Federal Reserve Made $47.4 Billion in 2009

[Truth2Tell]

Source: New York Times

By SEWELL CHAN
April 21, 2010

WASHINGTON — The Federal Reserve transferred $47.4 billion, a record sum, to the Treasury Department last year, a result of the central bank’s actions to support the fragile housing market.

The transfer to the public coffers rose roughly 50 percent, or $15.7 billion, from $31.7 billion transferred in 2008, the Fed announced on Wednesday in releasing its annual financial statements, which were audited by Deloitte.

“Central banking is a great business,” joked Vincent R. Reinhart, a former director of monetary affairs at the Fed.

Unlike private banks, the Fed does not exist for the purpose of making a profit, though it inevitably does so. Historically, it paid no interest on the currency and bank reserves that represent its liabilities, while it made interest on the Treasury securities that make up its assets.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/22/business/economy/22fed.html

[SDuderstadt]

1. You realize that this means the Fed...

gave the "profit" to us, right?

Do you have a problem with that?

[Truth2Tell]

2. Do I have a problem with that?

Why would you ask? I posted the story with no commentary whatsoever.

But since you bring it up, could you please explain exactly how that works? How was that money "given" to "us?" I'd like to better understand.

[SDuderstadt]

3. Look at your headline.....

Does that really tell the whole story? Not really. But the first line tells you a lot: "The Federal Reserve transferred $47.4 billion, a record sum, to the Treasury Department last year"

The Federal Reserve is required by Federal law to rebate all of its proceeds minus operating costs back to the U.S. Treasury. That's the "us". It's the same place our tax revenues go. The Federal Reserve is a self-financed independent federal agency and makes its money through fees charged to member banks and interest it earns on the Treasury securities it holds. As stated previously, it rebates everything above and beyond operating costs to the U.S. Treasury Department...us.

I get really tired of the anti-Federal Reserve nonsense and, in some cases, outright propaganda that is posted in DU, often from people who have watched idiotic movies like "Zeitgeist" or "Money as Debt" and have uncritically bought into their claptrap. I am, by no means, accusing your post of this, but I think DUers would be well-served to gain a better and accurate understanding of how the Fed actually works,

[Truth2Tell]

4. It's not "my" headline. It's the headline from The Times,

which is what LBN rules require we post.

Take up your beef with them.

[SDuderstadt]

5. Simple question....

why did you post this?

[Truth2Tell]

6. Because I think annual financial statements of the Fed

are newsworthy. And because the relatively ramped-up lending activity is worthy of discussion.

[SDuderstadt]

7. Dude....

when you start prior threads with subject lines like: "Federal Reserve Resorts to Open Blackmail of the American People", I seriously doubt your real motive here is merely because you believe the "annual financial statements of the Fed are newsworthy. And because the relatively ramped-up lending activity is worthy of discussion".


You have very little grasp of how the Fed actually works.

[Truth2Tell]

8. you should link that

as I recall it was a good thread.

[SDuderstadt]

9. Why don't YOU link it?

You're the one who embarrassed yourself with your lack of knowledge of the Fed, dude.

[Truth2Tell]

10. What's entertaining here is that I posted an article

from the New York Times without commentary therefore giving you nothing to flame. So you searched out some old thread of mine to flame instead. Classic.

[SDuderstadt]

12. No, dude...

I went back because you usually post anti-Fed stuff and I suspected your motive here was to get some people to falsely believe the Fed is a maney-making operation. I hardly think correcting the record is "flaming", dude.

[JDPriestly]

11. SDuderstadt, maybe more of us would understand the FED if they

were more transparent in their dealings. Secrecy causes suspicion and distrust.
And the FED is too secretive for this information age.

[SDuderstadt]

13. Ummm, dude....

I know a lot of things about the Federal Reserve and I'm no insider. Many people who complain about the secrecy of the Fed don't even try to learn about it. Have you?

Having said that, I am quite in favor of more Fed transparency.

[YankmeCrankme]

15. What's with the constant use of the term dude?

Just curious because it sounds insulting when you use it and people tend to react to what they feel.

[wildbilln864]

34. I think that's the intent IMHO....

of course. :shrug:

[SDuderstadt]

35. It's an expression of frustration...n/t

[boppers]

40. It's an expression of mutual respect, dude.

You have no title, or honor, over me, nor do I have title, or honor, over you.

We're just dudes.

[boppers]

14. Too secretive.... love that charge.

Obama's too secretive about his birth certificate?
The 9/11 commission was too secretive in their report?
East Anglia's CRU was too secretive with their data?

Typically, the charge is tantamount to this: If an agency/group/entity is saying things that don't match my pre-conceived notions, it's because they're hiding something (or I don't understand the topic, which means they're hiding something from me, personally).

Start here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Reserve_System

Read *ALL* of it. Not just the wiki page, follow all the footnotes and links (for example, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Administrative_Procedure_Act outlines one way they are required to be transparent) and read those sources, as well.

Then go here and read all of this site as well:
http://www.federalreserve.gov/sitemap.htm

....or, alternately, stop complaining that "the FED is too secretive for this information age." when the very same information age has made this vast wealth of information available, online, 24/7, free, exposed to anybody who wants to invest the time to learn.

The third option, of course, is to still bitch that secrets are being hidden, even when the sources have just been spoon-fed to you, but that might be a wee bit hypocritical.

[JDPriestly]

21. I watched as members of Congress tried to get permission

from members of Obama's economic team who now work or have worked for the FED to permit Congress to arrange for an audit of the FED. It was no dice. To my knowledge no audit of the FED has been performed. They are a very secretive organization.

[boppers]

41. They are constantly audited.

Here's how this game works:
1. Cash for the poor is created.
2. Asshats file endless lawsuits and FOIA requests.
3. Claims are made about "transparency" and "wasting money"
4. Millions, or Billions, are wasted.
5. repeat step two.
6. The poor are fucked.

The Fed is audited daily, on a massive scale. Opponents want more of step #2.

[mbperrin]

43. The Fed is in court even now after losing the first two rounds which

would force it to disclose who got bailout money and how much. The "audit" you speak of is numbers on paper with no names behind, and all at face value, with no forward-looking statements on risk; in short, worthless for any type of decision-making to those reading.

http://www.sfexaminer.com/opinion/columns/oped_contributors/Lift-the-Feds-veil-of-secrecy-on-bailout-money-91000004.html


Lift the Fed’s veil of secrecy on bailout money
By: Daniel J. Popeo
Special to The Examiner
April 16, 2010

Washington, D.C.’s massive and unprecedented $3 trillion taxpayer-funded bailout of failed institutions has given rise to legitimate bipartisan concerns about the nature of the Federal Reserve Bank’s activity, especially given the impenetrable veil of secrecy under which it operates. The once-clear line in America that separates the private sector from the public sector is quickly disappearing, and Washington is emerging as the financial, as well as political, capital of the country.

In such a troubling climate, the need for government accountability and transparency has never been greater. Following the Fed’s use of trillions in tax dollars to help bailout a hand-picked group of unknown firms, many news organizations and public interest groups filed Freedom of Information Act requests to learn the basic details of the bailout scheme — namely, who received what, in exchange for how much collateral and why?

The FOIA is a federal law designed to help citizens hold their government accountable by granting broad public access to federal government records. After the government repeatedly blocked such disclosure efforts, Bloomberg News Service, among others, filed suit. The case, Bloomberg LP v. Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System, goes to the very core of why Congress enacted FOIA in the first place — to empower an informed citizenry to be a watchdog over its government. After a federal district judge ruled in favor of Bloomberg on the merits, the Fed dug its heels in even deeper and appealed the order.

The 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals recently affirmed the district court’s ruling against the government and ordered the Fed, yet again, to disclose the names of all bailout recipients and the amounts they received. The decision was a victory for the Washington Legal Foundation, which, along with other leading public interest groups, filed a brief in the appeals court urging strict adherence to FOIA and its goal of transparency.

But even in the face of two adverse federal court rulings, the Fed has so far refused to disclose the identities of those who received the emergency bailout funds or the known amounts of those highly controversial “loans.” The Fed has until May 3 to decide whether to seek further appellate review. Meanwhile, the Clearing House Association LLC, a consortium of banks who intervened in the case on the side of the Fed, has announced that it’s prepared to take its fight against disclosure to the Supreme Court, if necessary.


more at link.............

[JDPriestly]

22. I watched as the FED refused to agree to the requests of members of Congress for an audit

of the FED. The FED is very, very secretive. It exists for bankers, not for the public. It is mostly controlled by bankers, not the public. It serves the bankers, not the public.

When Alan Greenspan was the chair of the FED, his easy money policies, low interest rates and generosity to the banks helped ruin our country.

And the FED does all of that behind the backs of most Americans without our knowledge -- and on our dimes.

The FED should be replaced by an institution that is open to scrutiny and that answers to the American people and not to the international banking cartel. Germany owns a real interest in its national bank. We should too.

The FED makes no effort to be transparent or to communicate in terms ordinary people can understand. All parts of our government should communicate with Americans in plain English. And the FED should be part of our government, not some independent bank-owned, bank-run entity.

I am not a dude. Never was. Never will be. I just don't have the equipment to be a dude. That's my message to both boppers and duderoo.

[SDuderstadt]

33. "It is mostly controlled by bankers, not the public"

I think if you look up the bios of the Board of Governors of the Fed, you'll find that they are much more likely to be economists and academics, rather than "bankers". Beyond that, the board of directors of the regional Federal Reserve banks don't really exercise a policy role at all, but exist to implement the monetary policy of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve.

In fact, if I'm not mistaken, there are regulations/safeguards in place to make sure that the member banks cannot control the regional Federal Reserve banks (even though the board of directors doesn't really "control" the regional FR banks as noted above, anyhow).

For example:

Here's the Board of Directors of the Dallas Federal Reserve Bank:

Class C
James T. Hackett
(Chairman)
Chairman, President and CEO
Anadarko Petroleum Corp.
Houston, Texas

Class A
Pete Cook
CEO
First National Bank in Alamogordo
Alamogordo, New Mexico

Class B
Robert A. Estrada
Chairman
Estrada Hinojosa & Company, Inc.
Dallas, Texas

Class A
Joe Kim King
CEO
Brady National Bank
Brady, Texas

Class A
George F. Jones, Jr.
President and CEO
Texas Capital Bancshares, Inc, and
CEO
Texas Capital Bank
Dallas, Texas
Class C

Herb Kelleher
(Deputy Chairman)
Founder and Executive Chairman Emeritus
Southwest Airlines Co.
Dallas, Texas

Class B
James B. Bexley
Professor, Finance
Sam Houston State University
Huntsville, Texas

Class B
Margaret H. Jordan
President and CEO
Margaret Jordan Group
Dallas, Texas

Class C
Myron E. Ullman III
Chairman and CEO
J.C. Penney Company, Inc.
Plano, Texas

Federal Advisory Council Member
Richard W. Evans, Jr.
Chairman and CEO
Cullen/Frost Bankers, Inc.
San Antonio, Texas


El Paso
D. Kirk Edwards
(Chairman)
President
MacLondon Royalty Co.
Odessa, Texas

Laura Mathers Conniff
Qualifying Broker
Mathers Realty, Inc.
Las Cruces, New Mexico

Robert E. McKnight, Jr.
Partner
McKnight Ranch Company
Fort Davis, Texas

Larry L. Patton
President and CEO
Bank of the West
El Paso, Texas

Cindy J. Ramos-Davidson
(Deputy Pro Tem)
President and CEO
El Paso Hispanic Chamber of Commerce
El Paso, Texas

Martha I. Dickason
President
DM Dickason Personnel Services
El Paso, Texas

Gerald J. Rubin
Chairman, President and CEO
Helen of Troy Ltd.
El Paso, Texas


Houston
Douglas L. Foshee
(Chairman)
President and CEO
El Paso Corp.
Houston, Texas

Jorge A. Bermudez
Principal and Managing Partner
Byebrook Group
College Station, Texas

Jodie L. Jiles
Managing Director
RBC Capital Markets
Houston, Texas

Ann B. Stern
Executive Vice President
Texas Children's Hospital
Houston, Texas
Paul W. Hobby
(Deputy Pro Tem)
Chairman and CEO
Alpheus Communications
Houston, Texas

Kirk S. Hachigian
Chairman and CEO
Cooper Industries Ltd.
Houston, Texas

Paul B. Murphy, Jr.
CEO
Amegy Bank, NA
Houston, Texas


San Antonio
Steven R. Vandegrift
(Chairman)
Founder and President
SRV Holdings
Austin, Texas

Catherine M. Burzik
President and CEO
Kinetic Concepts, Inc.
San Antonio, Texas

Ygnacio D. Garza
Partner
Long Chilton, LLP
Brownsville, Texas

Guillermo F. Trevino
President
Southern Distributing
Laredo, Texas

Ricardo Romo
(Deputy Pro Tem)
President
University of Texas at San Antonio
San Antonio, Texas

Thomas E. Dobson
Chairman and CEO
Whataburger Restaurants, LP
Corpus Christi, Texas

G. P. Singh
President and CEO
Gur Parsaad Properties, Ltd.
San Antonio, Texas

http://www.dallasfed.org/fed/board.cfm


So, out of 30 board members, only 6 (or 20% are bankers. The rest are business people, academics and heads of community organizations. I think that pretty much disproves your claim. I also think you'd be suprised at the great amount of information that is publicly available about the Fed.

[Trillo]

47. Looks like a who's who of corporatism. Not one identifies as "citizen".

If there's a private party, a regular citizen who identifies as a citizen on that board, I didn't see it. not one says "U.S. Citizen" or "American citizen". They all seem to have "titles", and each one seems to be a corporate title.

[Trillo]

48. self-delete

[SDuderstadt]

49. Nevermind....n/t

[boppers]

38. Dude, you have the equipment to be a dude.

It's a satirical statement, mocking the city-country divide, changed by surf culture to be genderless.

[nyy1998]

18. Actually most of this information was probably taught to you

in your high school economics class. That's where I learned that the Fed Reserve has to hand over their profits to the Treasury.

[clixtox]

17. I am curious...

What are the annual "operating costs" and the costs associated with any other liabilities/expenses of the "Federal Reserve", say for the last decade?

Are these numbers audited and transparent, readily available to all of those interested, like income/expense and asset/liability balance sheets of publicly traded corporations?

It looks like you are the expert...

[SDuderstadt]

19. Did you read the 2nd paragraph of the...

OP/NYT article? Did you see where it talked about the Fed having released their financial statements for their last fiscal year? Did you see the part that said they had been audited by Deloitte?

You can go to the Fed's website and find the financial statements in question. If you want to drill down deeper, I'm pretty sure that each regional Federal Reserve bank does the same thing. As noted by several other posters, the tone of your post makes it sound like because the Federal Reserve didn't hand-deliver their financial statements to your door, they don't want the public to see them. If you'd bother to read up on the Federal Reserve, you'd also find out that they are subject to audit by, not only the GAO, but also by an outside accounting firm.

As I stated upthread, far too many members of DU have gotten their "information" about the Fed from movies like "Zeitgeist" or "Money as Debt" without realizing the extent to which they have been duped. If you can't locate the financial statements on your own, let me know and I'll provide you with a link to them.

[clixtox]

23. How about who owns the outstanding shares in the Federal Reserve Bank...

and do they receive dividends? Do you know that or can you point out the answer with a link?

What do you know about the bill in the House that would require more transparency from the "Fed"?

Do you actually have any knowledge to share, or are you only a "know-it-all" who only writes these sort of posts?

It's OK if your actual knowledge comes from the one NYT article...

[SDuderstadt]

28. Your questions betray your lack of knowledge about...

how the Federal Reserve actually works. The Federal Reserve isn't "owned" by anyone. The Federal Reserve is a self-financed, independent federal agency. The regional Federal Reserve banks are "owned" by its member banks, each of whom receive shares of "subscription stock", but it isn't "ownership" in the way a private, for profit company is "owned".

In another post, someone linked to several good sources of extensive information about the workings of the Fed. In the meantime, let me ask: where do you currently get "information" about the Fed?

[JDPriestly]

24. Enron was subject to an accounting by an outside accounting firm.

We know what that was worth. I assure you that the big mortgage companies were subject to accountings by outside accounting firms. That meant absolutely nothing.

The FED should be absolutely open with Congress about everything it does. It should be subject to, controlled by Congress, not by bankers. The bankers have shown that they are not loyal to the people of the United States -- the ordinary people. The FED should be completely subservient to Congress and the president who represent the people of the United States.

I do not want banks that are owned and controlled to a great extent (even if not primarily or in the majority) by Saudi Arabian princes. That was the case of Citibank, one of the banks that would have had more say in the FED than the entire state of California. The FED should not be controlled by the banks. The FED should be the institution through which Americans control their own economy.

[SDuderstadt]

27. Each one of your posts shows you have little knowledge...

of the way the Federal Reserve actually works. Take, for example, your claim that the Federal Reserve is "controlled by the banks". That's a patently false statement. The Fed is controlled by the Board of Governors, all of whom are appointed by the President and confirmed by the Senate. You might start with learning who they actually are and reading their bios.

The regional Federal Reserve banks are also not "controlled by the banks". Each one is governed by a board of directors and there are rules in place that ensure that member banks do not control these boards. You can confirm this by going to the website of your regional Federal Reserve bank and looking at the bios of the members of the board. You'll find that the majority are representative of the community.

Your posts are so rife with factual errors and outright falsehoods, it's hard to know where to begin. I'm curious...what is your your source of "information" about the Federal Reserve?

[JDPriestly]

29. I thought that all the members of the board of the Federal Reserve are bankers.

Is that also incorrect?

If my sources are not good, why ask me about them?

[SDuderstadt]

30. That is incorrect...

and the reason I am asking where you get your information from is because I sincerely wonder how you are being misinformed.

[JDPriestly]

31. I don't really have a source. I don't know of a reliable source.

I watched hearings in Congress and I read portions of books and news articles that don't say much. If I am misinformed, I assure you, a lot of people are misinformed. When I read about the FED, the information is confusing and makes no sense. That is why I have the impression that the organization is secretive.

[SDuderstadt]

32. "the information is confusing and makes no sense"

I think a better explanation is that it is complex and hard to understand, which is why people fall for anti-Fed propaganda so much. However, there are reliable sources for information about the Fed and several appear here in another post. Spme sources that are NOT reliable are: "Money as Debt", "Freedom to Fascism", "Zeitgeist" and anything that originates with the LaRouchites.

[JDPriestly]

36. Thanks. I will try to investigate further.

[mbperrin]

44. Bios of the Board of Governors reveal their backgrounds as bankers.

Board of Governors runs the Fed. All but one are bankers.



http://www.federalreserve.gov/aboutthefed/bios/board/bernanke.htm

Ben S. Bernanke

Ben S. Bernanke began a second term as Chairman of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System on February 1, 2010. Dr. Bernanke also serves as Chairman of the Federal Open Market Committee, the System's principal monetary policymaking body. He originally took office as Chairman on February 1, 2006, when he also began a 14-year term as a member of the Board. His second term as Chairman ends January 31, 2014, and his term as a Board member ends January 31, 2020.

Before his appointment as Chairman, Dr. Bernanke was Chairman of the President's Council of Economic Advisers, from June 2005 to January 2006.

Dr. Bernanke has already served the Federal Reserve System in several roles. He was a member of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System from 2002 to 2005; a visiting scholar at the Federal Reserve Banks of Philadelphia (1987-89), Boston (1989-90), and New York (1990-91, 1994-96); and a member of the Academic Advisory Panel at the Federal Reserve Bank of New York (1990-2002).

Bernanke: Federal Reserve BANK employee beginning in 1990; 20 years ago. Banker? Yes.


Donald L. Kohn

Donald L. Kohn originally took office on August 5, 2002, as a member of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System for a full term ending January 31, 2016. On June 23, 2006, Dr. Kohn was sworn in as Vice Chairman of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System for a four-year term ending June 23, 2010.

Dr. Kohn was born in November 1942 in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. He received a B.A. in economics in 1964 from the College of Wooster and a Ph.D. in economics in 1971 from the University of Michigan.

Dr. Kohn is a veteran of the Federal Reserve System. Before becoming a member of the Board, he served on its staff as Adviser to the Board for Monetary Policy (2001-02), Secretary of the Federal Open Market Committee (1987-2002), Director of the Division of Monetary Affairs (1987-2001), and Deputy Staff Director for Monetary and Financial Policy (1983-87). He also held several positions in the Board's Division of Research and Statistics: Associate Director (1981-83), Chief of Capital Markets (1978-81), and Economist (1975-78). Dr. Kohn began his career as a Financial Economist at the Federal Reserve Bank of Kansas City (1970-75).

Kohn: Federal Reserve BANK employee beginning in 1970; 40 years ago. Banker? Yes.


Kevin M. Warsh

Kevin M. Warsh took office on February 24, 2006, to fill an unexpired term ending January 31, 2018.

Prior to his appointment to the Board, Mr. Warsh served as Special Assistant to the President for Economic Policy and as Executive Secretary of the National Economic Council from 2002 until February 2006. His primary areas of responsibility included domestic finance, banking, securities, and consumer protection. He advised the President and senior administration officials on issues related to the U.S. economy and capital markets. Mr. Warsh participated in the President's Working Group on Financial Markets and served as the administration's chief liaison to the independent financial regulatory agencies.

From 1995 to 2002, Mr. Warsh was a member of the Mergers & Acquisitions Department of Morgan Stanley & Co., in New York, serving as Vice President and Executive Director. He served as financial adviser to numerous companies across a range of industry sectors, including manufacturing, basic materials, professional services, and technology. In that capacity, Mr. Warsh structured capital markets transactions and facilitated fixed income and equity financings.

Warsh: Responsible for BANK policy in Washington since 2002; M&A for Morgan Stanley beginning in 1995; 15 years ago. Banker partner and regulator? Yes.


Elizabeth A. Duke

Elizabeth A. Duke took office on August 5, 2008, to fill an unexpired term ending January 31, 2012.

Prior to her appointment to the Board, Ms. Duke was Senior Executive Vice President and Chief Operating Officer of TowneBank, a Virginia-based community bank. Prior to this, she was an Executive Vice President at Wachovia Bank, and an Executive Vice President at SouthTrust Bank. Earlier in her career, Ms. Duke was President and Chief Executive Officer of Bank of Tidewater, based in Virginia Beach, Virginia.

Ms. Duke served on the Board of Directors of the American Bankers Association from 1999 to 2006, and served as its Chairman from 2004 to 2005. She also served on the Board of Directors and as President of the Virginia Bankers Association. From 1998 to 2000, Ms. Duke served on the Board of Directors of the Federal Reserve Bank of Richmond. She has also served as a member of the Fannie Mae National Advisory Council.

Duke: COO of Townebank, Exec VP Wachovia Bank, Exec VP Southtrust Bank. Banker? Yes.


Daniel K. Tarullo

Daniel K. Tarullo took office on January 28, 2009, to fill an unexpired term ending January 31, 2022.

Prior to his appointment to the Board, Mr. Tarullo was Professor of Law at Georgetown University Law Center, where he taught courses in international financial regulation, international law, and banking law. Prior to joining the Georgetown Law faculty, Mr. Tarullo held several senior positions in the Clinton administration.

From 1993 to 1998, Mr. Tarullo served, successively, as Assistant Secretary of State for Economic and Business Affairs, Deputy Assistant to the President for Economic Policy, and Assistant to the President for International Economic Policy. He also served as a principal on both the National Economic Council and the National Security Council. From 1995 to 1998, Mr. Tarullo also served as President Clinton's personal representative to the G7/G8 group of industrialized nations.

Before joining the Clinton administration, he served as Chief Counsel for Employment Policy on the staff of Senator Edward M. Kennedy, and practiced law in Washington, D.C. He also worked in the Antitrust Division of the Department of Justice and as Special Assistant to the Undersecretary of Commerce. From 1981 to 1987, Mr. Tarullo taught at Harvard Law School.

Mr. Tarullo has also served as a senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations and as a non-resident senior fellow at the Center for American Progress. Mr. Tarullo has also held a visiting professorship at Princeton University.

Tarullo: Various political appointments as financial regulator and adviser. Banker? No.

[SDuderstadt]

46. Let me make sure I get this straight...

the only banker on that list was actually Duke. The rest came from precisely the kind of backgrounds I described, yet you're using their prior experience working for the Fed to classify them as "bankers"?

You're being quite intellectually dishonest here.

[mbperrin]

50. No, people who work for Federal Reserve BANKS are bankers.

Why is that so difficult?

Why would it even be surprising?

Why are you so keen to push the idea that bankers are shunned from running the Fed?

I can't tell if you're being dishonest, obtuse, or simply driven by another agenda. Help me here.

[SDuderstadt]

51. I never once said that "bankers are shunned from running the Fed"...

But, it's clear that the only member of the Board that came from a banking background is Duke. If I am employed as an economist with the Federal Reserve, does that make me a banker?

I can't tell if you're being dishonest, obtuse, or simply driven by another agenda

If you're going to misrepresent what I actually said and resort to backhanded name-calling, we're done.

[mbperrin]

52. Nothing backhanded about it. You insisted I'm doing something wrong.

Read those bios again. When someone works for the Federal Reserve BANK of wherever, they're not a banker?

An economics degree makes you never a banker? Well, then, I guess my ten years in banking with my degree in economics meant I never was a banker. Weird.

Cause my bosses thought I was.

You are misrepresenting, not me. I asked you to differentiate, and you wouldn't.

Now, good day to you. Have a nice life.

[SDuderstadt]

53. You lost me at "obtuse", dude....

and, as I pointed out, I never said the "Federal Reserve shuns bankers". That was your strawman. Done, dude.

[groundloop]

16. Wow, I'm feeling the love vibes this morning

[nyy1998]

20. Some people apparently haven't had their coffee yet.

I'm here all week folks.:+

[conspirator]

25. WTF? They print the money. They can make as much as they want

The problem is that inflation will keep the middle class poor forever.

[SDuderstadt]

26. No, the Fed does not "print the money"...

that's the Bureau of Engraving and Printing, a part of the Treasury Department. Quit spreading misinformation.

[joshcryer]

37. The money is interest bearing the moment of creation, therefore it is tied to assets.

It is not magically printed.

[dipsydoodle]

39. tied to assets ?

:rofl:

[boppers]

42. Interest is an asset.

So is projected value.

GAAP weeps.

[mbperrin]

45. Interest earned goes on the income statement, same as interest

payable. Is not an asset, but part of the income statement.

Debt is an asset to banks, a liability to borrowers.

Projected value is just that: a guess, and should be accompanied by forward-looking statements.