I Love Seeing All These Same-Sex Marriages Taking Place

[Stevendsmith]

We're witnessing a very important historic event.

Good for them.

Just let the knuckle-dragging homophobes try to revoke these marriage licenses.

You can only fight human progress for so long.

[MuseRider]

1. I so agree.

I wish I could be there to honk my horn and congratulate them.

[Must_B_Free]

42. What is unbelievable is that anyone makes an issue of it

As if somehow these marriages have some tangible detremental effect on anything.

The people opposed to gay marriage are, what, in crisis? Under seige? Are we to think that the institution of marriage is under seige?

What possible effect of some people that I don't even know exist in San Francisco decide to take some vows and enjoy the same status rights as any other adult in a legally registered monogamous relationship?

This media event of the gay marriages going on sort of exposes the irrelevence of the oppostion.

[LunaC]

2. Seeing their joy

is contagious....I keep smilin' my ass off every time I see a news blurb! I'm sooooo happy for them!

[not systems]

3. It is great.

I have seen so little social progress in my life that I
don't think I knew what it looked like.

These marriages are the biggest social change in about 35 years.

[arewethereyet]

4. its already done

the licenses are not being accepted for registration if the forms are impoper as in having scratched out "bride" and "groome" in favor of other descriptions.

not revoked, just unprocessed. not married till registered.

I guess they can ask for their money back though.

[wryter2000]

5. Isn't it wonderful?

I've never been a big Gavin Newsome fan before, but this has been terrific. I don't know how anyone can watch this display of love and support and not be moved to see the rightness of it all.

:loveya:

[Stevendsmith]

6. Send Flowers

Here’s a great idea I saw posted here.

http://www.livejournal.com/community/twin_cities/517426.html#cutid1

Flowers

Today a coworker of mine had a thought to send flowers to a random couple waiting in line at SF city hall.

He called a florist and they agreed to do it. He told them to deliver to any couple -- it didn't matter who -- standing in line to get married, with his blessing. The card will read simply "With love, from Minneapolis, Minnesota."

Once they understood, they were very touched and thought it was a great idea.

He told another co-worker who did the same thing. And now we want to start a movement. Wouldn't that be cool if people from all over the country, gay, straight and otherwise, started sending flowers to the people waiting in line to get married.

Call it The Big Gay Bouquet call it Flowers from the Heartland. Call it whatever you want, but help us get this off the ground.

Call Flowers on the Bay at 888-217-9119 and order a bouquet to be delivered tomorrow at noon.

And Tell all of your friends to do it.

Because straight or gay, we believe and we know many people who believe, support and celebrate the right to marriage. And we'd like to show it. We'd like to see all of the people standing in line with flowers of support from all over the country.

PS. Flowers on the Bay seems like a small shop and might get overwhelmed if this really did catch on. I have a feeling that any Bay-Area flower shop, perhaps even doing FTD through your local florist, could work.

[Sterling]

7. Me too!! Now I say fuck civil unions, it's an all or nothing thing.

It has really inspired me on this issue. I cannot tolerate bigotry in any form and see no reason to budge one inch on this.

[Taeger]

8. Enjoy it while it lasts !!!!

State legislators across the 50 are scrambling to enact anti-gay marriage amendments. Some of them (like Indiana's) include language banning Civil Union as well.

In this climate, most reps will have no choice but to sign on.

Refusal to settle for Civil Unions will result in Civil Unions being constitutionally banned in MANY states. Nice work :shrug:

Next time you Gay Lesbian alliance folks go on a streak of demanding something, try to make sure you have more than 10% of support amongst the general population. :shrug:

[kiahzero]

12. 50 Years Ago today....

"State legislators across the 50 are scrambling to enact anti-inter-racial marriage amendments. Some of them (like Indiana's) include language banning Civil Union as well.

In this climate, most reps will have no choice but to sign on.

Refusal to settle for Civil Unions will result in Civil Unions being constitutionally banned in MANY states. Nice work :shrug:

Next time you Black-White alliance folks go on a streak of demanding something, try to make sure you have more than 10% of support amongst the general population. :shrug:"

Should Rosa Parks just have gone to the back of the bus?

[foreigncorrespondent]

13. Well done, Taeger.

You are implying that the court is going to listen to the religious right, rather than what the STATE and FEDERAL CONSTITUTIONS say.

[Taeger]

22. No ...

I'm stating that you've riled up the general populace that DOES NOT want gay marriage. They're not just "kinda" against it. They are VERY, VERY much against it in a militant way.

The result is that they will be enthusiastically FOR amendments that preclude gay marriage. In some instances, the conservatives will sneak in provision that ALSO ban civil unions. Under the current climate, lawmakers will be hard pressed to vote AGAINST such propositions.

Had the recent events NOT occurred, a lot of this legislation would have simply been shrugged off as a waste of time. Moderates could confidently vote against this stuff knowing that it would have little or no traction in the press.

Well guess what??? Recent events have riled folks up and make this stuff front page news. Those same moderates will now be under the gun and may be forced to vote for anti-gay marriage/union/whatever legislation to keep their seat.

You wanna know what makes this issue 500% worse. If gay folks were ASKING for the right to marry, it wouldn't be that bad. They are DEMANDING it. And they are trying to force the courts to FORCE it on the vast majority of Americans who DON'T WANT IT!!!!

Their response to this is "Oh really, we HAVE to recognize gay marriage!!! I don't think so." A LOT of these folks would otherwise support generic civil unions (including myself).

You fail to realize that this IS a Democracy. You have every right to consider same-sex couples as being a marriage. Those who oppose it, have every right to their opinion. They simply do not want a same sex relationship to be called marriage. And THEY have the numbers. Boy do they have the numbers.

They will vote Democratically to NOT recognize it. They will pass Constitutional Amendments to MAKE SURE that they don't have to recognize it. The court rulings and court challenges will put the urgency of God under these folks. The gay-marriage amendments will be proposed across the fifty and MOST of them will pass.

The great tragedy is that these very same people will completely ignore the Civil Union issue now. A LOT of politicians who were willing to carry this isssue before will COMPLETELY drop it after being betrayed by the very people they were TRYING to help.

This has set the Civil Union issue back 10 years. I suspect that it has set the possibility of recognized gay marriages back 20 years.

So yeah, good fucking job. One step forward, 5 steps back.

[arewethereyet]

24. I think some folks refuse to face facts

this is an unwise thing. Even Barney Frank thinks so.

[foreigncorrespondent]

25. Get your facts right....

...before you start spouting off to the queer community.

It was a court in Mass that ruled in favor of gay marriages. It is the Mayor of San Francisco that decided to begin issuing licences to LGBT folk, not the queer community.

As for my feelings. I will NEVER take a separate but equal deal just to please the right wing.

We don't know if the FMA will pass or not. Most people say it won't. But if the issue of gay marriage goes to the SCOTUS, then the SCOTUS is going to have to rule in favor of it, because the federal DoMA is UNCONSTITUTIONAL, and the right wing knows this, hence their introduction of the FMA.

I don'
And just like Rosa Parks refused to take a seat on the back of the bus, well the queer community and its supporters are refusing to do the same.

[Taeger]

27. Fine, dig your own grave ...

I'm tired of trying to knock the shovel out of your hand !!!!

[foreigncorrespondent]

34. Tell me Taeger...

...would you have tried to hold Rosa Parks back? Would you have tried to hold back any of the black civil rights activists?

Because all you are doing here is trying to hold back the gay civil rights movement of 2004.

Unless we have activists that are willing to tackle the problems head on, then we will never get anywhere.

I'm not digging my own grave. But you are giving the right exactly what they wanted, to split the democratic party. Well done!

[mike1963]

29. Well, I say FUCK a bunch of homophobic bigoted assholes.

You don't get a plate of fried alligator tail by saying "please Mr. Gator, lie down and die for me."

Ever heard of Niemoller?

shit

[Taeger]

33. You don't get honey ...

You don't get honey by pissing off the bees. If you watched "Fried Green Tomatos" you would know that ;-) Better to charm them into KNOWING that you really aren't a threat at all.

Of course, you can learn the same lesson by watching "Ghandi".

