Hired Guns with War Crimes Past

[seemslikeadream]

By Louis Nevaer, Pacific News Service
May 4, 2004

When a suicide bomber parked a van disguised as an ambulance in front of the Shaheen Hotel in the Karadah neighborhood of Baghdad on Jan. 28 and blew himself up, he killed four people and wounded scores of others.


He also blew the lid off a dirty little secret of the Coalition Provisional Authority: due to its "outsourcing" of privatized security services, the CPA has put terrorists, mercenaries and war criminals on the payrolls of companies contracted by the Pentagon.


After the Shaheen Hotel blast, departmental spokesman Ronnie Mamoepa at South Africa's Foreign Ministry confirmed that one of the Westerners killed was South African Frans Strydom. Four of the wounded were also South African nationals, including Deon Gouws, who sustained serious injuries.


News that Strydom and Gouws were in Iraq sent shockwaves throughout South Africa: In front of the South African Truth and Reconciliation Commission, both men were granted amnesty after confessing to killing blacks and terrorizing anti-apartheid activists, acts that can only be called crimes against humanity.


In Iraq, Strydom and Gouws were employed by Erinys International, a security firm based in the United Kingdom. Erinys Iraq, the subsidiary of Erinys International, was awarded a two-year, $80 million contract in August 2003 to protect 140 Iraqi oil installations. Erinys has been awarded subcontracts to protect American construction contractors, including San Francisco-based Bechtel Corp. and Halliburton's subsidiary Kellogg, Brown and Root

more
http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=18588

[seemslikeadream]

1. The US Has Lost the Battle of the Photographs

Published on Monday, May 3, 2004 by TomDispatch.com
The US Has Lost the Battle of the Photographs
by Juan Cole

The war of guns is only part of any great military enterprise. It is always supplemented by a war of words and, in the modern world, a war of images. The Bush administration, despite the savvy of its spinmeisters and Hollywood-trained publicists, has lost the war of images abroad. Although it has had more success in managing war images at home, cracks have increasingly opened up on the domestic front as well.

The graphic photos of abused Iraqi prisoners released on CBS's 60 Minutes II news show on April 28 have been reproduced as stills and transmitted all over the internet, showing up, as well, on Arab satellite television and in the Arabic press. The footage shows US military personnel forcing nude Iraqi prisoners to simulate sex acts. In others they are made to form a human pyramid. One photo now circulating shows a man badly beaten. Another shows a corpse. Sexual humiliation may be the least of the indignities inflicted on some of the prisoners.

Several of the scenes show an American woman in uniform, gesturing lewdly and prancing before the hooded, nude Iraqi prisoners. One wonders if she is playing out her insecurities as a woman in the U.S. Army, looked down on by some of her male colleagues, by lording it over Iraqi prisoners of war. Was she compensating by playing dominatrix to Muslim men she imagined to be the ultimate male chauvinists? Although the main purpose of the abuse was to soften up the prisoners for interrogation, the precise forms of humiliation appear to have been shaped by the insecurities and prejudices of the reservists, who had been given no training in the Geneva Conventions.

The reaction to the photographs in the Arab world was, predictably, fury and humiliation. Samia Nakhoul of Reuters reported that Abdel-Bari Atwan, editor of the pan-Arabist London newspaper, al-Quds al-Arabi, said, "The liberators are worse than the dictators. This is the straw that broke the camel's back for America . . . That really, really is the worst atrocity. It affects the honour and pride of Muslim people. It is better to kill them than sexually abuse them." She also reported the sentiments of Daud al-Shiryan of Saudi Arabia: "This will increase the hatred of America, not just in Iraq but abroad. Even those who sympathised with the Americans before will stop. It is not just a picture of torture, it is degrading. It touches on morals and religion . . . Abu Ghraib prison was used for torture in Saddam's time. People will ask now what's the difference between Saddam and Bush. Nothing!"

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0503-04.htm

[Tellurian]

20. Excellent articles. Thanks for posting them, seemslikeadream.. nt

[seemslikeadream]

2. When we're the evildoers in Iraq

When we're the evildoers in Iraq
With immoral U.S. leadership, is it so shocking to find torturers in the ranks?


President Bush is again refusing to take responsibility for any of the horrors happening on his watch. This time it is the abuse of Iraqi prisoners carried out by low-ranking military police working under the direct guidance of military intelligence officers and shadowy civilian mercenaries. Our president launched this war with the promise to the Iraqi people of "no more torture chambers and rape rooms. The tyrant will soon be gone." What went wrong?
The president has called the now-exposed pattern of violence an isolated crime performed by "a few people." Yet the Pentagon's own investigation of the incident shows that not only was the entire Abu Ghraib prison out of control, it was the MPs' immediate military superiors who "directly or indirectly" authorized "sadistic, blatant and wanton criminal abuses" of the prisoners as a way to break them in advance of formal interrogations.

"Military intelligence interrogators and other U.S. government agency interrogators actively requested that MP guards set physical and mental conditions for favorable interrogation of witnesses," says the report. The report, completed in March and kept secret until it was revealed on the New Yorker website Friday, also stated that a civilian contractor employed by a Virginia company called CACI "clearly knew his instructions" to the MPs called for physical abuse.

Furthermore, in a statement released Friday, Amnesty International reported that in its extensive investigations into human rights in post-invasion Iraq, it "has received frequent reports of torture or other ill treatment by coalition forces during the past year," including during interrogations, and that "virtually none of the allegations of torture or ill treatment has been adequately investigated by the authorities."

http://www.workingforchange.com/article.cfm?ItemID=16891

[brokensymmetry]

3. But you know....

I'm not seeing or hearing much outrage in the media or among the general population. It seems almost like a non-story here in the U.S.

Odd, isn't it? Or maybe I just haven't seen it??

[Just Me]

8. It takes a little time to overcome the shock,...

,...but, there is absolutely no doubt whatsoever in mind that it is sinking in.

[seemslikeadream]

10. American public will not like to be compared to this

[SEpatriot]

4. Nothing surprises me in a government that hires Eliot Abrams

Don't think that the old Iran-Contra rogue CIA guys aren't full up on what's going on in Iraq.

Abrams, who headed the Latin American bureau for the State Department, lied not only to Congress but to the whole nation about the government’s role in the Hasenfus affair (flights delivering weapons to the Contras). Abrams appeared before the House Subcommittee on Western Hemisphere Affairs and lied that that “the flight in which Mr. Hasenfus took part was a private initiative. It was not organized, directed, or financed by the U.S. Government.” Each time, he lied. Oliver North’s ( now our Fox News correspondent) office had hired the men and Abrams knew it.

When, in 1982, two reporters from competing news organizations — the New York times and the Washington Post — discovered evidence of a horrific massacre of women and children by U.S.-backed military forces in El Salvador, Abrams sought to discredit the reports and cast suspicions, instead, on the reporters, whom he implied, were tools of communist guerrillas.


Oh, there's more ...but my point is that the Bushies have these people in high levels of government. The shadow community is strong in Iraq.

[seemslikeadream]

6. Bush's Terrorist: John Negroponte Sent to Iraq

Bush's Terrorist: John Negroponte Sent to Iraq

Iraqi ambassador pick grilled on hand-over

By Steven Weisman
The New York Times

WASHINGTON -- President Bush's nominee for ambassador to Iraq on Tuesday defended the limits that would be placed on Iraqi self-rule, particularly those on control over security forces, asserting that after June 30 Iraqis will have "a lot more sovereignty than they have right now."
Facing skeptical questions about the new constraints emerging in the long-planned transfer of power before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, the nominee, John Negroponte, said he saw his major challenge as trying to avert conflicts if the new Iraqi government objected to U.S. military actions. "These are the kinds of questions that I think our diplomacy is going to have to deal with," said Negroponte, who is now ambassador to the United Nations.
The toughest questions came from Democrats, but all the senators said they would support Negroponte's confirmation, which the committee could approve on Thursday. Senate aides said Negroponte could be confirmed by the full Senate as early as next week.
Negroponte said that any decisions on whether to attack rebel strongholds, as the United States is threatening now in Fallujah and Najaf, would require "great political sensitivity" even though American s will nominally be in charge of such decisions.

http://www.sltrib.com/2004/Apr/04282004/nation_w/161439.asp





Bush's Terrorist: John Negroponte Sent to Iraq


Dems Ignore Negroponte's Death Squad Past, Look to Confirm Iraq Appointmen


As Negroponte, responded to Hagel, he was interrupted by an activist, Andres Conteris of Non-violence International.

Andres Conteris, is program director for Latin America and the Caribbean for the human rights group Non-violence International. He disrupted yesterday's Senate Foreign Relations Committee hearing on John Negroponte's appointment as US ambassador to Iraq.

As ambassador to Honduras, Negroponte played a key role in coordinating US covert aid to the Contra death squads in Nicaragua and shoring up a CIA-backed death squad in Honduras. During his term as ambassador there, diplomats alleged that the embassy's annual human rights reports made Honduras sound more like Norway than Argentina. In a 1995 series, the Baltimore Sun detailed the activities of a secret CIA-trained Honduran army unit, Battalion 3-16, that used "shock and suffocation devices in interrogations. Prisoners often were kept naked and, when no longer useful, killed and buried in unmarked graves." In 1994, Honduras's National Commission for the Protection of Human Rights reported that it was officially admitted that 179 civilians were still missing.

A former official who served under Negroponte says he was ordered to remove all mention of torture and executions from the draft of his 1982 report on the human rights situation in Honduras. During Negroponte's tenure, US military aid to Honduras skyrocketed from $3.9 million to over $77 million. Much of this went to ensure the Honduran army's loyalty in the battle against popular movements throughout Central America.

http://www.pacifica.org/programs/dn/040428.html

Bush's Terrorist: John Negroponte Sent to Iraq




Negroponte's "embassy" in Baghdad will, according to press reports, constitute the largest US "embassy staff" in the world with some 3000 employees, including up to 1,000 Americans.


Yet according to a four-part series in the Baltimore Sun in 1995, in 1982 alone the Honduran press ran 318 stories of murders and kidnappings by the Honduran military.

Opponents of Negroponte are demanding that all Senators read the full report before voting on his nomination.http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/ROF111A.html
In a cruel irony, the Bush administration has appointed a bona fide "terrorist" to wage its "war on terrorism" in Iraq.


It should come as no surprise that "on the day he was appointed to Iraq, Honduras decided to bring its troops in Iraq home." (Financial Times, April 21, 2004)

http://www.conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=2&contentid=1189



Face-off: Bush's Foreign Policy Warriors


On August 27, 1997, CIA Inspector General Frederick P. Hitz released a 211-page classified report entitled "Selected Issues Relating to CIA Activities in Honduras in the 1980's." This report was partly declassified on Oct. 22, 1998, in response to demands by the Honduran human rights ombudsman. Opponents of Negroponte are demanding that all Senators read the full report before voting on his nomination.

Reich, unlike Negroponte, is primarily a lobbyist and anti-Castro activist rather than a diplomat. He is director of the Washington-based Center for a Free Cuba and works for some of America's favorite industries: liquor (Bacardi), tobacco (British-American Tobacco), and weapons (Lockheed Martin). He also serves as vice-chairman of the Worldwide Responsible Apparel Program, or WRAP, an apparel industry-backed group characterized by union activists as an artifice for clothing importers to avoid serious scrutiny of their factories in developing countries.

In the 1980s, he headed a propaganda department in the State Department called the Office of Public Diplomacy. This unit, staffed with CIA and Pentagon psychological warfare specialists, reported to Oliver North. The function of the operation was to win support for administration policy in Central America. They wrote op-eds under the name of Nicaraguan rebel leaders and attacked those who differed with Reagan's policies. The Congressional investigation of the Iran-contra scandal identified numerous illegalities which led to the closure of the Office of Public Diplomacy.

Reich followed up these activities by serving as ambassador to Venezuela from 1986-89, at the height of the Iran-contra scandal. The Venezuelan government tried unsuccessfully to block his nomination.

While working for Bacardi, he successfully lobbied to slip Section 211 into the 1998 Omnibus Appropriations Bill, thus stripping Cuba of trademark protection. Ironically, he will be overseeing the Helms-Burton Act, which he helped to draft, which the administration has just decided not to carry into effect.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/ROF111A.html


NEGROPONTE - Sleeping Ambassador or Death Squad Diplomat?

The widespread use of American aerial surveillance to direct the Contra murderers to villages where only women and children were present to be killed, the routine use of torture, the encouragement of drug-smuggling into the U.S. to provide funding for the U.S.-backed forces all were revealed only after Negroponte had left his post as U.S. Ambassador to the Honduras. And who could forget the Honduran Anti-communist Liberation Army's ever popular practice of dropping victims from helicopters while they were in flight?

Make no mistake about it -- both Iraqi rebels and Al Qaeda terrorists see Negroponte's appointment as the first stage in implementing a policy of covert violence against their right to sovereignty and will effectively use it to recruit and incite radicals to commit more acts of violence against us. It's no coincidence that our Office of Homeland Security issued a heightened security alert just as Bush announced his plans for Negroponte.

http://www.buzzflash.com/contributors/04/04/con04178.html

US Martyrs Pose Questions for Negroponte
October 28, 2003
By TONI SOLO

US nuns murdered in El Salvador 4

In 1981, a couple of decades before Rachel Corrie was murdered, the bodies of four women were found in a shallow grave in a rural district not far from San Salvador, El Salvador's capital. They had been raped and shot dead by members of the Salvadoran army on the orders of senior officers. In the context of the time, the atrocity would hardly have merited reporting. But the women were United States citizens. Two were religious sisters of the New York based Maryknoll order, Ita Ford and Maureen Clarke. One was an Ursuline Sister, Dorothy Kazel, the fourth a lay missioner, Jean Donovan. By virtue of their nationality, the story did make the news, just--the back page of the New York Times, to that paper's eternal shame.

Those four women had helped defend Salvadorans from the terror unleashed against their own people by the Salvadoran government with support from the United States administrations of Jimmy Carter and Ronald Reagan. They gave their lives working alongside vulnerable people and communities in El Salvador. The murders followed the assassination in 1980 of Salvadoran Archbishop Oscar Romero. The women's deaths were manipulated by the US government and its ever-pliant news media. The full facts took years to emerge. US ambassador to the UN, Jean Kirkpatrick, falsely accused the women of having supported the Salvadoran armed opposition, the FMLN. In fact, the four women were passionate advocates of non-violence, accompanying the rural villagers they served while caught up in a violent civil war.

Ambassador Kirkpatrick's statements on the case of the four women were to be expected from an unrepentant supporter of the bloodthirsty Argentinian military dictatorship. Her successor at the UN was Vernon Walters, former deputy director of the CIA, co-organiser of the continent wide terrorist blueprint Plan Condor and promoter of Ronald Reagan's terrorist war against Nicaragua. In 1986 Vernon Walters threw in the face of the UN his government's rejection of the International Court of Justice verdict convicting the US of terrorism against Nicaragua.

Kirkpatrick's and Walters' apologetics for mass murder helped John Negroponte, then US ambassador to Honduras, cover up his support for the systematic forced disappearances used to destroy Honduran civilian opposition to the presence of Contra bases in their country. Thomas Pickering, US ambassador to El Salvador at the time, also gave misleading information on local army and paramilitary murders, probably an essential qualification for his subsequent posting in 1989 as US ambassador to the UN, taking over from Vernon Walters.

Jean Kirkpatrick, Vernon Walters, Thomas Pickering, John Negroponte and other US government representatives sent clear signals that the local military in El Salvador, Honduras and Guatemala were to be allowed a free hand by the United States government to murder tens of thousands of civilians and anyone who spoke out against the slaughter. Perhaps the defining climax to the sickening murder campaign came in 1989 when the Salvadoran army killed six Jesuit academics and two of their domestic staff at the University of Central America in San Salvador. These crimes were made possible because the United States government consistently tried to conceal its institutional role in funding, training and supporting the military and paramilitary perpetrators. The Iran-Contra scandal was the culmination of that sustained program of regional deceit.


http://www.counterpunch.org/solo10282003.html

[SEpatriot]

9. Another bad flashback

The whole thing makes me sick. These shadow guys are all over Bushco and the public is clueless as to what's going on. I imagine that there are a bunch of graduates of the School of the Americas or its Arab equivalent in Iraq already.

You are a wealth of information. It just brings back more bad memories.

[seemslikeadream]

11. We can never forget even for a moment

look what's happened now. We all pretended Vietnam was over. It's not.
And we still have promises to keep for that war


Laos - 2004 Anuual Report


The arrest of two European journalists for investigating the situation of the Hmong ethnic minority drew international attention to the lack of freedom in Laos, where the news media take their orders from the authorities. A press law announced in 2001 has still not been adopted.

The 15-year prison sentences received by reporters Thierry Falise and Vincent Reynaud drew the world's attention to the obstacles to foreign press coverage of the plight of Laos' Hmong ethnic minority. An international outcry forced the authorities in Vientiane to release the two journalists but their Laotian guides remained in prison and were allegedly mistreated.
Directly controlled by the information and culture ministry, the Laotian press gave a very one-sided account of the case of the two European journalists. The French-language weekly Le Rénovateur was the only publication to give both sides of the story, and it was immediately censored. The government news agency Khaosan Pathet Lao (KPL) is the only news organisation that is allowed to express a view on sensitive issues.
The party newspaper Paxaxon (People) bills itself as a "revolutionary publication written by the people and for the people which serves the revolution's political action." Journalists are civil servants in the employ of the information and culture ministry. The foreign ministry also has a say in media content. Criticism of the "friendly countries," especially the Vietnamese big brother and Burma, is banned.
To escape the propaganda, many Laotians are in the habit of watching Thai TV stations that can be received in border areas, including the capital. The authorities have never tried to put a stop to this. Similarly, the international radio services that broadcast in Lao, especially Radio Free Asia and Radio France Internationale, have never been jammed. On the other hand, foreign journalists who enter on a press visa are watched closely and are banned from visiting some parts of the country. The authorities control the only Internet operator and block some news websites and sites operated by dissidents based abroad.

http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=10197


Hmong leader in Calif. may be target of violence in Minnesota

Associated Press

ST. PAUL - Authorities are looking for connections among a spate of violent incidents directed against local Hmong leaders affiliated with Gen. Vang Pao, a California resident regarded as the most influential Hmong leader in the United States.

The incidents include a firebombing at the suburban St. Paul home of the general's son, a drive-by shooting at the home of his translator, a suspicious fire at a St. Paul social service agency the general founded, and a reported hit list that includes a veteran St. Paul police officer.

Star Tribune of Minneapolis in its Sunday editions. Rumors are swirling about what's behind the violence, which the Star Tribune of Minneapolis reported in its Sunday editions. Popular theories include communist agents, political divisions or the opening shots in a war of succession in the Hmong community.

"I believe there is something going on in a more general way," said Steve Young, former dean of the Hamline University law school and a close adviser to Vang, who lives outside Los Angeles. "These are not isolated incidents. Somebody is doing something."

http://www.montereyherald.com/mld/montereyherald/news/politics/8574361 ...


gen. vang pao is a liar
Base: military
Re: My war too (Rose)
Re: WHAT YOU DON'T KNOW (your own people)
Re: i think... (kasey)
Re: General VANG PAO>>>??? (Alexis)
Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 00:01:18 GMT
From: [e-mail] (unknown yang)

vang pao is a liar who don't care about no one but himself. lets just face it, he is hmong and hmong men are are full of it. it was because of him lying to our parents in Laos that led to the death of over 108,000 hmong peoples. Two of thos people were my brothers. My dad lost his whole family and everyone else he cares for. General "coward" is not helping the hmongs in the usa neither the ones back home. he uses all the money he gets on gambling and the us lets him have 8 wives just because he was a dog to the americans who brainwashed the HMONGS to actually take part in th war just to die for the americans. A "TRUE LEADER" survives with all his people or die trying.

http://knossos.shu.edu/HyperNewsV/get/vp/military/66/4/16/1/2.html


US WI: Sen. George Asks UW For Probe On Vang Pao

URL: http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v02/n809/a09.html
Newshawk: Drug Policy Forum of Wisconsin www.drugsense.org/dpfwi/
Votes: 0
Pubdate: Sat, 27 Apr 2002
Source: Capital Times, The (WI)
Copyright: 2002 The Capital Times
Contact: [e-mail]
Website: http://www.captimes.com /
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/73
Author: Pat Schneider


SEN. GEORGE ASKS UW FOR PROBE ON VANG PAO

State Sen. Gary George is calling on UW-Madison Chancellor John Wiley to order an investigation into allegations by a UW-Madison professor that the commander of the CIA's secret army in the Vietnam War - now a leader of refugee Hmong in the United States - engaged in drug trafficking in Laos.

The allegations, 30 years old, resurfaced this month, enraging the refugee community.

"We will seek the truth and follow that path wherever it leads," George said Friday at a news conference at the State Capitol packed with Hmong veterans and supporters of Gen. Vang Pao.

Professor Alfred McCoy wrote about his findings on the role of Vang Pao and the CIA in drug trafficking in southeast Asia in a 1972 book, "The Politics of Heroin."

McCoy said the U.S. government assisted Vang Pao in bringing opium, an important cash crop for the Hmong, to heroin factories to help Vang Pao seal his leadership role and ensure a supply of fighters who waged a secret war against the North Vietnamese in Laos.

http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v02/n809/a09.html


McCoy said the U.S. government assisted Vang Pao in bringing opium


Posted on Wed, Apr. 28, 2004


ST. PAUL: Crime spree on Hmong investigated

BY LENORA CHU and TODD NELSON

Pioneer Press


Authorities are trying to determine whether a connection exists between anonymous death threats leveled Monday against seven Hmong community leaders and recent crimes committed against prominent Hmong.

St. Paul Police spokesman Paul Schnell revealed Wednesday that the death threats came in an anonymous call received by a St. Paul Hmong veterans group. Local and federal law enforcement agencies are investigating the alleged hit list.

Authorities also confirmed Wednesday that an object hurled through a window sparked the arson fire that destroyed the home of Cha Vang, son of influential leader Gen. Vang Pao. Cha Vang narrowly escaped the early Sunday fire with his wife and three daughters.

A flammable substance was also found in the home, according to Maplewood Police Chief Dave Thomalla, who declined to identify the object and substance.

Two other crimes are being investigated for possible connections. On April 20, someone fired five shots into the Maplewood home of Xang Vang, Gen. Vang Pao's translator. The following day, officials discovered someone had thrown a brick into a window and started a fire at the St. Paul offices of the Lao Family Community of Minnesota.

more
http://www.realcities.com/mld/twincities/8543732.htm



Muaj ib nqe ntawm Sen. Norm Coleman cov lus hais tias "nws yog ib qho tseem ceeb heev uas U.S. State Department yuav tsum ua txhua yam coj kom tau kev thaj yeeb nyab xeeb mus rau tebchaws Lostsuas thiab pab kom tau txoj kev muaj vaj huam sib luag (humanitarian) rau haiv neeg Hmoob nrog rau daws kom tau teeb meem tsoom Hmoob tawg rog nyob rau SE Asia".

http://www.hmonglaoradio.org/default.asp?active_page_id=32

From The Wire

Rapid Fire At Home Investigated
Saint Paul Pioneer Press (April 27, 2004)

Maplewood investigators suspect an arsonist set a weekend fire at the home of a prominent Hmong community leader, who is calling the blaze a politically motivated attempt to kill him and his family.

The fire destroyed the home of Cha Vang, son of Gen. Vang Pao, one of the most widely known and influential Hmong leaders in the United States.

http://fe.pennnet.com/News/Display_News_Story.cfm?Section=WireNews&Sub ...

Cha Vang, his wife and their three daughters were asleep when the fire broke out after 1 a.m. Sunday. A noise, possibly the sound of breaking glass, prompted him to investigate and he discovered the flames toward the back of the home. He and his family escaped unharmed, but the fire left little more than the garage standing.

"If you want to terrorize a person or send a message, you slash a tire," Cha Vang said Monday. "To burn down a house with people sleeping in it is attempted murder."

Investigators said they suspect arson because the house burned so thoroughly within minutes, said Maplewood Police Chief Dave Thomalla. Investigators searched the soot and debris for evidence for a second day on Monday.

http://fe.pennnet.com/News/Display_News_Story.cfm?Section=WireNews&Sub ...

1961
Eisenhower warns the young president-elect that Laos is a major crisis, the first "domino" in Southest Asia. The CIA begins the covert build up of Hmong forces under General Vang Pao at the beginning of the year. At the same time the U.S. sends the rightist forces to Laos six AT-6 Harvard trainer aircraft armed with machine guns and equipped to fire rockets and drop bombs. The covert PEO infantrymen are replaced by 400 clandestine U.S special forces personnel known as White Star Movile Training Teams. Kennedy announces U.S support for the sovereignty of Laos in March, directly confronting the Soviet Union. Geneva conference on Laos opens in May.

http://www.seacrc.org/pages/ravenschrono.html

http://www.ohiopowmia.com/news/2190302.html


37. COLEMAN HOSTS FIRST EVER MEETING BETWEEN HMONG LEADER


COLEMAN HOSTS FIRST EVER MEETING BETWEEN HMONG LEADER GENERAL VANG PAO AND SENIOR STATE DEPARTMENT OFFICIAL
Coleman working to alleviate humanitarian crises in Laos and streamline Hmong refugee resettlement process

January 21st, 2004 - Washington, DC - Senator Norm Coleman today hosted a meeting in his Senate office between Hmong leader General Vang Pao and Deputy Assistant Secretary of State for East Asia and Pacific Affairs Matt Daley. The group, which also included Chao Ophat Nachmpassak, a member of the Lao royal family, discussed General Vang Pao's efforts to bring peace to Laos, the refugee resettlement program for Hmong in Thailand, and the humanitarian crisis facing many Hmong living in Laos.

"I have some serious concerns about the way the Hmong people are being treated today in Southeast Asia," Coleman said. "It's critical that the U.S. State Department does all it can to bring peace to Laos and an end to the humanitarian and refugee crises facing many Hmong in Southeast Asia. This meeting is a solid first step in opening up a real, meaningful diplomatic dialogue between Hmong leaders in Southeast Asia and the U.S. State Department."

General Vang Pao presented to State Department officials his vision for a lasting peace in Laos, as he publicly articulated on November 26. State Department officials listened to Vang Pao's presentation, and discussed the changing opportunities for peaceful reconciliation in Southeast Asia.

Daley, who had just returned from an official visit to the region, described the U.S. initiative to resettle in the U.S. as many as 14,000 Hmong refugees currently living in Wat Tham Krabok, Thailand

http://coleman.senate.gov/index.cfm?FuseAction=PressReleases.Detail&Pr ...

Hmong Proving Potent Political Organizers in U.S.
SuabHmongRadio, News Report,
Compiled and Translated by Pha Lo, Apr 30, 2004

MILWAUKEE, Wisc. -- Milwuakee is home to approximately 20,000 Hmong, a nomadic tribe that emigrated from Laos in the Vietnam War's aftermath. Here in the United States, Hmong are discovering that their traditional, clan-based system of leadership can benefit U.S.-style grassroots politicking.

Tens of thousands of Hmong left Laos in the 1970s and 1980s after losing a war in which they were covertly recruited to serve alongside the U.S. military. Here in the United States, many were naturalized as U.S. citizens after the Lao-Veterans bill, introduced in 1996, expedited the process for those who had served or been disabled in that war.

Since gaining citizenship, Hmong have begun to exercise their voting rights. This year marked a political rite of passage for Milwaukee-are Hmong who worked on Republican State Sen. Bob Welch’s campaign for the U.S. Senate. He won the Republican primary and will compete in general elections.

Wisconsin is home to approximately 40,000 Hmong.

Victor Vaj is a Hmong radio personality in Milwaukee who spent a year working on the State Senator’s campaign. For Vaj, seeing an older generation of naturalized citizen exercise voting rights fulfills a second purpose. It encourages the U.S.-born generation to use their birthright along with their traditional Hmong upbringing to pursue politics in this country.

http://news.ncmonline.com/news/view_article.html?article_id=9d4de22d1f ...

Thousands of Hmong Refugees from Laos Ready to Arrive
Jack Austin Smith, a Vietnam Veteran and a retired career soldier

Thousands of Hmong Refugees from Laos Ready to Arrive


By Elizabeth Putnam
Wausau Daily Herald
[e-mail]

The clan system remains an integral part of Hmong culture, but the assimilation of the Hmong into American culture is threatening the system's survival.

The Hmong clans
Original 12 Hmong clans
Cha, Hang, Her, Kue, Khang, Lee, Moua, Song, Thao, Vang, Xiong, Yang
The 18 clans of today
Cha, Cheng, Chue, Fang, Hang, Her, Khang, Kong, Kue, Lee, Lor, Moua, Pha, Thao, Vang, Vue, Xiong, Yang
Sources: "Mong Education at the Crossroads," by Paoze Thao and the Hmong Cultural and Resource Center of Minnesota at hmongcenter.org



Within Hmong culture, there are 18 clans, and members of each share the same last name. The clan leaders and members provide each other with social, economic and legal assistance. They help organize social events such as weddings and offer support during difficult times, as when a family member is ill.

"I think that in the future, most of the younger children now might lose that knowledge of the clan, but that's why we need to teach or educate the kids," said Chang Yang, 36, president of the board of the Wausau Area Hmong Mutual Association.

The origin of the clan system is a mystery, according to local Hmong residents and the book "Mong Education at the Crossroads," by Paoze Thao, a professor at California State University in Monterey Bay. Thao uses an alternate spelling of Hmong in his work.

Hmong folklore tells the story of a brother and sister who married and had a child who resembled a seed. They cut it up into 12 pieces and scattered them. The pieces made people, each representing a clan. The 12 clans eventually branched out into 18 clans.

http://www.wausaudailyherald.com/wdhlocal/291782635188000.shtml

Thousands of Hmong Refugees from Laos Ready to Arrive in California
Tamara Keith
Fresno, California
08 Apr 2004, 19:28 UTC

Listen to Tamara Keith's report (RealAudio)
Keith report - Download 676k (RealAudio)

In just a few months as many as 3000 new Hmong refugees could arrive in California's Central Valley. For years they've been living in a makeshift camp at a broken-down Buddhist temple in Thailand. The Hmong people aided the United States during the Vietnam War and were forced to flee their home country of Laos as the war ended. Thousands have come to the U.S since the early 1980s, but nearly 15,000 remain on the temple grounds in Thailand. In December the State Department bowed to pressure from Hmong Americans and the Thai government and agreed to let this group of refugees immigrate. Tamara Keith reports on what Fresno community leaders are doing to prepare for the arrival.
Hmong refugee Pai Yang came to this country when she was 10 years old. Now she's the Refugee Resettlement Director for Catholic Charities in Fresno, helping families fill out the forms needed to bring their relatives over from Thailand. For Ms. Yang and others, the upcoming influx of new refugees came as a surprise. She said, "For our community this is like a very great time, a joyful time. To be able to have this opportunity to resettle in this country, to have the opportunity for education, health, etc."

On this morning, Ms. Yang is meeting with Pai-Yang Thao and her husband, who are hoping to sponsor 22 family members now living on the temple grounds in Thailand. The young couple visited the camp in December. They found it surrounded by armed guards, and the people there living with no electricity or running water.

"When we got there we felt very sad that they were living in a bad place and being caged up like animals," she said. "They can't go outside to find food and they're always waiting for us over here to send them money."

Ms. Thao can't wait for her parents, siblings, nieces and nephews to arrive in Fresno. She said that for her the reunion is like a dream come true. But, if past experience is any indication, her family will likely have a hard time adjusting to life here in the valley. Pai Yang says that when she arrived with her mother and sister in the 1980s, they struggled with the language and the culture. In Laos, her mother was a successful businesswoman, but here in California she had to pick tomatoes to make a living. Ms. Yang believes that many Hmong refugees had similar difficulties.

http://www.voanews.com/article.cfm?objectID=0D604918-8C63-43F1-A1BBC15 ...

400 protest opening trade with Laos
Minneapolis Star Tribune (subscription), MN - Apr 14, 2004
... older Hmong military veterans in camouflage fatigues and younger Hmong college students ... for the US government to pressure the communist leaders to address human ...

http://news.minnesota.publicradio.org/features/199810/15_radila_reform /

Duluth's Hmong Families Find Reform Pressure
By Amy Radil
October 15, 1998 RealAudio 2.0 14.4
Part of the MPR Welfare to Work Series

DULUTH'S SMALL HMONG COMMUNITY has been steadily growing over the past ten years. Late last year there were about 175 Hmong households in Duluth on the welfare rolls. But then Minnesota moved in to welfare reform and as they themselves admit, St. Louis County and the City of Duluth Job Training forgot the city's immigrants.

Bea Larson: There was a lot of initial panic and fear and initial orientation sessions had to be redone.
Bea Larson, is an instructor at the Adult Learning Center who teaches English as a second language classes. She soon learned the county had not only sent out letters informing Hmong recipents of the changes in English alone... it was also conducting required orientation sessions exclusively in English.

Larson: Initially people were asked to sign jobs plans that they didn't understand. A number of different folks with limited English had to be re-oriented in ways that they'd understand what they were agreeing to do.
Larson contacted Gwen Updegraaf, a legal aid attorney, who met with a group of Hmong welfare recipients who told her of further problems. The Minnesota Family Investment Program, or MFIP, legislation calls for participants to receive an individualized assessment with a job counselor, who helps them formulate a plan consisting of education, training or active job seeking. Updegraaf says instead, these people had pre-printed job forms instructing them to perform 30 hours of job search each week.

Updegraaf: There was no individualized assessment done with these people, no one sat down with them and determined how much English they spoke. Several people who had problems with their plans complained of disabilities.
Amidst the confusion, Hmong families began leaving Duluth for the Twin Cities. Reasons varied. Some wanted to join relatives, some wanted access to support services in their own language, and many found ready employment and higher wages. When Updegraaf contacted St. Louis County officials with her concerns, they agreed to allow Hmong immigrants to start over in the orientation process, this time with an interpreter, Bobbee Vang. Vang was hired with a grant from the McKnight Foundation to provide special support for Southeast Asians seeking jobs in Duluth.


My interest in Hmong started here in GD

lojasmo (219 posts) Sun May-02-04 01:24 AM
Original message
Police everywhere in duluth WTF


There was a police officer in the lobby of my hotel on canal point, and an oficer in the lobby of Grandma's restaraunt/bar.

In the cold war, reportedly, duluth was number seven on the list of probable nuclear targets.

Any ideas?

Jackpine Radical (1000+ posts) Sun May-02-04 04:34 PM
Response to Reply #25

27. OK--but why Duluth?


It's 150 miles north of the Twin Cities.

social workers and educators say it's been a struggle


FRED DE SAM LAZARO: The twin cities are home to the largest Hmong population in North America, about 60,000 people. They began arriving from Laos and Thai refugee camps in the late '70s, initially placed here by local church-based refugee relief groups. And while this community has plenty to celebrate, social workers and educators say it's been a struggle. Of all the Southeast Asian refugees who fled for the U.S., none was more reluctant or less prepared than the Hmong. Hmong music, artwork, and ceremonies depict an agrarian people who fled once, a century before, from China to almost total isolation in the hills of Laos. Until the mid-20th century, the Hmong did not have a written language or a currency.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/asia/vietnam/hmong_5-4.html


2001 Hmong Population and Education in
the United States and the World
August 24, 2001
Researched and Collected by Dr. Vang Pobzeb

From 1975 to 1991, more than 500,000 people in Laos fled and became international political refugees in the world because of the legacy of the Vietnam War in Southeast Asia.


The Communist Lao and Vietnamese governments have been exterminating Hmong people in Laos since the end of the Vietnam War in 1975 and are still doing so today, because of Hmong people cooperated with the U.S. government during the Vietnam War. In 2001, witnesses in Laos have reported that many thousands of Communist Vietnamese soldiers are cooperating with the Communist Lao government of the Lao People's Democratic Republic (LPDR) to conduct an ethnic cleansing war, genocide and human rights violations against Hmong people in Laos. Therefore, we appeal to and call upon Hmong American intellectuals, educators and the general public to unify our leadership strategies and efforts in order to save the lives of Hmong people in Laos. We call upon all Hmong people to unify and work together to save the lives of Hmong people. Power politics in the world and global actors are remaining silent on the genocide against Hmong people in Laos because they are concerned with economics and commercial goods for themselves. They do not really care about human rights violations and genocide in Laos and in other parts of the world.

There are about 300,000 Hmong American people in the United States in 2001.


In 2001, there are approximately 80,000 Hmong American people in Minnesota; and 80,000 Hmong Americans in Wisconsin.


About 40,000 Hmong Americans moved from California to Minnesota, Wisconsin, and other states between 1996 and 2001.


About 70,000 Hmong Americans still live in California in 2001.


Many Hmong Americans moved from California to Minnesota and Wisconsin and other states because of the problems of welfare reforms and unemployment problems

http://www.laohumrights.org/2001data.html

Jack Austin Smith, a Vietnam Veteran and a retired career soldier


Writing to an American who was confused about the Hmong people, Jack Austin Smith, a Vietnam Veteran and a retired career soldier, wrote the following in 1996 (quoted from his e-mail to me, with permission):

The war in Vietnam was fought on several fronts and I served in two them. The main American battle ground was in the Southern end of South Vietnam. In order for the North Vietnamese forces to fight us there, it was necessary for their supplies and troops to go through Laos and Cambodia on the Ho Chi Minh Trail, and Laos was controlled by a Pro-Communist Government at that time. Therefore America was not allowed to have any forces on the ground, although we were allowed to bomb and attack North Vietnamese troops with our aerial forces. About 99% of the combat forces on the ground were Hmong irregulars who were persuaded by Americans to forget about being neutral, and to fight the N. Vietnamese regulars (not relatively poorly trained Viet Cong guerrilla forces). We supplied air cover, but every combat trooper knows aircraft can't take and hold ground. We depended on the Hmongs to do this. Without modern arms, without medical help.
After the fall of Saigon we pulled out of Southeast Asia and left the Hmongs to continue the fight without air support. When we left, the Hmong had to fight both the Laotians and the N. Vietnamese. They could not fight tanks, heavy artillery and aircraft with rifles. A great many Hmongs were slaughtered in their villages. Many were slaughtered at airfields where they waited for evacuation planes that never came. A few were able to fight every foot of the way across Laos and cross the Mekong River into refugee camps in Thailand where they were further mistreated by rather corrupt UN and Thai officials. Out of a estimated 3,000,000 prewar Hmong population less than 200,000 made it to safety. One other ill informed or stupid writer said "they were all gone" meaning, I guess, that the combat Hmongs were all dead, they are wrong. Most of the survivors are in Australia, France and here among us.

Now I don't know about those heroes who have never heard a shot fired in anger, but I am embarrassed that my country so mislead these people. The Hmongs gave up literally everything for us: their country, their homes, their peaceful way of life, most of their families, everything that we would cherish. We promised them our continued support and then we bugged out.

You mentioned having relatives who fought in Vietnam and I hope they all survived. However their chances would have been much less if the Hmongs hadn't intercepted over 50% of the N. Vietnamese troops and supplies. If you truly loved your relatives, you should be grateful for the Hmongs' sacrifices.
http://www.jefflindsay.com/hmong.shtml

[0007]

13. Thanks for the link, I just hope everyone reads this horrible

shit this administration is doing. Worse than Iran/Contra in my opinion. These crooks must be stopped.

[BiggJawn]

5. "Civilian Contractors"

Hey, they're civilians, and they have contracts with Halliburton and Bechtel and KBR.....

"Private Security Guards" like that's suppose to bring to mind the obese sick old guy sitting by the door at the Mall with the antique 6-shooter on his belt?

[seemslikeadream]

7. Who else to guard the elite? Not just ordinary soldiers

23 April 2004 at 09:28


CLOSE PROTECTION? THE SHADOWY WORLD OF PRIVATE MILITARY COMPANIES


They travel in armoured SUVs, ostentatiously carrying powerful weapons - assault rifles, sidearms, grenades - and they shoot and arrest people just as the soldiers do but minus the uniform and legal status. They're paid around $1,000 a day, considerably more than the regular soldiers or police officers which they used to be, work six weeks on and three off with paid flights home at the end of each tour. The advantage for the US is that their deaths and injuries don't show up on the figures for troop casualties. They are the bodyguards.

Jo Wilding said it best in her piece on the incident when four 'contractors' were killed, sparking off the siege of Falluja by US Marines.

"We arrived back just after the incident in Falluja where the contractors were shot, burnt, mutilated and dragged through the streets. The scenes themselves, on satellite TV in a friend's house, were shocking, all the more so because the dead men were described as civilians.

But what if they were soldiers, armed men who signed up for war and were paid to fight it? They were shot dead in an ambush - what was done to their bodies afterwards was distressing no matter what, but if they were soldiers, they were killed in action. The truth of course is that they were somewhere in between, mercenaries from US firm Blackwater Security, given a contract by USAID to protect contractors".



And it's not just the US government engaging the services of these private armies, operating on the very edges of legality in the shadowy world of close protection. Britain's own Foreign and Commonwealth Office employs civilian close protection officers from UK firm Control Risks Group amongst others to look after its staff and secondees deployed to Iraq. Global Risk International, another British private military contractor has had as many as 1,200 of its personnel in Iraq making it effectively the sixth-largest contributor to the Coaliton Forces. Most of its uniformed troops are either Nepalese Gurkhas or demobilised Fijian soldiers.

I must admit, I hadn't given the concpet of being provided with my own close protection team a great deal of thought prior to my arrival in Baghdad, other than pondering on the motivations of someone who felt their life, should it come to it, was worth less than mine. After all, as a last resort, a bodyguard's role is to protect his principal's life with his own. And in the strange reality that is life within the Green Zone, I soon got used to the men who, looking like extras straight from central casting, arrived at my accommodation each morning to escort me through Baghdad to wherever my assignments took me. It was only later, upon my return that I paused to consider the deeper implications - both legal and moral - of governments using hired guns.

With soldiers still having to battle insurgents and defend themselves, the job of protecting everyone else in Iraq - from journalists like myself, engineers and those involevd in the country's reconstruction to government contractors to the US' head of the CPA, L. Paul Bremer - is largely being done by private security companies. It's believed that as many as 30,000 former soldiers, special forces personel, police officers - and anyone else with the right skills - are working for private security firms in Iraq. With Blackwater charging its clients between $1,500 and $2,000 per day for each close protection officer - and even I attracted a team of four, plus two two armoured SUVs for each excursion - it's clearly a lucrative business.

[seemslikeadream]

12. Erinys is an international Security Services

*

Erinys is an international Security Services and Risk consultancy. We provide clients with a range of services and capabilities to reduce the impact of operating in volatile, uncertain or complex environments such as sub-saharan Africa and the Middle East.

Formed in 2001 by senior managers and executives of the security & risk management industry our combination of skills and experience has enabled Erinys to rapidly establish a pre-eminent reputation in its field. A reputation exemplified by a client list representative of some of the world's largest and most important corporations.




Apartheid Enforcers Guard Iraq For the U.S.

By Marc Perelman

02/21/04: (The Forward) In its effort to relieve overstretched U.S. troops in Iraq, the Bush administration has hired a private security company staffed with former henchmen of South Africa’s apartheid regime.

The reliance on apartheid enforcers was highlighted by an attack in Iraq last month that killed one South African security officer and wounded another who worked for the subsidiary of a firm called Erinys International. Both men once served in South African paramilitary units dedicated to the violent repression of apartheid opponents.

François Strydom, who was killed in the January 28 bombing of a hotel in Baghdad, was a former member of the Koevoet, a notoriously brutal counterinsurgency arm of the South African military that operated in Namibia during the neighboring state’s fight for independence in the 1980s. His colleague Deon Gouws, who was injured in the attack, is a former officer of the Vlakplaas, a secret police unit in South Africa.

“It is just a horrible thought that such people are working for the Americans in Iraq,” said Richard Goldstone, a recently retired justice of the Constitutional Court of South Africa and former chief prosecutor of the United Nations International Criminal Tribunals for the former Yugoslavia and Rwanda.

The Coalition Provisional Authority in Iraq and the Pentagon did not return requests for comment.
In Iraq, the U.S. government has tapped into the ever-growing pool of private security companies to provide a variety of defense services, including protecting oil sites and training Iraqi forces. Observers worry that a reliance on these companies and the resulting lack of accountability is a recipe for further problems in a volatile region.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article5723.htm

Guarding a Vital Asset
Are Iraqis ready to protect their valuable, vulnerable oil?By Joe Cochrane
Newsweek InternationalFeb. 16 issue - It might be a stretch to call Ali and Muhammad the guardians of Iraq's future. Pulling guard duty recently in the rain-soaked northern town of Kirkuk, home of one of the world's largest oilfields, the two men sport mismatched uniforms and clutch rusty AK-47s. But looks are deceiving. Faced with continuing attacks by anti-U.S. insurgents and, according to some, insufficient ground troops to stop them, the U.S. military is counting on Ali and Muhammad (not their real names) and thousands of other private guards to protect Iraq's vast oil infrastructure. The task is daunting: dozens of oilfields, refineries and pumping stations, along with thousands of kilometers of pipeline that crisscross Iraq, are prime targets for insurgents bent on denying the U.S.-led occupying force money for long-term reconstruction. They also hope to exacerbate ongoing fuel shortages in hopes of further enraging a population already angered by long queues for petrol and kerosene. "Production at the refineries is already down 40 to 50 percent," says Asim Jihad, a spokesman for Iraq's Oil Ministry, "so any attacks seriously affect the flow of oil for export and our ability to provide things for the people."

advertisement

The vast majority of the attacks around the country each day are directed at U.S. troops and the Iraqis who support them, including the Feb. 1 bombing in Arbil that killed 100 Kurds and wounded 247 more. Similar strikes at targets like the Kirkuk fields or Daura oil refinery in Baghdad could seriously disrupt production and oil exports, and have major implications for Iraq's recovery. "One attack could be catastrophic to the oil industry," says Col. Tom O'Donnell, commander of Task Force Shield, which oversees the security of Iraq's oil infrastructure. Anti-U.S. fighters have launched at least 100 attacks against the oil infrastructure since Baghdad fell, including two last fall on a northern pipeline route that halted crude-oil exports to Turkey. The Coalition has been forced to buy oil products from neighboring countries to meet domestic needs.

U.S. war planners gave high priority to seizing Iraq's northern and southern oilfields before Saddam Hussein could sabotage them. But after major combat operations ended, manpower was shifted elsewhere, leaving the oil industry dangerously exposed. To protect its infrastructure, last September the Pentagon awarded a $40 million contract to Erinys International, a private, Britain-based security firm. In only four months Erinys has trained, armed and deployed more than 9,000 Iraqi guards across the country, and plans to expand its force to nearly 15,000 in the coming months. The U.S. military also struck deals with tribal leaders to provide an additional 5,000 guards in their areas.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/4208603/


South African mercenary question in Iraq

Is Iraq a zone of conflict? A war zone? Or is it a peace-building situation? On the answer to these questions rests the fate of more than 1,500 South Africans now working in Iraq.
Among them are some of the known assassins and torturers from the apartheid era. Most have been recruited as bodyguards, security consultants or security guards at salaries ranging up to $10,000 a month.
The issue came to a head after the bombing of the Shaheen hotel in Baghdad earlier this month, which South African Frans Strydom died and another South African, Deon Gouws, was seriously injured.
Gouws, a former policeman, was linked to the notorious South African Vlakplaas death squad.
The murderous activities of Vlakplaas were exposed when its commander, Colonel
Eugene de Kock, gave full details of the unit. Gouws and others associated with it were exposed and applied for amnesty to South Africa’s Truth and Reconciliation Commission (TRC).
The TRC granted amnesty to Gouws for at least 15 murders and the petrol bombings of the homes of between 40 and 60 anti-apartheid activists. He was discharged from the police force in 1996 as medically unfit and apparently had difficulty finding or settling down to another job.
Strydom was a former warrant officer in the Koevoet (‘Crowbar’) counterinsurgency unit that achieved notoriety for being paid bounties for the bodies of ‘terrorists’ in Namibia. They conducted a reign of terror in the northern parts of that country in the years before independence.
The backgrounds of these men are not yet widely known in Iraq, let alone the wider region. But those officials who have become aware expressed shock and anger that such ‘mercenaries’ could have been recruited.
As this information spreads and undoubtedly becomes embellished, there is likely to be a backlash against private security companies operating in Iraq.

http://www.muslimnews.co.uk/paper/index.php?article=1497




Johannesburg - Francois Strydom learnt about killing in the Koevoet, the apartheid-era paramilitary police unit, notorious for violence, torture and murder.

In Iraq, Strydom found his skills were in demand.

Employed by US-based firm SAS International, Strydom was one of a number of South Africans in Iraq working as private "security experts" before a January 28 bomb outside the Shaheen Hotel prematurely terminated his contract.

The aftermath of the blast sent shockwaves through the media, as Strydom"s death revealed an embarrassing situation. It was estimated that 1 500 former soldiers and policemen were operating in Iraq, in defiance of stringent legislation forbidding the practice.

It emerged that the men make up along with US and British personnel the largest contingent of commercial "military service providers" on the ground in Iraq.

Most are said to be members of former elite units, disbanded following the end of apartheid, their members suddenly finding themselves unemployed, their skills no longer required.

http://www.africancrisis.org/ZZZ/ZZZ_News_2085.ASP

[0007]

14. Keep pounding sweetheart, I love it!!

[seemslikeadream]

15. GEE!!

[Iceburg]

16. Told ya so -- having been a target of these evil doers in 1994

while on loan to the South African Independent Electoral Commission in 1994 ...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1494140#1494496


Special Forces in Iraq ... bet cha he's SA
http://www.spiegel.de/img/0,1020,246775,00.jpg

[seemslikeadream]

17. Whoa how'd I miss that

very scary.



I'm not takin that bet.

[Iceburg]

18. Kick ...lest we forget

[Tellurian]

19. Here is the Mother of all Sound Bytes!

"People will ask now what's the difference between Saddam and Bush. Nothing!"

courtesy of Common Dreams.

[Iceburg]

21. Your right and I heard an elderly Iraqis woman say exactly

those words today.