Is the AIDS virus man-made and/or the result of a bio-accident?

[ecstatic]

While growing up, my dad always asserted that AIDS was a man-made disease that was created to wipe out the white gay male population. Of course, at school, I was taught that AIDS resulted from people eating/and or having sex with green monkeys in Africa. I always kept my dad's view in mind, however.

On NBC, a new author named Michael Carroll talked about his new book, "Lab 257: The Disturbing Story of the Government's Secret Plum Island Germ Laboratory," which describes how the West Nile virus may have been the result of a bio-accident, etc. Yet, up until today, I've never heard anyone tie the disease to anything other than mosquitos.

If what Mr. Carroll states is true, I wonder if the same misinformation is prevalent in regards to how AIDS originated. Funny how it suddenly popped up in America, out of nowhere, in mainly white gay males. Could it be that a green monkey was involved, but not in the way the media would have you believe--maybe some researchers were running tests on the monkeys, and were curious about how the disease inherent in those monkeys would affect human beings. Even if some AFricans did eat monkeys, that fact still may be irrelevant to why AIDS is rampant within the gay community, and has become such a devastating disease in Africa.

BTW, this post is not about how AIDS spreads; I think we're all pretty clear on that. Its more a question of how the disease actually originated.

http://www.universalway.org/aidsmanmade.html
http://www.wnbc.com/health/2855091/detail.html
http://www.rag.org.au/sra/plum.htm

[mobuto]

1. The AIDS virus

is a mutation of the SIV. How it came to humans is unclear. But there is no way it could have been genetically engineered. As just one argument (and many more could be provided), the mutation appears to have occured back in the 1930s - before any super secret government laboratories.

[ecstatic]

2. hmm....one Dr. says it is Visna and HTLV-I combined

The theory hinges on the claim that the AIDS virus (HIV) is virtually identical to two other viruses: Visna, which causes a fatal disease in sheep but does not infect humans, and HTLV-I (Human T-Cell Leukemia Virus), which infects humans but is seldom fatal.

Prof. Jakob Segal, the author of the theory, says that structural
analysis using genome mapping proves that HIV is more similar to Visna than to any other retrovirus. The portion (about three percent) of the HIV genome which does not correspond structurally to Visna corresponds exactly to part of the HTLV-I genome.


http://www.sas.upenn.edu/African_Studies/Urgent_Action/AIDS_Contract.html

[Minstrel Boy]

3. "Emerging Viruses" by Leonard Horowitz

Anyone read it? I picked up a copy yesterday. Horowitz makes the case for it having been bio-engineered, though suggests its release was likely accidental.

Myself, I know enough only to say "maybe."

[readmylips]

5. Accidental my A$$!...

Is that a super smart virus that is capable of finding blacks and gays throughout the world to infect? Give me a break. We also must believe that chickenpots was a virus that on its own, found our American Indians and killed them.

[AntiCoup2K4]

12. Exactly.

It was no coincidence that the outbreak of AIDS started in Africa and in the gay communities of NY and SF at exactly the same time. Oddly enough, just a few years before, there was a hepatitis vaccine distributed in NY at the same time a small pox virus was distributed in Africa.

Declassified CIA documents speak of a plan to decrease the "undesirable" populations. Included in that definition were blacks and homosexuals. It's genocide without the "in your face" horror practiced by Adolf.

[Kinkistyle]

15. Oh please. Whites, and heterosexuals have same genes as gays blacks.

Meaning eventually whites and heterosexuals getting the disease would have been inevitable. There is no way this disease was engineered unless it SPECIFICALLY affected gays and minorities and no one else.

[Az]

4. As we destroy more of the rainforests expect more such diseases

We keep exposing ourselves to more and more exotic diseases isolated deep in rainforests and other enviroments. We have barely catelogged even the insects living in these places. The microscopic diversity in there is off the scale. We may well eventually dig up our own undoing.

[sangh0]

16. Actually, we face a greater threat from domesticated animals like cows

pigs, horses, etc.

Take an inventory of history's greatest epidemics, and you will be looking at a list of diseases that originated in either domesticated animals (smallpox from cows, chickenpox from chickens) or animals that live in close contact with humans (ex. bubonic plague from rats)

But your point still stands. Destroying the rain forest means exposing people to the animals that might be carrying diseases we have no immunity from.

[Avalux]

18. Had a disturbing conversation with a colleague

about the influenza epidemic of 1918 that killed 20-40 million people. It is possible the culprit was a genetic mutation of avian influenza and human influenza. It is almost expected to happen again - a person infected with human influenza comes in contact with avian influenza and bingo. The two produce a superstrain of influenza virus. Scary stuff.

[sangh0]

22. Exactly

While the increased human to animal contact deforestation brings does increase the odds of creating an epidemic, the amount of human to anumal contact that results from corporate farming (specifically animal husbandry) far outstrips the contact that occurs during deforestation

[Silverhair]

6. Humanity does not yet have the kind of knowledge

to be able to do that kind of bioengineering. Further, the AIDS gained media attention in the early 1080's, but it didn't pop up out of nowhere. It is now known to have started in Africa, infected people took it to the Caribbean, and from there vacationing gays caught it and brought it back to USA.

