Nothing OPEC can do to bring oil down ($50.17 now!!!)

[gp]

Nothing OPEC can do to bring oil down - Purnomo

JAKARTA, Sept 28 (Reuters) - OPEC is powerless to stop the rise in oil prices at the moment although it has about 1.5 million barrels per day (bpd) of spare capacity to add to supplies, president Purnomo Yusgiantoro said on Tuesday. As U.S. crude rose to a record $50.17 a barrel on Tuesday, Purnomo said he had not yet had any contact with OPEC's 10 other members.

"At the moment there's nothing we can do. OPEC has spare capacity, however, whatever we do there is no sensitivity in the market," Purnomo, who is also Indonesian oil minister, told Reuters.

http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/ns/news/story.jsp?id=2004092723120002500402&dt=20040927231200&w=RTR&coview=

[RamboLiberal]

1. Kerry needs to bring up the failed * energy policy

I'd love to see gas prices go high for a few weeks if it helps oust *.

[napi21]

3. You know what shrubs response to that would be, don't ya?

If the Dems would have passed my energy policy, we wouldn't have a problem now.

That's been the Pub talking point for over a year now.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

8. Whoa! Without a majority in either house of Congress, how could...

...the Democrats have passed anything? Evidently, some Republicans also believed FratBoy's energy bill to pretty badly flawed.

So much for that talking point.

[schultzee]

4. If it would oust that pig, I would pay 3.00 or more and eat beans

Freedom is priceless.

[rooboy]

6. I think if more people joined you and ate beans for the next 4 years...

many of our energy problems will be solved. :-)

[SammyWinstonJack]

28. If bush* steals his way back in office

Some, perhaps a lot of people will be greatful to have beans to eat. How many more jobs will bush* get rid of over his next four year occupation of this Country? How many more people will he throw out of work? I honestly believe that one can not be a good caring unselfish person and vote for bush*.

[Wednesdays]

29. "If more people joined you and ate beans for the next 4 years..."

"many of our energy problems will be solved." :-)

Yeah, but that would aggravate global warming. :evilgrin:

[tabasco]

27. Beans are a very healthy food.

Even wealthy people are wise to eat beans. :)

[Tight_rope]

40. I'm with you....It can go to $5.00 for all I care!...Just get Bush* out!

[GaryL]

2. Call your friendly Congress critter...

and ask them what the CPI and PPI are. They can't answer because the fascist family won't print them. How's that for honesty in government?

[ejcastellanos]

25. CPI and PPI

What are those? Consumer Price Index and....?

[Zynx]

5. Yeah, OPEC is really crying.

Greedy SOB's.

[kestrel91316]

7. OPEC is not the one with the "power to bring the price down"..............

WE ARE!!!!!!!!!!! We, us, you know............THE PEOPLE.........have it entirely within our power to bring the price of oil down. You see, in the equation there are two components: supply and demand. OPEC is doing all it can to supply. Now it is up to us to do all we can about DEMAND. As in, quit wasting gas like there is no tomorrow. Get off your lazy a---es and walk someplace, bike someplace, get a car that gets better mileage, ride the bus, DO SOMETHING. Accept personal responsibility. Change you life permanently for the better. Get creative. You are either part of the problem or part of the solution. Wake up, every last one of you.


(boy, that felt good)

[Carolab]

10. Good point

Consumption in this country is OUTRAGEOUS. We are all a bunch of pigs. People who CONSUME too much, of everything.

[demoman123]

13. All the US has to do is tell Kuwait to turn on the faucet.

Kuwait has served this purpose for years. For some reason the US government/oil cartel has not given the order yet.

Consumer boycotts are notoriously hard to organize. Grapes were an exception, long ago.

[llmart]

16. Thanks for that rant.

People here at DU need to admit that they are part of the problem. Whenever I mention practicing voluntary simplicity or boycotting something, there's a lot of rationalization that shows up in responses. Take one small step each week and you'll actually find out that you can do without a lot of "stuff." Also, there are other ways to stop wasting oil. We usually focus on driving less or more fuel efficient vehicles, but just using plastics enables the oil industry also. Start reading more. Sierra Club magazine, E magazine, Utne Reader, log on to newdream.org. Check out simple living websites. You don't have to do everything at once, but just do one thing this week and you'll see you can live just fine.

[jmcgowanjm]

22. Sitting on your ass might be a good thing

Try not doing anything once a "something"

Emulate your dog.

Use manual tools.

Don't eat anything that comes in a package.

Never travel by air.

Don't buy another new car.

Allow beef producing cattle to become extinct.

Learn to garden.

[uncle ray]

32. where does vegetarianism equate living simple?

i'm not trying to belittle what meat means to you, but what does it have to do with living simpler? i'll take a thick juicy cut of meat over any pile of processed shit you get at a fast food joint. if "beef producing cattle" became instinct, ALL cattle would be instinct.

[leesa]

35. It costs an enormous amount of energy and water to produce meat

Producing plant products costs much, much less in terms of oil and water. It will be inevitable that Americans will be eating much less meat in the future. You might want to practice doing without.

[kestrel91316]

36. Factory farming is extremely wasteful......................

uses huge amounts of energy!! I am anything but a vegetarian, but I rarely eat factory-raised beef, only occasionally chicken. If I wnt red meat, it's venison hunted humanely (killed with single shot) by my DB, or fish caught by him. I hope to raise my own chickens before I get old and die. Meat takes a lot of water and grain (= more water) to raise, and huge amounts of energy to process. Waste not, want not.

[jmcgowanjm]

45. I eat chicken and fish uncle ray

and, yes, generalizations can get tricky. I'm
referring to milk producers over beef.
But even milk production is hard
on the environment.

"All of these numbers suggest that the experiment on much
of the northern Plains with European agricultural settlement
may soon be ending," said Myron Gutmann, a University of
Texas professor who is an authority on Plains population
trends.

At the turn of the century, only a few hundred buffalo were left
in the West. Now there are 300,000, and more than 30 tribes
in the northern Plains are controlling large herds on land
where bison, unlike cattle, need no help to flourish. A third of
the nation's 31 accredited Indian colleges offer
bison management.

http://www.lightparty.com/Misc/IndiansBisons.html

[NickB79]

41. I don't think you have to go so far as drive livestock to extinction

If we are truly concerned with maintaining both the environment AND maximizing food production from this country, we have to make use of every possible food resource we have. This includes meat. Yes, much of the meat we eat today is produced very wastefully, because it is produced by factory farms. This does not mean that meat cannot be produced in an environmental and resource-conservative manner, though. For example, there are massive amounts of land in the central and western portions of the US where the soil is too poor and the rainfall too low to produce large grain crops. Here, grazing of livestock offers the best bet for food production. Cattle could be used, but personally I'd rather see bison, since they are a native species that the native plants and wildlife evolved to co-exist with. They also have the benefit of being much hardier than cattle to the elements of the Great Plains. This would actually improve the wildlife habitat, since many plants required the constant migrations of bison herds to break up the soil, deposit fertilizer and germinate/transport seeds. Similarly, many species of small animals and birds depend on these plants and the accompanying insects for a food source. Harvest the herds for meat on a regular basis to maintain populations.

Otherwise, switch to more food-efficient species of livestock, such as goats, chickens, turkeys and even rabbits. All produce much more meat per lb of food than cattle, and require less space and water to support.

[jmcgowanjm]

44. Uncle Ray, Leesa, Kestral91316 & NickB79 covered the angles

12,000 gallons of water to produce a pound beef, 60 gallons
to produce a pound wheat. Enough grain is fed to
American livestock annually to feed approximately 800
million people a basic vegetarian diet. It takes between
sixteen and twenty units of protein input to yield one unit
of protein output in the formof beef; the ratio of caloric input
to output in producing beef
for human consumption is placed at ten to one.

http://www.tikkun.org/magazine/index.cfm/action/tikkun/mode/printer_friendly/issue/tik0011/article/001113c.html

March 1, 2001 -- To date, probably the most reliable
and
widely-accepted water estimate to produce a pound of beef
is
the figure of 2,500 gallons per pound. Newsweek once put
it
another way: "the water that goes into a 1,000 pound
steer

grain/flesh ratio
beef 13/1
pork 7/1
chicken 3/1
catfish 1/1
would float a destroyer."

[uncle ray]

47. i see plenty of arguements to keep eating meat, but to do it smarter.

the resources used to raise cattle don't get "used up" water is a multi use commodity, as long as it doesn't get ruined with herbicides/pesticides etc. i say if you're gonna use animal products, use them all to their maximum, including the meat, leather, etc. the bones and blood are full of nutrients to be put back into the soil. i'm big time into cars, but i will give up oil before i give up meat products. i just don't see meat as the first step. oil consumption, chemicals in daily use, etc. are far more important than eating meat. as humans, we've always ate meat, but we haven't always pillaged mother nature for all we can.