You're trying to FORCE people to recognize an institution that they DO NOT want to. Instead of difusing the issue, you've brought it to a boil.

[foreigncorrespondent]

35. No we arent.

We aren't forcing anything on anyone, but the religious right is trying to force their ways on us, by constantly telling us to comform to the way of religion.

[LeftCoast]

43. Small correction

"...the religious right is trying to force their ways on us, by constantly telling us to comform to the way of religion"

They're trying to make us conform to the way of THEIR religion. But then...they also feel the seperation of church and state only applies to other people's religions...

[mike1963]

37. You get honey by stunning the bees with smoke. Not a great analogy,

but you sure as HELL don't get it by being 'nice' to them.
:grr:

[mondo joe]

18. Well that was stupid of you.

"Refusal to settle for Civil Unions will result in Civil Unions being constitutionally banned in MANY states. Nice work."

How can gays settle for civil unions when they're not being offered?

[Taeger]

26. Read again ...

Many of these constitutional amendments will BAN Civil Unions.

Before, you could have gotten recognition from simple laws like the ones passed in Vermont and Massachusetts. After these amendments, you will have to go through a Constitutional process to overturn those amendments.

In other words, it will be a LOT fucking harder to get civil union legislation now.

It will be a LOT harder to bend the ears of politicians who have supported civil unions and NOW have been sideswiped by a group unwilling to accept progress.

I want you to realize that most legislators have constituents who are NOT homosexual. In fact the vast majority of them are not. They MUST look out for the greater good of their constituents. If they get kicked out of office over some bullshit nonsense issue like this, they can't help their constituents.

There are WAY more progressive issues than gay marriage and civil unions. It's egotistical and naive to think that a legislator should neglect the greater good on behalf of YOUR particular issue.

A LOT of legislators have been willing to go out on a limb on the civil union issue. I dare say they lost a lot of voters just for that. The way that gays and lesbians have paid them back is by cutting the limb down simply because it wasn't high enough for them. Do you think a LOT of these moderates will really GIVE A SHIT about civil union after this fiasco????

I know, you don't think it's a fiasco. You think it's all great and dandy. You don't realize whats going on in statehouses across the nation. You don't realize the degree to which this has empowered the anti-gay crowd.

Within 4 short months, you will regret the Massachusetts ruling and San Francisco's open defiance of law. Just WATCH and see whats going to happen. You will see the BACKLASH of ALL BACKLASHES!!!!

[mike1963]

30. So what do you suggest? Stay in the closet forever? Let the idiots run

roughshod over gay folk for eternity? When is the "right" time? In the year 9595?

:eyes:

[a priori]

31. That doesn't matter

They aren't interested in civil unions; they want equality. Constitutional amendments can be repealed; eventually, all this bigotry towards gays will be phased out and probably directed at something else. Every civil rights struggle has to start somewhere, why not here and now?

[Andy_Stephenson]

40. Why did you come in here and

Rain on this parade? To quote GW...You're either with us or against us.

[Razoor]

9. I like how the repugs are blowing a gasket about all this

I love seeing repukes head explode over this since they cant wrap their brain around the concept of gay marriage. good for the couples!

[a priori]

10. "You can only fight human progress for so long."

I have no problem with fighting for it for as long as it takes.

And about the homophobes trying to revoke the licenses: the fundies are already pressuring Arnie to arrest the mayor of SF for allowing this to happen. The pressure, courtesy of the good people at http://www.afa.net

Not that their demand will go anywhere, but it just goes to show how deep the hatred runs...

[Silverhair]

11. They don't have to revoke them. They aren't valid anyway.

The anti gay marriage organizations will simply ignore them. The RW will use all the publicity to get their base excited.

[arewethereyet]

23. they are not being recorded by the state, no marriages happening

in the case where the forms are altered to replace bride and groom boxes.

nothing is real until its recorded.

[arewethereyet]

32. Reuters: Wrong Form May Invalidate Calif Same-Sex Marriages

this is not going to be allowed folks. First you challenge the law, in court. Then things change.

-snip
SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - California will not accept the marriage licenses granted to thousands of same-sex couples in San Francisco because the city created its own form to remove such terms as "bride" and "groom," a state official said on Wednesday."

"There is a statewide form that every county has to use for marriage applications. If we receive application forms that are different from the single form used throughout the state, we will not accept them," said Nicole Kasabian Evans, a spokeswoman for the Health and Human Services (news - web sites) Agency.
=snip



http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20040218/us_nm/rights_gays_sanfrancisco_dc_8

[lcooksey]

38. First you challenge the law in the streets,

then it goes to the courts, then the law gets changed.

Women went into polling places to vote when it was illegal. They were cursed, beaten and jailed.

Rosa Parks refused to go the back of bus, and people in the Freedom March went into whites only diners and sat at the counters and refused to move. And they were arrested.

The National Guard escorted black children into a segregated school despite state laws.

I have a coworker who is pretty conservative and very religious. I asked him at lunch today what he thought of all the fuss in Massachusetts and San Francisco. And he said, "The gay marriage thing? I haven't really been paying any attention to it."

The avalanche has already started, it's too late for the pebbles to vote.

[Silverhair]

41. less than 2% of the population doesn't make a big

avalanche. And there is a big head of steam building up for the FMA. The gays just don't have the numbers to win this one.

[lcooksey]

49. Numbers

2%? Where did you get that figure? Gays and bisexuals make up more like 10% of the population. It's impossible to know for sure since many people will not identify themselves to pollsters for fear of losing their jobs, or being outed to their families.

Besides, in the struggles for women's sufferage and African-American civil rights did 100% of the oppressed people participate in the struggle? No. Did 100% of the mainstream population oppose their struggle? No. Some men marched with women for the vote, and some whites marched alongside blacks in the South.

We don't need huge numbers to win this fight. Timid people don't win civil rights victories.

[arewethereyet]

46. wrong approach, see Mass

that will most likely sort itself out without pissing off the entire country. Breaking the law by no less than the Mayor is a galvinizing act that can only hurt the long term chances of gays not only in California but accross the country.

Too late to do anything about it now. Going to be a lot of uphappy people with no recourse.

Oh well.

[SinkingInTheRain]

14. What if Kerry helps revoke them?

Will he be a knuckle-dragging homophobe and still get your vote?

[kiahzero]

15. What if the moon is made of green cheese?

Take your mudslinging to GD2004.

[a priori]

16. Yup, he will. Look at the alternative.

[sangha]

47. Kerry, Kerry, Kerry

That's all I hear :-)

[Hippo_Tron]

17. I love when we get to "degrade society" and piss of the right...

They are so cute when they are mad.

[Chovexani]

19. Me too!

Somebody on another thread posted a link to a photo gallery:

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/document.cgi?f=/g/a/2004/02/18/gaywedgallery.DTL

I've been going through it and crying like a baby. I'm such a sucker for romantic stuff. :)

Best wishes to all the couples. That this is even an issue in the 21st century is just frelling stupid.

--C.

[xchrom]

20. yup -- it just makes me happy

and i'm already gay.
thanks all for the idea on the flowers.
as for the rest -- it seems to this little homo -- that the hetero extremists have had their say for far too long.
maybe gay marriage won't stick right now -- but damn, it sure feels good for the time being -- and if you think it will energize the right then you will be amazed at the energy it will give my gblt brothers and sisters.

[sweetheart]

21. Heartfelt blessings indeed

I wish those being married the absolute best'est goodwill and happy tidings on their magical union.

No "man" can split asunder what that "man" has no business messing with. Buck Fush, its your magic wedding. I am so proud of all of you who make a go at enshrining love and light in your lives in the midst of such republican evil darkness.

God bless the lovers and poets of the world... they complete us all.

[Cronus Protagonist]

28. Here's a pic for your desktop

http://bushspeaks.com/home.asp?did=159



"FUCK BUSH" Buttons, Stickers & Magnets

[Fleshdancer]

36. what a beautiful picture!

I love the expression on that baby's face too. "So what's the big deal? My mommies are married, why all the fuss? Now let's get back to focusing on me again, okay?"

Here's a virtual toast to all couples in love and may every baby today grow up to not understand what all the fuss was about in the first place!

[Joe Momma]

39. since there seem to be some gays on this thread

can someone please explain to me why 25% of the gay vote went to bush in 2k? i cannot get an answer to this question. i hear the outrage and agree with it. what i do not understand is this high level of support from an oppressed group for the oppressors. i hope that this all leads to acceptance for gay marriage or civil union or whatever you want to call it. if only just to piss off the fascists. i still don't understand the voting with the pocketbook that seems to go on here. as i've said before, maybe blacks would do the same if they had the money in theirs that gays do. but they don't, so they vote overwhelmingly against the fascists. still they do, because their struggle goes on. what percentage of democrats are for gay marriage or at least civil unions? is it higher than 75? is it at least 75?

[lcooksey]

50. Why did 25% of gays vote for Bush?

I wish to heck I knew. I don't understand it myself. I think the first time around the Log Cabin Republicans bought into the message that Bush was not very conservative, that he was "a uniter, not a divider", and they thought they could work with him.

If you are a single gay or bi person who isn't interested in marriage, maybe you're more worried about taxes than marriage. If you're in a relationship, but you can afford to have a will drawn up, and medical power of attorney documents, and you both have good health care, maybe you're more worried about national defense than marriage.

I do know that the Log Cabin Republicans have said that if Bush backs the FMA, they won't support him. Don't know if they'll be pissed off enough to actually endorse a Democrat. But it could happen.

[nedlogg]

44. I'm up for anything that pisses off conservatives!

This issue really has these sanctimonious right-wing assholes panties in a bunch, doesn't it?

I love it!

[Cptn Kirk]

45. Someone should buy a web domain

and ask people to send in pictures of them getting married to put on the site. It would be great. I might actually do it my self if I had the money.

[eleny]

48. Me too

And it's really odd but I thought that people would be showing up in droves at the courthouse trying to get licenses to marry their pets. Just another right wing myth, I guess.

Hubby and I have been married for the big 25. But when I learned that those 2 elderly lesbian ladies who got married first had been together 51 years, it brought tears to my eyes. I hope I my old man and I live long enough to be hitched that long.

Power to the people and all that lovely, smooth jazz. Yeah, baby!

[booisblu]

51. Look

if our candidate is not strong enough to stand up to the homophobic fundies, then he won't be strong enough to do anything else that needs to be done. We did not start this fight, it was brought to us. Not all of the GLBT community agree with what has happened in San Fran, but it is out there now and we have to continue on with circumanstances as they unfold. We are not going away, unless this government starts killing us or shipping us out. And those of you that claim to be democats on this board who keep chastizing us, well I have to wonder what your true motives are? Gay marriage is not the huge issue that A) the fundies are trying to create, and B) not the giant wedge issue that you are making it to be.

The bottom line is that the fundies are losing control over all they have gained in the last 50 years and are panicking. The older homophobic generation is dying off. The under 30 crowd are supportive of gay rights in every poll I've seen. And frankly, they are not interested in the rabid preachings of the Falwell's and Robertson's. People want to live and be happy and party and have fun. The gloom and doom crap just isn't cutting it anymore. So it is my community, my people who have now become the focal point of their hatred, just so they can hope to hold on just a little longer to their power and money base. Once those donations stop, the fundies are done.

And this crap about 25% of the gays voting for Bush..let me see cold, hard statistics on that. You keep spouting that off in just about every thread I've seen lately, but you never back it up. The log cabins are ridiculed in my community, and I have never met one. I live in a large GLBT area, so surely 25% should show up here also. But I have not run into one yet.

I don't compare our struggle for civil rights with the fight for equality by the blacks. There are some similarities, but also great differences. For one, we don't have the great, inspiring leaders like MLK and MalcomX. We need that badly. Blacks were not disowned over the color of their skin. They always had the family to support and understand their struggle, since it was the same. They were not called evil with bible quote after bible quote. We are killed, and we are assulted. Our women are raped because it is a sport of some sick straight men to fuck a lesbian. And yes, I say my people becuase it seems so many are turning their backs on us when we need them most.

We did not start this fight, but we will see it through.. I promise you that.