Fitzgerald Threw a Softball

[Paranoid Pessimist]

Much as I dislike living up to my posting handle, I have been afraid for a long time that the air of celebration about the Fitzgerald indictments is, at best, premature. All the progressive blogosphere jumping up and down, saying, "It's starting! The Bush gang is on its way out now!" leads me to fear that, should it not lead to any major changes, the progressives will react with disappointment and fall back into apathy.

As always, I hope I'm wrong, but this article certainly gives one pause:

http://www.commondreams.org/views05/1029-26.htm

[skids]

1. You know, I think I figured out the cause of apathy.

...the relentless grinding buzzkill caused by pessimists.

[Paranoid Pessimist]

10. Relentless Grinding Buzzkill -- I like that.

The last thing I posted caused people to call me a "tinfoil hat wearing crackpot". Could be. I always hope I'm wrong and the optimists are right: pessimists would rather be relieved than disappointed. And, for the record, my hat is made of aluminum foil, and the apathy I perceive preceded my starting to post on this forum.

[skids]

13. Relax, you're not a pessimist.

Have a haiku:

A true pessimist
believes himself engaging
in optimism.

[melody]

15. I think they meant the poster you linked to, not you

At least that's whom I was addressing.

[LiberalFighter]

11. It is better to exercise caution...

then to be made a fool.

Too many times we have all gotten our hopes up to later be shot down.

[melody]

16. No one can make me a fool

Without my consent.

Caution is not the problem - discouragement and reticence is the problem. You need a lot of energy to get past inertia. I think we can use all the optimism we can get.

[Demeter]

2. Think of It as a Long Slow Screw on the Beach

or whatever those deceptively strong cocktails are called.

[still_one]

3. sorry but this is not over

for one thing the investigation is continuing

Most importantly though, it is impacting this administration, and the repukes in general

I am in California, and in a state where Davis got recalled, the govenor has lost considerable support. In fact the election coming up with his propositions looks like it is going down to defeat

From what I have seen in other states, the repukes are in big troubel

As dumb as people are, the truth is slowly getting out, that a war was started based on a lie

We will see what happens in the course of time, but this should embolden the cowardly democrats in congress to finally take a stand

[melody]

12. Very true about Arnie

Had an ex-Republican friend today ask me "which ones are Arnie supporting" so she knew which to vote against.

[Paranoid Pessimist]

17. Arnie's proposals are likely to go down (the polls have them close

primarily because SEIU and the other public employee unions worked busted their begonias and spent a ton of money saturating the air with very effective commercials. I am a California-living public employee and we had a meeting with them just last Wednesday where they say the polls have all the propositions close.

I'm sure Melody (see above) is smart and aware enough to not be made a fool of without her consent, but my experience tells me that most average people can easily be made fools of non-consensually. It happens every day; it's called "advertising." You have to really work at it to filter out all the bullshit that comes our way every day -- stuff like "helps reduce the appearance of wrinkles" whatever that means.

The pro-Arnie commercials are starting to show up now, vilifying "politicians" and these are sure to reach the sensibilities of the susceptible. They're quite well done too.

I hope all this stuff, that's finally making into mainstream media, will cause a lot more people to react like the examples cited in this thread. I'd love to see the Bush gang in cuff being perp walked.

[melody]

18. The worse thing Arnie has against him isn't commercials

It's individual parents who've seen their young children forced to walk home for miles in hot and cold weather. It's also people like you. He has lots and lots of people who REALLY hate him... rather like the Shrub himself.

The only way this election is going his way is if he steals it.

[Paranoid Pessimist]

19. People like me who have worked with the unions against these measures?

I don't think you have to REALLY hate him to work against what he's doing. I don't REALLY hate him. I think he's a joke, unfortunately one many people don't get.

I hope you're right about the election, but having it stolen by Republican chicanery is always a real possibility. They think they're entitled to be in power and will do whatever it takes to remain there, and feel virtuous doing so.

[melody]

22. I hate him - I hate Bush, too

I think hate can be a valuable emotion. It empowers us against bullies, and that's what these guys are. I've learned that the hard way in business.

It's not a matter of what I think will happen -- I have to be optimistic. The alternative, for me, is despair and that's the kind of thing that destroys people. If it's stolen from us again, I think we'll see an upsurge of anger this state has never, ever seen before.

[Paranoid Pessimist]

26. And I encourage you to keep your hate going

if that's what motivates you. I can't do either hate or optimism, but if you can, go for it. We each go in the right direction our own way. I hate the fact that so many people still think Bush and Arnie are heroic wonderful fellas, but as television icons I find them funny in a sick sort of way.

[still_one]

20. I think arnie has pissed people off big time in california

his popularity is sinking, and after what happened in texas with redistricting/delay, etc. people are getting wise

The important thing is turnout, and if they don't turnout, we lose

[I Have A Dream]

21. I bet that felt wonderful!

:)

[OldLeftieLawyer]

4. He's blowing hot air

This guy has his head in that same sand that was thrown in the metaphorical umpire's eyes. If he worked for 38 years in the same office where Fitzgerald now presides - at the age of 44 - I'd say there's some serious sour grapes at work in the motivation behind his reasoning.

In fact, things are never as complicated as the writer makes them out to be, and I'm amused by his assumptions that he knows things Fitzgerald isn't telling anyone, even though he's not part of the special prosecutor's team.

The simple truth is that we know nothing beyond what happened yesterday - that Libby got caught lying and was indicted - and that changes nothing. We're still spectators, watching a show that may or may not continue.

Keep in mind the power of the Presidential pardon.

But, this article? As another veteran lawyer, I'd say, "Eh."

[corbett]

5. If You're Right, I'll Have To Rely On GAO Report Giving Ohio Back To Kerry

http://www.freepress.org/departments/display/19/2005/1529

http://www.wakeupwalmart.com/feature/delay

[jody]

6. History may prove Drobny is correct. n/t

[movonne]

7. Well it might very well not go anywhere, but this is a hugh drip in the

endless dripping...with the Delay case, the Noe scandal, the Abramoff(sp? etc...

[Wilms]

8. People who say

the progressives will react with disappointment and fall back into apathy are paranoid pessimists.

[Joe Chi Minh]

9. Former Federal Prosecutor, Prosecutor Elizabeth de la Vega's

latest brief article, quoted on one of these threads, will surely cheer you up.

It's likely to be a looooong drawn out process, with maybe tens, possibly scores of indictments of lesser mortals, perchance leading up to the arraignment of the biggest fish.

[melody]

14. Typical psy ops moodkill liberal groundswell elixir

Best to be ignored.

The Grand Old Psychopaths better get real to the knowledge this is NOT solely a liberal movement against them. My moderate Republican friend Terri just changed parties and is calling Shrub (for whom she voted) "that murdering bastard".

The old dirty tricks are dead and gone.

[AndyTiedye]

23. It's Not Apathy, It's Despair. Fitzgerald is Our Only Hope

WE HAVEN'T BEEN APATHETIC, AND WE'RE NOT APATHETIC NOW!

We have been protesting, organizing, raising money, more than ever before.

We raised more money for Kerry last year than any candidate had ever raised before...
...except for Bush** of course, with his bottomless war chest fueled
by loot and pillage,
(not to mention billions worth of free promotion by the ever-fawning media).

Even with all of that, we could have beaten them in fair elections.
But the elections are no longer fair.

It isn't apathy, it's despair.

If Fitzgerald cannot bring them down then the rule of law is ended.
I have not given up on Fitzgerald yet.

[Paranoid Pessimist]

27. I hope he's not our ONLY hope.

That's a lot to pin on one guy. I haven't given up on him either, but if he should falter there's still Cindy Sheehan.

[AndyTiedye]

28. It isn't all on Fitzgerald

Who persuaded Ashcroft (of all people) to step aside and allow a real investigation with a real investigator?
It was a bunch of extremely angry CIA people.
Ashcroft resigned shortly after that too. Seemed to think it would be better for his heath.
Porter Goss was installed to conduct a purge (with extreme predjudice?)
but he may be a bit out of his league.

[peacetalksforall]

24. My metaphor involves those citizens who have built a wall around

themselves in their houses. This Libby affair and the reruns of the headlines and the press conference have caused some of these people to raise their window blinds to find people waving at them to come out and join the parade.

Yesterday, there was a thread where someone quoted a Congressperson as saying that they have done things out of fear. If they continue to do things out of fear (of the right wing), then they are hopeless. People are feeling more free. They didn't know how far it was all going to go with rights rescinded and neighbors spying on each other and people being snatched off the street, imprisoned, with no lawyer and family contact - in other words - blatant loss of rights - real and projected..

Where are they going to get that power. Truly, they only have 1/4 to 1/3 of the people with them. They can bring in Chinese, African, Israeli, or Paraguayan soldiers to do it.

IT'S UP TO US. We must lead ourselves and prompt the right people to use the law to get a grip on our country.

The biggest thing we have to fear are radical born-agains in police, civic, and justice positions. I used to include the media. But, they have acted so blatantly irresponsible and ridiculous that enough people see what they are doing and we have too many alternatives.

IT'S UP TO US. Educate. If your cousin talks about this all being only an outing of a CIA employee - be sure to tell them about:

. PNAC and (Team 2)
. phoney war
. forgeries by right wing operatives connected to PNAC - directly related to the phony war.
. signatories of PNAC
. Brewster-Jennings - investigating the trafficking of nuclear and wmd parts and knowledge - Cheney and Rumsfeld would not want them investigating their trafficking and motives.
. Cheney and Rumsfeld trafficking with the very countries that George claims we are fighting
. grand size holes in the 9-11 story
. billions on billions of dollars missing from the DOD and the Iraq war budgets.
. no-bid contracts going to Halliburton and related companies.
. Rumsfeld owning a company related to an Avian flue chemical?

Have a list of links they can check out.

IT'S UP TO US.

Cheney and Rumsfeld love apathy as long as it isn't associated with military recruiting.

[Boo Boo]

25. He might be right.

If Fitz really is stymied, without alternate avenues, and is relying on Libby to "flip" in order to proceed any further with the original investigation, then I kinda think he might be done. I don't think Libby will crack.

Reading the indictment, though, it sure seems like there's an awful lot there. It's a little hard to believe that Fitz has really run completely aground on Libby island. If Libby goes to trial, it is pretty obvious that guys like Cheney will be called to testify---heck, maybe even Bush will get called. Would Bush preemptively pardon Libby to prevent that from happening?

:popcorn:

[peacebird]

29. cheney & bush will cite executive priv. and refuse to testify.

and i believe bush has already promised libby a full pardon.

[longship]

30. I am celebrating tonight, also.

I have two fingers of scotch in a glass. (Single malt.... okay, cheap single malt!) It tastes good. But not as good as the taste of the substantially positive press about today's brilliant move by Reid and Durbin.

And when the Dems do other things that are good, or when something else happens to hold these fascists in the WH accountable, I will celebrate again. I'm going to keep celebrating until these asshats in the WH are ridden out of town covered with tar and feathers.

When Congress back in responsible hands a year from now, I'm going to rent a big hall and invite all my DU friends to join me in a huge celebration. That will pale in comparison to the celebration that will happen when the Congress holds these guys ultimately responsible for our current debacle. And that celebration will in turn be just a whisper compared to the one in Nov 2008.

But then, I'm one of those glass half full kind of guys. Well, at any rate, two fingers full.
Cheers!
:toast: