Most Fallujah insurgents are Iraqis: US (AFP)

[gottaB]

The vast majority of the insurgents in Iraq are local and not foreign fighters," said Captain Ben Connable, the intelligence deputy for the US 1st Marine Division, in charge of the western al-Anbar province.

***

The Zarqawi network often recruits the disaffected unemployed youths in Anbar with the promise of jihad (holy war).

"What they try to do is get local and disaffected youth and pound their heads with jihad. They are roving the street (looking) for your classic 16- to 24-year-old," the intelligence officer said.

"They themselves rarely get shot or killed. They take these kids and run them out into firefights. It's a cynical approach," said Colonel Buck Connor of the US Army's 1st Infantry Division, in charge of the Anbar town of Ramadi.

***

"The Americans are deluding themselves if they think they can subdue Iraqis by force or through bribery. When an Iraqi is humiliated, he rebels," said Mohammad Hamadani, a Sunni nationalist from Fallujah.

***

Most Fallujah insurgents are Iraqis...

[Journeyman]

1. One of the first things I remember learning about Iraqis. . .

was from back during the Iraq/Iran War in the '80s. I remember reading how both sides in that sad conflict took 12 and 14 year old boys and put them in the field between their armies before the start of any offensive. The young boys task was to clear the field of mines. . .

It could have been propoganda. I didn't read it too close in those days. My interests were elsewhere. But I think about that image a lot these days and what it may bode for our future in Iraq. . .

[DoNotRefill]

8. Ummm....

that was an Iranian tactic. I don't recall the Iraqis using that technique.

[KissMyAsscroft]

2. 16-24 year olds are kids? Our military is 18-24 year olds...

What's the difference? This is just propaganda. It's sad that it's come to this, but they are defending their homes and their families what the hell do you expect them to do?

[Dead_Parrot]

3. Nah...

What the US Army do is get local and disaffected youth and pound their heads with patrioism. They are roving the streets and schools looking for your classic 16- to 24-year-old.

See? Totally different.

[DoNotRefill]

9. the difference is...

we TRAIN our kids, on average a minimum of 6 months before we commit them to ground action (Basic and AIT). Give your average 16 year old kid an AK or a RPG, and they'll think they're invincible. They'll also die like flies when confronted with soldiers.

[ze_dscherman]

13. Training

"A US military spokesman said the marines were surprised by the organised nature of Monday morning's assault by Iraqi insurgents in Falluja."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3659979.stm

It's the well trained marines, backed up by the best equipment the taxpayer has bought, using sophisticated weaponry, protected by armoured vehicles and flak vests, having air support at hand, and still losses are significant. Remember, most of the 100+ dead and about 900 other casualties came from Fallujah. And you believe they only send stupid kids fighting?

[DoNotRefill]

18. If you think only 100 fallujahns have died....

you'd be wrong.

US losses haven't been "significant" from a military perspective in the entire war. July 1, 1916, at the Somme, THAT was militarily significant casualties(58,000 casualties in a single day on one side, almost 20,000 dead). I'm not trying to make light at the number of casualties, but less than a thousand dead in a year of combat operations? From a military perspective, that's not significant. It's only from a human perspective that it's significant. From a human perspective, each death is a tragedy. The military doesn't necessarily think that way. Remember the old military axiom: "War means fighting, fighting means killing." I'd bet money that if you asked the average jarhead in Fallujah what the situation currently is, they'd say something along the lines of "we're kicking their asses."

[daleo]

21. 58000 was militarily insignificant in 1964-1971

Considering the size of the U.S. population, and especially considering that the baby boom generation was in the prime draftable age. Still, it catches up with you.

[ze_dscherman]

22. That's 100+ dead U.S. soldiers

Casualties among Iraqis are much higher, of course.

Nevertheless, "insurgents" have been able severely wound or kill several hundred GI's (so the official numbers) in about three weeks only. That's not insignificant any more, even in military terms. One can't compare this war to WWI or WWII, where people were much more ready to accept own high casualties. They won't accept ths, especially when many of them know this war has been wrong from the beginning. The Pentagon knows this.

And no, I doubt the average soldier in Iraq still thinks he's there kicking ass.

[leftchick]

4. "The Zarqawi network "

say al-qaida enough times and it will make it true? These people are clueless.

[gottaB]

5. What's your thinking here, please?

Sec. Powell told lies about Zarqawi's relation to the last government in Iraq, and perhaps stretched the truth about connections between Zarqawi and Ansar al-Islam.

Currently, some Iraqis have claimed that Zarqawi is dead, while US intel continues to point the finger at Zarqawi, blaming his group for upwards of 700 bombings in occupied Iraq.

Zarqawi, aka Ahmed al-Khalayleh, is or was a real person, and was convicted of terrorist bombings in Jordan.

Do you accept these statements as factual?

What more do you suspect or know?

[leftchick]

6. What I know is....

The US is using the UBL/A-Q boggey man to suit their purposes. There is probably very little going on in Iraq right now being directed by al-qaida. Perhaps a few bodies for the cause. The fact that there are any foreign "terrorists" in Iraq is entirely the fault of the US. I believe what we are seeing is native Sunni, Shiaa Iraqis doing their best to oust the US occupiers. Much as they did in the 1920's against the British occupiers. Here is a great link if you have not seen it...

http://www.juancole.com/2004_04_01_juancole_archive.html#108109946449807198

[gottaB]

7. Thanks, found Cole's Zarqawi files

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~jrcole/zarqawi/zarqawix.htm

[izzie]

10. Cap Ben will be back to night from Iraq.

We know they are not from Iraq, as those people love us.

[htuttle]

11. What was their first clue?

They don't think that SyriaAlQuedaIran would send troops into battle armed with axes and crescent wrenches?

Don't be fooled! Those crescent wrenches are VICIOUS! You can reduce a Humvee to pieces with one of those!

[gottaB]

15. beware the crescent wrench of mass destruction

dipped in castor oil...

[Ganja Ninja]

12. I never bought the "insurgents" story in the first place.

The whole story that Iraqi's love us and it's only a small percentage of the population along with foreign fighters that are causing all the trouble doesn't wash. I would like to know just how many foreign fighters they have killed or captured. I'm willing to bet the amount is pretty minuscule.

[caledesi]

14. I never bought that story either. Good ol' propaganda. nt

[Just Me]

19. Yup,...propaganda: everyone's a "terrorist" and there are no Iraqis,...

,...fighting to take their country back from occupiers. Blah,...what crap,...repeated over and over and over.

[gottaB]

16. it's interesting because it would contradict the higherups in Baghdad

BremerCo say foreign terra-ists, the local intelligence officers say, no, it's pretty much an uprising. This story from Anbar agents confirms Ron Harris's reports from Husaybah.

http://www.npr.org/features/feature.php?wfId=1842192

Read between the lines. I think the local sources are telling us the truth as best they know, as best they can under the circumstances.

[yellowcanine]

17. Well Duh! Didn't really think they were Hittites, didya Dumya?

Onlyl Dumya and Rummy believe the propaganda about them being furriners.

[Minstrel Boy]

20. Most US soldiers are American: Iraqis

Though some "contractors" are South African.

[cornfedyank]

23. they leveled a mosque in fallujh

Also, there was a mosque ... here; it had a minaret 50 to 60 feet high. Marine commanders say they were taking sniper fire from that minaret.

That minaret has now been leveled by U.S. military ordnance, missiles and mortars. There's nothing left at all of that minaret. ...


wage peace