Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

The Un-risen Jesus

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Editorials & Other Articles Donate to DU
 
Daveparts still Donating Member (614 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:07 PM
Original message
The Un-risen Jesus
The Un-risen Jesus
By David Glenn Cox


Every civilization on Earth, every man and every woman, lives under the sentence of death. We respond to that by developing beliefs in an afterlife. Ah, yes, we’re all going to a better world when we leave this mortal coil. Who told you that? An medieval cult called the Perfects believed that this life was actually hell. So bring on the wine! Bring on the song! Bring on the virgins! Let’s party like it’s 1499!

Karl Marx said that “religion is the opiate of the masses” and that’s true enough. Yet there is something fundamental inside of us that needs that great mommy and daddy in the sky, something to connect with this world, with our relatives and with our society. Religion is indeed an opiate but the addiction is a naturally occurring phenomenon. This faith, any faith can then be easily exploited to control the population until religious leaders either control society or stand on the same tier as the leaders that do.

This has given us world religions so mean-spirited and vile that if they called themselves anything but a religion right thinking populations would denounce them immediately. Some of these religious practices and beliefs are so absurd as to be laughable. Some believe that after you die God will take your soul and make you a God on a new planet. Of course you have to be white and male and have lived your life in a way as to keep your sacred underwear clean.

Some believe it is sinful to celebrate a child’s birthday or to not wear your hair a certain way. One of the key components of many religions is racism. It is found among tribal cultures around the globe, the belief that you and yours alone are God’s favorites. Some believe that God created the whole universe in all its majesty and everything in it just for them. That the rest of humanity are just interlopers and hangers on, riff raff obscuring their view of the promised land. Kind of makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside, doesn’t it?

This is Passover week or Easter week depending on your persuasion. What originally drew the Jewish hierarchy’s attention to the blue-eyed Jewish radical rabbi from Galilee wasn’t the miracles or the followers upsetting Caesar, it was that this upstart was teaching that you, too, could be one of God’s chosen people.

Cults, then like now, were always springing up with some miracle man performing feats of magic for the crowd. The leadership viewed this in the same way we view people waiting for a UFO to take them away when the next comet arrives. Miracles are fine, preaching is good, but when you start telling the great unwashed mobs that they too can be God’s chosen people, then you’ve really stepped over the line. If that is so, that you too can become one of God’s chosen people, then maybe those already chosen aren’t so special anymore.

When Jesus spoke to the Samaritan woman at the well he was breaking rules all over the place. Samaritans were the enemies of the Jews and were considered unclean. Anyone who is not of your faith or belief is considered unclean on some emotional level. Reminds me of a joke I heard once about a little boy standing in front of a grocery store with a box of kittens. On the box it said “Free to a good home! Methodist kittens."

A man looking at the cats asked, “What makes them Methodist kittens?”

The little boy answered, “'Cause they ain’t got their eyes open!”

Sweet, lovable bigotry! When Jesus spoke to the woman at the well it was considered improper for a man to speak to a woman alone. That woman was not only considered unclean, she might belong to another man, like a chair or a goat might belong to another man. Finally, this was a woman two thousand years before Joan Jett; she did give a damn about her bad reputation. Imagine how tongues would wag if the leader of your religion was seen on the wrong side of the tracks talking to women with bad reputations on the street corner.

I like the radical Jesus, the revolutionary Jesus. Was he the Son of God? How do I know? I do know that while the dogma says he rose again, the revolutionary Jesus still lies buried in a tomb. His teaching didn’t then and doesn’t now fit the religious power structure mold. When Jesus overthrew the tables of the merchants and moneychangers in the temple, he was saying that mercantilism and money don’t mix with God. He would raise hell in a televangelist studio today. Remember now that this was mister prince of peace. Suddenly Marvin Milquetoast was going all postal, tearing up goods and disrupting the services of honest, innocent merchants.

When he was asked if citizens should pay taxes to Rome, Jesus first called them hypocrites and then asked them, "Whose picture is on that money? Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's and render unto God what is God’s." Remember that the next time someone starts talking about the separation between church and state. The wall of separation wasn’t built by the founding fathers but by the revolutionary Jesus.

When criticized for eating during fasting time he told the Zealots it is not what goes in your mouth that defiles you but what comes out of your mouth. There are a lot of ways to interpret that statement but it sounds to me like the prince of peace just told that guy to mind his own business. That your relationship to God is between you and God. If you’re hungry, eat; if you’re thirsty, drink. If you’ve got work to do then do it. Want to give your kid a birthday party? Then go right ahead. Want to shave off your side burns? Good for you!

Your relationship to God is not dependant on your rituals but on your actions. If you believe that your faith or religion makes you better than somebody else then you've got it all wrong. Jesus was asked by a rich man how he could follow him and was told to give all his money away and then sell all his possessions as well. Jesus was a Communist revolutionary that believed in redistribution of wealth. He was a celebrity and could have stayed in the homes of people with wealth but instead he stayed with the lowly and despised. Today he would be found at an Aids clinic or at a crack house or maybe sleeping on a couch in a run-down tenement in South Philly, or Los Angeles or Detroit.

His intention was not to establish a theocracy, for as he said, his kingdom was not of this world. His intention was to change this world in preparation for the next, and for that he was viewed as a dangerous man. He de-coupled faith and religion from race and nationalism and dogma, teaching that there are no God’s chosen people, only people who choose God.

He taught that the most sinful and the most dangerous people in society were the rich. That if you’re looking for hypocrites you need look no further than your nearest church, temple or mosque. Your connection with God has nothing to do with temples or cathedrals or bowing and scraping. He left behind only one commandment, to love one another. Sounds simple enough, but it sure does get lost sometimes.

“If Christ were here now there is one thing he would not be – a Christian." --Mark Twain

JESUS CHRIST
(Woody Guthrie)

Jesus Christ was a man who traveled through the land
Hard working man and brave
He said to the rich, "Give your goods to the poor."
So they laid Jesus Christ in his grave.

Jesus was a man, a carpenter by hand
His followers true and brave
One dirty little coward called Judas Iscariot
Has laid Jesus Christ in his grave.

He went to the sick, he went to the poor,
And he went to the hungry and the lame;
Said that the poor would one day win this world,
And so they laid Jesus Christ in his grave.

He went to the preacher, he went to the sheriff,
Told them all the same;
Sell all of your jewelry and give it to the Poor,
But they laid Jesus Christ in his grave.

When Jesus came to town, the working folks around,
Believed what he did say;
The bankers and the preachers they nailed him on a cross,
And they laid Jesus Christ in his grave.

Poor working people, they follered him around,
Sung and shouted gay;
Cops and the soldiers, they nailed him in the air,
And they nailed Jesus Christ in his grave.

Well the people held their breath when they heard about his death,
And everybody wondered why;
It was the landlord and the soldiers that he hired.
That nailed Jesus Christ in the sky.

When the love of the poor shall one day turn to hate.
When the patience of the workers gives away
"Would be better for you rich if you never had been born"
So they laid Jesus Christ in his grave.

This song was written in New York City
Of rich men, preachers and slaves
Yes, if Jesus was to preach like he preached in Galilee,
They would lay Jesus Christ in his grave.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
HopeHoops Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:10 PM
Response to Original message
1. Damn. God forgot the FUCKING YEAST!
Same thing happened with matzo.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
katandmoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:11 PM
Response to Original message
2. There is not one bit of real evidence that the bliblical Jesus even existed.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Golden Raisin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. Let alone had blue eyes.
Of course many of his most fervent U.S.A. followers are convinced he was blonde, blue-eyed and spoke English. They're a little confused on whether it's King James-esque or Nascar-esque.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NAO Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
14. There is a mountain of Biblical evidence that Jesus did NOT exist
Put most simply, the earliest New Testament books, the Pauline epistles, do not talk about a "guy" who walks around doing stuff and saying stuff. The are worshiping a spiritual Christ. They never mention any biographical details - other than the crucification and resurrection of Christ - no miracles, no sayings, no geographical / historical mention.

The church fathers that crafted Christianity deliberately placed the Gospels BEFORE the epistles so that when the epistles were read, people would associate Paul's heavenly "Christ Jesus" with the fictional character in the stories.

If all of the documents from the 1st and 2nd centuries - canonical, apocryphal, christian apologetics, and secular history are scrutinized carefully, it becomes clear that not only is there no evidence that Jesus ever existed, but there is compelling evidence that he could not have existed, or else just about every Christian Writing before Justin Martyr (150 CE) and these between Justin and Ireanaeus (180 CE) doesn't make sense. After Irenaeus, they "got" the story straight, and stuck with it. That was the point of Ireanaus' writings.

Further, if you examine the Gospels closely, every detail in story of the life of Jesus - every "pericope" - will be seen as a reworking of an Old Testament story thru the process known as midrash.

Extensive research, details, documentation at The Jesus Puzzle
http://www.jesuspuzzle.humanists.net/home.htm

There are a slew of websites and books which have gathered evidence and made the case that there was no historical founder to Christianity. I select Earl Doherty's "The Jesus Puzzle" because I think it has the most compelling, comprehensive argument.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
teknomanzer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #2
25. That was the fact that quarantined the religious virus...
I never found the historical Jesus but I did find many similar dieing and resurrecting gods from the western end of the Mediterranean to the Levant. I also discovered the great diversity of Christianity in ancient times. This lead me to do something really off the charts - I started looking into other religions! It was all so fascinating to me I had to dig deeper. I started reading Huston Smith, Joseph Campbell, Carl Jung among others. And then came "The God Gene." Everything clicked and I had a greater understanding of spirituality, mythology, ritual, and dogma. "God" I understood (and as many here may have already deduced) is the anthropomorphic projection of ourselves and our evolutionary archetypes onto the natural world.

A person's view of god is a damn good way to determine that person's world view. Is god angry, judgemental, vengeful, and unforgiving? If you know someone who thinks so you are likely dealing with a person who typifies those traits.

I believe that religion and dogma are sophisticated viral memes which make entire populations of people very easy to manipulate and control. Religion makes use of powerful evolutionary archetypes which are understood at the most basic level, down to the reptilian brain. Such archetypes are understood through emotion rather than reason. That is the essence of a religious "mystery." Thumb through Revelations and you will bombarded with the most powerful and frightening archetypes. Its a really bad acid trip at best. The problem with revelations is that without the context behind those images there can be very little undestanding of its meaning, but if you provide your OWN context you can use it to scare people -- behold the wrath of God! Do as we say and you will be the among the elect chosen by God to be spared. Powerful stuff.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-03-10 10:05 AM
Response to Reply #25
34. Bingo
I love Joseph Campbell for showing me that. And I love my religion all the more for it. I'm comfortable with the mythological aspects of my religion and everyone elses.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-03-10 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #2
33. And that is most definitely not the point here
These are mythical stories. It would frankly lower Jesus' status to be a real human.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
harkadog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-03-10 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #2
39. Roman historians wrote about him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
3. I continue to be amazed in a clinical sort of way how there are so many here at DU that hate religio
Edited on Fri Apr-02-10 12:16 PM by Gman
and can't stand people believing in something. That belief, in and of itself, hurts no one and hurts no more any more than the state of being gay hurts someone else. But some people just can't stand it and are moved to post a diatribe like this. Although at least there is an acknowledgement that Jesus walked the earth and what he stood for.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Proof?
All I see is a post doubting the historical Jesus because there is absolutely no record, not even a Roman record of his crucifixion and the Romans were known as meticulous record keepers.

If you are conflating doubt with hate, perhaps you need to examine the nature of your own faith.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #4
12. There's plenty of of that on other threads in the Religion forum
Why would you want me to examine the nature of my faith while you are making faux outrage accusations of hate when you have no faith yourself, or so it seems?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 07:18 PM
Response to Reply #12
29. That's a copout
Try again.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-03-10 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #29
37. No copout
Edited on Sat Apr-03-10 12:42 PM by Gman
I just refuse to play by your rules. And I don't need to go into something that has been/is discussed extensively in that forum.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #4
13. Curious: What's your understanding of what an "archetype" is and how such a thing
Edited on Fri Apr-02-10 01:20 PM by patrice
might be acquired?

on edit: typo
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
teknomanzer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #13
32. I think you meant to ask me the question ...
As I was the only one to really discuss archetypes.

Archetypes are acquired through evolution. They are part of what Jung called the collective unconscious. The collective unconscious is not some new age mystical super-conscious as some would like to believe. It is rather a collection of evolutionary knowledge -- it is all the stuff we are hardwired for. Jesus would be a good example of an archetype in the form of the dieing and resurrecting god. In this capacity he is the symbol for cycle of birth and death that we have a deep understanding of in our unconscious. And it is a really important and useful symbol as it helps some people to face mortality on a deep emotional/spiritual level.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-03-10 10:06 AM
Response to Reply #32
35. You studied well
I have nothing more to add.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #4
18. Another question if you don't mind: What is your opinion of the movie "V"?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. Unwatchable.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 07:11 PM
Response to Reply #21
27. Yeah, you're right about that. I gues I should have asked what you thought about
the story idea.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 07:19 PM
Response to Reply #27
30. I have no clue what the story line is
because I have never been able to watch more than a couple of minutes of it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #4
19. There's no particular reason to expect a Roman record of his crucifixion to survive
The only original documents from that long ago to survive have to have been in exceptional conditions - bone dry, safe from fire and so on. Any other document from that time would have had to be copied, and they didn't systematically copy everyday records. It takes far too much effort and materials.

The New Testament books are moderate evidence for his existence - mostly written within 50 years of his death, but by sources with an obvious bias. That they make miraculous claims does mark them as unreliable, but it doesn't mean they can be disregarded completely.

As I said in a discussion on DU a few years ago, people were making public claims, in several cities, about Jesus's existence and his crucifixion when people who had been adults in Jerusalem at the time were still living. It would be bold to completely make up a person and his life (and it would have been safer to place him a generation or two earlier if you wanted to avoid direct accusations of "I lived there; it never happened"). Though someone else pointed out that the chaos of the Jewish revolt around 70 AD might make it possible to get away with the claims.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
harkadog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-03-10 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #4
40. Record of every crucifixion? What utter nonsense.
Where are these meticulous records? Of you love to ignore that Roman historians wrote of his existence even though it was not in their interest to do so.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
onehandle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. Yes. Some DUers can be pretty freeperish and intolerant on this subject.
Sad, really.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #7
15. Some are as enslaved as that against which they rave, just by an opposite set of ASSUMPTIONS
Edited on Fri Apr-02-10 01:10 PM by patrice
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jotsy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #3
17. Belief is a beautiful armor, it makes for the heaviest sword. -John Mayer
Organized religion in most forms has been used as justification for centuries of blood shed, oppression and abuse trying to define and contain the will of the masses. I'd opt for simple faith over the baggage of that any day of the week, tyvm.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tutankhamun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #3
20. Hurts no one? Ever heard of the crusades? The inquisition?
Do you have any idea how many wars have been fought and are still being fought for religion?

There have been some unbelievably evil popes, as well. There was one who used to hae Jewish babies kidnapped and raised as catholics.

If not for the Mormons, gay marriage would be legal in California. Instead we have car bombs, Mosque bombings, murder of homosexuals.

The Christians (the ones whose belief harms nobody) got George Bush into office. Twice! If the belief in God is harmless, then so was Bush.

Osama Bin Laden is/was also (he may be dead) a man of deep faith. Faith is anything but harmless.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-03-10 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #20
36. You do not read well. I said:
"That belief, in and of itself, hurts no one and hurts no more any more than the state of being gay hurts someone else." With your logic, you would blame gays for the AIDS epidemic.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #3
22. As I remind the whiners o' faith:
Jesus said to you: rejoice when mocked or persecuted for my name's sake.
Why is it that you reject that teaching, and instead complain that you are not respected, even as the 'faith community' organizes against minorities they don't like, slander us and behave like political clubs when they pass laws that revoke our basic human rights.
Jesus did not say this, but it applies: y'all can dish it out, but you can not take it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hissyspit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #3
24. You're losing the argument right away.
...equating sexual identity, something that is not a choice and can't be changed, with religious belief, something that is ultimately a choice and can be changed within an individual.

In addition, the statement that a belief in and of it itself does not "hurt" is a great oversimplification. Belief precedes action. People's concepts of how reality is structured and how the world works affects how they think and ACT.

If you listened to some of the horrific justfication and rationalization and Scientology-like slop eminating from the Catholic church leadership today and can't figure out why some people are disgusted, you are not honestly looking at the issue.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
teknomanzer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #3
31. Do not be amazed...
I don't hate religion - it makes for fascinating study. I just happen to be very wary of the 'religious' and I make a clear distinction between spirituality and religion. As Joseph Campbell said, "Religion is a defence against the religious experience." I do not dismiss human spiritual capacity - I am a pure agnostic.

I will say this much, if Jesus did not exist he would have to be invented -- he is an ideal figure and a projection of our human capacity for being selfless. Truth is, as a non-believer I have more appreciation for Christianity than most christians. I at least understand that part of the Jesus mission was to move people beyond Leviticus and past religious legalism.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
katanalori Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
5. Ella Wheeler Wilcox (1850-1919) said.........
So many Gods, so many creeds,
So many roads that wind and wind;
When just the art of being kind,
Is all this sad world needs.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RKP5637 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. +1, n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 07:13 PM
Response to Reply #5
28. Yep. The answers aren't nearly as complex nor as abstract as $o many are making them.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
murray hill farm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
6. Excellent!
Thank you for posting this editorial.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RKP5637 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
8. Thanks for posting!!! n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Daveparts still Donating Member (614 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:36 PM
Response to Original message
9. No Evidense
But there is in the Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire a report of a man arrested by authorities because he was believed to be the great grand nephew of Jesus Christ. Rome would have had no interest in him if there hadn't been a Jesus. But try to read the piece again because even if there wasn't a Jesus there should have been. The real Jesus had no use for churches or Hypocrites. When he spoke in the temple he blasted the faithful as hypocrites comfortable in their fine chairs and fine clothes.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. Right. Was there never one or more persons who took a stand against religious & economic slavery?
Persons who could feel and be inspired by Truth the same way we are?

Some with higher degrees of "success", i.e. noteriety, in affecting others, and some less well known . . .

Could these kinds of persons not have been arrested and tortured or killed for getting folks all riled up about the way things are (whether they actually intended to overthrow the Church-State or not)?

Some of us, including me, may have a problem with what has been done to The Bible and that there EMPTY (= indeterminant!!!) tomb, but just because there's a lot of people running around saying, in effect, 2 + 2 = 10, that doesn't make 2 + 2 = 4 wrong.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 03:12 PM
Response to Original message
23. religion aside, this is some good stuff
Turning some phrases, a very enjoyable read. And I also agree.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Uncle Joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 06:02 PM
Response to Original message
26. Kicked and recommended.
Thanks for the thread, Daveparts.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cdsilv Donating Member (883 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-03-10 08:15 PM
Response to Reply #26
38. As the shepherd (in Firefly) said - it is not what you believe, but that you believe -
Edited on Sat Apr-03-10 08:16 PM by cdsilv
in something other than yourself.

I am not the center of the universe. Nor are you.

You are not the center of the universe. Nor am I.

'We' exist somewhere between the two previous statements.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Wed May 01st 2024, 12:18 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Editorials & Other Articles Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC