Religion (EEK!) poll

[Smirnoff]

Just curious I guess! One of my repuke friends informed me yesterday that "all democrats are atheists." Interesting huh?

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. Welcome from a liberal Christian Green

See my website for more explanation on all of that. ;)

[Bronco69]

2. You forgot

Agnostic. :-)

[distortionmarshall]

7. yah.....

that would get rid of a lotta the "other" category, i bet....


YAFP.... (Yet Another Flawed Poll)..... :)

[wryter2000]

8. Yup

I can't really call myself an atheist, so I had to choose other. If you add agnostic, put me in there.

[Smirnoff]

17. damn...

Can you believe I was racking my brain for more too? :dunce:

[Lars39]

20. You still have time to add it to the poll. eom

[distortionmarshall]

30. i dunno - a lotta lost ground to make up.....

.... atheist got a lotta falses votes, and christian too, i'd imagine... we'll see if agnostic can catch up at all....

[blondeatlast]

72. Wiccan, Pagan, Scientologist... nt

[denverbill]

19. Yep, another agnostic Christian-type.

[skippysmom]

3. Catholic for now

I've been a Catholic all my life, but the vitriol and hypocrisy coming out of the church is driving me away from them.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

10. Same here-Archbishop O'Malley has proven to be divisive here in Boston

I am half-assed Catholic but still consider myself Catholic 'culturally'. The Church should be working on its internal problems as well as the continuing allegations of sexual abuse. I was very angry that O'Malley chose to lead the gay marriage opponents on Boston Common. If he is so concerned about a secular/government issue, maybe the Dioscese should start paying taxes.

[not systems]

4. infidel here.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=infidel&r=67

[prodigal_green]

5. Catholic

Please include Catholic as separate from Christian. "Christians" don't consider us saved and there are some fundamental differences that warrents their being separated.

[truthspeaker]

13. Only some Protestants think Catholics are non-Christian

I think most Protestants accept that Catholics are Christians. Mormons, on the other hand....

It's just the Jack Chick hater-types who call Catholics non-Christian, and they also think most Protestants aren't Christian either because they're not Biblical literalists.

[DarkPhenyx]

23. Baptists and Born-Agains think so too.

I hear that a lot down here in North Carolina from the baptist set.

Personally, I just think Catholics are a mostly welcome addition to the "Pagan" segment of the religious scale. Baps and BA's are just lost and confused Catholics. :)

[GreenPartyVoter]

32. Most fundie evangelicals think Catholics aren't saved *sigh*

[TrogL]

57. I'm Anglican, but I voted Catholic

I'd invite Orthodox to vote with us.

[dae]

6. Episcopalian, also known as Catholic-lite, or Catholic w/o-the-guilt.

;)edited b/c God doesn't like ugly

[nickinSTL]

9. Some sort of neo-pagan/heathen

I follow the gods of the ancient Norse.

Some call it Asatru, other heathen, could be Norse reconstructionist.

I'm probably more of a Norse pagan, as I'm too laid back for some of the reconstructionists/Asatruar.

[noonwitch]

11. New Age Christian, with Wiccan leanings.

I've found a way to reconcile my love for Jesus and his teachings with the natural life principles from Wicca and Goddess-worship. I go to a Unity church.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

12. No use arguing that

These people usually redefine terms with cavalier abandon. You can show him/her any number of Democrats who are religious and s/he'll say the person is either "not actually" religious or "not actually" Democrat.

Edit: ether --> either. Is there a Freudian slip in there somewhere?

[Az]

14. Actually you will find a heavy representation of atheists in the repukes

Particularly the Ayn Rand objectivist variety. They are part of the old school economic coservative wing of the repukes. Their distaste for anything even resembling altruism drives them towards the rights economic cutthroat attitudes.

Alan Greenspan is a typical Ayn Rand atheist on the right. He even used to to write for the Objectivist magazine.

[DarkPhenyx]

16. Isn't Ann Colter also athiest?

I seem to remember that being so.

[Az]

31. Not after that convert them all to Christianity comment

She claims to be a Christian as far as I know. She has never shown up on the Celeb Atheist list. And we tend to even note the individuals we would rather not have on our team.

[CBHagman]

34. There's a celebrity atheist list?!

Where do you find out these things?

[Az]

36. Here

http://www.celebatheists.com/
Its a bit out of date. But still pretty accurate.

[DarkPhenyx]

15. Why is Wicca...

...the fastest growing religion the US, always listed as "other"?

[Muddleoftheroad]

22. Pretty easy to be fast growing

When your numbers are low.

