debate getting out of the UN every year it seems as well as trying to outlaw abortion every year and gay marriage this year.) When I first heard they had voted against it I thought it must be for different reasons. They do hate the feds telling us what to do but they were equally pissed about the cookie cutter approach and lack of funding.

And on this topic...3 republicans in my office will not vote for Bush and the rest of them are absolutely silent. They used to say "it's Clinton's fault" and other nonsense all the time but now, nary a peep.

[liberalitch]

67. In my neck of the woods.... no child..

left behind is called "let every child kiss my behind"

[alfredo]

37. Up until a couple months ago I was the only anti bush voice on my veteran

mailing list. Tonight another Republican declared that he will not vote for bush. The treatment of Veterans and the way he's fucking with social security has him pissed. This guy has been a republican since the 60's. My slams at bush would usually get a profanity laced response from him. Times are changing folks.


Only one is still a fire breathing bush fan. He's also the one that sends out really bad porn and gruesome images of accidents and murders to our group.

Most in the group see some very bad times ahead and are putting the blame on bush.

[Stephanie]

39. "Times are changing folks." That's what I want to hear.

And I think you're right!

Veterans turning against bush*! Lifelong Republicans! Bush has done more damage to the credibility of the Republican party in three years than we could ever have dreamed.

Where does this guy get his news about the treatment of Veterans? Wondering if it's from regular news, or some other source?

[peacebuzzard]

64. I think some red states will turn blue

this year. I have heard from people who work in the Appalachians that many rural folks are very unhappy. I believe many will refrain from voting. You hear this in East TN. Not voting for Bush is one less vote to cancel for the Dems. The Republican turnout will be low, IMO.

[alfredo]

65. Last night the one virulent repug on our list sent a Kerry flash

that hit all the GOP talking points. I came back with a point by point rebuttal. This morning he sent an appology, saying he hasn't been paying much attention. I told him to start paying attention because our country is in deep shit. I reminded him of our times as spooks and the importance of vigilance in defense of our country. I told him it is again time to be vigilant.

[northofdenali]

80. Try these websites - you'll be astounded.

http://www.vvaw.org/ Vietnam Veterans Against the War
http://www.vaiw.org/vet/index.php Veterans Against Iraq War
http://www.sftt.org/ Soldiers For The Truth
http://www.cdi.org/ Center for Defense Information

Bush has royally screwed the troops in Iraq now AND the veterans at home.

[PassingFair]

41. Not scientific, mind you...

...but my 80 year-old aunt told me tonight that about 95% of the folks in her "retirement" complex want to flush Shrubby. They're mad about their pharmaceutical situations. Of course, it had to hit them in THEIR pocketbooks before they began to see the light...

[Stephanie]

42. Whatever it takes

Bush has managed to SCREW every demographic. And he thinks they don't see through his lies!

The great thing about those old folks is: THEY VOTE!

[fizzana]

44. No conversion stories to tell but reading all these posts confirms

what is becoming more and more clear. Bush manages to piss off one group after another and each time he loses a bit of support. It's evident in the polls but the mainstream hasn't yet realized just how much his support has really eroded.

The Ben Chandler vote was huge in this respect and the mainstream meadia were so focused on Wisconsin they completely ignored it but it wwas huge because it was the first real test of Bush's popularity and he failed dismally.

I think a lot of Republicans (at least not the rabid, blind, faithful) are put off as much or more by his incompetence and his refusal to ever take responsibility than by his actual policies.

[Dunedain]

49. I have a group of older gentlemen

who come into my business everyday that I am open. They all sit drink my coffee and discuss life. Over the past two years we have gotten to know each other step by step.

The leader of this group, he really should more aptly be termed the constant. We're alike this man and I. We share a similar perspective of how we would like our government to function in society.

I find value in my fathers example of how a man should conduct himself in life, and I have found acceptance in what would become my rejections of those things which he believed and would not move from.
Things which I saw as being incongruent with beliefs that I perceived as my own.

So we see eye to eye as such, this group of men and I. We are conservative. Strong defense, small taxes, and limited government.
All of us to the one are capitalists. Service in faith is central to our life.

These days we talk about the very things that I come here to read.
The discussions we have only seem to mask the the underlying truth of the matter for us. The names and words of the ideas that we held to be worthy of living up to had been co-opted by a nefarious enemy. I can no longer make the association to a named construct because Jr. broke it in the sand box. More distressing than that is what has been accomplished in our name and at our expense since. I have young children and the fear I have for them and the future is at times palpable.

I found DU around the time of the 2000 elections. I have 'lurked' here until this year. I have read some incredible posts in that time.
There were times when the nail was hit so hard and so clean that it sent me off on weeks and months of reading, researching, questioning.

I will continue to come to DU as long as it's here. I believe in many ways I am a square peg in a round hole with many of the issue's grappled with on this board. To me, that's to be expected and respected. I can live with that, I believe thats how it's supposed to be. Thats what makes us strong, diversity of perspective.

I will join you in this fight, and I will feel the same elation at the defeat of the boy king and the same sorrow and dread in his assumption.



edit>Sand box not sad box

[yowzayowzayowza]

51. A middle of the night welcome!!!

n/t

[ignatius]

52. A beautiful and touching post. Thank you for your thoughts and

welcome to our little oasis of sanity in a world gone mad.

[Stephanie]

56. Welcome to DU, Dunedain!

"diversity of perspective" is what we're all about. We don't belong to an organized party - we're Democrats! Glad you're here!

[calimary]

62. SO eloquent! Welcome to DU!

Neat to see that people lurking here for a long time now want to participate more actively. Took me a little while to get up the nerve, also. But the water's fine. You will enjoy the swimming, I think. We'll certainly enjoy swimming along with you!

[guitar man]

82. Welcome to DU!

The "old timers" that come into the diner where I like to eat breakfast are echoing the same sentiments.One of them hit the nail right on the head last week with an observation about the RW pandering to the uber-wealthy corporate interests at the expense of the middle class working folk. These guys lived through the depression,and this old timer went on to a chorus of nodding heads about how the current trend of outsourcing,stagnant low wages and general poor outlook for the working class is starting to mimic the conditions workers faced during the great depression.

None of these guys are voting for *.

[WolverineDG]

55. Not sure if he's seen the light

but my very Republican, retired Navy, CPA cousin sent me (& the rest of his email list) an email questioning Bush's budget, essentially saying it didn't sound fiscally responsible to him at all.

damn near fell out of my chair in surprise. :wow:

after years & years of all the anti-Dem, anti-Clinton garbage he sent around, apparently there are cracks appearing in his Republican armor. I told him a long time ago that the values my Republican parents raised me with had not been in evidence in the GOP since the 2nd Reagan term, hence, my solid Dem voting record. He told me, in that "I'm 10 years older than you & much wiser" way that cousins do, that I was mistaken & just hadn't been around the block as much as he had. So in the interest of keeping the peace at family holidays, we agreed to disagree on this issue. :shrug:

I've since sent him a few links & articles showing Bush's lies, & suggested he read Franken's book & to let me know if there was something in there that he found erroneous. Haven't heard more from him on this, but hey, that first email was a start....



DG

[calimary]

57. My best friend since age 9 may be starting to turn.

I love this woman like the sister I never had. Our lives are so parallel and we've never lost touch, even after we all scattered at the end of school. Only one difference: she's become something of a redneck, hanging out with/working with cowboys and folks on the rodeo circuit. I'm in lockstep with her every minute of the day EXCEPT for our politics. There, we could NOT be more different.

Every now and then she forwards me one of those knuckle-dragger emails that either thank God for bush or heap derision on Bill/Hillary. Last time I got one, a week ago, I sent a link to the LA Weekly story about Lt. Col. Karen Kwiatkowski around to EVERYBODY on that email's forwarding list. I've just made it a habit of fighting back, that way. (By the way, that's a very effective method for STOPPING those damned emails. Send a really serious link on something not only to the sender, but to everybody on the list of whoever forwarded the email to the sender. Once, I got into a long and vitriolic argument with one of THOSE - a second-generation email recipient, who insisted our troops were "fighting for our freedom" in Iraq, and that I was a Saddam lover and demanded to know "where were you 9/11?" - an exact quote - no prepositions. I've also noticed that kind of kneeJERK response has quieted down, COMPLETELY in the last year or so...)

My friend has been resolutely republi-CON all the way along (mainly because she's discovered over a long time that when she does charity work, the only people who appear willing to give her charities any money are republi-CON. Dems, she said, never contribute). After I responded, she sent back THIS:

"OK, I pass this stuff on because I think it's interesting, not necessarily because I buy into all of it. I will admit to being Republican, and I voted for Bush, mostly because of his team which had way more experience than he did. I think he's dangerously distanced himself from the American population and the world. He seems to be the ultimate isolationist!"

I think she's finally wavering. She may wind up being one of those who gets discouraged and doesn't vote this year, and if so, I'll be VERY glad! I make an exception for this woman - someone I cherish and will NOT stop being her friend and "sister" despite her politics (while I've found myself backing away from other former friends who remain bush-lovers). Her politics will never dampen our friendship, if I can help it. But I don't hesitate to argue with her and try to set the record straight with her - heaven knows she'll never hear an opposing view from ANYBODY else she hangs with. In our 40-some-odd-year friendship, the ONLY arguments and disagreements we've ever had have involved presidential politics.

By the way, after I got that response from her, I emailed her back, mentioning the Cakewalk Cabal and all those other schmucks surrounding bush, and mentioned the Project for a New American Century.

VIGILANCE!!! CONSTANT VIGILANCE!!!!!! NEVER SURRENDER!!!!!!!

[King Coal]

60. I like this thread Stephanie.

I am the only Democrat where I work, and let me tell you we have had mucho arguments. Now, I find it is best to stay quiet. The minds, they are a changin'. Big time. The case against Bush* is just too huge. Americans won't stand for it.:kick:

[Stephanie]

66. Thanks! This thread really IS cheering me up!

I'm starting to feel a little better.

[Bragi]

68. Here's One!

(I saw this posted today on a professional but politically-chatty listserv)

<< Although I didn't vote for Bush in 2000, I wasn't upset when he won.
I still support just about everything he's done since then, including
Afghanistan, Iraq and the tax cut. The gay marriage thing is a red
herring, but it still has left me uncomfortable with someone who
would presumably have a "hands off" government intrude into citizens'
private affairs.

This morning, however, was the tipping point.

I kid you not, when I heard that - under pressure from the FCC and
Congress - ClearChannel radio suspended Howard Stern from six markets
due to "content issues", it heralded the end of free speech and the
beginning of Soviet-style mind-control that I just can't endorse.
Mind you, the "content issues" are of an arbitrary nature. The
public air waves are no longer public.

I personally don't care about Stern; he's made his pile. I do care
about what this represents for everyone else.

It happened well into Dubya's watch, he's endorsing it, so there's no
where else to place the blame.

I don't care how many terrorists he brings home before November, he's
lost my vote. The question is, who to vote for instead? >>

[FrankBooth]

69. Report from Seattle

In the part of Seattle where I live, Bush bashing has been in vogue since 2000, so most of the people I know are already converted. But there is this one guy, an older Hispanic lawyer who frequents the neighborhood pub that I hang out in - he and I usually just talk about the Mariners or the Sonics, but a couple of months back I was on a rant about Bush and found out he was a Repub and * supporter. I was surprised. He told me that he was 100% certain that Bush was going to be re-elected. (We even bet $50 on that.) Of course I disagreed and we talked at length about how much Bush has fucked everything up - he left a little dazed and less sure about his support and the inevitability of Bush's re-election.

Last night I ran into him - he said "This Gay amendment thing is exactly what Bush needs - this is the issue that is going to put him over the top." Of course when he said it he was rolling his eyes - he was being facetious. He went on to deride the idiotic politicization and manipulation of this issue - he was apalled at the prospect of altering the constitution, particularly for something so inherently discriminatory - he now thinks Bush is toast and said he won't be voting for him. It was great!

Great thread idea Stephanie- the conversion threads are among my favorite on DU.

[Stephanie]

70. I'm so glad THAT was the issue that put him over the top!

LOVE it! Americans don't like BIGOTRY. They cherish the Constitution. It is just thrilling to hear that this issue is what turned your friend around - his own sense of fairness and what is right. Excellent!

[never cry wolf]

71. Great thread, here's mine, still working on her

This is from a thread I started (and soon died) last Monday.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1150917

Ok, here's the deal. My best friend has been a BIG bush supporter. She really is a very nice lady and quite intelligent but lives in a rural area and gets her news mainstream. She also has two daughters aged 18 and 22 who are her life.

I sent her info on the Pending legislation in the House and Senate (twin bills S 89 and HR 163) would time the program so the draft could begin at early as Spring 2005 and pointed out that they include women as well as men. Her response was:

"hey, and thnx for ruining my day with the draft stuff....that sucks. I am gonna vote for anyone for pres who does NOT support.
"

So, what I need is ammo to push her over the edge and convince her that the current admin. is not likely to let up their warring ways any time soon, such as the perle "total war" quote and PNAC info.

Also, if any of you know if any of the candidates have taken a position on the possible draft or if anyone in the admin has commented on it I'd be very grateful.

As always, with wingnuts, mainstream is easier for them to swallow!


I am still working on her. Any info anyone has on the potential of an upcoming draft, what the various candidates' positions are, including shrubbie's admin would be greatly appreciated!

This could be a wedge issue, folks. There are millions of boomers out there with kids of draft age! This friend has been staunchly RW until I brought up the draft.

[Woodstock]

86. Do you have the link for the legislation?

I see of visits are from people searching on Google for the reinstating the draft. The more we post this issue, the better.

[Stephanie]

87. Here's a recent DU thread about the Draft

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1164882

[never cry wolf]

90. Just got in the office

Thanks for the info and this thread deserves a :kick:

[BearFlagDemocrat]

72. My sister

Who has been a Republican since she first registered to vote in 1978, has recently said she's going ABB. Here are two quotes of hers from recent emails she's sent me:

">Haha. I'm feeling more and more like a "RINO""

and

"Oh, God...giving that man (Bush) four more years is like putting bullets in the gun so you can shoot yourself!"

[Stephanie]

89. LOL!

"...like putting bullets in the gun so you can shoot yourself!"

That's hysterical.

[Papa]

73. I have a freeper type coworker who is beginning to see the light

He said the other day he was thinking about voting for Edwards. This is a guy that said "that's beautiful" when the bombs starting falling on Baghdad . We were watching it on tv at the office ( i lost my cool and screamed at him to shut up and sit down).

What's helped in my case is that all along I was telling him what was really going on, and telling him news that was not yet news. The kind of news and analysis you don't get from FOX. I told him about PNAC. Bush Lies. Iraq War. Powell putting on a dog and pony show at the UN, etc...

There IS hope if someone like this, a hard core conservative, begins to waiver and question what Bush is doing.

[damnyankee2601]

74. Havent gotten one to convert yet.

But their efforts to spin my facts are getting weirder and weirder. I think they don't belive themselves anymore, but can't admit they're wrong.

The other day I presented one guy with the fact that Republican states actually get more federal tax money than they pay in, and Democratic states get hosed. After much thought, he proposed that the extra money created more bums on welfare, which drove people to vote Republican. He's a freind, so it was really hard no to laugh in his face. I think I need to buy him more beer and explain Stockholm Syndrome to him.

[nannygoat]

75. Me either. I have a good friend/co-worker who is a repuke

and we have agreed to disagree except I get in a few jabs whenever I can. One day we were on our way to lunch and she made some comment about "playing devil's advocate" (something not politically related) and it popped out of my mouth "Oh, that explains your support of *." Another day she said something about how she thinks monkeys are cute and I said "Oh, that explains why you like *." She actually said she thinks * is good-looking compared to Kerry and Clinton. She also said she liked *'s smile! I told her she had to be kidding and that every time I saw * I wanted to wipe that smirk off his ugly face. Yesterday I sent her a link to the news about Greenspan talking about how future SS benefits will need to be cut. I added a note about how the millionaires got theirs and now we're going to have to pay for it. She's a pretty good sport about it but I'm thinking I need to cool it with her because I really want to bop her one.

Today she and a newly hired repuke started talking in the hallway about their love for * and after I said I was a Dem I excused myself and went to my office and closed my door. Within 30 seconds the newly hired repuke popped her head in my door and said "I just wanted you to know that I'm a nice person and that on social issues I'm very liberal." I didn't want to get into with her at the time so I just said, "Oh, ok, I can get along with most anybody."

My repuke friend is really smart and good-hearted but very religious and I think she thinks that * is moral and upstanding which just kills me. She thought Clinton was completely immoral. She and her husband have both committed adultery (she's told me; they are both on their second marriage) and I'm just waiting for her to say something about Clinton committing adultery and I'm going to let her have it with both barrels. I know it will probably ruin our friendship/work relationship but I just don't care--the future of our country is at stake and these right-wing mindless hypocrites are a huge part of the reason why.

[strategery blunder]

76. My mother didn't care in 2000

and refused to vote. She hates politics. But about a month ago, she told me that she was ABB, and, to quote her, "When I have an opinion about politics, something is seriously wrong."

She hates Bush because of all the corporate scandals. She works for United Airlines, and she believes strongly that the executives hid the company's assets in subsidiaries to file for bankruptcy and screw the employees.

As an example, she gave me a copy of all of United's subsidiaries, and Domicile Management, Inc. (or something like that) was on the list. Not knowing what domicile had to do with airlines, I asked her.

Her response: "Domicile is managing the shifts and scheduling of flight crews."

Me: "They have a separate company for THAT!?"

Mom: "You've GOT to be kidding. Oh my God."

[AgadorSparticus]

79. 2 little stories I've got to share...

1. my cousin was a bush sympathizer. she was defending bush last year. but i kept on her refuting all the media bias and spin. i told her not to take my word. go check the data i've told you. she went and did her research and came back ABB. she asked me not long ago, why is it that she makes darn good money and yet she is barely scraping by? i told her to blame it on bush. that little refund you got didn't come free--you are paying through the nose for that.

2. my hard-core-neo-con-faux-news-addicted father lives in a bubbled retirement world--oblivious to the reality of most of america. he just told me that his healthcare premiums have more than doubled lately. he was wondering why and i told him it was thanks to bush and his corporate supporters.

although he is still hopelessly RW, my husband and I see a crack in the armor. he was forced to put down the right wing torch for a moment and THINK about what was really happening despite what faux news was blaring. as healthcare continues to degrade, and he will have to pay more than what is comfortable for his fixed income, he will be forced to acknowledge what we already see.

[tanstaafl]

81. Republican Gun toting Brother-in-law ...

My sister's husband who is in his 50s, always votes republican, is ex-airforce, lives in Phoenix, spent a great deal of time in Texas and Colorado, works in the defense industry, loves guns, hates Clinton, voted for Bush in 2000 has officially announced he will be voting .... Democratic!!!

[Stephanie]

88. Excellent! What is motivating him?

Did he say?

[comsymp]

83. My mom

is a lifelong, rock-ribbed Republican. Tho' she's never voted straight ticket, she has NEVER supported a D for president. (she was even a CREEP in '72)

Needless to say, I spent much of Y2K doing my Cassandra impression for her, the rest of the family and anybody else who would listen and, since then would either point out the fulfillment of my prophesies (war, recession, jobs, Halliburton/Big Oil... hell- name it) or call her up to rant whenever she passed on one of those dumbass rightwing spam mails. (I also turned her on to Snopes- she now has it bookmarked)

But because she's my mom I always try to tone the rhetoric down a little and back off when she's had enough.

We usually talk on the phone daily for about 10-15 min. About a month ago, out of the blue, she called specifically to ask me what I thought of Clark. Well! We had a good conversation (tho I was leaning towards Dean ATT). She indicated that she'd probably be voting for him if he was still in play by the time we have our Primaries and acknowledged that I was right (love hearing that) about *.

Last weekend she called again. Question: what do I think of Nader? We talked about 2000 (I'm not a Blame Ralpher), Jebbie/Cruella, Public Citizen, his experience level, then about Kerry & Edwards. Bottom line: she and my stepdad, in her OWN words, are firmly ABB.

Guys, this is huge- and it may be a trend that even Diebold can't counter.

[Stephanie]

85. I was called "Cassandra"

Everything I said then is now mainstream news.

I did not PREDICT anything, I only reported the news before the mainstream deemed it appropriate to publish it.

[Stephanie]

84. I Saw The Light, by Mr. Hank Williams

I Saw The Light
-Hank Williams

I wandered so aimless, life filled with sin
I wouldn't let my dear savior in
Then Jesus came like a stranger in the night
Praise the Lord, I saw the light.

Just like a blind man I wandered a long,
Worries and fears I claimed for my own.
Then like the blind man that God gave back my sight
Praise the Lord, I saw the light

I was a fool to wander and stray,
Straight is the gate and narrow the way
Now I have traded the wrong for the right
Praise the Lord, I saw the light

I saw the light, I saw the light
No more in darkness no more in night
Now I'm so happy, no sorrow in sight
Praise the Lord, I saw the light

http://www.lyricscafe.com/h/harris_emmylou/emmy135.html

[Arugula Latte]

91. One of my brothers-in law

Nice guy; Colorado; not very political; from a Repub. family (not fundies, though). He voted for AWOL. My sister-in-law mentioned that he regrets the vote and won't vote for Shrub again.

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

93. I want to kick this

It's too interesting and encouraging to drop it yet, all these people changing their minds! Wish I could say the same for the people I know, but they are still holding on to Bush, although it is obvious they are getting more and more cognitive dysfunction over it!

:kick:

[bobbieinok]

95. kick

:kick:

[ElementaryPenguin]

96. I believe ALL of my in-laws - all of my wife's family were Repukes in Ohio

But now, from what I'm hearing - they ALL intend to vote for ANYONE but Bush! They think he lied about the Iraq war, that the war on terror is an unwinnable joke - and that he is a one man wrecking crew as far as the economy and he's going to destroy social security! They basically hate the shit out of the guy, and they are scared of Cheney and Rumsfeld!

[Stephanie]

97. "they ALL intend to vote for ANYONE but Bush!"

That is freaking amazing. Bush turned the whole FAMILY around?! He's a wonder!

It seems to me we're in very good shape. The posts in this thread are EYE-OPENING. The tide has turned.

Now all we need is an honest election.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

106. He has "united, not divided" your extended family...

In their loathing of him! LOL

[Ysabel]

98. converting republicans...

i knew about seven republicans (back in 2000) and then met about five more recently...

i set out to convert them...

i took care not to not offend them, i was friendly, and presented my case thoughtfully - i believe that i was most successful in helping them to see the many ways in which bush is costing them money...

of the 12 of them - i think only two still plan on voting for bush...

also - about 8 of them say (the others didn't say) that they are not against gay marriage and that they do not support an amendment to the constitution banning gay marriage...

[Stephanie]

99. You see! Reasonable people, presented with the actual facts...

will come to the correct conclusions.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

100. How many do you want me to post?

And where should I begin?

The band instructor at my school, who after about three conversations with me, did his own research, came back to me and said he was horrified that he ever voted for * and won't again.

My next-door neighbors who were HUGE * supporters just a year ago and now want John Kerry bumper stickers.

My 15 year old neighbor's son (another neighbor) who walked up to my driveway the other day as I was unloading groceries, took a look at my anti-* bumper sticker and said, and I quote, "I decided bush is a douchebag." I choked on my gum.

The best two:

My best friend's dad....a total shittohead who thinks every word that comes out of rush's mouth is gospel, admitted to her just three days ago that the constitutional amendment was the straw that broke his camel's back. My best friend didn't even know her dad was wavering, because he always defended * so vigorously, but it turned out he has been on the fence for about 7 months---the war, NCLB, the economy, and then the amendment thing just pushed him over to the anti-* side. My friend said she nearly fell over after he convinced her he was NOT kidding. He asked her to tell him about John Kerry.

Another couple we are friends with are BIG neocons. The LAST people in the WORLD who would vote against bush. We have been debating for TWO YEARS. This time last year, * practically gave them orgasms. Then the summer came and the war dragged on. He is former military and they both suddenly got really quiet on the subject of *. Really quiet. Then in the fall, I started hearing them grumble about him, little under-the-breath mumblings. Nowdays, they are openly supporting John Kerry. They have told me they sadly think * was VERY wrong for the job and they feel he has done more harm than good. The husband admitted to me how painful that was for him to admit.

That's not even including the people in my everyday life who see my anti-* button on my purse and stickers on my van who honk and give me thumbs up or say in the checkout line (upon seeing my button), "I HATE that man!" I mean seriously, it's almost shocking. I did NOT hear all this just a year ago. In fact not even last summer.

And it gets worse every day.

I've had people pull me aside at parties to admit they no longer support * (after they look around first, LOL!).

Edited to add: I don't like to let hard core freepers and the like know about this. Let them be smugly apathetic. I heard Sean Hannity on TV say that if he were advising the bush re-election campaign, he'd tell them to ignore the south and focus on places like Pennsylvania, etc. Swing states. I jumped up and cheered. I hope to GOD they do take that advice. Ignore the south, bushies. Ignore the south. Ignore the south. (hee hee)

[Stephanie]

102. That is a LOVELY story. And you're in Texas?!

Incredible!

"...the constitutional amendment was the straw that broke his camel's back."

This really cheers me. I love seeing BushCO's attempts at pandering to bigots backfire in such a big way. They're going to lose a lot more people than they gain on this one. Nobody reasonable wants to be on the side of the bigots.

[never cry wolf]

105. You mean it get's BETTER every day

We all have to keep it up, keep up the pressure on editors and columnists, LTTEs, word of mouth, etc. I'd love nothing more than to have this asswipe not only lose but get the smallest incumbent vote ever and bring along some house and senate seat our way in the flood!!

You know, nobody is going the other way!

I LOVE this thread!!!

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

108. "Shittohead"-- LOL, soda squirting through nostrils... (eom)

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

101. Kick

Kick Kick Kick Kick this!

:kick:

[West Coast Democrat]

103. A Good Friend of My Boyfriend who adored bush* after 9-11....

...has had an epiphany over the past few months, and has come to despise him so much that he now plans to work in a grassroots anti-bush campaign. This is a guy who was sort of on the fence during election 2000, and I'm not sure that he even bothered to vote. After 9-11 he became one of those flag-waver types who adored shrub's "leadership" or whatever. It really p*ssed me off, personally. Then the guy moved to another state.

Now my boyfriend told me that his friend called him a few days ago and announced to him: "You guys are going to like me a lot more now...especially your girlfriend." He asked why was that, and his friend replied, "Because I REALLY hate Bush now! The things you guys were saying about him are RIGHT!".... and he went on and on.

This guy lives in a southern state by the way.

[Hamlette]

107. add my republican sister in law

she is active in the PTA and she is so angry about NCLB she can spit nails and she won't stop talking about it. She said it was a disaster from the beginning. The wrong way to go. She was completely apolitical before. I've never heard her talk politics. Not sure she even voted. She'll be out voting for anyone but bush this time around.

I think we can turn her husband too. Last night I asked him about gay marriage he said: "I'm against it but for all the wrong reasons. It's completely an emotional issue with me. I know I'm wrong. When I was younger I would have been against gay marriage. But some of my patients over the years have been gay and good people. I don't support an amendment."

Hard to argue with that. He's conflicted. I will work on him. The occasion didn't allow me to really talk to them more about it.

[Stephanie]

111. "I don't support an amendment."

It must be obvious even to your bro-in-law that Bush* wants to mess with the Constitution purely to pander to the bigotry vote. He must see that it's nothing but a cynical political ploy.

I think Bush* may have overreached way too far on this one. The people you might least expect are offended! Sweet justice!

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

109. I meant to add

that I cannot find a SINGLE teacher (I am one) who supports NCLB. I am in Texas and we have already been under the heavy grip of * from when he was gubbernor and have been dealing with this for years, only it is WORSE under NCLB and we never thought it could possibly get worse.

Seriously, I have been asking teachers for about a year and haven't found a SINGLE ONE who supports NCLB.

Come to think of it, I am hard pressed to think of a single parent I have spoken to who supports it.

And these are people who come from all parts of the political spectrum.

Is there ANYONE out there who thinks NCLB is good? I don't even hear conservatives on TV or radio or ANYwhere talking about it.

Edit: For those of you who are curious, I am in the Dallas area. Yeah, DALLAS.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

110. Aren't there teachers in Texas who have had their retirement

ruined by the Enron flameout? Hasn't this had any negative political fallout on the shrub?

Around the time of the big Iraq invasion propaganda blitz (can't remember if it was before or after actual fighting began), one of the staff where I work was parroting some anti Saddam propaganda that could have been straight out of Fox news. Then later that day she mentioned how Enron was a dirty word in her family because her mom, who had been a teacher in Texas, had her retirement fund decimated because the teacher's retirement fund had been so heavily invested in Enron... No connection seems to have been made between Kenny Boy and the shrub... sigh...

[WillyBrandt]

112. My Coast Guard Brother-in-Law Registered Democratic

Was an open-minded Republican who liked to poke at my very Democratic sister.

He never had any tolerance for the fundies or the racists, at all. He was essentially a "Hank Hill" good-guy Republican who felt conservative, insofar as he wasn't into any of that hippie mumbo jumbo stuff.

He recently changed from Independent to Democrat, and hates Bush. He thinks he's a moron, a nut who dragged us to war, and has total contempt for the guy.

He was in the first Gulf War, and thought the second one was total madness. He refers to Bush as a stupid nutjob, and will vote for the nominee. He prefers Edwards, which makes sense considering he's in NC, and still has a few conservative impurities that haven't yet been purged :)

[Stephanie]

113. "He refers to Bush as a stupid nutjob"

That's EXCELLENT that he went and registered as a Democrat! Now THAT's what I'm talking about. He went out and SWITCHED PARTIES!! Woo hoo!!! Bush the UNITER.