No conspiracy, just simple evolutionary biology.

[Liberal Veteran]

8. Agreed. I have HIV and I don't believe in the conspiracy theories.

New and unique illnesses and viruses have been cropping up thoughout history. This is no different.

[ecstatic]

9. Check this out...

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=AIDS+man+made+disease

[Bridget Burke]

7. I think the disease originated naturally....

But the fight against it could have been handled better.

"It's no problem--only gays get it."

"It's no problem--only those Africans are dying."

[Minstrel Boy]

10. some things that make me go hmmm:

1969 Dr. Robert MacMahan of the Department of Defense requests from congress $10 million to develop, within 5 to 10 years, a synthetic biological agent to which no natural immunity exists.

1970 Funding for the synthetic biological agent is obtained under H.R. 15090. The project, under the supervision of the CIA, is carried out by the Special Operations Division at Fort Detrick, the army's top secret biological weapons facility. Speculation is raised that molecular biology techniques are used to produce AIDS-like retroviruses.

1970 United States intensifies its development of "ethnic weapons" (Military Review, Nov., 1970), designed to selectively target and eliminate specific ethnic groups who are susceptible due to genetic differences and variations in DNA.

1975 The virus section of Fort Detrick's Center for Biological Warfare Research is renamed the Fredrick Cancer Research Facilities and placed under the supervision of the National Cancer Institute (NCI). It is here that a special virus cancer program is initiated by the U.S. Navy, purportedly to develop cancer-causing viruses. It is also here that retrovirologists isolate a virus to which no immunity exists. It is later named HTLV (Human T-cell Leukemia Virus).

EDITED BY ADMIN: COPYRIGHT

http://www.raven1.net/humanexp.htm

[ecstatic]

11. its scary that gov'ts can do this in the name of defense

Even more scary is the fact that most of us are not aware of these things.

[hang a left]

14. Here is a little bit more

http://www.sonic.net/~doretk/ArchiveARCHIVE/Aids/TheMerchantsofAIDS.html

There is documented evidence that a disease which could be recognized as AIDS has been worked on for years. Testimony before a sub-committee of the House Appropriations Committee, in Washington, D.C., in 1969, for Department of Defense appropriations for 1970, stated:

Within the next 5 to 10 years, it would probably be possible to make a new infective micro-organism which could differ in certain important respects from any known disease-causing organisms. Most important of these is that it might be refractory to the immunological and therapeutic processes upon which we depend to maintain our relative freedom from infectious disease. (R. Harris and J. Paxman, A Higher Form of Killing, 1982, p. 241)

The money was approved! By 1972, this potential new micro-organism was described so clearly that there is little doubt that it is AIDS:

An attempt should be made to ascertain whether viruses can in fact exert selective effects on immune function, e.g., by . . . affecting T cell function as opposed to B cell function. The possibility should also be looked into that the immune response to the virus itself may also be impaired if the infecting virus damages more or less selectively the cells responding to the viral antigens.

This is beyond question a clinical description of the function of the AIDS virus! But it appeared, of all places, in the Bulletin of the World Health Organization, Vol. 47, pp. 257-74, in 1972.

[Moderator]

23. Minstrel Boy

Per DU copyright rules
please post only four
paragraphs from the
news source.


Thank you


DU Moderator

[Avalux]

13. No - not manmade

Conspiracy theories often abound when something can't be explained. We STILL don't have all the answers about HIV after 20+ years; no cure in sight, not even a vaccine. I've been working in the field for 15 years and do not believe it was cooked up in a lab. There is evidence that it may have been present since the late 1600's but the mechanisms were not in place for an epidemic until recently.

[ecstatic]

17. mechanism?

Do you mean casual sex? Or drug use?

[Avalux]

19. Several things

Drug use, unprotected sex with multiple partners, global travel - it's almost as if the planets have to be perfectly aligned.
Things are changing too - the heterosexual transmission rate is going up in the western world. I'm seeing a number of new infections among heterosexuals.


on edit: changed casual sex to unprotected sex with multiple partners

[Kinkistyle]

20. Yes. Incredible how fast SARS spread.

Only needed a few people in an airplane cabin going to several places.

[Avalux]

21. HIV is not easy to get

it can only be transmitted through sexual contact (body fluids) or blood, so the SARS comparison doesn't work. HIV was spread globally by those who traveled amongst countries and engaged in unprotected sex and IV drug use.

[Solomon]

24. Aids is man made. It was given to white male homosexuals as a cover

for genocide against africans. It worked beautifully since because the white gay male population was affected, no one believes it was deliberately placed in africa.

Read my sig line.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

25. "Mary, Ferrie & the Monkey Virus" by Edward T. Haslam,

Go to the link below and read the reviews...very interesting, IMHO.

<http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/602-1764303-3702237?asin=0964398125>


ADDITIONAL NOTES:

1. David Ferrie was a primary suspect in Garrison's JFK assassination case. Ferrie was also the commander of Lee Harvey Oswald's Civilian Air Patrol group...Barry Seal was also a member of the same group.

2. While in jail, Jack Ruby claimed on more than one instance that he was being injected with a substance that was designed to give him cancer.