Lies, damn lies and statistics.

[DarkPhenyx]

24. The numbers aren't that low.

Simply because we are not evangelical dosen't mean we aren't there.

[Muddleoftheroad]

25. By comparison

Which is what stats do is compare.

[DarkPhenyx]

26. You are assuming your numbers are accurate.

There are a lot of pagans who self ID as agnostic or athiest when asked. Proclaiming yourself as being Pagan can cause a lot of issues and problems. Yes, the percentage of Pagans to total pop is lower, but it isn't as low as you'd think and it is growing. Now what has any of this had to do with Wicca being listed as other when alternate Pagan religions are listed seperately?

Wicca is a federally recognized religion after all. You can even have it put on your dog-tags when you are in service.

[VelmaD]

29. You are spot on with this

I never know what to say when someone asks me my religious affiliation. I'm kinda a pagan and kinda an agnostic and kinda an atheist and kinda just areligious. I believe things but it's all very amorphous and confusing. "Other" just really doesn't cover it. :)

[historian]

45. answer

If someone asks you about your beliefs just say atheist - that usually shuts them up. Anyone who has to ask needs to stop feeling so self righteous and feel that i need to be saved.
If the person is really stupid just say satanist
that takes care of them

[Muddleoftheroad]

70. They aren't my numbers

They belong to the Census Bureau or the major marketing companies that make money making sure their numbers are accurate.

So you can delude yourself all you wish. It doesn't bother me.

[Forkboy]

85. But but,that's a disrespectful thing to say about someone's beliefs

[Butterflies]

18. Agnostic

how can anyone be so sure they're right about their religion?

That's the question that I can't get past.

[Tims]

44. Yes but

at what point do you say the doubt is so small that you can't justify further consideration. The moon may indeed be made out of green cheese, I haven't been there so I don't really know. At some point skepticism must give way to the reasoned argument that the evidence (or lack thereof) doesn't justify further serious thought. All that can change if evidence should suddenly appear, but unless you have reason to expect that the evidence may just be around the corner, why hang on to unsupported beliefs.

Many agnostics are persuaded by Pascal's Wager and simply fear giving up.

Looking at your post again, I see I've made a mistake. The argument of "being so sure" made by agnostics is usually directed at atheists, but here it seems you are directing toward believers. And as such I agree with you.

A common saying of atheists to believers is "the only difference between you and I is that I believe in one less God than you". If more believers could understand the arguments they make against other religions can just be as easily directed at them, it would seem there would be much more open minds.

[Mountainman]

21. I would say I tend toward pagan and Wiccan thought

I am more of an earth religion person. More in tune with the Native American beliefs that divinity is is all things living and non living.

Religions make excuses for wars and subjugation of other people and animals and other things I consider evil.

[Smirnoff]

27. Added the other two...

I know Catholics are different than like baptish and methodist and bla bla, but isn't the same basic idea? Oh well... you ask and you shall receive.

[Kazak]

28. Voted atheist, but...

I consider myself more of a Naturalist.

[Auntie Bush]

35. I consider myself Spiritualist

I now believe in God or that spiritual energy exists, but I dislike ALL organized religions. I don't like openly religous people...

[CBHagman]

33. Ask your Republican friend how he/she explains...

...Democrats Father Robert Drinan, a Roman Catholic priest, and Senator Joseph Lieberman, an Orthodox Jew.

Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan, God rest his soul, used to quietly attend St. Patrick's Church in D.C. He was there regularly.

Tell your Republican friend THAT, too.

[Bucky]

37. Unitarian-Universalist; So I guess I'm "all of the above"

Except atheist. I just don't like the way they prey.

[muriel_volestrangler]

46. Maybe you should have a word with the BBC

they've classified Unitarian Universalist as Atheist.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/atheism/types/index.shtml

[Lauren2882]

59. UU here too -- and that's odd

The problem with classifying Unitarian Universalism in a religious taxonomy is that it really doesn't fit the definition of religion at all, in that there is no set of beliefs to which members are expected to adhere. And many UU's do have beliefs; some even have traditional Christian beliefs but for some reason prefer the openmindedness of UU services to Christian services. There are also UU-Buddhists, UU-Pagans, UU-Jews, and so on. So for all of the individuals who fall into one of these groups, to me it seems that the second part of their religious identity (the Christianity or Buddhism or what have you) is what actually refers to their "religion" while the UU part simply refers to where they attend services, or their religious "affiliation" perhaps. Then of course there are UU atheists, and UUs like me who don't have any particular set of defined beliefs, so I'm just a UU, or else since I hardly ever go to services I tell people when they ask that I have no religion.

