NATO: Troops Miss Target, Kill 12 Afghan Civilians

[Lars77]

Source: ABC News

Twelve Afghans died Sunday when two rockets fired at insurgents missed their target and struck a house during the second day of NATO's most ambitious effort yet to break the militants' grip on the country's dangerous south.

Thousands of NATO and Afghan troops encountered pockets of resistance, fighting off sniper attacks, as they moved deeper into Marjah, a town of 80,000 people that is the linchpin of the militants' logistical and opium-smuggling network in Helmand province.

Marines and Afghan troops used metal detectors and sniffer dogs, searching compound to compound for explosives rigged to explode. Blasts from controlled detonations could be heard about every 10 minutes north of Marjah.

Read more: http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=9832148

[SirRevolutionary]

1. Isn't war great?

Civilians, dogs, homes, nothing's sacred to the War Hawks, so long as they make their profits.

[IndianaGreen]

2. As in Vietnam, we are winning their hearts and minds

and as in Vietnam, we will return home with our tails between our collective legs.

[Xenotime]

48. It's easier to win hearts and minds when you can just pick them up off the ground.

[swilton]

3. You mean that our technologically sophisticated weapons

don't always get the right targets, that surgival strikes aren't really surgical, that our intelligence is flawed!??:wtf: :sarcasm:

[dipsydoodle]

4. Having missed th goal,

by 900 yards, I think the match will decided by a penalty shoot out. :sarcasm:

[sam sarrha]

6. someone was using a cell phone that blocked the guided bomb.. we should quit having those guidence

systems outsourced to China.

maybe we could outsource this war to china like the one in Somalia

[sam sarrha]

5. our "Acceptable" Colaterial damage to target ratio is 26 to one..what is the point..? how did this

even get in the news,..?? :sarcasm:

it seems like they have someone look'n thru the news paper for weddings so they can bomb them..

[IndianaGreen]

8. This is Obama's war, and since he is a Democrat, we must now rationalize every civilian casualty

and blame Bush for this debacle.

:sarcasm:

There is something morally repugnant about giving a pass to Democratic Presidents when they commit war crimes.

[sam sarrha]

11. this is quite an interesting link>>

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2010/01/10-3
"snip...Bin Laden proclaimed his grand strategy in the 1990s. He would oust the modern "crusaders" by luring the U.S. and its allies into a series of small, debilitating, hugely expensive wars to bleed and slowly bankrupt the U.S. economy, which he called America's Achilles' heel...snip"

we need to get out of all Islamic countries, and become free of any importation of energy of any kind.

we need to rebuild our manufacturing on a green base relative to our strategic requirements.. like shoes, clothes, electronics, fuel..hemp oil will free us from Saudi clutches.. we need to isolate all muslim countries, let em go back to the Dark ages by themselves. when the people finally realize its a political cult they will revolt. not a shot fired by us.

[swilton]

24. Don't forget to mention and include

local agriculture in your scenario for local manufacturing.....Local communities and local economies.....

I disagree that the Islamic countries in the Dark Ages - Their basic problem with the Western industrial economies is that they haven't embraced capitalism.

Furthermore, I would argue that just becasue the West has technologically advanced beyond the Dark Ages that it is in no place to say other countries are in the Dark Ages because they haven't. Our humanity hasn't and doesn't automatically have to follow our scientific and military prowess....Our humanity is still back there with our belief that might makes right....an eye for an eye mentality that provides no answers immediate and long-term solutions to any of the major problems facing us.

[sam sarrha]

34. you should read this book...

Cruel and Usual Punishment: The Terrifying Global Implications of Islamic Law
http://www.amazon.com/Cruel-Usual-Punishment-Terrifying-Implications/dp/1595551611/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1266185627&sr=8-1

Nonie Darwish lived under Sharia Law for 30 years, she is definitely a scholar on the subject as she can discuss the subject on several levels at the same time, all the while following a convoluted Historical documentation and context.

it is Sharia Law that will destroy any opportunity of Modernity. it looks like all the technological advancements attributed to the early Muslims were simply gleaned from those they conquered.. most of it came from 2 old Roman Libraries they discovered.. the Zero was discovered in India

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Who_invented_number_zero
It was invented by a Hindu mathematician Aryabhatta in India before 400 BC on the basis of a vedik chant as below-
पूर्णमदः पूर्णमिदं पूर्णात् पूर्णमुदच्यते।
पूर्णस्य पूर्णमादाय पूर्णमेवावशिष्यते॥

the Muslims put 80 million in India to the sword who wouldn't convert during their their invasions there..they consider all history archeology etc before Muhammad to be of the Dark Times.. the last 30 years Islam has taken a turn to the worser. once a Country becomes an islamic republic Sharia law is imposed. all women are subjugated. un-islamic things are disposed of.. the only thing that is allowed is what promotes Islam. which is simply what Muhammad did and said.. emulation of Muhammad.

you really need to read several books to 'Get It'.. from their perspective. i read about Sharia Law, but then when you hear Nonie Darwish, see youtube, explain it from living it.. one quickly realized that you didn't see it the way it is.. we project our own overview/concept of reason into it. when you hear Dr Wafa Sulton, see youtube/amazon, a Syrian woman gynecologist describe her experiences and talks about her 3 sisters being lucky. in spite of their father denying them marriage because of his being unable to deal with the thought of a man having sex with them. he locks them in a small shuttered room, no air conditioning, in blazing desert heat their entire life, they are lucky because they have a TV, one station, but they get to pick their channels and they get to go shopping once a year. 100's of millions of women under Sharia law. a man can rape any woman he can manage to rape and not get caught because the woman cant report it.. if she does she is charged with adultery, buried up to her waist and stoned to death.. that is a bit Medieval. there are a couple different versions of Sharia law.. but none a woman would volunteer for. Sharia law sets up a really weird association between men too, i cant see how much could get done on a regular basis. pm me i'll give you my reading list.

[dipsydoodle]

22. My mouse was just in the right place to think

you said nationalise every civilian casualty. I thought............. ?

[Goldstein1984]

35. These aren't Bu$h's wars anymore...

They belong entirely to Barack Obama. Every decision made after the inauguration belongs to this Commander-In-chief. Escalation in Afghanistan?--Obama's decision; increased use of unmanned drones?--Obama's decision; expanding the war further into Pakistan and Yemen?--Obama's decision; continued

His decision not to investigate Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld for war crimes also serves the purpose of setting a precedent that he surely hopes his successor will follow.

It's my hope that the world community finally reaches the point where U.S. officials are tried in world courts, and the next ten years will see an entire cohort of U.S. "leaders" essentially under house arrest and unable to leave U.S. territory without fear of arrest.

[CountAllVotes]

7. Welcome to Obama's Vietnam

are you enjoying all this murder Mr. President?

What the hell is wrong with these idiots? Are they so very stupid that they cannot tell what they are bombing with all of their superior high tech weapons? Seems to be the case doesn't it.

This is worse than Vietnam as they did not have the high tech weapons being used now! What is the excuse for this horrific murder?

ENOUGH!!! :nuke:


:dem: :kick:

[Xenotime]

49. Wrong. This is still Bush's war. He just inherited it.

[Mari333]

52. Its Obama's War now

he owns it now, lock, stock, and dead children.

[saigon68]

53. YES HE OWNS THIS PIG

The dead tell no tales

[Robb]

9. I give NATO a lot of credit for their reporting.

They've been diligently reporting every civilian death for some time now, it appears.

[IndianaGreen]

10. NATO should have been disbanded at end of Cold War

but since it is in the interests of the American oligarchs to keep the people in a permanent state of war, and fear, NATO will continue to fulfill its role as an arm of American imperialism.

ISAF = I See Americans Fight

[bvar22]

15. How do we know?

What if the NATO numbers are "low balls"? :shrug:

[Don Caballero]

12. The President is going after the real terrorists in Af/Pak

If the Shrub had decided to focus the military apparatus in the right place these incidences would not be happening today. We cannot blame the current administration for these types of errors.

[IndianaGreen]

13. While trying to bribe the Taliban to stop opposing Karzai regime

Kinda psychotic foreign policy, wouldn't you say?

[Flaneur]

21. George Bush didn't authorize this offensive. This is Obama's baby.

We most certainly can blame the current administration for these types of errors.

[L0oniX]

14. Maybe they should practice first on a few big red barns.

[bvar22]

16. And the slaughter continues.

:(

[bergie321]

17. They hate us

For our lifestyle.....:sarcasm:

[robdogbucky]

18. Is any of this a surprise to any of us?

Inside Afghanistan-Fighting Alongside Stoned Afghan Soldiers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kc8w0IX4UQc&feature=related


"They know it doesn't cost them anything to keep fighting...."



What a clusterfuck on behalf of the MIC's newest theater of operations.

Are the mongers happy this morning with their new "operation?"

Christ on a trailer hitch.

We do not belong in every country's civil war.

Oh, wait, there's that pipeline Karzai's corrupt family and all that opium and Russia right nearby.





Just my dos centavos


robdogbucky

[winyanstaz]

19. I am sure they still "hate us for our freedoms"......

and not for the growing pile of murdered civilians.....:(

Those poor people...damn it I am so sick of war.

[Lars77]

20. Interesting map

[dipsydoodle]

23. Yes

The protection of that line.

Some old stuff here :

The United States imports 51 percent of its oil. That will rise to 64 percent in 2020. The Caspian Basin is a large, untapped resource of oil and natural gas, boasting 33 times more oil than Alaska. It was only feasible for US-based companies to transport this crude via ship, by building a pipeline to the Indian Ocean, through Afghanistan and Pakistan, rather than a costlier, landlocked line through China, Russia or Iran. UNOCAL, the ninth largest oil company, pursued rights to cross Afghanistan almost a sure-bet with that country's president, Hamid Karzai, a former member of UNOCAL's board of directors. Construction plans were underway for Central Asia Gas Pipeline Consortium (CentGas), under the services of Halliburton, and its CEO, Dick Cheney. Plans were abandoned in 1998 due to Afghanistan's political unrest.

The multi-joint-venture, between UNOCAL, and two former Soviet Republics, would have been profitable, until former President Clinton bombed the region in retaliation for fallen US-embassies in Kenya and Tanzania. UNOCAL funded 40 percent of the project. In 1999, the $2.6 billion Caspian Pipeline Consortium (CPC) planned 935-miles of pipe aligned to the North of Afghanistan, extending from the Tengiz oil field in Kazakhstan to the Russian Black Sea, in conjunction with Enron Inc., Halliburton, and General Electric Capital Services. Once UNOCAL abandoned Afghanistan plans, Enron pursued the project independently by entertaining Taliban officials in 1999, to negotiate an Afghan-land deal from company headquarters in Sugarland, Texas. This deal wasn't sealed, and details of this meeting were destroyed. Enter, September 11.

Afghanistan is under US-military control as a result of the war on terrorism. ChevronTexaco, ExxonMobil, and Great Britain's BP, started pumping oil through the CPC on November 28, 2001. ChevronTexaco leads production with 15 percent while ExxonMobil at 7.5 percent. As oil soothed the veins of this pipeline, Bush congratulated US-corporate efforts. He said, "The project advances this administration's National Energy Policy by developing a network of Caspian pipelines, which help to diversify US-energy supplies, and enhance energy security."

http://www.thinkandask.com/news/eyes.html

[Mari333]

30. eye opening.

people being blown to bits to secure huge contracts for oil corporations.
and we are stupid enough to allow it to continue, using our tax monies.

and our own kids.

[Robb]

43. Quite outdated.

This may prove more illuminating. If you were Turkmenistan, why would you bother selling to the "west" in any of the proposed directions, much less through Afghanistan??

[Lars77]

47. Because the west pays the pipeline

and it's better to diversify your customer base. When you're selling a precious commodity the more potential buyers you have the better, because it make you less vulnerable to the buyers tampering with the price. If China decides to play hardball you just sell to the west and vice versa.

It's also the question of security. A pipeline to China will be a prime target for Uyghur separatists, not to mention the fact that it goes right through Uzbekistan, which also has an uprising of Islamic extrimism in opposition to it's bloody regime.
The Trans-Caspian pipeline is a potential target for for Russia in a future war on Georgia (they might "accidentally" hit it), not to mential Kurdish rebels in Turkey.

Turkmenistan's gas reserves are so huge they can serve all customers at once, but there's a good chance one of the pipelines will be down at one point or another.

That's a great map by the way.

[Mari333]

25. WE ARE THE BAD GUYS

KNR

[slay]

28. +1

sad but true. :( :cry:

[chrisa]

42. While it was an accident,

I really don't think NATO is "the bad guys." Actually, the term "bad guys" is pretty meaningless.

Anyway, RIP to the innocents. This war should end.

[BunkerHill24]

26. They admit killing 12 civilians....multiply that by 33.....and there is your factual casualty

WAR Is A RACKET! BRING THE TROOPS HOME NOW!

[slay]

27. Go USA! :sarcasm: This sucks. End this war now!

The USA is in DEEP shit financially. We don't need this war, what's the fucking point, why are we even there - but above all - there is NO imminent threat from there and we can NOT afford it! Fuck the pentagon - bring the troops, and the money, home NOW and stop lining the pockets of Haliburton/KBR! Cheney is GONE - lets end this bullshit!

[golfguru]

29. Afghanistan is a Quagmire

It is a tribal land with inhospitable terrain and most people
are under educated, unlike Iraq.

The sooner we get out of there, the better off we will all be.

[yorgatron]

31. Hey Hey LBJ

can we get the fuck out of there yet? :wtf:

[Bigmack]

32. We gotta start numbering our responses....

to "US kills civilians" news items.

It happens so often, and we could save ourselves a lot of keyboard time.

It's gonna happen a LOT coming up soon, too, so I'll start...

1 Get the hell out of there... today.

2 Love those hi-tech weapons!

3 Vietnam II... the sequel.

4 Winning hearts and minds one dead kid at a time.

any others...?

[swilton]

33. 5. We're creating terrorists

faster than we can kill them

6. War is terrorism with a bigger budget.:kick:

[hayu_lol]

36. I really hate to see all this claptrap falling on our troops...

Apparently the missiles were aimed properly since the link story said that the missiles 'veered'...in other words for some reason, the missiles did not fly directly to the target. A sandstorm in the area indicates strong winds which could account for the problem.

Our rules of engagement apparently are that you cannot fire until fired upon. That gives the insurgents time to kill us before we attempt to kill them. Not fair to our troops...that sort of political thinking. The nastiest job in the world is attacking a village or city.

Quit knocking the troops. Civilians do get killed and there isn't much that can be done about that. Perhaps some of the nay-sayers could walk up to the Taliban and ask them to retreat away from these villages. Do your good deed for the day.

[Bigmack]

41. Why do you want our troops to die for nothing?....

Not to even speak about the poor fucking Afghanis? I guess "oops" is good enough for you when innocents die. Not for me.

Where, in my post, did I "knock our troops"? In what twist of logic does wanting our troops home become "knocking our troops"?

Rules of engagement are what keeps the field from becoming a clusterfuck, with lots of fratricide. "Free Fire" zones become piles of dead civilians and fellow troops.

I don't believe you "rah-rah troops... go get 'em" have ever been in the shit. I have, and what these guys are doing is pointless and fruitless.

[Nihil]

50. "Sticks & stones" are nicer than missiles ...

> I really hate to see all this claptrap falling on our troops...

Beats the hell out of what's been falling on Afghan civilians recently.


> Quit knocking the troops.

I'll quit complaining about civilian casualties (a.k.a. "knocking the troops")
when they stop happening (a.k.a. "bring the troops home" - the only honest way
to "support the troops").


> Civilians do get killed and there isn't much that can be done about that.

Wrong. The most obvious thing that CAN be done about that is to stop invading
sovereign nations for the sake of greed. By supporting this ongoing murderous
farce you are supporting war-crimes, supporting the exploitation of the troops
being used in a for-profit operation and supporting the facade of two-party
politics.

[New Dawn]

37. Is this what we voted for????

[CountAllVotes]

44. it is not what I voted for, others not happy either

nor is it the type of hope and change that was supposed to be delivered to the American people. :mad:

Listen up to Ray Taliaferro's Friday show. He reams BO's butt good!

http://bayradio.com/kgo_archives/50200.mp3
http://bayradio.com/kgo_archives/50300.mp3
http://bayradio.com/kgo_archives/50400.mp3
http://bayradio.com/kgo_archives/50500.mp3

:dem: :kick: :kick: :kick:

[bemildred]

38. Gotta love them "surgical strikes". nt

[DCBob]

39. I support the mission in Afghanistan but this is bad...

I know it is difficult for the soldiers to avoid killing civilians sometimes but this kind of mistake can endanger the entire mission, not to mention the deaths of innocents and the impact on their families and friends.

[gregO]

40. pictures of the fighting

U.S. Marines from Bravo Company, 1st Battalion, 6th Marines, protect an Afghan man and his child after Taliban fighters opened fire in the town of Marjah, in Nad Ali district, Helmand province, February 13, 2010.




Airborne in a Black hawk helicopter on a U.S. Army medevac misssion, a Marine MP, left, guards a Taliban fighter who is wounded, along with two other seriously wounded Taliban fighters captured after a firefight. U.S. Army flight medic Sgt. Michael G. Patangan, left, from Houston, Texas, with Charlie Company, Task Force Talon, as they try to keep the fighters alive after a firefight, airborne over Marjah, Helmand province, southern Afghanistan, Saturday Feb. 13, 2010.

[nod factor]

45. Wow.

For years I was privy to pictures just like those and can remember asking myself why I never saw them in the media.
If there's one difference between Obama and Bush in terms of Afghanistan is the priority placed on hearts and minds.
Otherwise known as War Propaganda.
From images such as these right down to the Islamic naming of the operation.
I never thought in my wildest dreams I would quote Al-Qaeda but,
"He wants to smile and stab us with the same knife Bush used."

[Mari333]

46. and 5 CHILDREN....

http://rethinkafghanistan.com/blog/?p=1688 (VIDEO)

[Bragi]

51. It's like we are on war autopilot

Almost no-one I know thinks this war is a good idea, they all know it is being waged using borrowed Chinese money the U.S may not be able to pay back, and we all know in our hearts that it will end badly.

Yet despite the fact that Americans voted for what they (mistakenly) thought was a peace President, this war not only continues, it has been escalated by the new administration.

The war lords continue to rule in Afghanistan, and also in the U.S, and in Canada, where I live.

Sigh.