Bush joins 'outsourcing' debate

[wicket]

http://news.ft.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=FT.com/StoryFT/FullStory&c=StoryFT&cid=1078381644895

President George W. Bush hit back at Democratic critics of his administration's job-creation efforts on Tuesday, branding them as "economic isolationists" who would raise new trade barriers and damage the US economy.


The comments came as part of what appeared to be a co-ordinated administration effort to respond to growing political pressures over the anaemic pace of US job growth, which has helped push Mr Bush's likely Democratic opponent, John Kerry, ahead of the president in several recent polls.

In a speech in Virginia, Mr Bush said: "There are economic isolationists in our country who believe we should separate ourselves from the rest of the world by raising up barriers and closing off markets. They're wrong. If we are to continue growing this economy and creating new jobs, America must remain confident and strong about our ability to trade in the world."

Robert Zoellick, the US trade representative, similarly warned Congress on Tuesday that "given the fact we're now in a stage of an economic recovery, the absolutely worst thing we could do would be to turn to economic isolationism".

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Because you know, Bush has done such a WONDERFUL job at creating jobs. *snort*

[Barrett808]

1. Just keep talking, Smirky

That "losing your job is good for America" rhetoric will really play in Peoria.

[trumad]

3. Yes indeed...

Keep talking!

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

23. HEY! WHAT DID I DO?

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

[redqueen]

2. Is he drinking again?

What isolationist?

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

10. What do you think?

:beer: :beer: :beer: :beer:

[mike1963]

25. He's just crazy as a shithouse rat and dumber than a bucket of rocks.

:eyes:

[wabeewoman]

4. This should go over good with the

many unemployed Americans. A robust defense of companies that move jobs overseas indeed!

"The administration has been uncertain over how to respond to the continued slow pace of job creation. Mr Bush has sought to distance himself from recent remarks by a senior economic adviser, Gregory Mankiw, that outsourcing of jobs is just a part of trade and therefore good for the US economy. But the administration now appears set to mount a more robust defence of companies that move US jobs abroad."

[hatrack]

5. Little George builds a strawman, and whacks it in public!

That's right, if you're worried about job loss, outsourcing and the steady decline of real wages since 1973, and if the prospect of competing with sweatshop and prison labor leaves you rather concerned about exactly how you'll compete, that means you're an "economic isolationist".

Uh-huh.

Nice try, Chimpy. Try again.

[buddy22600]

6. Who would do something to stop the loss of jobs

Certainly not the American people. If you had to choose between two products that are effectively the same, but one is 20-40% cheaper, which would you choose. That is the major problem. We want things cheap, but you cant have that with most things made in America

[liberalhistorian]

16. That's indeed a good point,

but I think the main problem is that most Americans aren't aware of the correlation between cheaper prices and Americans being out of a job because of those prices.

And frankly, the gazillions that corporate leaders and top management get belie the argument that companies need to outsource in order to effectively compete. The salaries and perks of the top management of the comanies most guilty of outsourcing always rise after they move most of the jobs overseas, and they don't use the profits to improve the company or anything like that, just in their own salaries.

And nowadays most Americans, especially families, don't really have a whole helluva lot of money and for even essentials and have to watch every single penny. I, for one, refuse to buy the products of or patronize any business that outsources, at least those that I know of. And I also refuse to set foot in Wally World (Wal-Mart).

This is really gonna come back and bite the repukes in the ass. When they were moving all the manufacturing jobs overseas most people didn't see it or didn't really care all that much because it didn't affect them. and they were the ones Congress seemed to listen to. But now that it's hitting the middle class and white-collar workers like never before, as well as workers in almost every class and every occupation, it will not be tolerated for long.

These companies are going to get what they've so long deserved. And hopefully the repukes will be thrown out on their asses. Let Georgie go back to living off of his daddy's money like he has all of his useless, worthless life.

[Crachet2004]

37. There IS a disconnect between the low prices and outsourcing...

But I think people realize, jobs here have to come first, or eventually nobody can buy anything, no matter how cheap.

There is a lot of anymosity building up over globalization in general, and corporate America in particular. Who's side are they on, anyway?

Why is it good for an American corporation to worry more about it's bottom line, than the welfare of this nation? To me, John Kerry has it right-it's Benedict Arnold behavior...treason.

And IMO, China and India are not going to NEED us. What for? With their Labor supply, they will ALWAYS be able to take care of their own needs cheaper than we can supply them...unless, we drag our own working conditions and compensation down to their slave-labor level!

Or we can try and bring foreign workers up to our level. That is basically what Kerry wants to do, I think. No more Chinese children building toys and clothes for American children. Decent standards of living, on both sides of the ocean. Then, maybe we can compete, and export to THEM. Not until.

We cannot compete with wage-slave labor, without becoming slaves ourselves. However, there is an entrenched monetary, global aristocracy, who would like nothing better...and finally, white-collar workers are beginning to see, they can be replaced with wage-slaves too!

[mike1963]

26. Well, cheap products generally are cheap products...and without a job,

who the hell can afford ANY products?
:eyes:

[wicket]

35. wasn't it Henry Ford who said...

...something like, "I have to pay my workers enough to actually be able to afford my product".

[wicket]

7. he is so out of touch with the American public

Let's show him the door in November!

[moondust]

8. He doesn't know what trade is.

Somebody needs to explain to him and his fellow idiots that trade is the exchange of goods and services, not the opportunistic giveaway of people's livelihoods.

[Just Me]

9. An easy debate question: Who profits MOST from outsourcing?

DDDAHHHHHH!!!!! Do the slaves to those corporations most benefit? Do the American workers most benefit? Do the American people most benefit? Does the world most benefit?

DDDAHHHHH!!!!

THE CORPORATE ANARCHISTS (which the father of fascism, Mussolini, endeared) are the ones who most benefit. Outsourcing would be Mussolini's dream,...a whole world of fascism. I'll bet he is just waiting for some "born again" to "save" him from his grave *LOL*.

Good, God,...please awaken within humanity!!!

[denverbill]

11. Oh, so sending millions of American jobs overseas DOESNT damage

the economy?

Tell that to the thousands of towns who have lost factories or the millions of unemployed Americans.

[liberalhistorian]

20. Sure, it damages it,

it damages it for the 95 percent of us who aren't in his economic class with his wealth and privilege, which makes it that much sweeter for his fellow class cronies. And the rest of us can go to hell, for all they care. Many of us are there already, with no end in sight.

[joeunderdog]

24. Chimp's policies (outsourcing, etc) are DESIGNED to cut jobs.

The President’s promise last month to create 2 ½ million new jobs in 2004 came on the heels of his first public embrace of the trend of outsourcing American jobs. It was a contradiction not lost on those in the unemployment lines.

The Shrub has earned the distinction of being the first American president since the Great Depression to produce negative job growth. He has earned this distinction not simply through a result of arbitrary factors beyond his control. In reality, his policy decisions have the predictable and sometimes designed effect of job loss.

There are many examples, but outsourcing is amongst the clearest. It's the practice of sending American jobs overseas to increase corporate profits. Simply by definition, it cuts jobs. Even in the long run, if profits are realized by companies that outsource American jobs, then they will have no incentive to put Americans to work if they seek to expand in the future. The trend will be reinforced and not reversed with no longterm re-investment in America. Only the stockholders will see the gains.

With constant pushing, the King George pushed through his plan for ending overtime for 8 million American workers later this year. (He thinks labor laws like OT are archaic.) This will result in employers asking fewer employees to work longer hours to save on wages and benefits. Do the math and plan on more lost jobs. And less pay and family time for those who do work.

Overseas, aggressive US foreign policy has led to European and Asian boycotts of American goods like colas and clothing. Talk about economic isolationism! This anti-American sentiment has hurt exports for our international businesses. Additionally, the importing of goods from countries without labor laws has unfairly undercut the pricing of US businesses who don’t run sweatshops. The Bush Administration has shown no sensitivity to these imbalances, the seeds of which were sown in Clinton’s NAFTA.

In January, the announcement by El Presidente that he was in favor of relaxing Immigration Laws in order to encourage increasing foreign labor came as a shock to many Americans. The political impact of this policy is far-reaching and controversial on many levels, but what is clear is that it will directly result in lost jobs for Americans. And it will further serve to drive down the wages of those US citizens who are working.

Democrats blame the tax cuts. Republicans blame Clinton. And while the effects of these factors are in some ways tomaytoes/tomahtoes, the intended effect and the results of many of President Bush’s policies are clear in the jobs lost so far.

When you get right down to it, President Bush’s policies ARE working. That's why 2 ½ million Americans aren’t.

[Jacobin]

12. Foot, meet trap, Trap meet foot

:evilgrin:

[wicket]

14. Hopefully Kerry will hit him HARD on this

n/t

[mhr]

13. He Can Go Straight To Hell

Unemployed 45 months,
BSEE,
MBA,
Commercial Pilot,
Honorably discharged Naval Officer,
Refuge form telecom and aviation.

Jobs?

What Jobs!

Mr. * you are the biggest economic idiot to ever sit in that office.

[buycitgo]

15. Mr. President....BEAR down that TERRIER!!!

here:

"If the terriers and barrifs are torn down, this economy will grow." - President George W. Bush, Rochester, New York, January 7, 2000

remember that one?

http://pub146.ezboard.com/flipoliticsmessageboardforumsfrm8.showMessage?topicID=937.topic

[liberalhistorian]

19. Yeah, and he said that

at at time of unprecedented economic growth, too, which I thought was un-fucking-believably stupid!

[mike1963]

27. Missed that one but sounds about right for a mucking foron...

:D

[pinto]

17. don't see one lick of an answer in puff piece. "confident and strong" =

standard Bushco "answer" for any question. economy? we must remain confident and strong. WTF does that mean in real, economic terms?

[liberalhistorian]

18. So he claims that

they would "damage the US economy", does he? As opposed to what, building it up and keeping it going strong like 'ol know-nothing Georgie has? How could the economy possibly be more damaged than it already is, thanks to him? Oh, wait, don't answer that, 'cause it's gonna get even worse before he's through!

[wicket]

21. let's hope...

Let's hope that more and more Americans realize this before November...

[mike1963]

22. But I thought import tariffs were "a good thing"...

http://edition.cnn.com/2002/BUSINESS/03/05/steel/

[Ilsa]

28. Bush wouldn't talk about it before, when the policy was kept quiet until

it hit the India Times.
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/xml/uncomp/articleshow?msid=21849

From last summer. They don't want the states to do anything to hamper outsourcing either. They're afraid they'll miss a few extra dimes in dividend payments.

US gives India assurance on outsourcing
CHIDANAND RAJGHATTA

TIMES NEWS NETWORK< FRIDAY, JUNE 13, 2003 07:43:08 PM >

WASHINGTON: The Indian government and businesses have won a major assurance from the Bush Administration on the issue of outsourcing.

A senior US official has said Washington is against any attempt by state governments to legislate a ban on outsourcing on the lines of what is being considered in New Jersey and other states.

The official, US Trade Representative Robert Zoellick, gave this assurance in course of three hours of intensive talks with Indian Commerce Minister Arun Jaitley, during which they discussed subjects ranging from the movement of people to the export of Indian mangoes to the US. The length of the talks itself was indicative of the wide range of bilateral and multilateral topics under discussion as the two sides try and bump up their modest $ 15 billion trade to greater levels.

Snip

[TEXASYANKEE]

29. Soundbites for the sheeple.

So if you're dismayed by this outsourcing, that means you're an isolationist? There's no middle ground, no grey area? It's all or nothing? That is what makes me so angry with the Republican party, its use of soundbites designed to inflame people who can't think past a short sentence.

[maxrandb]

30. Would someone PLEASE

make the connection between the loss of jobs and the increased crime rate?

We need to hit hard on this. Ever since * took office, the crime rate has been going up.

It's as simple as this. Clinton-great economy and reduced crime.
Bush-lousy economy and INCREASED crime.

Now...Why do you think the crime rate is going up? It would not be because of so many desperate people that can't find work, now would it?

This will shatter the Re-puritan party claim to being tough on crime.

[davhill]

31. Who is the U.S. Economy?

What Republicans consider to be the U.S. Economy consists only of those who are invested in corporations which were originally based in the United States. A company with its headquarters in Bermuda, all its factories in Mexico, all its suppliers in the Far East, its IT department in India, and with the majority of its stockholders consisting of Saudi oil sheiks and Japanese pension funds, is considered representative of the U.S. Economy. This is particularly true if a portion of it's earnings end up donated to the Republican party.

[NeoConsSuck]

32. But my dear retarded chimp...

look at your words: "If we are to continue growing this economy and creating new jobs"

Creating new jobs where? In India? You're certainly not creating any here.

[mumon]

33. What that smirking pile of feces fails to grasp...

is that he is, first and foremost our employee, and he's due to be down-sized.

[Barkley]

34. "we're now in a stage of an economic recovery..."- Robert Zoellick

Oh really:

588,000 people quit looking for work last month
Only 21,000 public sector jobs created in Feb.
NO private sector jobs created in Feb.
Rising gasoline prices nationwide.

and he calls this a "recovery"!?!?!?!

I wonder what's his definition of a depression?

[PROGRESSIVE1]

36. The Chimp and his whores (the media) can't hide the realities of....

outsourcing. Keep on smirking chimpster. Mr. Kerry will show you
the exit this fall.

[wicket]

38. I can't wait to boot him out of office

n/t

[teryang]

39. The leader is the last one to perceive an issue

He's really on the ball, isn't he? When I hear repukes discuss leadership issues, I laugh out loud.

[shanti]

40. trading with other countries is one thing

giving them OUR peoples' jobs is quite another!!! :grr:

[BabsSong]

41. Noted something a number of our former candidates said

Several of our now 'former' candidates said that when they traveled on the campaign trail they found that people no longer believe in the American economic system; they don't trust their employers; they have lost faith even in themselves; they have lost faith that our government will help or protect them at all. They also emphasized that the Midwest is really, really gutted. So, Georgie, go out there and defend corporate America and their bosses. That should turn them on. They are going to outsource your balls if that's the line you're going to use. It may make your handpicked, market invested, rich bastards applaude; but that's going to make the average American even wilder. And remember, Georgie, now you are outsourcing white collar jobs---lose those boys and you repukes are toast.

[bvar22]

42. This is a National Security Issue.

To remain secure in the unforeseen future, it is vital for our country to maintain and refine certain essential industrial resources.

1) a viable steel, aluminum, and alloy production industry. These plants must remain here with a skilled labor force, updated regularly, and have the ability to rapidly increase and expand production in an emergency.

2) A viable machine tool and die manufacturing capability

3) A heavy manufacturing and assembly industry capable of rapid expansion to meet emergency needs

4) A textile industry with skilled workers capable of rapid expansion to meet national needs.

5)(name your own necessity currently being outsourced)


If an international emergency occurs (like pre-WWII), the US will not be able to depend on our foreign trade partners to supply our own needs, and rebuilding these industries from scratch may not be possible. It is dangerous to let these industries wither and die in pursuit of corporate profits.

As the psychopath Donald Rumsfeld might say: "The future is a known unknown".

If the US does not own the homegrown ability to quickly produce these essentials, we will become vulnerable to international capriciousness and extortion.

[porkrind]

46. Excellent comment !!!

thanks for the great point.

[FloridaPat]

43. I don't know what Clinton & Gore were doing, but whatever it

is I want it back!

[SideshowScott]

44. More backwards talk " Outsourceing will create more Jobs "

Tax cuts will reduce the deficet
Higher medicare costs will help people afford drugs
White is black and black is white in Bush's world
shades of big brother when lies are considered truth

[markses]

45. Ah, the delirium of the free trade cultists

They will persist in the mythology that free trade - absent any checks - will produce good results here in the US inevitably. I say, inevitably, ladies and gentlemen.

Needless to say, this is rank nonsense. We were told the "intellectual" or "symbolic analytic" jobs would support us once manufacturing had gone away. But there was no structural reason (other than implicit racism) why skilled jobs should not also be moved for the same reason: cheap "intellectual" or "symbolic analytic" labor can be got as easily now as cheap manufacturing labor. The point is clear: we are non-competitive precisely because we have already passed through an initial stage of labor uprising against capital - in the period between roughly 1920 and 1970. Labor, in this country, will not go back to the thorough exploitation by capital that existed prior to that structural transformation - even if the organizations that effected the transformation have been rendered harmless. But neither are we protected by isolationism. The point is not to keep jobs here by force, but to promote the same protections we have here everywhere.

As it stands, trade is not free, since regulation burdens the US labor market. These regulations include the prevention of child labor, minimum safety and environmental standards for industry and - once upon a time - safety and wage standards (both enforced by government and demanded by the market forces - that is, laborers). You know, all those bad things. ;-) In any case, if we start exporting these, we will very quickly stop exporting jobs. This is the logic of the cash nexus.

"The bourgeoisie, wherever it has got the upper hand, has put an end to all feudal, patriarchal, idyllic relations. It has pitilessly torn asunder the motley feudal ties that bound man to his "natural superiors," and has left no other nexus between man and man than naked self-interest, than callous "cash payment." It has drowned out the most heavenly ecstacies of religious fervor, of chivalrous enthusiasm, of philistine sentimentalism, in the icy water of egotistical calculation. It has resolved personal worth into exchange value, and in place of the numberless indefeasible chartered freedoms, has set up that single, unconscionable freedom – Free Trade. In one word, for exploitation, veiled by religious and political illusions, it has substituted naked, shameless, direct, brutal exploitation."

- Marx and Engles