German Giant Says US Workers Lack Skills

[dtotire]

German Giant Says US Workers Lack Skills

Published: Monday, 20 Jun 2011 | 2:07 AM ET
By: Ed Crooks

A mismatch in the US labour market between the skills of unemployed people and the jobs available is making it hard for some companies to find the right staff despite an unemployment rate of more than 9 percent, one of the country’s largest manufacturing employers has warned

Eric Spiegel, chief executive in the US for Siemens , the German engineering group, said the problem exposed weaknesses in education and training in the US. Siemens had been forced to use more than 30 recruiters and hire staff from other companies to find the workers it needed for its expansion plans, even amid an unemployment rate of 9.1 percent

“There’s a mismatch between the jobs that are available, at least in our portfolio, and the people that we see out there,” Mr Spiegel told the Financial Times. “There is a shortage (of workers with the right skills.)”

He said Siemens was having to invest in education and training to meet its staffing needs, including apprenticeship programmes of the kind it uses in Germany.

His comments, made before Tim Geithner, the Treasury secretary, visits a Siemens plant in Ohio on Monday, suggest better education and training could help reduce the persistently high US unemployment rate.


more:
http://www.cnbc.com/id/43459947

[leftyohiolib]

1. what he means is if all the suddenly unemployed people

would go back to school for a masters in computer sciences, go 75k in debt (at age 40-50) we would be willing to hire them at 10 dollars an hour

[get the red out]

3. Bingo!

There is such a disconnect where "education" is concerned, especially since it is so expensive here in the US. And how would someone even make sure to obtain a "marketable" education that won't fail them yet again in another few years?

[OHdem10]

4. Exactly. What about all those computer workers who litterally

had to train imported workers to take over their job
as they (American Workers) were thrown to the wayside???

[ProfessionalLeftist]

6. Yep. That's about it. n/t

[OHdem10]

2. Since this is our FREE TRADERS MANTRA. and is used to

bring in H-1B workers ar lower wages,. I become
a bit skeptical.

Do not get me wrong. I am for all education and training
we can get. I have been around so long now and heard
this line over and over used to lay off skilled workers
and either send their jobs overseas or bring in lower
paid workers from overseas.

[roxiejules]

5. What skill sets are hard to find...

Young and cheap?


http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/2009-07-08-science-engineer-jobs_N.htm

The slow growth of U.S.-born STEM workers, analysts say, may have less to do with funding commitments than with cloudy career paths and low wages relative to other specialized careers such as medicine, law and finance.

Among the most vocal critics: Michael Teitelbaum of the Alfred P. Sloan Foundation in New York, which funds basic scientific, economic and civic research. He says there are "substantially more scientists and engineers" graduating from the USA's universities than can find attractive jobs.

Alan Weissberger, a 61-year-old telecommunications engineer in Santa Clara, Calif., admits to being "stumped" when people say there's a shortage of engineers. He has been unemployed since 2005. Unemployment, especially among older Silicon Valley engineers, has been a constant reality for the past 20 years, he says. "But it's certainly gone into 'hyper mode' in the last six."

Many of his fellow over-40 engineers hear repeatedly that they're actually overqualified for many of the jobs they seek; he recalls that a friend, laid off from Nortel in 2002, couldn't find work for 1½ years, until Santa Clara University hired him — as its dean of engineering.

[southmost]

7. wish i could recommend this post

+1000

[TreasonousBastard]

8. But what skills? Robots and automated machinery have...

taken over maybe a third of manufacturing jobs in the past decade, so what's needed are sophisticated - milling machine operators, mechanics, and other people with very definite skills. A good machinist can make over a hundred grand these days, if you can find one.

Aerospace engineers we don't need so much as mechanical engineers and industrial designers-- how many of those are we graduating? How are we doing training high school kids in the math and reading skills needed to fix cars these days, much less operate million dollar robots?

[Mopar151]

12. A mchainist makeing 100K/yr ?

Are you talking wages on a W2, or total cost of employment? Gandalf the wizard tops out at about 50K in this market....

As someone in that trade, and with some knowledge of local Siemens plants - They ain't payin' no 100K. It's more like 35K, with all the crap you can't stand - stressed out, and regularly displaced managers, drug testing, shift work, and a low paid production crew who are exhibits for repetitive motion injury.

Far as training goes - if the money is there, the help will appear. We have massive UNDERENPLOYMENT in this country, and a lot of cheap, miserable bastards running the show.

[TreasonousBastard]

14. OK, you got a point. Most places say median salaries top out at...

mid 20's an hour, and a lot less in right-to-work shitholes.

The hundred grand I got from some medium sized shops in in New Jersey that do very specialized work and have people who have been around for years. And there's a lot of overtime involved.

I'm kind of curious how "machinist' is defined-- is it just the guy who runs the computerized lath or does it include the guys who rinse the parts?

[Mopar151]

15. In my case

It's the guy who runs the lathes, mills, grinder, saws (I'm a "toolroom CNC" guy, myself), figures out the parts to be made (engineer mold from part print, reverse engineer from smoking ruin, napkin sketch....) Make the parts, pick the hardware, build up the machine, plumb it, do most of the cable runs for the electrican - you know, just a shoprat who is not fit to lick the shoes of the 3rd assistant toady to the VP of Finance.

[EC]

9. Evidently there is a shortage in Germany too.

since they had to use the SAME training programs here that are used in Germany. "He said Siemens was having to invest in education and training to meet its staffing needs, including apprenticeship programmes of the kind it uses in Germany."

So, I'm glad to see they offer training programs. When I was younger there were training programs and training periods with most jobs. Now they expect you to pick it up on day one...I know they did this to cut costs, but from what I've seen, it results in everyone doing things differently and no coherency in results. So I have to wonder, do they really save money, or would they have been better off just training everyone?

[xocet]

10. The apprenticeship programs in Germany are part of their basic educational system....

Students graduate some level of high school or some level of technical college and go from there on to apprenticeships in industry. There is a closer linkage between basic education and a career in Germany than there is here in the US.

Here is a brief description of education in Germany: http://countrystudies.us/germany/124.htm . This website cites

Eric Solsten, ed.
Germany: A Country Study.
Washington: GPO for the Library of Congress, 1995

as its source.

So, it is not that there is a surplus of unskilled workers in Germany - unless you wish to count teenagers as part of the pool of workers. Their teenagers will have the training and education that they desire by the time they are to enter the workforce.

Here in the US it is up to the individual to divine what set of skills might be useful, when they might be useful, and for how long they might be useful. Furthermore, education in the US is an individual investment which may or may not pay off: woe be to those whose education is nothing more than expensive. Germany treats education as a societal good - not as an individual investment.

[w0nderer]

13. Doesn't Germany have a lower employee turnover?

Most Euro countries used to have a lower turnover of employees than the US

in W.Europe working in the same company for 10-20-30+ years isn't that uncommon
at that point paying for training makes sense from the company perspective
the longer you keep an employee, the cheaper the training investment becomes
and the more of an asset to the company he/she becomes due to gained experience and skill

but that means that you have to treat employees in a way that makes them
WANT to be loyal to the company and that's short term expensive, long term it actually probably is cheaper

in the US mostly employees aren't loyal to companies cause companies don't take care of employees
and vice versa. Companies are judged on 'what can they give me' and people are judged on 'can we burn them out and get a new one'
the whole 'get in, get what you can that ain't nailed down, get out' mentality on both sides

i'm guessing that economy/recession/depression has changed that a little but that WAS the going style 2000-2009 at least


Europe is also heavier on unions
so deals can be struck like
'company needs to downsize'
union offers to remove the 50 workers the company wants gone
for 6 months severance pay for each of them and 1 year paid at sick leave level re-training for other job on top of that
that's not just a company or society doing it for the good of society it's a case of union power and worker protection as well

[xocet]

16. I do not know. n/t

[roxiejules]

11. Good point

Training used to be standard practice. As a young adult my first job was waitressing in a small town. We were trained for an entire week (40 hours) before being allowed to interact with the customers. Sit down lectures on how to serve, formal table settings, presentation of food, cleanliness, manners, etc. Same type of practice when I transitioned to the business world. As the years went by the training became nearly obsolete and employees were learning the ropes on their own. And as you said, everyone did things differently which resulted in much chaos and lower standards.




http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/e74e5d74-9aad-11e0-bab2-00144feab49a.html#axzz1Ppa1XfNG

Mr Spiegel’s concerns about skills are shared by many other US business leaders.......Jeff Joerres, chief executive of Manpower, said businesses were more selective while the recovery was still weak and uncertain: “Employers have a much more sophisticated definition of skill requirements. Workers need to be instantly productive, and that makes a higher bar.”

[xocet]

18. FYI: Here is a post that relates to your statement about a shortage of skilled labor in Germany....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x609228

I think that the German apprenticeship programs are still a different sort of thing than what you mention in your post, but, apparently, there is a shortage of skilled labor in Germany. Hence, your earlier assertion regarding labor is essentially mostly correct.

[Bluenorthwest]

17. This is so far out of my area. I wonder, if a person had the skills

Siemens needs, how many other companies would also need those skills? Are they seeking a sort of training that makes a person suited for many companies, or just for them or a very limited industry? Is Siemens Unionized?