Sanders: Senate has the votes to pass public option via reconciliation

[kpete]

Source: The Hill


Sanders: Senate has the votes to pass public option via reconciliation
By Jordan Fabian - 02/25/10 11:16 AM ET

The Senate has the 50 votes necessary to pass a public health insurance option using the budget reconciliation process, Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) said Thursday.

Sanders, a self-described "democratic socialist" who supports the government-run plan, urged President Barack Obama to push for the public option even though the possibility of passing it appeared to die this week.

"I think we do have 50 votes in the Senate for a public option and frankly I don't know why the president has not put it in and I hope that we can inject it," Sanders said on MSNBC. "I think it's a very important part of healthcare reform."

It's not clear if Sanders's remarks will encourage leaders to take up the public option, but they will surely give hope to his liberal supporters who have put pressure on Congress to pass a public plan.

Read more: http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/83641-sanders-senate-has-the-votes-to-pass-public-option-via-reconciliation

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[pleah]

2. K&R

[Pirate Smile]

3. They will have to do it in public so they should all be willing to say it now.

[Jefferson23]

4. K&R

[Kingofalldems]

5. Yeah..... yeah!

K and R :shrug:

[caraher]

6. Don't we need 51?

The difference, sadly, could be significant if somehow it comes up for a vote

[villager]

8. Once you have fifty, you get Biden...

And if you get fifty for the public option -- somehow -- Biden will have to vote for it. Even this diffident White House would have to support it, at that point...

[4lbs]

17. Doesn't the VP come into play ONLY if there's a tie? If the vote is 50-48 because several Senators

abstain, Biden couldn't vote because it's not a tie, and the bill would fail because it didn't get 51 votes.

[villager]

22. That's a good question!

And I don't know the answer off the top of my head...!

[AllyCat]

24. Then we wheel them into the room in straight jackets and get a ventriloquist

to speak for them. Seriously, we need to get these Dems to stop playing nice and pull the same crap the Repukes did to their own kind for decades. They show up and they vote. Let the American people see them vote this down, then don't fund their campaigns and watch them wither and be replaced with someone else.

[Big Orange Jeff]

28. That's exactly right, the VP only votes to break ties...

...since he's not elected member of the body itself, per Article 1, Section 3, Clause 4 of the Constitution.

[Jackpine Radical]

36. I think a simple majority of those voting carries it.

50-48, the 50 win. 50-50, Biden breaks it.

[wryter2000]

37. Not exactly

We'd win 50 to 48. A simple majority wins except for a filibuster. :hi:

[No Elephants]

72. I thought votes that will result in increasing the deficit require 3/5 ?

[karynnj]

78. The reconciliation fixes will not increase the deficit

That is the ONLY part that will still needs to pass the Senate.

[No Elephants]

82. My bad. Forgot to mention that the Constitution requires 2/3 votes sometimes. Those occasions have

nothing to do with health care reform, though.

[quaker bill]

40. No

A bill could pass with 30 votes, if the other side had only 29. This could happen if 31 were absent or abstained from voting. 51 is only the nmuber if all Senators are present and voting, in that case it takes 50+Biden or a vote of 51 to 50. If only 98 are present, then a vote of 50 to 48 would be a victory. Absence does not count as a "no" vote.

[4lbs]

41. Ah. Good to know. I was always fuzzy on that aspect. Good to know it's a majority of those voting

instead of a majority of the Senators in Congress.

[No Elephants]

71. You are correct about the Constitution as to the VP voting only when there is a tie, but I wonder if

anyone would abstain from this vote?

[Big Orange Jeff]

26. Self-delete

Self-delete

[Dulcinea]

65. So do it already!

WTF are you waiting for??!!

[Mithreal]

9. How many times do we have to say 50 + 1VP. Even Cheney was a tie breaker.

[caraher]

13. DOH!

OK, yeah, 50-50 is a tie and the VP can break ties. Thanks for reminding me!

[No Elephants]

73. A tie is a tie. It does not have to be 50-50.

IIRC, the Constitution says three things about Senate votes

1. A quorum is a simply majority of all Senators.

2. The Senate will make rules for its own governance.

3. In the event of a tie, the President of the Senate (who is the V.P.) votes.

If the Senate rule is that the vote of a majority of those present and voting carries the matter, what if only 70 are present and voting, and the vote is 35 to 35?

Okay, thirty absences/abstentions are unlikely, especially on the health care bill, but the point is 50 50 is not the only possible tie.

[caraher]

74. I never said there weren't *other* ties

But on the theory that there won't be 100 votes on HCR, then why are we even worrying - let's just try to vote when the Republican's aren't looking? ;)

[karynnj]

79. The rules require 50 votes, 51 if there is a tie

So, it passes, with 50/48

It passes with 50/50 and Biden voting yes.

It fails with 49/0.

(Think of the possible mischief otherwise. Assume we have 48 votes. Imagine now when primaries are near, Reid tells Democrats to stay in touch and in town - then about 3pm on Thursday he schedules a vote for later that night or Friday morning - I'm not sure on the notice that must be given. (Remember Obama got caught in NH when the Kyl/Lieberman vote took place because the day before Reid said that the vote was not coming soon) All it would take was for 5 "no" voters not to scramble back.

[No Elephants]

80. What is the number of the Senate Rule to which you are referring? Or do you have a link?

Everything I've seen, including a pdf from senate.gov, defines a simple majority vote of the Senate as 50% of those voting, plus 1 vote.

Several posts upthread are also to that effect.

Is there a different definition of "simple majority" for purposes of a reconciliation vote?

As far as Obama and Kyl Lieberman, maybe Reid did Obama a favor.

[karynnj]

84. Looking for links, I apologize - you are right

Your last comment is interesting. Obama did state at roughly the time of the vote that he would have voted "no" and the vote was not close.

[mzmolly]

7. He "thinks" they have

the votes.

[Mithreal]

10. You can help whip the votes yourself. Both my Senators support

a strong public option but will not sign the letter. There is enough support in the Senate. Next might as well ask if average Americans on all sides support public option for everyone. There will be plenty of time for naysaying this when the fight is over.

http://whipcongress.com/

[mzmolly]

11. I called the one senator from my state who has not signed on

yesterday. Thanks for the info for those who have not done so. :hi:

[Mithreal]

15. You're welcome.

Don't hesitate to thank ones who signed already or adopt another state.

My Senator Cantwell's office spoke positively about out-of-state phone calls. Patty Murray's Seattle office whines about being "phonebanked." They are not just being hammered by phonebankers, they are hearing the voice of their constituents. Some would prefer we only organize only when they tell us to do so.

If you have time, then call, doesn't even need to cost anything, toll free. If you don't have time but money, give a little to DFA or another authentic grassroots organization leading the effort.

https://www.democracyforamerica.com/contribute

LIST OF TOLL FREE CONGRESS SWITCHBOARD PHONE NUMBERS

1-800-828-0498

1-800-459-1887

1-800-614-2803

1-866-340-9281

1-866-338-1015

1-866-220-0044

1-877-851-6437

Thanks to orleans for the list.

[PassingFair]

66. They should bloody well sign it, with a note that they don't think it's strong ENOUGH.

Fucking sign it with objections, so this
White House stops hiding behind Nelson
and Baucus and their ilk.

[Oregone]

12. What kind of public option?

Heh, sorry to piss on the parade.


Well, they have no excuse not to deliver something, but with this crowd, it could damn well be anything and theyll be humping at the Congressmen's legs

[Mithreal]

16. Give them the courage to stand up for simple majority.

[bkozumplik]

27. who are you referring to on your comment?

"Well, they have no excuse not to deliver something, but with this crowd, it could damn well be anything and theyll be humping at the Congressmen's legs"

If "they'll be humping at the congressmen's legs" you mean to say that people here arent savvy enough, then to that I say at least we arent the defeatist centerdems who will settle for whatever Obama wants, no matter what that is.
Also, screw you.

If I am misinterpretting your comment-- because its not too clear to me, then please accept my preemptive retraction.

[winyanstaz]

14. K & R

I will keep my fingers crossed but I won't hold my breath.

[KansDem]

18. So do it already, goddammit!!! Let's stop pussyfooting around!!!

This should have been done last year, so we could move on to address other problems facing our country...

The fucking Republicans are LYING when they say "reconciliation" means the "nuclear option."

[burning rain]

19. He also said the Senate would pass a public option befote it passed its no-p.o. bill.

I'm afraid the good senator has little credibility on the prospects of getting a public option, though I certianly don't doubt his commitment to it.

[Dr.Phool]

20. Then, get off their fucking asses

And pass the motherfucker already.

Whoever votes against it WILL be punished.

In some other universe.

[benld74]

21. They may have the votes, BUT nobody has the balls,,,

[Mithreal]

23. Senator Bennet is taking some heat right now.

There is some truth in what you say. If R's are the Party of No, Dems are the Party of You First with many more exceptions every day.

Do you have the backs of the people who are standing up? Call Senator Bennet's office and thank him, I did.

http://whipcongress.com/

[GreenTea]

25. They keep saying it, but the weak-kneed Democratas never use this very legal option as the majority

party that republicans have used so often in the past while in power.

[earcandle]

51. They are not weak kneed. They are greedy for the lobby money and don't want to lose it either.

[Q3JR4]

29. If the dems decide to go it alone with reconciliation

they'd better include the public option. How many conservative democrats can there be in the senate?

I voted, in the last election, for democrats. I did it because I'd hoped--though I had no allusions that my hopes would yield fruit--that they would be better for the country and that we would get some kind of REAL change out of the situation.

If the democrats don't fight for what's popular, they don't deserve to hold onto power. Period. Bottom line, end of the road. How can we make it any more clearer?

Q3JR4.
Former, disaffected D voter who won't support the party in the next election with time, money, or votes if they don't get off their asses and do something for their fellow natural born (corporations need not apply) citizens.

[nradisic]

30. Git 'er done...

For Christ's sake....just do it!

[defendandprotect]

31. The health hearings today and Obama looked idiotic in NOT discussing Medicare for all --

I would imagine most people watching were shouting Public Option or

Medicare for all at the screen --

Meanwhile, if Rahm is the problem, let's get him out of the White House --

and certainly the DLC poison has to be expunged from the Democratic Party!!

[601Liberal]

32. Do it and do it now!

Don't wait on the Republicans or anybody else!

[Enthusiast]

33. Including the public option

changes the bill from a hated bill to one enthusiastically embraced by a majority of citizens. Why wouldn't the Administration insist on a public option?

[punkin87]

34. If every state elected a Bernie Sanders, this country's government would rock!

[Dinger]

44. You Mean President, Right?

I like it.:)

[pezDispenser]

56. nice sig, love that song

[SlingBlade]

35. Who's lying now ChangeAholics ?

[HughMoran]

38. Cool! My Senator signed up - I know that

You go Shaheen!

[mckara]

39. WE NEED THE PUBLIC OPTION!!!!!!!!!!!!

Then, Single Payer Health Care

[CONN]

42. K&R

[Dinger]

43. Rec # 108 And A Kick From Da Ding!

:)

Gotta love Bernie!

[Overseas]

45. Yes Please !! //nt

[PoliticalOne65]

46. The Senate already passed the bill.

If the house adds to it, or takes away from the senate bill. They then have to re-vote on the new bill the house passed in the Senate. 60 vote breaks a filibuster. If the house passes the Senate bill as is. Then it goes to reconciliation. The senate bill doesn't have a single payer, or a public option. Bernie Sanders Is dreaming. I don't see the house passing the Senate bill as is. Reconciliation is not an option if the house doesn't pass the Senate's bill.

[Rozlee]

53. There's the rub

I was hearing on the news, consider the source--it was CBS, that too many Congressional Democrats are too frightened by midterm elections to want to risk voting for reconciliation and that Pelosi might not have the votes to pull it off. Now, that's the thought that'll keep me tossing and turning tonight.

[laughingliberal]

58. They can still pass a public option under the budget reconciliation process as a stand alone bill

It is the same procedure under which Medicare part D was passed and it only needs 51 votes or a simple majority. This could be done whether the full Senate HCR bill passes the House or not. Sanders is not dreaming.

[Suji to Seoul]

47. For all those who have been flippantly ridiculing me for posting my HCR Reconciliation Threads;

Now all my statements are true. Everything I predicted it true, even though I disagree with Bernie. By my count, it's still 49 - 49 - 2.

Conrad and Begich are the two maybes. I have not heard on thing from them. Conrad was one of the Gang of Six. . .idiots in the Finance committee, so I am leaning no. That leaves Mark Begich, freshman Senator from Alaska.

Time to twist arms, Dick and Harry. . .get him to say yes!!!

[humbled_opinion]

48. Well I hope that Democrats

Realize if they are going to be bashed over the head by Repukes on whatever they do and get zero support then if they have to do this option with 51 votes they better actually make it worthwhile in other words, scrap that mandate that everyone Must purchase from an insurance industry and offer a real buy in for a fully subsidized and managed Public Option otherwise known as single payer. Anything less will become a political liability.

[FourScore]

49. K&R

[ananda]

50. OMG. Please let it happen.

God I need something good to happen, just for once.

[and-justice-for-all]

52. If Dems what to save themselves....

they better get us a Public Option aka Medicare for all.

[glinda]

54. oh please please please.

[pezDispenser]

55. list them

I don't believe we have 50. If Sen Sanders does then he should list them, otherwise this is just pandering.

[jannyk]

57. Just Fucking Do It!!!!

[DisgustedInMN]

59. If Dems fails to pass a HCR that..

.. includes a Public Plan open to any American who CHOOSES it, and goes into affect BEFORE November, they might as well announce their early retirement now. They will be toast for the foreseeable future and Barack Obama will spend 3 years as a lame duck.

[stillwaiting]

60. And as a lame duck, Obama will suddenly become a much more vocal proponent

of common sense, progressive legislation.

Of course, there will still be a zero percent chance of it passing, but then we can blame it on the Republicans again! Yeah, that'll be fun to do again. There is NO putting the little man behind the curtain back behind the curtain. It's been exposed.

We are so screwed until we change the way we elect our Congresspeople.

[DisgustedInMN]

61. To be blunt...

.. I hold zero hope that anything will change, short of a revolution, hopefully not a violent one, but realistically, the odds aren't good it won't be. Corporations now hold our government in a death grip with the intensity of a pitbull. They WILL NOT release it unless forced to do so. Make no mistake, there is a class war happening, today, in America, and what is at stake is the very essence of the legacy we leave our children and grandchildren.

The "election" of 2008 proves beyond ANY doubt, that no matter WHO We the People elect to office, they will NOT do the bidding of We the People. The last shred of the blinder that was my own belief that we could really make a difference, has been ripped from my eyes. My vision now sees a reality that won't let me hide from the truth any longer, a fundamental change in our society and how we govern it is the only hope for this Nation to survive. The Powers That Be will fight tooth and nail to make sure it doesn't happen.

I've said it over and over, there's a huge, ugly storm brewing on the horizon and it's headed our way.

[girl_interrupted]

64. K&R

[freddie mertz]

62. OK. So Why did the WH claim they did NOT have the votes?

Were they speaking only of the 60?

Does this Biden is ready to be the 51st vote?

We shall see I guess.

[European Socialist]

63. Bernie comes on Thom Hartmann's radio show at noon here...

Hope he still has the 50 votes then.

[Triana]

67. Of course they do. "We don't have the votes" in this administration means...

..."we don't have the political will"

There's a damned difference between "I don't wanna", and "I can't"

They don't wanna.

[bvar22]

68. Just DO IT!...or admit Nader was right.

[SLSmith]

69. VID Sanders 2/26 Public Option Maybe Off Obama's Agenda But It Ain't Off My Agenda!

2/26 Sanders on Thom Hartmann - answering a Q&A about whether a deal was cut with Rahm & Hospitals to not have Public Option in health care reform.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mTNWILstpM

UTube's api interface or something on DU is not working have not been able to post videos in weeks to DU!

[Kingofalldems]

70. Kick

[depakid]

75. Just do it!

[Dinger]

76. Keeping This Kicked (nt)

[harun]

77. K

[mvd]

81. Kick - if true, there's no excuse not to go forward

After all, it's one of the most popular aspects of the reform proposals.

[No Elephants]

83. Reconciliation is only for budget. So, if health care reform passes by reconciliation, does that

mean we lose things like health insurers must cover pre-existing conditions, health insurers can't kick you out of coverage if you get sick, etc.?

If so, the bill will really be a turd, IMO.

[mvd]

85. Most of those things should be able to pass separately

Just imagine the commercials we could run if Repukes filibustered the no pre-existing condition denials part.

Or, we could pass the Senate bill, which has those things, and add things through reconciliation.