Nobel laureate Elie Wiesel says he cannot forgive Madoff

[IndianaGreen]

Source: Haaretz

Last update - 19:58 26/02/2009

Nobel laureate Elie Wiesel says he cannot forgive Madoff

By Reuters

Calling accused swindler Bernard Madoff a "crook, a thief, a scoundrel," Holocaust survivor and Nobel Peace Prize winner Elie Wiesel said on Thursday he could never forgive the man he says stole all of his foundation's money.

Wiesel said he twice met Madoff, a once-respected Wall Street trader who authorities say preyed on the Jewish elite of North America and Europe in what grew to be an estimated e50 billion fraud. They discussed ethics and education, not finances.

"Could I forgive him? No," Wiesel said during a discussion, "Madoff and the Meltdown," hosted by Conde Nast Portfolio magazine. "First of all, it would mean he would come on his knees and ask for forgiveness. He wouldn't do that."

He said the Elie Wiesel Foundation for Humanity had e15.2 million under management with Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities, substantially all of its assets. Wiesel said he and his wife also lost personal investments, but he did not disclose the amount.

Madoff, 70, is under house arrest in his luxury Manhattan apartment after being arrested and charged with securities fraud in December. He has not appeared in court to formally answer the charge as several government agencies investigate.

Asked about so-called affinity frauds and whether Madoff's being Jewish had any relevance, Wiesel said Madoff "is simply a crook, a thief, a scoundrel. It is not the Jewishness in him, it is the inhumanity in this man."

"What he has done to people breaks my heart."

Read more: http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1067270.html

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Why isn't Bernie in the slammer already? Why is this POS allowed to stay in his posh apartment while his victims suffer? What about that money his wife took just before the scheme crashed?

[Happyhippychick]

1. Above all else, this story of Weisel's victimization makes me the saddest and the angriest.

[roguevalley]

34. me too and all the other great charities too. He even defrauded his elderly

inlaws

[Gregorian]

2. Kid gloves for the rich. Chained to a wall for the poorer.

This is sickening. And maddening.

[panader0]

3. Outrageous yhat he's not in jail.

A guy can get thirty days for stealing a pack of smokes from a circle K, but 50 billion? Life at Rikers please!

[depakid]

6. At least he's been indicted for something- unlike Stanford

who must still have a lot of friends among corrupt Democrats and Republicans.

[BoneDaddy]

31. I am surprised a bullet has not found him yet

He sure pissed off enough people.

[Zorra]

43. More proof that there are two Americas - one for the wealthy, privileged class,

and one for the rest of us.

Our laws do not apply to the filthy rich.

[hughee99]

4. If there's any justice in this world

Madoff would have all the money he stole invested with Stanford and vice versa.

[Lorien]

5. If there were any justice in this world ALL of his assets would be seized

and distributed among his victims.

Madoff's misdoings have hit home for me. My best friend's son is at Julliard and wants to continue to work towards his doctorate there. The program had always allowed 12 students for the doctorate program in composition, but because Julliard had investments with Madoff the program has been reduced to seven students. :grr:

[FiveGoodMen]

7. Where DID he put the money?

Because we should take it back.

[hughee99]

8. I'm sure he and his family made sure that was protected

or hidden a long time ago.

[FiveGoodMen]

9. Unless he's paid it out to people who legitimately earned it, I'd think the US could find it.

[hughee99]

11. I'll bet what the government is able to recover

is just a tiny fraction of what he managed to rip off. (less than 10%)

Madoff wasn't making trades, he spent years of his life covering things up with what is, I'm sure, an extremely complicated series of financial dealings. I'm willing to bet he's better than hiding it than whoever the government sends after him is at finding it.

[tanngrisnir3]

14. Perhaps, but it is really, really difficult to hide $60 billion.

There are some foresnic accountants working for the gov't who are awfully, awfully good at what they do.

[FiveGoodMen]

16. With the 'Patriot Act' still in effect and 50 Billion on the line

I'm thinking the government can do pretty much anything it wants to in this case.

There's bound to be a clause in there somewhere that allows the seizure of assets for a crime this big.

[hughee99]

24. But they're not going to seize assets they can't find

or can't prove they belong to him, and while they may have good people on the hunt, Madoff has been doing this for years and it may take them a long, long time to catch up with him, if ever.

[tanngrisnir3]

29. It's actually easier the longer he's been doing it because...

the sheer amount of money that tends to accumlate and must be dispersed.

[hughee99]

32. It's easier to find something...

but harder to find most of it. If Madoff put it all in one place, that's one thing, but I suspect he didn't. A thousand hiding places means a thousand trails to be followed.

[Frank Booth]

33. If this worked like the typical ponzi scheme there's not $50 billion left,

since he would have paid people who cashed out, and I assume he paid dividends. I believe they're trying to recover much of that by "clawback" though. I don't think the scheme actually made any money other than what was paid into it by investors.

Regardless, I'm sure there are tens of billions sitting in bank accounts somewhere. His family members are the most obvious recipients, and hopefully they'll rot in jail as well (assuming any of them ever actually see the inside of a jail cell).

[atreides1]

38. Define Legitimate

The man hasn't purchased any securities for at least the last 13 years, which means that the money he was giving to clients was not legitimately earned.

[FiveGoodMen]

42. If he paid money to clients, then he was giving it back to them, right?

But he didn't really rip them off if he gave the money back, so...

He must have kept most of it.

By legitimate, I meant money that he spent on things (boats, houses, whatever) where you can hardly go to the person he bought them from and demand that they return the money.

[JerseygirlCT]

21. I certainly hope that's what they're doing now

Looking for it, making their case rock-solid, and then making sure he or his family never sees any of it again.

[FiveGoodMen]

23. I hope so too, but I'll believe it when I see it.

So far, I haven't even heard it hinted at.

[JerseygirlCT]

25. Yeah. I know... frustrating

especially for all those foundations. Frustrating b/c you have to wonder who was supposed to be watching those things from the foundation's POV. And because while it was big news for a long time, he surely doesn't seem to be getting the treatment non-rich people would be getting.

[catrose]

10. I was most shocked

that he was preying on religious and charitable institutions. He was on the board of the yeshiva he was ripping off. How sick is that?

[cottonseed]

12. Kind of odd that he had ALL of the foundation funds with Madoff.

He must of liked the looks of those completely consistent returns he was getting year over year.

Look I don't want to be an ass, but jeez louise.

[Submariner]

13. Surfing the internet while under house arrest?

A TV news video shot a couple of nights ago, that looked like it was taken from a building roof across the street, showed Maddoff at a notebook PC keying away. I would hope his internet connection was cut so the thief can't transfer funds.

[nichomachus]

15. There's a little bit of larceny in the heart of many scam victims

Most of the people who were investing with Madoff weren't stupid. They knew they were getting returns that were obscenely above the market rates. That's got to set off alarm bells all over the place -- unless you're trying to run a little scam yourself.

One "victim" even admitted that he was sure Madoff was doing something illegal -- but he thought it was just some insider trading. He was OK with Madoff stealing from other people, but was pissed Madoff was stealing from him.

Two rules I learned as a child:

1. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

2. Don't put all your eggs in one basket.

Most of the people who got ripped off by Madoff violated both of those rules, because they were greedy.

It doesn't mean Madoff isn't scum, but the victims had a hand in their own victimization -- just like the people who send their bank information to the Nigerian "princess" in order to help steal money from Nigeria.

[bread_and_roses]

26. There were pension funds nearly wiped out too....and I doubt those pensioners

had much of a clue what was being done with their money - i suspect it was handled by "advisors" making hefty fees. Some of the affected will be near destitute.

[roguevalley]

35. a huge pile of investors and fund managers didn't know they were lumped into

madoff's stuff. they were completely unaware due to how convoluted and corrupted managers and banking houses were.

[DinahMoeHum]

17. Search for the word GONIFF in a Yiddish dictionary. . .

and odds are that Madoff's name and picture are under it.

:evilfrown:

[femmedem]

18. Madoff is the cause of my own dire straits, even though I never had any dealings with him.

Mr. Femmedem had one big customer for 2008/9, someone who was opening a showroom of Mr. Femmedem's musical instruments. He had ordered enough to take us through this rough year. But all of that fell through when our customer lost $30 million dollars to Madoff, and no longer had the money to invest in us.

The ripples must be everywhere.

[IndianaGreen]

22. There was that elderly man that had to go back to work as a store greeter

He and his wife lost $700,000 in lifesavings they had invested in Madoff.

[No Elephants]

19. The affinity issue is a real one. Of course, Madoff did what he did bc Madoff's greed far

exceeds his humanity. That has nothing o do with being Jewish. There were evangelical affinity funds, too. Rather, the affinity issue is part of what causes the investor--the pigeon, sadly--to deaden his or her skepticism, to forego investigations and other cautions. Otherwise, a smart man like Wiesel would never have put all his foundations funds and his wife's funds and his personal funds in the hands of one individual and left them there indefinitely.

[JerseygirlCT]

20. Steal thousands; find yourself in jail. Steal billions?

Stay, sit, make yourself comfortable for a while. We'll handle all the ugly details, don't worry.

[galloglas]

27. Bob Dylan said

"They say that patriotism is the last refuge
To which a scoundrel clings
Steal a little and they throw you in jail
Steal a lot and they make you king
There's only one step down from here, baby
It's called the land of permanent bliss
What's a sweetheart like you doing in a dump like this ?

from "Sweetheart Like You"

lyrics at http://www.songmeanings.net/songs/view/3530822107858517668/

[gauguin57]

28. Any greedy MF'er who steals millions from a Holocaust survivor should burn in hell.

I can't think of an earthly punishment bad enough for this guy. The fact that he's sitting in his luxury apartment makes me want to vomit.

[skooooo]

30. These are very strong, powerful words coming from a man like Wiesel. nt

[chatnoir]

36. Why is this man not locked up in a cell?

Instead of under house arrest in his posh pad in the sky? Wtf?

[Karenina]

37. Because he isn't THIS GUY, who IS:

http://www.digitaljournal.com/print/article/265402

[chatnoir]

39. That is absolutely heartbreaking

And enraging. Wtf is wrong with this country??

Make me think of the book we had to read for an Intro to Criminal Justice class at school "The Rich Get Richer, The Poor Get Prison".

[Karenina]

44. It's certainly not just the U.S.

The big story here is about a 31-years-with-the-company cashier who allegedly stole 1,30 in recycle receipts being fired. She claims to have been targeted for union activity. The court would have none of that. She's out of appeals but not of publicity! :popcorn:

[Dreamer Tatum]

46. Because he probably offered to give up some of the other crooks who invested with him

You think all of those $50B were clean dollars?

Madoff would be dead within a day if he wasn't sealed in his apartment.

[The Stranger]

40. You beat me to it. Staying in a luxury apartment isn't quite getting the point across.

He needs to be in jail, where he belongs until trial.

[marshall]

41. Maybe the politicians who received money from Madoff can pool their money

That ill-gotten money could be used to pay back some of the money these poor souls lost.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/12/15/senate-democrats-may-retu_n_151120.html

[geek tragedy]

45. Madoff isn't in jail because he hasn't had his trial yet.

Pre-trial punishment is generally frowned upon. They've made sure he's not a flight risk.