Refresh my memory re: media count of Florida votes

[BuelahWitch]

The other night some friends and I went to the University of Missouri to see a video that recapped the events of the Florida recount. At the end, it was stated that the results of the media count were to come out on September 11, 2001, and of course, were postponed due to the WTC tragedy.

I remember the results were supposed to come out *close to* that date, but was it specifically 9-11?

[John_H]

1. In the big media recount

the one where they counted every ballot--gore won under every scenario save one --the one his advisors was aiming at. He won by the largest margin under the recount scenario that followed the texas statute Chimpy signed while governor of texas. Lots of irony there--he loses under the strategy the dopes that ran his campaign wanted, and won under chimpy's idea of a good way to recount.

[dolstein]

2. What the media recount showed

The recount showed that (1) if all of undervote ballots were recounted using a consistent chad standard, then Gore won under some scenarios (ironically, Gore tended to do better under stricter chad standards) and (2) if both undervote AND overvote ballots were recounted, then Gore won in all (or nearly all) scenarios. However, this doesn't mean that Gore would have won had the recount been allowed to go forward. For one thing, it isn't clear whether all the ballots would have been counted (or rather, recounted). For instance, nobody knows for sure whether overvotes would have been examined. It's also unclear what chad standard would have been used, and whether it would have been applied consistently. Also, the margins of victory for Gore under the recount scenarios were very small, and could easily have been offset through human error (the counters would not have been as well trained as those used for the media study, and they would have been under immense time pressure).

The only thing I can say with certainty is that it is nobody can be certain that Bush's lead in Florida would have survived a statewide recount. And frankly, that's saying a lot. I simply find it indefensible that we would allow someone to ascend to the presidency without doing everything humanly possible to determine whether they actually won the election.

[deadeye]

3. gore lost almost every scenario according to this link

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/media/media_watch/jan-june01/recount_4-3.html

I think that Gore losing Tennessee should be what people remember.

[judgegina]

5. Gore did indeed lose Tennessee, but Bush lost the USA...

by more than 500,000 votes.

What people will remember is that Bush could not have "won" Florida if his brother had not been Gov. of the state.

[nannygoat]

8. There was lots of voter fraud in TN, too...

How Al Gore Lost Tennessee
http://www.counterpunch.org/tnfraud.html

Vote Fraud in Tennessee: Worse than Florida?
http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=10589

[w4rma]

6. Media recount results ("Gore won Florida by...")

FLORIDA ELECTION RETURNS

RED indicates official "certified" results.
GREEN indicates unofficial recounts included in our totals.
BLUE indicates link to source material.
PURPLE indicates our final unofficial count.
...
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Florida Totals
Bush 2,912,790 --- Gore 2,912,253
Bush 2,636 --- Gore 3,675

Final Adjusted Total,
including first media recounts for all Florida counties:

Bush 2,915,426 --- Gore 2,915,928
http://www.unknownnews.net/election2000.html#count

Count ballot as a vote if vote is indicated, but marked incorrectly. Example
Vote is indicated and marked correctly, but the candidate's name is also written in. Example
Ballot condition is agreed upon by at least two judges.
Count ballot as a vote if the chad is at least dimpled. Example
Final Tally: Gore won Florida by 107 votes.

Count ballot as a vote if vote is indicated, but marked incorrectly. Example
Vote is indicated and marked correctly, but the candidate's name is also written in. Example
Ballot condition is agreed upon by at least two judges.
Count ballot as a vote if the chad is detached from one or more corners. Example
Final Tally: Gore won Florida by 72 votes.

Count ballot as a vote if vote is indicated, but marked incorrectly. Example
Vote is indicated and marked correctly, but the candidate's name is also written in. Example
Ballot condition is agreed upon by at least two judges.
Count ballot as a vote if the chad is fully detached from ballot.
Final Tally: Gore won Florida by 430 votes.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/onpolitics/elections2000/recount/yourvote.html

[radwriter0555]

9. Let's not forget the 80,000 people erroneously placed on the felon's list.

ok?

That was the coup they really pulled off.

[FlaGranny]

10. It has been estimated that

the felon list cost Gore about 22,000 votes. If 80,000 registered voters were removed erroneously from the voters' lists as felons and 40 precent of them would have voted (at least that percentage voted of ALL registered voters), 22,000 votes lost is a conservative estimate (since these were nearly all Democratic voters). Jeb and Kathryn planned well. These voters, I read, will NOT be reinstated before November 2004 - but, Jeb is working on it, so do not fear.

