Obama says he supports gay rights

[ddiver]

Source: 365gay

Washington) Countering criticism that he’s done little on gay rights, President Barack Obama commemorated the 40th anniversary of the birth of the modern movement by welcoming its leaders to the White House and reaffirming his commitment to their top priorities.
---cut---

As activists work to change minds and change laws, Obama added: “I will not only be your friend, I will continue to be an ally and a champion and a president who fights with you and for you.”

---cut---

Obama pleaded for patience.

“I know many in this room don’t believe that progress has come fast enough. And I understand that,” Obama said. But he added: “I expect and hope to be judged not by words, not by promises I’ve made, but by promises that my administration keeps.”

By the time he leaves office, the president said, “I think you guys will have pretty good feelings about the Obama administration.”



Read more: http://www.365gay.com/news/obama-says-he-supports-gay-rights/

[arcos]

1. Well... then support gay rights! nt

[Rebubula]

2. Yeah..

...but only some of them.

Sorry, Mr. President - that is not enough. Be a freaking leader - you are the most powerful man in the world; your opinions carry a lot of weight.

[JonQ]

3. Yes he does

just not in any meaningful/substantial way, like say through laws, or actions. Basically he supports them through vague promises in situations where that is guaranteed to gain more support than it costs.

[TrogL]

6. So you want him to wave his magic wand and make it all better

That's not how it works.

Read through the entire speech (it's on another thread somewhere) where he lays out exactly how it's all going to happen and what's happened so far. I would expect (demand) progress reports on how things are progressing.

One thing the speech did was clarify the earlier abrupt announcement about "enforcing existing laws", basically that they will be enforced until replaced. Could you imagine the hue and cry if he announced that they weren't going to be enforced?

[JonQ]

7. Being a leader is now "waving a magic wand"?

He had an oppurtunity to overturn, or at least come out strongly against DADT, he didn't. He has stated that he believes a marriage is between a man and a woman.

What exactly has he done in this area to be proud of?

It's easy enough to simply throw up your hands and say it's impossible, those mean guys won't let me do anything, especially without having tried anything in the first place. But for some reason people who do that aren't remembered as great leaders.

[TheWraith]

46. The President can't rewrite laws on his own.

An executive order is a temporary fix that would likely prevent an actual repeal. And besides, we just finished having 8 years of a President who thought he COULD rewrite the law, and we're trying to walk back from that, eh?

[No Elephants]

57. Please see Reply 11. And what is your basis for claiming that an Executive Order would

likely prevent repeal?

Your Bush allusion is also a total straw man. Bush signed Executive Orders in areas in which the POTUS did not have power. He also issued signing statements claiming he was not bound by laws of Congress that apply to everyone.

Contradistinctively, the President, as CIC, has ample power to suspend DADT discharges and 10 USC 12305 also provides him or her with specific statutory power to do that.

Besides, if Obama is as powerless as to DADT and DOMA as you imply, what the hell did he mean when he campaign on repealing them? If he tried to be that totally cynical with voters, he deserves whatever criticism he now gets. In other words, he cannot have it both ways, no matter how slick his speeches are. And neither can his uncritical disciples.

[JonQ]

70. Perhaps not but he can take stands

he can give his opinion (which is not without weight) he can promise to veto any bill that doesn't meet his approval. The president isn't a dictator, but he isn't a puppet either. He does actually have a great deal of authority, both official and unofficial.

[RedSock]

50. amen

when bush said "X", we rightly ripped him.

when obama says "X", some dems make all kinds of lame excuses.

it's not right.

there's a right thing to do -- and obama ain't doing it.

[subcomhd]

51. X =

“I know many in this room don’t believe that progress has come fast enough. And I understand that,” Obama said. But he added: “I expect and hope to be judged not by words, not by promises I’ve made, but by promises that my administration keeps.”

By the time he leaves office, the president said, “I think you guys will have pretty good feelings about the Obama administration.”

\That's what Obama said. When did Bush say X? And then get criticized for it? Do tell.

[JonQ]

69. In other words:

don't count on anything now, just keep the support coming and maybe towards the end I'll throw you a bone or two, once it no longer matters to my reelection.

Such a bold leader.

[No Elephants]

58. +1 But he wants to have it every which way.

[No Elephants]

11. Good. Let's enforce laws, starting with 10 USC 12305. And stop lying that

there is absolutely nothing he can do about DADT until Congress acts. Speaking of which, where are the bills he sent to Congress to repeal DOMA and DADT, per his campaign promises to repeal them?

He doesn't get to have it both ways.

[David__77]

4. Feh...

We will see. Words don't count, actions do. And we need to see more of these. Opportunism will take a terrible toll, if "gay rights" is seen as a tactical issue as part of triangulation, or some other crappy strategy.

[cbdo2007]

5. If it didn't happen on his first day in office then it wasn't soon enough!!

[Strong Atheist]

9. Welcome to DU!

:toast:

[No Elephants]

12. Baloney. (But welcome.)

His first day in office, we were having Riok Warren lead us in prayer. He acted fast enough on honoring the gay hater.

[subcomhd]

14. anyone less committed to civil rights than Obama would tell gay rights activists to fuck-off

With the fucking daily raft of shit they float toward him.

[Behind the Aegis]

15. Exactly!

How dare we demand to be treated as equals?! Who do we think we are? I mean, after all the money we raised, the votes cast, our job is clearly done, and we should just STFU!

[subcomhd]

16. yeah, because it's either or

trash the best advocate the gay community has ever had in a President or STFU. LOL. Are those your only two speeds?

[Behind the Aegis]

17. Seems to be your only two speeds.

Wait or STFU.

The best advocate for GLBT has ever had in a president? Yeah, OK. Sure, because you say so. Let's see, as he done NOTHING to earn that title.

[subcomhd]

18. OK, Who Was?

[Behind the Aegis]

19. To date, none have been all that great, Clinton was best by far.

But Obama ain't the knight in shinning armor you or he thinks he is.

[subcomhd]

20. Clinton signed the DOMA

and he's better than Obama?

[Behind the Aegis]

22. So far, that says something doesn't it?

[subcomhd]

23. Yes, it does

just not what you think. You prefer a guy whose most significant act in terms of gay rights was DOMA to a guy who hasn't done anything in the 5 months he's been president. Yes that speaks volumes.

[Behind the Aegis]

24. What speaks volumes is you think Obama is so great on GLBT issues...

....yet hasn't done SHIT!

Sill gays, just STFU and wait for rights! I heard you loud and clear the first time, and this little sub-thread just confirmed it.

[subcomhd]

25. It has indeed confirmed a lot.

[Behind the Aegis]

26. Sadly, you probably missed the point., others won't.

[subcomhd]

27. No I get it

You think that Clinton was better on gay rights, with 8 years in office and only DOMA to point to, than Obama who has done nothing in 5 months.

[Behind the Aegis]

28. No, you don't get it, as I suspected.

[subcomhd]

29. It's what you said. have you changed your mind?

[Behind the Aegis]

30. It's not what I said. But nice try. Shows your true intention.

[subcomhd]

31. Short-term memory problems

"To date, none have been all that great, Clinton was best by far. But Obama ain't the knight in shinning armor you or he thinks he is."

[Behind the Aegis]

32. I did say that, but that is NOT what you said I said.

So, nice try, FAIL.

[subcomhd]

33. delete

[Behind the Aegis]

36. Circular logic doesn't suit you.

I said Clinton was best by far, not better than Obama. You asked "Who was?" indicating "past."

By the way, Clinton did more than sign DOMA, learn some fucking history. So your little false conclusion (dogs are mammals, humans are mammals, therefore dogs are humans) is absurd.

Obama hasn't done SHIT. But, at least you finally admit that fact! So, I guess we should all just STFU and wait for his "royal fierceness" to prove it. :roll:

[subcomhd]

38. I get it, you don't understand logic. eom

Sorry to have confused you with it.

[Behind the Aegis]

39. No, you have confused yourself. Typical among cheerleaders.

Projectionism at its best.

[Name removed]

40. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[subcomhd]

35. Let's see

If Clinton is "the best so far" then he is better than Obama. Clinton signed DOMA and Obama has done nothing. Therefore signing DOMA is better than doing nothing. I'm sure that's not the point you are trying to make, but it is the logical conclusion of your illogical statement.

this thing is threading wrong (edit)

[ThomCat]

43. It confirms that you have no clue what you're talking about

but you're arrogant enough to consider yourself more of an expert than us on our own history and our own struggle towards equal rights.

Yes, it's wonderful when straight people announce that you know better than all us silly queers what we should think and how we should feel, and you feel qualified judge who our advocates and champions are. :eyes:

[subcomhd]

52. No - "arrogant" is telling me I can't have an opinion about a policy of my president

I will defend Barrack Obama against anybody making ridiculous accusations about him. Why in the world would I exempt those who you call "silly queers." Get over yourself. I don't have to defend my support of LGBT issues, but I will defend a the most progressive president in decades against senseless attacks from anyone.

[ThomCat]

53. "Most progressive?"

Prove it! What are his real credentials that make him the "most progressive?" What has he accomplished?

You're the one being ridiculous. He's not progressive. He's a moderate-right democrat.

[subcomhd]

68. moderate-right LOL

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2009/02/26/national/w102432S08.DTL

[ThomCat]

72. That is your proof?

:(

That article lists him squeezing Medicaid and Medicare. That's not progressive or leftie.

Instead of fixing farm subsidies, taking that money from big agribusiness and giving it to small family farmers who really need it, he's slashing the farm bill money. Again, how is that progressive when family farms have been decimated and made hugely vulnerable to predatory huge agribusiness?

He is INCREASING defense spending. We're already spending more than every other nation in the world combined, and he's increasing the amount we throw at the pentagon. Cutting pentagon spending is the Premiere progressive value.

Spending for green projects is still there, but it has stagnated. Instead of increasing, it's still a minuscule amount compared to the subsidies he's giving for other corporate subsidies. One of his progressive priorities was supposed to be ramping up spending and prioritizing for green projects. It's not here.

One of Obama's key campaign promises that he was supposedly keeping was building a nationwide high speed rail system, and this article even touts that. But he got criticism for drastically under-funded that idea last year, this year the project got only a 2.8% raise, so it doesn't look like its in any better shape.

"At the same time, the White House projected a savings of about $4 billion over 10 years by cracking down on states that make unauthorized unemployment insurance payment..." This means that the white house is going to crack the whip on states that are too generous, and are paying people unemployment benefits when they should be cutting people off and paying them nothing at all. States have been pushing to extend unemployment payments only because of the desperate economic times with such high numbers of people out of work and in desperate situations. My, how progressive of the White House. :(

Doubling foreign aid, but it's all going to Afghanistan and Pakistan? We're famously one of the least generous nations with our foreign aid. We should be increasing our benevolent foreign aid, but we're not. We should be untangling ourselves in both Iraq and Afghanistan, and we should stop being an open check book for Pakistan, but instead we're going in the other direction.

There are a few progressive things in this article, but as a whole it does not support your idea that Obama is a progressive. He's definitely a center right politician.

[subcomhd]

74. Omaba's Center right is about as accurate as 'he's a socialist-fascist"

on the hyperbolic, non-sensical scale. if Obama's center right, then Bill Clinton was a republican.

[ThomCat]

75. You're posting that hyperbol, and acusing me?

I, at least, back up what I have to say. :rofl:

I love it that people who adore Obama as a big lefty never need proof that he's a lefty, never have proof that he's a lefty, don't require him to actually accomplish anything on the left, ignore most of what he's really doing that isn't on the left, and then have all these big exaggerated accusations for those of us who have our eyes open. :P

Just because he convinced you that he was a lefty during his campaign doesn't mean it was ever true.

[subcomhd]

76. In this world of yours where Obama is center-right, what color is the sky?

Obama is the most progressive president since Harry Truman.

[ThomCat]

78. Again, you say it with no evidence.

Just becuase you say it doesn't make it true.

You can keep saying it, but that still won't make it true.

[subcomhd]

79. But you calling him center-right makes it so?

[ThomCat]

80. I posted information that shows it's so.

He's broken promises to the LGBT community that show it's so.

Defending US torturers and hiding the evidence of US torture show it's so it's so.

Increasing the US debt at an even HIGHER rate than even Bush managed shows that it's so.

Making wall street his priority repeatedly by a factor of thousands-to-one in terms of budget commitments instead of main street shows that it's so.

Proposing a free trade agreement with Panama, after campaigning against free trade, even though Panama is a tax shelter haven for corporations shows that it is so.

Reaching out repeatedly to compromise with the ideas and demands of conservatives republicans while ignoring and sometimes openly dismissing the ideas and demands of liberals and progressives who voted for him shows that it is so.

What have you shown to refute any of this?

[subcomhd]

81. his budget alone makes him the most progressive prez. in a generation

in addition:

Reversed Bush auto-emmissions policy to allow states to set stricter standards.

Expanded health insurance for children.

Reversed Bush policy on stem-cell research

Repealed ban on USAID to NGOs that provide reproductive services

Regulated tobacco as a drug

Signed the Equal Pay Act

[ThomCat]

82. His budget makes him a democrat, but not a particularly progressive

one. Have you Read his budget?

Have you seen how that the amounts going to progressive causes are in most cases token amounts?

Have you compared that to the amounts going directly to ensure corporate profits? And directly to military contractors? And into aggressive foreign policy?


Letting the STATES do the work to reverse Bush policies doesn't give him much credit when his policies are helping to bankrupt the states so that the states can't do much.

Reversing Bush policies back to almost Clinton levels, but no better, doesn't make him somehow more progressive than Clinton. That would be really bad logic.

Signing legislation that he COULD have championed loudly from the bully pulpit from the beginning, but barely mentioned, doesn't give him the right to claim credit for that legislation. It's not like he did the fighting to propose and build support for that legislation. I'm sorry, the people who fought hard for that progressive legislation, without him, earned the credit for it. All he did was sign it when it crossed his desk. Get real. Did you give Bush credit like this for the legislation he signed?

I would love it if Obama was progressive. We all would. That's what we were hoping for when we all voted for him. But clearly he's not, and despite your insistence even you can't show that he is.

[Mari333]

83. and yet soooo much stays the same

LEGITIMATE LEFT ANGER



There has been a lot of left-wing teeth-gnashing over the policies of the United States' fake-progressive president Barack Obama. Left-progressives' anger with the Obama administration is understandable given the new White House's actions to (for example):



* Significantly expand the reach and intensity of imperial violence (replete with the mass slaughter of civilians and the related escalation of targeted assassinations) in South Asia.



* Promote a notorious assassin and death-squad leader (Lt. General Stanley A McChrystal - former chief of the military's special Joint Special Operations Command) to the position of Commander of U.S. Forces in the newly merged "Af-Pak" war theater. <1>



* Sustain the criminal occupation of Iraq beneath rhetoric of withdrawal. <2>



* Increase "defense" (empire) spending, consistent with the following statement in a report issued by the leading Wall Street investment firm Morgan Stanley one day after Obama's presidential election victory: "As we understand it, Obama has been advised and agrees that there is no peace dividend."<3>



* Revive military commissions.



* Continue the practice of renditions.



* Maintain secret prisons for persons "held on a short-term, transitory basis."



* Continue the unspeakable torture of prisoners by an "extrajudicial terror squad" (Jeremy Scahill's description of the Pentagon's sadistic "Immediate Reaction Force" in Cuba) at Guantanamo Bay. <4>

and more.....



http://www.zcommunications.org/znet/viewArticle/21576

[No Elephants]

63. Plenty of heteros are gay rights supporters and even activists. This is not about gay versus

straight, but about bigots vs. advocates of equal rights.

[subcomhd]

71. Either Thanks or FU, LOL

Either you are calling me a bigot or defending my right to be a hetero gay-rights supporter. If the latter, thanks. If the former -not so much. FYI - I'm certainly the latter. Let me clarify - I'm not saying don't criticize Obama or keep the pressure on him. Yes, do that. I am just saying that the vicious and ignorant statements like 'he's no different than Bush' irrational and frankly pretty infuriating. Anyway, I'm done arguing this one.

[greeneyedboy]

41. absolutely, Clinton has had the most positive effect SO FAR.

By far the most dramatic positive changes took place under President Clinton. We went from complete invisibility to actual participants in gov't under his leadership.

Yes, there were major setbacks and betrayals. (If you think Clinton had much of a choice about signing DOMA, though, go back and re-read the news from then. Had he vetoed, it would have been overridden.)

DADT is another story--but one of many problems that admin had by not having a transition team ready BEFORE THE ELECTION. Clearly Obama has had the benefit of hindsight on that, and has not repeated the mistake.

Obama, on the other hand, living in a much more queer-positive culture, and with a landslide victory and strong Democratic majorities in his pocket, made specific promises and has done nothing yet. He could outdo Clinton, but thus far he hasn't.



We'll see what happens.

[No Elephants]

64. IMO, both Clinton and Obama are much more motivated by their own interests than anyone elses's

interests. But, yes, DADT, much as it sucks, at least gave gays who are willing to at least try to stay closeted a way to stay in the military.

As far as having little choice about signing DOMA, I disagree totally. He had as much choice about signing that as he did any other bill. He could have vetoed. So what if his veto was overridden? At a minimum, he would not have put his person and Presidential imprimatur on a POS.

Sorry, re-election and image is all either of them really cared about, IMO. They both try to walk the tightrope of keeping at least 4% of voters on their side without alienating any bigots.

Neither of them is exactly a candidate for a Profile in Courage award.

[ThomCat]

44. Clinton at least made an effort to help us, as flawed as it was

and he tried to give us visibility.

Obama is doing nothing to help us, his administration has actively hurt us, and he's done his best to support people who actively oppose us.

So, yes, Clinton definitely ranks better than Obama as an LGBT advocate than Obama.

[No Elephants]

61. Please don't make me have to agree with subcomhd, even a little.

If Clinton had had any fortitude, he would vetoed DOMA and he would not have cooked up an insane policy like DADT with Morris and Powell, then had Congress pass it so he would not have to take the heat for even that pathetic improvement. If he had not done that, Obama would not be able to hide behind Congress now, even as implausibly as he is.


Clinton was no better than any other Democrat. He wanted the votes of the gay community, but wanted to do squat for them, so that he would lose as few bigot votes as possible.

The right answer to subcomhd is that none of them have done right by the gay community, but at least Clinton gave gays a way to remain in the military--if they want to and manage to stay in the closet-- no matter how bigoted and nonsensical that way is.

[No Elephants]

62. Totally false premise. Not one President has done did the right thing, so making claims about who

has been the best is a joke. Especially when you claim doing absolutely nothing for gays makes Obama the best--and you had to move a goal post to get even to that point.

[No Elephants]

59. Your only speed seems to be no speed at all. You're stuck.

[closeupready]

37. So what? Since he is that committed to civil rights, he's not going to tell us to fuck off, is he?

??

[donco6]

48. Yeah, he's a prince.

Golly, guess we should all be grateful he doesn't just round us up and throw us in the slammer.

Wait, we are talking about Obama, right?

[TheWatcher]

55. With the raft of shit that Gay People have to deal with on a daily basis

And the number of times they have been SHAFTED by empty promises and rhetoric, pardon our impatience.

Amd I will resist the urge to tell you to fuck off yourself.

We will NOT Be Silent.

And You Will DEAL With It.

[No Elephants]

56. Bullshit. With election margins, no one can afford to tell any minority group to fuck off. BTW,

why are YOU not a gay rights activist?

