U.S. students are ignoramuses

[trud]

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/15/education/15history.html

"American students are less proficient in their nation’s history than in any other subject, according to results of a nationwide test released on Tuesday, with most fourth graders unable to say why Abraham Lincoln was an important figure and few high school seniors able to identify China as the North Korean ally that fought American troops during the Korean War."

But, hey, our current teachers do a great job, and are worth every penny of the early retirement/fat pensions/nearly free healthcare they get for nine months of work a year. Sure.

My teachers from decades ago would have been ashamed to turn out ignoramuses like this. Not that they ever would have.

[midnight]

1. In Wisconsin they don't learn about labor... So our out going Govenor

Doyle signed a law making it part of public education... No child left behind and race to the top our administrative tools to cause great harm....

[sense]

18. True.

The problem is enormous and cannot be solved by blaming teachers. The ptb want a dumbed down populace to ensure compliance with the plan. Not only do we need to begin with a complete change in the purpose of public schools, but we'd have to completely change the educational process for teachers. They are doing exactly what they were taught to do.

We pulled our children out to unschool for academic reasons 12 years ago and it's been the best thing we could have done for them. We're facilitators for their education and we don't have to follow an arbitrary order for their learning nor do we endorse the sort of "skim the surface" pablum that's offered in school. Our children learn what they want to learn when they are actually interested in the subject matter as that's the most effective way to obtain and retain knowledge. They learn as they learned before they entered school and much more in depth. They are not perfect, nor are we, but they will not contribute to the apathy they see around them.

They used to worry about being different but as they've grown older they've embraced that and know that their freedom to learn instead of being limited by the possibilities in public school are going to serve them well. The resources are out there, many free or very low cost. Families can work together to provide what their children need to be pro-active in educating themselves to be assets in a quickly changing world. I wish more people were able to shake off the very well planned programming that so limits our thinking about what education is and how learning happens. It's 24/7 and all around us, not compartmentalized, shallow and limited.

[leveymg]

2. Four TVs, two computers, and a Wii always on - no books in the house - and you blame the teachers?

How about the parents (as if they were ever around or showed any interest in what their kids are doing)?

How are the schools supposed to overcome the vast dis-education system that parents allow to take over the lives of children, if they don't even care enough to try?

Sure, cut public school teacher pensions. That'll solve the problem. :think:

[Sanity Claws]

3. Why do you assume that the teachers are the cause?

I see several factors at play.
The textbooks are awful and are written so that they are acceptable to Texas.
The parents are usually both working and are not in the position to supervise their children's homework as in earlier decades.
Faux News has spread the belief that facts are an item of belief, not reality.
If you blame the teachers, you miss the big picture.

[leveymg]

4. The OP is part of the problem of rampant ignorance in America.

Don't do it often, but unrecced for spreading the plague of teh stupid.

[NBachers]

9. Yup, me too

[mainstreetonce]

23. You nailed it

Texbooks for the last twenty years or more have centered on "Social Studies" and history and georgraphy are not taught as major subjects.
Textbooks are controlled by board members in TX who know nothing about education.

[no_hypocrisy]

5. The textbooks are lacking in real, pertinent information.

Remember the huge fight over the content of history textbooks in Texas from which all national textbooks originate?

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/13/education/13texas.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/03/17/AR2010031700560.html

Texas to revise history textbooks: liberals out, Limbaugh and Gingrich in
http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2009/08/21/57324/texas-history-gingrich/

[MedicalAdmin]

6. 1st unrec I've ever given. Conclusions specious. n/t

[Fuddnik]

7. In Florida they teach kids to pass a test.

OP wins "Ignoramus of the Year" award.

[BiggJawn]

15. They "Teach THE Test" here, too.

Our House of Bubbas (the Legislature) think being successful farmers and car dealers qualify them as education experts, too.

[Chef Eric]

8. Your teachers DID turn out an ignoramus: YOU. nt

[trud]

11. yeah, I think about what an ignoramous I am

as I look at my MIT degrees.

[Fuddnik]

12. Did you ask for a tuition refund?

[snagglepuss]

10. Blaming teachers for the woeful lack of knowledge simply indicates you are

angry but forming opinions from thin air. Read Anti-Intellectualism in America by historian Richard Hofstadter, a book published in the early 60s that was awarded a Pulitzer Prize for history, it will give an historical overview of this woeful state of affairs.

[Paranoid Pessimist]

13. It's not the fault of the teachers or the students

Dumbing down the kiddies has been establishment policy for some time. School is brainwash training to produce good consumer-pawn-employees, that's all.

[sense]

19. exactly!

[texshelters]

14. Did you mean this as a slight on teachers

are you another ignorant student you were referring to:

"But, hey, our current teachers do a great job, and are worth every penny of the early retirement/fat pensions/nearly free healthcare they get for nine months of work a year. Sure."

It's not the teachers, it's the constraints and the curriculum forced on the teachers.

Perhaps you need to study more about the current class situation before spreading the "blame the teachers" message.

Yes, and calling students "ignoramuses" is not helpful. Hopefully, you aren't in a classroom with that attitude.

unrecommned

Peace,
Tex Shelters

[Igel]

16. Lots of trends.

First, facts are boring. Teachers want to teach critical thinking skills and analysis, and so de-emphasize facts that all the kids take away are vapid posturings and impressions. Critical thinking varies significantly by discipline because it can never be fact-free and, in fact, first looks to make sure the practioner is as fact-rich as possible.

Second, the facts that must be taught, and therefore the facts that are taught, are those suspected to be on the standard tests.

There's a third, as well, which is to make sure that everybody feels validated. Why Abraham Lincoln was important hinges on politics: To say he was important because under him federalism became far more entrenched as the result of the Civil War, while American chattel slavery was put on the path to extinction is more than many school districts rest easy with. To say that China was essentially the enemy in the Korean War might cause Chinese-American students to feel bad.

In any event, "relevance" squashes all of the above. "Will I need this?" "How will I use this . . . tomorrow, by noon?" "Is it going to get me a good job?" It's not relevant to their self-identity, to them learning more about themselves (and those who think learning 19th century history actually teaches them specifically about themselves is just plain loony), many kids don't care. They've learned that questions of relevance are the end-all cop-out questions. It will tie the teacher up in knots. "It develops thinking skills" is a long-range answer--and not pertinent. "It makes you a better citizen" looks past the time-horizon of many students, and leads to indignation--"I'm not a perfect citizen already?"

Sic transit whatever.

[Wait Wut]

17. Broad brushes are bad form.

I agree that many students lack sufficient education. As much as I loved History in school, there were other students that just didn't see the point. I was lucky to have two very entertaining History/Constitution teachers in high school that engaged those students in conversations and debates. Miraculously, they all learned to enjoy the class.

On the other hand, I also had some absolutely horrible teachers. Not just in History, but every subject. When my son was in school, the situation had deteriorated. He had two ancient teachers that had zero interest in teaching but seemed to relish in the misery of their students. Before anyone claims that there were "too many students" or "poor text books" or any other standard excuse for bad teaching skills, my son and I both attended schools in one of the top ranking school districts in Illinois (and in the nation). Some classrooms were overstuffed, but most were standard class sizes. Our textbooks were always new or near new.

It's easy to point fingers at any one entity, but the fact is the fault lies with the parents, teachers, students and society. A group effort. Not all parents suck. Not all students are lazy (or ignoramouses) and not all teachers hate children. If we're going to blame only the parents, then we're abandoning all hope for the child. If we blame only the teachers, we need to prepare for a battle with those that oppose public education (good luck). If we blame only the student, we're expecting roses from a weed bed.

To the good teachers out there, thank you!! You don't get enough credit for the extra time and effort you put forth to create good little citizens. To those that hate their job and barely teach, unable to be dismissed due to your union backing...you absolutely suck and are a drain on society. Quit your job and do something that doesn't require you to be a people person.

[immoderate]

20. Teachers don't control education. Judges and politicians do.

Your complaints should be registered with them.

--imm

[libmom74]

21. Teachers don't

control the curriculum, they are only allowed to teach childre to pass tests. It's the horrible legacy of NCLB and the newest education "reforms" will only make it worse.

[swilton]

22. I bet they are also ignoramuses about

global warming and evolution.

I don't blame the teachers - look at who we send to Congress and the Senate. Brains are not a criteria - they may even be a stigma - just look at the 2000 election.

[surrealAmerican]

24. History is barely taught in elementary schools ...

... in this country. Most students spend some time learning "social studies", which, in the early grades, tends to focus more on basic geography (like how to read a map) and civics (like what does a President do vs. what Congress does), but even that is minimal because schools are focusing more on reading and math in order to pass standardized tests.

[xocet]

25. (1)(23)(4) or Just (23)....

"But, hey, our current teachers do a great job, and are worth every penny of the early retirement/fat pensions/nearly free healthcare they get for nine months of work a year. Sure.

My teachers from decades ago would have been ashamed to turn out ignoramuses like this. Not that they ever would have."

What an interesting presentation you have made:

• a broad brush attack on all teachers: "...our current teachers..."
  
• a standard attack on workers who receive decent benefits: "...xxxxx retirement/xxx pensions/xxxxxx xxxx healthcare..."
  
• an exaggeration of said benefits to pique the envious: "...early retirement/fat pensions/nearly free healthcare..."
  
• a tacit dismissal of the fact that teachers work: "...for nine months of work a year."
  
• rosy remembrances back to a wonderful, but fading time in our nation's past: "...from decades ago..."
  
• a facile insinuation that all teachers do not care: "...would have been ashamed..."
  
• further rosy remembrances brimming with honor and rectitude: "Not that they ever would have."
  
• and, finally, a desperate appeal to an external, well-respected authority to lend you a modicum of credibility: "...my MIT degrees."
  

All in all, yours is a pathetic attempt at argumentation, and your situation is not improved if, instead, you actually believe that you are in possession of a well-reasoned opinion regarding the subject of the linked article. That belief would surely be delusion.

[Zoeisright]

26. This shit again?

Listen, bud, my husband is a teacher. He works 70-80 hours per week during the year, which translates to 50 hours YEAR ROUND. During the summer he takes classes to keep his license current AND prepares lessons plans for the next year.

And they pay into those "FAT" pensions from the day they start working. You're falling into the typical logical reasoning deficit of most dumb people: if you are jealous of teacher benefits, fight to get them in ALL jobs. Don't knock jobs with good benefits. The Koch brothers are laughing at YOU all the way to the bank.

Sounds like YOUR teachers turned out the ignoramus. Shove it.

[BlueJazz]

27. You Go...Girl!

:)