[jmcgowanjm]

48. Go ahead, my best bud is a premier limousine, turkey grower

Maxim-the best way to alter
the landscape is to put cattle, sheep, pigs,
goats on it.

The subsidies for cattle are tremendous
and subsidies will subside (pun intended)
w/ peak oil.

It's just impossible for any more of
the world's pop to eat meat.

Living off the top of the food chain is living
at the apex of the pyramid. But I agree, the hunter/gatherer
system beats agriculture.

And:
"The transport of virtual water is huge. Australians
were astonished to find that although their country is short
of water, they're net exporters of water in the form of
meat."

Sacrifice is going to come somewhere from US.
Industrial economies.

[wetbandit2003]

24. Well...

Some of us have to drive 30 miles to work every day and then drive to school.
I Also have a car that gets ~32 MPG in town.

[aquart]

9. They're stealing with both hands because they expect Bush to lose.

Hope it's a warm winter, folks.

[trogdor]

30. Econ. 101

At $50/bbl., it's a no-brainer that Saudi Arabia would be pumping at full-tilt. You would be, too. So would I.

Now, our Harvard MBA pResident, he'll probably buy all he can get his hands on - with OUR MONEY - for the Strategic Oil Reserve. What's the opposite of smart?

[Dogmudgeon]

11. Prince Bandar seems to have failed

If I were the Prince, I'd avoid small aircraft for a while.

--bkl

[demoman123]

14. Prince Bandar gave up a promising career as a lounge singer...

just to represent his country and serve the cause of peace and justice in the world. He and his principle wife would have been the next Steve Lawrence and Edie Gorme.

Shame on you for making fun of him.

[The_Casual_Observer]

12. Noticed that this didn't even make the news tonight

This along with the <10,000 were kept real quiet. How much longer are they going to suppress the pump prices? Will they really hold out until after the "election"?

[saigon68]

15. How can anyone who buys gas not see the looting

By the Corporations???

Sheep all !!!!!

[durablend]

17. Corporate: loot and pillage now...

Before the country goes broke...

[Flammable Materials]

18. Heard on BBC News this morning that Saudis boosting 2M bls per day.

Will that make a difference, though?

[saigon68]

21. It was just on NBC a few minutes ago

The king and Bandar are out to save the Chimp's bacon. The talking heads say oil will head down rapidly. Once this supply hits the market in 2 weeks.

[hatrack]

23. Yeah, and the al Saud have been saying the same thing for months now

Boosting production, boosting production, boosting production. Funny, it doesn't seem to have done very much, or even to have shown up in production totals.

[NickB79]

43. They're pumping high-sulfur oil (basically crap-oil), so no

What they're boosting production of is the heavy, high-sulfur oil that is generally ignored unless you can't get any of the light sweet crude that US refineries need to process for gasoline. What they're pumping isn't what the global economy is demanding right now, so it probably won't have much of an impact on the overall price per barrel of oil.

[Raster]

19. Notice the price of gasoline though. The saudis are eating loads of...

....sand to keep gasoline under $2.00 for the chimpster.

[benburch]

20. I am SO glad that I have a Prius Hybrid.

I get 44+ miles per gallon (depends on kind of driving) and it is an SULEV.

[KDLarsen]

26. 44+ mpg sounds very good

My dads car goes something like 30-35 mpg and it's a relatively old car (a 1994 Ford Escort). My moms car goes arond the 50 mpg but it's also a brand new car.

[kestrel91316]

37. Benburch gets a GOLD STAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Kitsune]

42. Prius <3 <3

I'm getting about 50 mpg with mine. I love my Prius. :D

[wishlist]

31. CNBC experts say Saudi increase is not 'sweet crude', won't help much

The financial channel, CNBC just had a discussion of the promised Saudi increased oil production. Their conclusion was that the increased output is not light sweet crude that U.S. refineries need, but it is undesirable high sulfur poorer quality oil that will not help the situation very much. Financial experts think $50/barrel is here to stay due to uncurtailed high global demand and U.S. failure to conserve.

[hatrack]

33. A lot of it is not only high-sulfur, but heavy oil as well

Not what the market really thirsts for, given higher energy demands for refining and processing.

[bobthedrummer]

34. This is manipulation of the worst sort-certainly not a "free market" or

so called "market conditions".
:mad::argh::puke::grr:

[lefthandedskyhook]

38. Ivan was a karmic democrat /nt

[Tight_rope]

39. There only so much ass kiss that OPEC can do....They need to make money!

[PROGRESSIVE1]

46. If oil prices suddenly rise in October and it hurts Bush, then GOOD!!!

:nopity: