Cubans Set for Big Change: Right to Buy Homes

[hack89]

Source: NYT

HAVANA — José is an eager almost-entrepreneur with big plans for Cuban real estate. Right now he works illegally on trades, linking up families who want to swap homes and pay a little extra for an upgrade.
In Havana on Saturday, Cubans looked at notices for apartment exchanges. Cuba is about to legalize the sale of property.

But when Cuba legalizes buying and selling by the end of the year — as the government promised again this week — José and many others expect a cascade of changes: higher prices, mass relocation, property taxes and a flood of money from Cubans in the United States and around the world.

“There’s going to be huge demand,” said José, 36, who declined to give his last name, stepping away from the crowd and keeping an eye out for eavesdroppers. “It’s been prohibited for so long.”

Private property is the nucleus of capitalism, of course, so the plan to legitimize it here in a country of slogans like “socialism or death” strikes many Cubans as jaw-dropping. Indeed, most people expect onerous regulations and already, the plan outlined by the state media would suppress the market by limiting Cubans to one home or apartment and requiring full-time residency.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/03/world/americas/03cuba.html?_r=1

---

Capitalism is coming to Cuba.

[dipsydoodle]

1. Requiring full-time residency

should at least keep the Miami Mafia at bay. Anyone misbehaves I'm guessing the State will take the house given its sitting on State owned land - no such thing as freehold in Cuba as far as I'm aware.

Cuba is a great country. Hope these changes don't start to spoil it.

[Billy Burnett]

2. Mr Obama has lifted all financial remittance restrictions. Who's money will be buying homes?

You guessed it.

The wealthy Cubans in Miami will be sending unlimited money for their family to buy them homes.

The destruction of Cuba's noble efforts at societal equity is underway. Stratification, here we come!

I might be a little pessimistic, but that pessimism is based on experience with US/Cuba policy and experience with the RW Miami Cuban political base.


:hi:

[flamingdem]

3. What it comes down to is they need the bucks

and Cubans need more flexibility with their living arrangements. Some will take the $
and be able to improve their lives and it's their only resource.

At least they aren't allowing foreign ownership except for those condos at the golf course!

Wanna live next to snowbird golfers who can't dance?

Dipsy has it right, if they don't like something they will confiscate... and sometimes after
the "owner" has done all the renovations, so if Diaz-Balart tries to buy in through his 3rd
cousin... heh

[dipsydoodle]

4. The golf complexes

are only on 99 year leases. :)

:hi:

[flamingdem]

6. I just read today that they will be in perpetuity

sales must be off! Who would trust their money otherwise really.

[dipsydoodle]

11. You sure ?

I thought that all of the development options were taken up by China, Russia , Canada and Europe on the proposed 99 year leases. :shrug:

This is the original details : http://www.cubastandard.com/2010/08/30/foreign-investors-get-99-year-lease-on-state-land/

[joshcryer]

14. I believe this is the report flamingdem is talking about:

http://www.cubastandard.com/2011/07/30/golf-course-condo-buyers-will-get-unlimited-ownership/

Canada gets unlimited ownership. Unless or until of course the state decides otherwise. ;)

[dipsydoodle]

15. Well I never

Thanks for that.

Maybe "in perpetuity" is for the lifetime of the owner like the watch with the lifetime guarantee. When the mainspring goes it slashes your wrist.

[joshcryer]

17. When the casinos come don't kill me.

'cause I have no doubt they'll arrive in due course. :evilgrin:

[flamingdem]

20. I said it before, you are wrong about that, they have fresh memories of that

plus though the agencies don't cop to it, they aren't going to allow the cruise ships to take over

[joshcryer]

25. Heheh, the Thomson Dream docked in Havana in Jan. 3,000 sq ft of gaming space.

http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/massive-cruise-liner-docks-796206.html

http://www.thomson.co.uk/cruise/ships/thomson-dream-ship-details.html

Unclear if gaming was banned while in the port, would be interesting if that was the case.

[flamingdem]

35. Wow. You're on the ball on this one Josh, I remember when Fidel came out against cruise ships

but didn't know they are letting (some) in. I'm wondering how many restrictions they place on the cruise ships.

[flamingdem]

19. ha ha I think you're right, I should have put a link

because it's pretty telling, I'm not sure of what yet, but something.

PS If I had mad money, lots of it, I'd want one! Even though my neighbors would probably be
elderly snowbirds who dislike salsa, and I don't golf..

[flamingdem]

18. Thanks Josh I was going to look for a link nt

[dipsydoodle]

5. I have a sneaking suspicion

that cases will soon arise where the new "owners" in Cuba will need to substantiate sources of funds. Jealousy if nothing else may contribute to people grassing on each other where they are aware that the "owners" are quite who they appear to be.

You'da thunk the Miami brigade would've learned their lesson long ago.........tossers.

:hi:

[joshcryer]

13. That's easy enough to make up or fake or bribe the correct official.

It would only hurt the non-connected Cubans who are getting general remittances or loans from abroad. Say I wanted to send a Cuban $2000 (yearly limit), I tell them that I want it paid back within 5 years at a fixed interest rate of 2-3%, very generous. They could take me up on my offer, to start one of the many businesses out there, but the commissions to test whether or not their funding is legit will require exorbitant fines and such if they cannot prove it is on the up and up.

[Cool Logic]

7. "The destruction of Cuba's noble efforts at societal equity is underway"

The problem is that in Cuba, social equity for all = equitable misery for all.

[joshcryer]

10. Nah, The Party is as Bourgeoisie as they come. They have a lot of benefits.

There are tons of stories about the party officials heading off to Venezuela only to return with big screen TVs and fashionable items (but that's another discussion).

So it's more like "misery for most, luxury for some."

[flamingdem]

21. This is not true from my experience.

Now if you're talking military that's a bit different.

Compared to other Latin American countries party officials are POOR by comparison.

I've met them and seen how they dress and what they drive. For sure they tone it
down but they are paid the usual low wages.

When some tried to make a bit extra they were cut down. See Roberto Robaina.

[joshcryer]

26. I used that as an example...

...but I didn't want to go off topic in the thread. Venezuela gives Cuban officials a purse and it's effectively unlimited, if you can go by opposition stories.

[flamingdem]

36. Why would they?

That sounds like pure propaganda. It would not be encouraged in that society and if it's undercover how do we know it's true.

[dipsydoodle]

12. When were you there ?

.

[flamingdem]

22. If I remember right Josh was in a resort area for a short stay nt

[flamingdem]

24. I'm not picking on him but it takes lots of time on the ground to know what's up there nt

[joshcryer]

27. Yep I admitted to it not being representative...

I'll go back some day. But even then it won't be representative of current or past Cuba, I reckon. Since the reforms will make big changes either way.

[flamingdem]

32. You did make that clear. I encourage you to go back and report on your findings! nt

[dipsydoodle]

38. That wasn't directed at Josh

Was another - see reply #7.

[Billy Burnett]

45. Looks like the post was a hit-and-run, dd

:hi:

[Billy Burnett]

37. Uninformed hyperbole like this is why I don't really bother here anymore.

I'm tired of trying to illuminate the deliberately dark places.

[Cool Logic]

39. The only deliberately dark places I am familiar with are those that occur

as a result of all the electrical blackouts they have in Cuba.

One of the those noble efforts at societal equity you referenced is achieved by means of rolling blackouts, which results in equitable darkness for all.

[dipsydoodle]

41. Their grid can only cope with so much

That's one of the reasons for import controls on white goods which consume a lot of power. Their infrastructure is weak mainly due to the US embargo.

So yes - the rolling blackouts are equitable.

I'm sure it will be ok with Cubans if you simply avoid the place.

[robcon]

40. Don't threaten to avoid DU. Stop with the pity party.

Just go... if you don't like it, your threat to leave sounds like a phony cry for some kind of sympathy.

I have no sympathy for people like you (it happens several times a year) who threaten to leave DU, wanting the posters to 'beg' him/her to come back. then they'll deny they wanted to be begged to post again.

Just go, if you want to go.

[Billy Burnett]

44. As usual from you. BS and false spin.

Please point out where I threatened to leave DU?


robcon: "wanting the posters to 'beg' him/her to come back. then they'll deny they wanted to be begged to post again."

What? You're a palm reader too? Can I book an appointment Ms Cleo?

[Judi Lynn]

46. You would remember a poster here we knew as Freecancat, or J.S. at an earlier board,

who learned, after talking to a vendor in Havana, well before 2000, when she told us about it, that she and her husband, who live in Miami, buy loads of crap from dollar stores, etc. in Miami, and take it to Havana, and sell it there for a good profit.

She said her mouth nearly flew open when the woman shared this odd info. with her. As a Canadian, she saw the treachery immediately in the people who go out of their way to keep the hatred and misperceptions concerning Cuba boiling away, and U.S. Americans living on in COMPLETE, profound ignorance while they step in and out, keeping non-Cuban U.S. citizens away from their own little personal market.

Sad, isn't it?

[Billy Burnett]

48. Hi Judi. Yes, I do remember.

Same uninformed hit-and-run posts, and the same routine defenders of said posts. Very sad, and tiring.

I salute you, and so many other fine friends and defenders of the good and decent Cuban people, who continue the good fight w/ research and dissemination of accurate information. :fistbump:

I'm taking a little break from doing so here. Putting my efforts into on-the-ground projects that, imo, yield more tangible impact. Will keep you informed later.


:hi:

[joshcryer]

9. Pretty much. They need to lift it unconditionally. As it stands now US citizens are limited to 2k...

...per year.

[joshcryer]

8. Nah, read the criticisms of Volunterism by capitalists. You just pay someone to inhabit.

Think of it as reverse rent, you pay the mortgage, the people living there agree with you (privately of course) that it's yours to sell to whom you wish, while getting paid on the side. The Miami Mafia will eat this up since they have their own Cuban network in Cuba, and that network has always benefited from the Mafia's connections (don't be misled that they're not "connected" in Cuba, there are lots of actually poor Cuban bloggers who resent the people who get free money from abroad and whom can live it up, while the rest of the population festers). It will only make the black market stronger as opposed to weaken it, and the class basis will still exist.

[joshcryer]

16. This is perestroika in many ways, though the political reforms are lagging significantly.

In Russia both political and economic development happened simultaneously, whereas here we're seeing the economic reforms but the political reforms are lacking. This could blow up, in some ways, but I have hopes it'll work out OK.

[flamingdem]

23. Do you mean electoral change or censorship issues? nt

[joshcryer]

28. Electoral.

ie, more than one candidate for a position on a ballot. USSR was the same way until the reforms kicked in. The Party (in Russia) was surprised that when more than one candidate for a position was on the ballot, their guy wasn't always picked!

[flamingdem]

29. I think that will be the last thing to change, multiple parties etc

because they are most vulnerable to destabilization that way, see Nicaragua after their revolution..

Right now the leadership is all about 70-80 years old so they could use some fresh blood at a minimum..

[joshcryer]

30. Yeah, that's why I say it's not perestroika exactly. The new blood idea will be very transformative.

[flamingdem]

31. I'd like to know who is in line to take charge in 5 years nt

[socialshockwave]

33. Why are they dolling out one freedom at a time?

I mean it's CUBA; from what I understand you're not even allowed to criticize the government.

[Major Hogwash]

34. But we can't buy their cigars because of the stupid embargo!!

And that was supposed to end with this President, too!!

Aaarrrggggghhhhh!!!!!

[Judi Lynn]

42. Cuba: A development model that proved the doubters wrong

Cuba: A development model that proved the doubters wrong
Cuba's unique approach to the eradication of extreme poverty sets it apart from other Latin American and Caribbean countries, but the challenge now is how it evolves

Posted by
Jonathan Glennie Friday 5 August 2011 07.00 BST
guardian.co.uk

The fundamental instinct at the heart of Cuba's revolution in 1959 was that slower wealth creation and limited political repression were a price worth paying for fairer distribution, and the consequent eradication of extreme poverty. It may not have been articulated as such, but that is how it has played out.

Along with South Korea, Cuba probably has one of the most impressive and distinctive stories to tell in the annals of modern development. Apart from achieving near 100% literacy many years ago, its health statistics are the envy of many far richer countries. It is a small country, but not too small – with 11 million inhabitants it is the same size as Bolivia and four times the size of neighbouring Caribbean island Jamaica.

No other similar country adopted Cuba's approach to development, although some tried, and the differences between poverty in Cuba and other Latin and Caribbean countries are stark. While average income has grown in Cuba at a similar speed to other Latin American countries such as Bolivia, Colombia and El Salvador, the poverty and social conflict still experienced in the mainland countries is very apparent. In Cuba, the extremes of opulence and misery are banished in favour of a generalised level of wealth, best described as "enough to get by".

Cuba has certainly forfeited any chance of becoming an economic powerhouse because of the egalitarian policies it adopted, but that possibility was always a long shot anyway. Holding out for some kind of big economic takeoff may be a fool's game for most countries – and that might be one of the most important lessons for other countries that want to log the kind of development statistics Cuba has achieved. As former president Jean-Bertrand Aristide said of his country's aspirations, Haiti was not seeking grandeur but the more limited ambition of moving "from misery to poverty with dignity".

More:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/global-development/poverty-matters/2011/aug/05/cuban-development-model

[dipsydoodle]

43. Great article Judi

Thanks for posting.

:hi:

[Judi Lynn]

47. Thanks, dipsydoodle, for taking the time to read it. Knew I had to share it the moment I saw it. n/t

[Billy Burnett]

49. Thanks for posting, Judi

As they say, proof is in the puddin'.