The other thing that BBC report got wrong was when it described Christianity has the world's "biggest" religion. Unless I'm mistaken, there are a higher number of Muslims.

[Bucky]

64. Well, may the principles of loving-kindness and respect damn them to hell

May Recycling cause their flesh to crawl with maggots in everlasting perdition

[PurityOfEssence]

38. Agnostic; Atheists are acting without proof too.

Yeah, I know, like bi-sexuals, agnostics are just in some kind of denial.

To be firmly convinced of something without proof is ridiculous. It's okay to have a little mystery in life, and even though most Agnostics would be operating under the assumption of Atheism (as am I) there's a subset that presumes Theism.

The whole thing would be supremely funny if it wasn't for the killing, abuse, enslavement and assorted mayhem done in the name of belief. As it is, it's just depressing.

[SixShooter]

39. Southern Baptist

probably the only liberal/progressive at my church of 1000 people.

Thats cool though, its fun to stir up the establishment.:evilgrin:

[PurityOfEssence]

54. Good work, brother

My sister in NC finally gave up on them and went back to being a Presbyterian. (That was what we were raised, at least until I bolted at age 6...)

We're pretty close, being the only siblings, but we're very different. I asked her, gently, if it was the "women are subject to their man's rule" crap, and she said that this was an issue, but that the close-minded nasty politics and social narrowness were the real sparks. She went on to point out how they were the richest people in their old church, and among the poorest in their new.

Thanks for making the effort; it's something I can have no say in, yet it's one of the pivots upon which the future of the world will turn.

[seabeyond]

40. but it wont matter

cause it is spread thru the followers only way to be christian is to be a republican. so though we call ourselves christians, we arent and no talking can convince, i just tried with one

[RebelOne]

41. Your friend was partially right.

Atheists and Christians are about even in the poll.

[libertad]

81. not really, since Catholics and JW's are Christian, as well. We

need to add those categories together.

[West Coast Democrat]

42. Sorry, why are Christian and Catholic in different categories?

[Ysabel]

48. somebody asked...

them to change the catagories - up there another poster who said they were catholic asked for that...

changing a poll doesn't seem to lend much towards accuracy - eh - although polls are almost always biased and inaccurate anyway...

edit - typo...

[Az]

73. There is a certain amount of discord

Between Protestants and Catholics. Enough so that they consider each other to be different categories in general.

[blondeatlast]

74. Good question. nt

[morgan2]

43. I deny the category of religion as ridiculous

and refuse to say I'm anything.. Religion is the biggest joke ever played on men. I see it as a Santa Claus type mythology that parents told their kids except when the kids grew up they never had to find out it was fake.

[Must_B_Free]

47. Yay! "OTHER" is now an official religion!!!

I am a high priest of "Other".

[Thoth]

49. Buddhist - we're really born again...

and again, and again... ;-)

And very tolerant of all religions, except the Christian Reich that is. There's nothing you have to believe, but rather, find out what you BE.

[EV1Ltimm]

50. Where's the option for Amish?

[NC_Nurse]

51. Ah- the buddy Jesus

my fav religous symbol!
What a great movie Dogma was...
I put "other" by the way...mine is an evolving faith based on several beliefs.

Anybody ever read Skinny Legs and All by Tom Robbins?

I love that book.

[Hippo_Tron]

52. You forgot Jedi Knight...

I think several million people returned their census with that as their religion.

[CO Liberal]

53. Gimme That Old-Time Religion - HAIL, ZEUS!!!!

:-)

[knight_of_the_star]

55. You forgot

Pagans.

[ButterflyBlood]

56. Christian

and at least change Christian to Protestant if you're going to have it seperate from Catholic. I'm Protestant but only a few wacko-fundies don't consider Catholics Christian.

[Kool Kitty]

58. I'm a Wiccan.

and I am sure that puts me in direct line for burning at the stake, or a stoning, at the very least.

[wyldwolf]

60. FYI - Catholics and Jehovah's Witnesses are christians...

I know many protestants will disagree.

[ButterflyBlood]

61. EVERY time I've check this poll

Atheist and Christian are EXACTLY tied. weird.

[blurp]

62. Question for agnostics:

So, you don't know if there is a god or not, but,

what do you BELIEVE?

Do you live as though you assume there is a god, or do you live as though you assume there is no god?

Maybe there should be choices for agnostic atheists, and agnostic deists.

[truthspeaker]

77. I'm not one, but I would imagine they believe nothing

[Mattforclark]

63. I would change my vote

from atheist to agnostic, now that you added that.

[freeforall]

65. You forgot...

the New Agers!

[corporatewhore]

66. Church of the SubGenius

Slack Slack Slack!!!!!!

[Darranar]

67. Culturally Jewish, theologically agnostic...

voted "Agnostic".

[Chovexani]

68. Wiccan.

Following a Hellenic path, to be specific.

It could just be the circles I run in but probably 90% of the progressives I know are Pagans of some variety. I don't get that "all Democrats are atheists" talking point...I guess it's because spiritually-minded Dems are less likely to wear it on their sleeves than the conservative fundie types.

FWIW, most of the atheists I know are Libertarians.

[BonjourUSA]

69. Is it subversive to be an atheist ?

or a citizen must believe in something to be recognized like a "good american" ?

[blondeatlast]

75. Not anymore. nt

[Az]

82. Maybe not subversive

But its certainly not a welcome thing in society. Simply put there are no elected open atheists sitting in any office currently. Atheism still can lead to exclusion in many social circles and commuties.

Atheists are still largely in the closet. Here on the internet we have a certain amount of freedom that is not available in real life thus you will see more atheists popping up. Suffice to say that there is still oppression and hatred guided towards atheists should the community discover where you live.

[BonjourUSA]

83. VIVE LA LIBERTÉ !

I don't know if they practice a religion of my co-workers or believe in something (excepted for two of them). For my friends is the same.

I'm an atheist but only God knows that. :-)

I am not an exception in France. The religion is very very rarely a subject in our discussions, but more often a subject of jokes.

[Grave Expectations]

71. Agnostic...

Still going to see the Satanic interpretation of Jesus' life though.

[Ilsa]

76. I consider myself a Christian, but I wonder how people define

"Agnostic". I see it as a set of Christians that split from the early church over the first couple of hundred years. They refer to a different history of the early church and internal political manipulation of the truth regarding Christ's life and intentions for our lives.

[Az]

78. The terms are muddy

I try to lay down some standards based on the lingustic basis of the words.

Theist: A person that believes in god or gods. This does not tell you what sect they belong to or how they come to this conclusion. It is only a statement of belief at the current moment.

Atheist: From the word theist and the prefix 'a' meaning without. Specifically a person 'without' a belief in god or gods. How they came to this position is undetermined. It is not necissarily a positive statement. It is merely a recognition that they are without a belief in god or gods at this moment.

Gnostic: Means to know a thing. This is not a minor use of the word know. It is know as in the absolute sense.

Agnostic: Derived from gnostic combined with the prefix 'a' meaning without. Without knowledge. That is a person arrives at a belief without knowing for certain whether they are right or wrong. They may be fairly certain or even very certain. But short of absolute knowledge they do not know the thing to be true.

Thus from these 4 terms we can have combinations.

Gnostic Theist: A person that believes and has direct knowledge of god. This can be tricky as the person may believe they have direct knowledge of having experienced god but it could in fact be a mental aberation. They may beleive themself to be absolutely certain but my in fact be mistaken about their belief.

Gnostic Atheist: This is a person that claims to both believe and know there is no god. Again the gnostic portion presents the problem. In order to know there is no god one would have to have absolute knowledge of the universe (or multiverse). While they may have a very high degree of certainty regarding their belief that there is no god claiming this position calls into question their understanding of the rules of logic.

Agnostic Theist: This is a person that believes there is a god or gods. They cannot back this belief up with any absolute evidence but this does not change their belief.

Agnostic Atheist: A person who does not believe in god. They may be able to refute every single argument for god they have encountered but they either keep themself open for any future arguments or recognise that they cannot know a thing in the absolute sense.

Belief and knowledge are two different things. Belief requires no logic or arguments. It simply is a statement of what the current balace of learning and experience are within your mind. It can vary in any given moment. A person so torn between positions can sway back and forth many times in a minute. But at any given moment the current balance resides in one or the other position. You either do or do not believe there is a god right now.

Gnostic vs Agnostic are tied up in the flow of logic. They answer questions about what you do and can know.

[Ilsa]

79. Thanks, You provided a lot of great info.

I haven't had enough coffee this morning to remember that "agnostic" was not a reference to "gnostic".

[jor_mama]

80. I guess all democrats except 206 are atheists

n/t

[ComerPerro]

84. I am actually embarassed to be called a Christian

I prefer not to associate myself with the likes of Pat Robertson and George w Bush

[Forkboy]

86. Agnostic