Survey: Iraqi Doctors May Have Tortured

[rodbarnett]

CHICAGO -- Iraqi doctors were forced to cut off ears, falsify reports on torture and participate in other human rights abuses during Saddam Hussein's regime, a survey of physicians there found.

<snip>

About half the respondents said they believed other Iraqi physicians were frequently forced to amputate ears as punishment and falsify medical reports. Seventeen percent said they believed doctors were frequently forced to remove organs from dead and living patients without consent.

About 70 percent of the doctors surveyed said they thought torture in general had been an extreme problem in Iraq.

Commenting on the study, Dr. Amer al-Khuzaie, deputy health minister in Baghdad, said Saddam Hussein "tried everything to terrorize the Iraqi people, and he used mean and brutal methods to oppress the people. One of these methods was the use of doctors to cut ears and tongues of opponents and army deserters, and other illegal and unethical practices."

"The aim of doctors is to end the suffering, but in Saddam's time, the opposite happened," al-Khuzaie said. "Most of the doctors conducted such practices under threat, and they feared for their personal safety. Doctors who refused to do such things were imprisoned or tortured."


http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/wire/sns-ap-doctors-abuse-iraq,0,5995324.story?coll=sns-ap-nationworld-headlines

[DrWeird]

1. Yeah, and they took kuwaiti babies off of incubators.

:eyes:

[Heyo]

2. so youre saying...

You don't believe the regime regularly tortured people?

Heyo

[Tempest]

3. Grain of salt

I believe what he is saying is that these stories should be taken with a grain of salt, considering the lies told in the past about Saddam's regime.

[Columbia]

12. I've seen these people

With their ears and tongues cut off. Not pretty. The ear thing is standard fare for desertion. Tongues are for speaking out against the regime. You're among the lucky ones if you only get a body part chopped off. The others get imprisoned, tortured, and killed.

[Eye and Monkey]

14. "The others get imprisoned, tortured, and killed." - present tense?

No offense intended. Is that an unintentional grammatical error, or are you saying that it continues under the current regime?

[Columbia]

15. Got. It's late.

[Eye and Monkey]

16. cheers.

I've seen it firsthand, too. In quite a number of places.

[Born Free]

18. article suggest it is opinions

notice the wording, they doctors are claiming they think others did it - note they ar enot saying they actually saw it done, or can prove it was done, this may be more misleading news from the white house

[Columbia]

20. No matter who did it, it was still done

[Eye and Monkey]

21. I can't speak firsthand regarding Iraq. I have seen it in other countries.

Firsthand.

[Noon_Blue_Apples]

4. its hard to know

when your government and media lie constantly.

you understand the incubator thing was BS?



B

[J. Fitzgerald]

6. IRAQ'S USE OF TORTURE

According to Amnesty International, Saddam's goons have been torturing prisoners for years. I have split feelings about the war in Iraq, and I'm gald we're finally getting the heck out of there, but I gotta admit
I'm glad they captured Saddam. He and his sons abused and raped women and tortured prisoners just for speaking up against his government.

[radwriter0555]

26. er there is no proof of the allegations of which you speak. So far ONE

SINGLE victim has come forward on the alleged torture and NO rape victims at all have spoken under any credible circumstances.

None of these fairy tales has been confirmed.

It's all BULLSHIT.

[Free_Thinking1]

29. Not accurate at all

I watched a special on TV (20/20, Dateline, one of those) where they interviewed the Iraqi national soccer team. They had many stories of players being tortured for not performing well.

I don't consider reports of torture and rape to be fairy tales, maybe in your warped world they are.

It is a very well known and documented fact that Saddam is a murderer and a torturer.

[J. Fitzgerald]

5. IRAQI Doctors and Scientists

I've been doing research on what is happening, not only to Iraqi Doctors, but to Iraqi scientists also. I have combed through dozens of news sites, including several arab news sites who offer news in english.
There are many different accounts of what is going on with all the doctors and scientists that were on Saddam's payroll.

Evidently various doctors and scientists that were on Saddam's payroll have been turning up dead, murdered. During the last few months nine Iraq scientists and three doctors have been murdered. This has been going on for awhile actuially. Doctors and scientist started turning up dead just before the war in Iraq started. Many have fled the country and have sought 'employment' in Iran and Syria, and who knows where else. Evidently there are people who don't want these Iraqi doctors and scientists to talk. Everyone knows there is no WMD in Iraq to be found today, but the doctors and scientists that were working for Saddam evidently had information that needed to be 'silenced'.

[radwriter0555]

27. yes, the ones who would tell the truth, have turned up dead...

glad someone else noticed this too.

Which leaves no one to verify the web of lies told by the bush regime to destroy saddam.

[Roaming]

7. I believe these doctors; most of them remained silent until after

they knew Hussein was captured. People were terrified to talk about it until they were sure the existing regime was destroyed. It confirms and totally agrees with hundreds of other testimonies about the torture that was going on. Cutting off the ear was a favorite punishment of Hussein, especially those sadistic sons of his. I'm surprised they didn't just lop them off with rusty knives and instead had doctors do it. Sickening.

[nonbelief]

8. Iraqi ears and Saudi hands

It is common practice in Saudi Arabia for thieves and political criminals to have their hands surgically amputated as punishment. When's the last time you heard of Americans surveying the Saudi doctors who perform those procedures?

In Tibet, before the Chinese takeover, it was common practice for Buddhist monks to gouge out the eyes or amputate the limbs of serfs who stole food from monastary agricultural holdings.

Mutilation is a common form of punishment that still takes place today, all over the world, even in many countries that are supposedly staunch friends of the U.S.A...

But apparently it's only bad when Saddam did it..

[daleo]

9. This certainly has propaganda elements

"Iraqi doctors were forced to cut off ears, falsify reports on torture and participate in other human rights abuses during Saddam Hussein's regime, a survey of physicians there found.

Fewer than 10 percent of the 98 doctors surveyed said they had performed such abuses, but their responses indicated they believed human rights abuses by other physicians were not uncommon."

Note that 10% reported participating, while 50% said they thought others did. The valid statistic here is the 10% (bad enough), not the 50%. It is akin to being asked whether you cheat on your income tax or whether you think others do. Naturally, the second item is bound to give a much higher and more dramatic answer than the first.

Also, it is not specified what the "other human rights abuses" were in the 10% who did admit to these practices. The article leads one to assume they are on par with cutting off ears, but doesn't actually say this. Without knowing this, it is hard to know what to make of the report.

"The results appear in Wednesday's Journal of the American Medical Association."

[AlienGirl]

10. Ethics: should they be tried for human rights abuses?

Should any doctors who participated in the torture and mutilations be punished for human rights abuses?

Tucker

[Eye and Monkey]

13. you mean the US military's MDs who observe the torture in Guantanamo?

[Free_Thinking1]

30. So you don't believe that Iraqis are tortured

because there isn't enough proof, but you believe that American servicemen torture prisoners based upon one or two reports?

[Eye and Monkey]

32. No. You've completely mischaracterized my comment.

As a matter of fact, in a post above, I point out that I have actually seen such situations firsthand.

Elaborating, I have personally been in situations in which I had to directly react to the FACT that MDs had been forced to perform such surgeries, by a number of regimes in other countries. As I said above, I cannot attest to the situation in Iraq. However, based on personal, direct experience, I can attest that it is more frequent than most unexposed westerners would imagine.

In the post directly above, I am pointing out that there are American military MDs associated with the imprisonment of some 600 Guanatanamo inmates who have not been tried, much less convicted. Of what I have read and the photos that I have seen, the conditions of their transport and imprisonment constitute a type of torture, irrespective of any interrogation techniques that might be used.

Further, I think that I am alluding to my belief that the current US administration is guilty of numerous and flagrant human rights abuses.

It would do you well should you notice that the US has resisted efforts for the International Red Cross and other recognized organizations to evaluate the conditions of the prisoners at Guanatanamo. Again, I have been personally involved in Red Cross visits to prisons in many areas of the world, including prisons in which military prisoners were held. A number of the most notorious regimes in recent history have permitted the Red Cross relatively frequent and impromptu access to prisons, while the current US administration does not.

No offense intended, you so entirely mischaracterized my posts that perhaps you might change your moniker to "Free Association" or "Thinking on Auto-pilot".

[icymist]

11. Saddam tortured people when the US supported him and

Saddam tortured people when the US was against him, as well as lots of other brutal regimes in the world. Are we supposed to suddenly be shocked to know that this has been going on?

[ze_dscherman]

17. Why is this replayed right now?

I remember these accusations were in the news shortly after the invasions. As well, I won't deny this really happened, but the question is on what scale. the difference of doctors who said "I did it" and those who said "I believe others did it" is telling of a regime that was based on the evocation of fear.

Also, it should be remembered, that most cruel or even capital punishment for desertes is/was not an uncommon thing. This is no excuse for such atrocities, but things should be seen in a perspective.

Most states on this planet also consider the death penalty, especially when imposed on non-adults and the mentally ill or retarded (as it is practiced in some U.S. states), as a cruel and most deplorable punishment.

[lostnfound]

19. No surprise and a horrible tragedy

Let's not let our healthy skepticism (i.e., the fake Kuwaiti-incubator-babies story) or the fact that such polls are taken selectively (to give evidence of Iraqi torture while ignoring somewhat-similar treatment in countries that are friends of the US like Saudi Arabia) block us from balance or compassion...

[tlcandie]

22. orf the fact that this is NEWSMAX?

/coughs to clear throat

:hi:

Would Pakistan, Haiti (now that Aristide is out), and Libyia be included in the 'tortured/torturing' category and yes, please do not forget Gitmo and all those 'secretive' US hiding places for their prisoners in suspension.

[Kelvin Mace]

24. NewsDAY, not NewsMAX

Just to clarify.

David Allen
Publisher, CEO, Janitor
Plan Nine Publishing
http://www.plan9.org

[radwriter0555]

28. newsday is a murdock owned moonie rag

as well.

not credible at all.

[tlcandie]

31. Thanks for correcting me!! I had just woke up and wasn't all here ..

:hi: Thanks again my bad on confusing the two!

[Judi Lynn]

23. Here's an article by Christoper Torchia, who contributed to the article

as it said at the bottom.

This one may bring back some very odd impressions to some DU'ers who already read a little about this nightmare:

Afghan who buried dead Taliban wonders 'what's all the fuss?'

Topic: Military Situation

Archives: September 2002


cleveland.com
09/02/02
by Christopher Torchia

Dasht-E-Leili, Afghanistan
- A scattering of human bones, tufts of hair and robes marks the sandy burial site of possibly hundreds of Taliban who were captured during the war in Afghanistan last year.

The mass grave lies just off a main road on the outskirts of the northern Afghan town of Shibergan and is a five-minute drive from the jail where U.S.-backed Afghan forces held many Taliban prisoners. A former commander whose men had the task of burying the bodies guided several reporters to the site Saturday.

Most of those buried died of injuries suffered in fighting before they were captured, said the commander, who identified himself only as Taher. But people who claim to be witnesses say many of the prisoners suffocated during their four-day-long transport to Shibergan in unventilated metal shipping containers.
(snip)

There are no guarantees that an investigation would lead to the truth, as little has been done to prevent tampering at the grave. Fragments of jawbones with teeth still intact were visible above the mass grave, as well as a plastic cuff of the type used by U.S. troops to bind prisoners. American forces interrogated many captives.
(snip/)http://www.afgha.com/index.php?af=article&sid=16268

[radwriter0555]

25. Yeah right. Put this right up there with all the 'rape camps' and torture

cells, oh and those "MASS GRAVES" filled with allll the millions of people saddam killed! LOL!

Newsday is a nice little murdoch owned moonie rag.

It's all BULLSHIT.

[yardwork]

33. I believe that this happened in Iraq.

It happens all over the world. It isn't a fairy tale. It isn't made up.

I was against invading Iraq and I still think it was a terrible thing to do. We can't run around the world invading every country that tortures its people, or we'd be at war with at least 3/4 of the world.

There are peaceful ways to bring pressure on governments to stop this kind of thing. Our invasion of Iraq just made those peaceful ways more difficult.

Bush's invasion of Iraq made the world more unstable, which always helps dictators and opportunists.

There's no need to pretend that Saddam was a good guy. He and his people are incredibly evil and violent. That is the simple truth.