What do you have against equal rights for all human beings?

And what "daily raft of shit" do gay rights activists send toward Obama? Or are you confusing posts on message boards with what happens IRL?

[subcomhd]

77. NE

I am in favor of gay marriage (repeal of Clinton's DOMA)

I support the repeal of Clinton's DADT policy.

I firmly believe in equal right for all human being.

As far as being a gay rights activist, I did march with some PFLAG friends once ten years ago. I wrote a couple of letters to my City Council when they were considering domestic partner benefits, back when I lived in a progressive place. So yeah, I should probably get some sort of medal for my activism LOL. I'm sort of surprised the Stonewall anniversary came and went without public recognition for my work.

You are right about IRL vs. message boards. A friend of mine was in SF this past weekend and got to watch a lot of the ginormous parade. He told me he didn't see any anti-Obama sentiment. He said that doesn't mean there wasn't - but he was surprised when my reaction to him having been there was "I guess there was a lot of anti-Obama stuff."

[cbdo2007]

47. oops...did I forget the Sarcasm tag on my original message?

Sorry. I was being sarcastic cause the President has plenty on his plate already.

My bad!

[No Elephants]

65. Please see Reply #12. Besides, misinterpreting your post would only improve it. It

had nowhere to go but up.

[Mari333]

8. talk is cheap. nt

[Behind the Aegis]

10. He's playing chess, don'tcha know?

:sarcasm:

[No Elephants]

13. BY THE TIME HE LEAVES OFFICE???? wth?

[donco6]

49. Yeah, so just hang on for another 8.

Dwaine and I will only have been together for 21 years by then, what's the rush?

[Umbral]

73. What that reads like...

"On my list of 'Things To Do', you are, let me see here... (Reads Blackberry) ...Dead Last. Thanks for coming, help yourselves to the complementary souvenirs on your way out. Please make your contribution checks payable to the Obama 2012 Campaign Fund. Remember, it will take me at least 8 years to get to the bottom of the list!"

[frebrd]

21. "Supports gay rights".......

as long as they don't ask for anything outrageous, like equality!

[ThomCat]

45. As long as all we want is the occasional pride proclamation

and we're willing to sit back and watch while he undermines our rights and supports those who undermine our rights, yes, I guess we can believe he really supports gay rights. :(

Though, the only people I know of who are satisfied with that are uninvolved straight people who want to tell LGBT people how to run our movement for equal rights. Go figure. :eyes:

[closeupready]

34. I find lately I'm just tuning him out, looking to others like Sen. Gillibrand, to get guidance on

how to get where we want to go. We'll probably have to look elsewhere than Obama for making progress.

[Ohio Joe]

42. Keep the pressure on

http://www.usa.gov/Contact/Elected.shtml

I am emailing weekly to let my elected officials know I demand equal civil rights now, not later. Be polite, be firm and don't stop telling them it is not ok to wait.

[No Elephants]

66. Yes, politely decline to donate or host fundraisers. .Politely ask to be removed from the

list of folks they email or mail seeking money and support, etc.

I've done that. Of course, I am still getting requests for money and support, so I guess it's time for me to do another round of polite "please take me off your lists because my money and efforts now politely go only to human rights organizations like HRC and Amnesty International, the ACLU and PBS."

[Ohio Joe]

67. Very good point, I missed that

You are correct, stressing that your money is going to those that support equal civil rights for everyone is a major point. Money is what allows them to survive, let them know it is not going to them unless they support the moral choice of equal civil rights! And not by speeches but by getting the laws we need enacted!

Thanks!

[TheWatcher]

54. More of the Keepers Of The Order Of the Eternal False Paradigm will undoubtedly show up to tell us

To Shut Up and be Patient, and blare rhetoric as empty as what we read in the article, so I will just save them the trouble.

And In PICTURES EVEN!











Etcetera, Etcetera, Etcetera.......



ACTIONS. Not WORDS.

PERIOD.

[Hugin]

60. Sadly, I get all of the references except the second one...

That horse is not dead and beaten.