[KAZ]

11. He's talking about the NORC recount which was to be released..

in Sep '01, and in which Gore wone in 6 of the 9 scenarios. But you knew that, didn't you. http://www.democrats.com/display.cfm?id=181

[newyawker99]

14. Hi deadeye!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[w4rma]

4. Here are some articles that came out September 10

Newsweek: The 'Accidental President' (September 9/10, 2001)
...
In a Virginia hotel, near the makeshift Bush transition office, Karl Rove—the campaign’s political guru—was watching MSNBC when the Court ruling was announced. He called Bush in Texas; the governor was watching CNN, which took longer to decipher the opinions. “This is good news,” Rove told Bush. “This is great news.”

“No, no, this is bad news,” Bush replied. Rove was the first person Bush talked to as the verdict came in—Bush had no sense initially he’d just been declared the winner by the stroke of the Court’s pen. It was very confusing.
...
Soon enough, Bush talked to his field general, Jim Baker, who talked to Ted Olson and the other lawyers on the team. Within half an hour, Bush was convinced Gore had finally run out of tricks.
...
http://www.msnbc.com/news/626045.asp
http://www.democraticunderground.com/forum_archive_html/DCForumID22/164.html

Report: Recount Vote Left Wounds in Some Justices
Monday, September 10, 2001; Page A05

Supreme Court Justice David H. Souter was convinced he could have altered the outcome of the 5 to 4 decision that tipped the presidential election to George W. Bush had he been given just "one more day" in which to make his case to a wavering Anthony M. Kennedy, Newsweek magazine reported yesterday.
...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A1617-2001Sep9

NBC in jam over election coverage (Tuesday September 11 4:14 AM ET)

NEW YORK (Variety) - Former General Electric Co. chairman Jack Welch most certainly influenced NBC News coverage on Election Night 2000 by allegedly distracting editorial staff, doing his own computer analysis of sensitive voter data and, ultimately, insisting the race be called for fellow Republican George W. Bush, a Democratic politician said Monday.
...
http://tv.yahoo.com/news/va/20010911/100020686800.html

Tuesday September 25 8:35 PM ET

TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) - A media review of uncounted Florida ballots in the 2000 presidential election has been delayed indefinitely as a result of the recent terrorist attacks.

A group of news organizations, including The Associated Press, had planned to publish stories in late September based on a review of uncounted ballots in the race between George W. Bush and Al Gore.

But the attacks on Sept. 11 have consumed the efforts of computer data analysts, editors and reporters at the participating news organizations…
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/20010925/us/media_ballot_review_1.html

Various links:
http://www.makethemaccountable.com/coverup/

[linazelle]

7. Do you think that's why Bush kept reading to those kids on 911...

because it was a planned election coverup/PNAC deployment?

Bush is the devil incarnate.

[DoYouEverWonder]

12. He does seem to have incredible luck

When it comes to the timing of major distractions, excuse me, events.

[Zero Gravitas]

13. If they had done the RIGHT thing

(i.e. count ALL the uncounted votes with a consistent standard) Gore would have won Florida. There was no "recount" as the issue was what to do with the votes that the machines rejected for being an "overvote" or an "undervote". This "re-re-recount" business is GOP spin.

What disgusts me the most about the Florida election debacle is that apparently no-one on either side cared about democracy, all they cared about was winning. The Bush* people didn't want a full count of the vote because the machine count (really an approximation of the true numbers because of the high reject rate of the machines) put them ahead, and the Gore people didn't care about the real numbers either as evidenced by their attempt to "cherry pick" counties that they thought would put them ahead. In fact if they had got their way they would have LOST. IF they had done the RIGHT thing they would have won (assuming that doing the right thing would habeen allowed).

It is a travesty that the lazy people in Florida not only relied on the silly punched ballot/machine count method but they had no mechanism to deal with the situation where the reported count/estimate from the machines was so close as to be within the margin of error of the machines. It is known that the machines make errors and when the difference between two candidates is a few 100 votes out of millions then common sense would dictate there should be some way to assertain the true numbers when the machines cannot be relied upon.

In my opinion the most fair and trustworthy way of voting is a paper ballot where you put an X by the candidate's name. If you make a mistake ask for another ballot and the old one is destroyed on the spot. The votes are then counted in public with representitives of all interested parties present. There are no hanging chads no chance for electronic fakery and there is a permenant record of the votes. No mechanical or electronic system will ever be as good as old fashioned paper ballots.