LA man upset over job kills wife, 5 kids, himself

[Tab]

Source: AP

LOS ANGELES (AP) — A father apparently distraught over job problems fatally shot his wife, five young children and himself at their harbor-area home Tuesday.

Shortly before the killings, the man faxed a letter to a TV station claiming that he and his wife had been fired from jobs as medical technicians and she suggested they kill themselves and their children, too.

"Why leave the children to a stranger?" the man wrote, according to KABC-TV.

KABC reported that the man claimed in the fax that an administrator rebuffed them when they showed up to work, told them to file a union grievance and said, "You should have blown your brains out."

The man wrote that they filed a grievance but nothing was done and two days later they were fired, KABC said.

"They did nothing to the manager who started such and did not attempt to assist us in the matter, knowing we have no job and five children under 8 years old with no place to go. So here we are," the note said.

At the bottom of the note, the man wrote, "Oh lord, my God, is there no hope for a widow's son?"

Read more: http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jgQq_Pn5o6mQHLQWGyzBoiaz4nOwD95VNH180

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God, this just sounds awful.

[Wapsie B]

1. Someone needs to find out the name of that wonderful administrator.

Sad to say I don't think this will be the last story like this.

[shadowknows69]

18. I was let go from what I thought was a promising career in radio 3 days before Xmas

I think it's possibly a good thing that I didn't own a weapon at that time. I never would have hurt my family but my shit list at that shop was pretty long.

[DonCoquixote]

40. I predict three things

1) Said admin was a republican

2) Said admin will really not fell all that bad about what happenned

3) That the Freepers will say something like "OK, that's a few less people stealing my tax dollars!

[Barack_America]

2. As I listen to a Republican bitch about Medicaid and tax-cuts for the impoverished...

...On Hardball.

Tragic. There's no other word.

:cry:

[murray hill farm]

6. Yes, tragic all around.

But, what kind of people were these to make such a decision not only to kill themselves, but their children. There is more to this story than losing their jobs. These actions are not those of persons who were well enough put together to be working as med techs or to be parents. remember, they made the decision to kill their innocent children...and methodically carried it out....and very public. This was vengence at the cost of their childrens lives.

[Barack_America]

8. We don't know their mental state...

I can imagine that two people trying to support a family of 7 on medical technician salaries have been struggling for quite some time. So, it's entirely possible that this could have been a last straw situation. Hopelessness, desperation and depression can cause people to do bad things...wrong things.

They are responsible for this horrible event, but I don't feel right about judging them.

[Mike 03]

3. Another horrible tragedy. This has become a weekly occurrence, which is probably going to become

a daily occurrence. Go to Google News and just type in "Murder-suicide." It's amazing what comes up.

[brentspeak]

4. Beyond terrible.

Were murder-suicides common during the first Great Depression too?

[juno jones]

37. Dunno about the great depression of the 30's

But they were relatively common during the depression of the 1870's.

Check out 'Wisconsin Death Trip' or any of the books chronicling police records such as NYC's during those years.

[No Elephants]

51. I know of a NJ man who was planning to kill himself and his family over the

Orson Welles "War of the Worlds" radio broadcast.

[nichomachus]

5. Let me get this straight

The woman had five kids in less than eight years -- and she worked too?

"Oh Lord my God, is there no hope for a widow's son?"

Something tells me there is much much more to this story than we've been told.

[redirish28]

7. two sets of twins a set of girls and set a boys and a 8 year old girl.

This is sad. Have to wonder how many more times will we hear a story like this?

[slackmaster]

9. Tragic waste of life

It's very sad that some people stake so much of their self-worth in their employment.

[dixiegrrrrl]

10. And stake so much of their children's food and housing on their employment.

Ah yes...if only they could have been happy together with no job, no income, and 5 dependent children.

[brentspeak]

11. I doubt the issue was "self-worth"

More like "How am I going to feed the family and keep a roof over our heads?"

[slackmaster]

12. A mentally healthy adult with an intact sense of self-worth doesn't do that sort of thing

In my opinion.

[AnneD]

57. If someone is stressed enough.....

no telling what they might do. And I wouldn't presume to judge.

Mom (the strongest, most gutsy person I know) didn't tell me til just recently-but one time she was going through a bad time. We were desperately behind on some bills and she and my step father were having marital difficulties(funny how those go together). She was figuring up the debts and looking at the life insurance policy. I happened into her office for something and asked her what she was doing. She told me she was doing the books but then she told me that with the insurance, she was worth more dead than alive. I was just a teen-but something struck me wrong and I went over and hugged her and said maybe on paper that was true but not to us (kids). To us she was worth more than any old piece of paper. She said that she broke down and cried about what she was thinking and swore no matter how tough it got she would never think that again. So she and I have a pact to always call each other when we are down. These folks may have been so isolated that things seemed hopeless. I am not excusing what they did-but I can understand how this could have come about.


These days, lot's of folks are leading lives of quite desperation. And if they don't have hope-they don't want to carry on.

[slackmaster]

14. The posting rules prohibit writing what I would have felt inclined to do in the situation

Suffice it to say I would have directed my outrage toward the union rather than my own family.

But there really isn't enough information to know what really happened.

[undergroundpanther]

45. second question after someone asks your name is...

What do you DO? As in what is your JOB.

Our greed based culture makes one's work the central part of one's person-hood and worth.By creating this illusion it is easier to exploit people's labor if their identity is wrapped up in what they DO instead of WHO they ARE.

[slackmaster]

58. I've worked hard all my life at bucking that societal expectation

That's why I'm called slackmaster. :-)

It's a work/life balance thing. I think of myself much more as a gardener, machinist, musician, and craftsman than as a systems administrator. How other people think of me doesn't matter.

[L0oniX]

13. People would rather kill themselves than be poor and out on the streets ...sad.

[shadowknows69]

19. Looking down that dark corridor is pretty hard

Maybe it's because I'm a life long depressive but I can see the appeal in taking the cowardly way out. Pain hurts enough. Pile on some serious injustice too and some people just break.

[razors edge]

27. Life longer here too.

I think I was around 15 when I just decided F**K it, I can't fix it all, I didn't even break the damn thing and those who did think it looks just great like it is.

For 30 years I've just stuck around to see just how totally screwed it can possibly get. It's a crappy way to live, but it beats the alternative, and people have never failed to deliver on a more screwed up situation than they started out with.

Some people just never get to that point of not blaming themselves for everything.

Hell, maybe I haven't either, I grabbed my new handle from this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=713OgBaNXW4&feature=PlayList&p=F55919826ADBA37E&playnext=1&index=53

[RobinA]

38. Granted

But give the kids a break for god's sake. I have no sympathy for people who decide to take the kids with them in these gestures. That goes a bit beyond depression.

[shadowknows69]

50. I never said you should take other people with you.

[acmavm]

24. Maybe they remember...

Unemployed men vying for jobs at the American Legion Employment Bureau in Los Angeles during the Great Depression.


Bud Fields and his family. Alabama. 1935 or 1936. Photographer: Walker Evans.


The photograph that has become known as "Migrant Mother" is one of a series of photographs that Dorothea Lange made in February or March of 1936 in Nipomo, California. Lange was concluding a month's trip photographing migratory farm labor around the state for what was then the Resettlement Administration. In 1960, Lange gave this account of the experience:
I saw and approached the hungry and desperate mother, as if drawn by a magnet. I do not remember how I explained my presence or my camera to her, but I do remember she asked me no questions. I made five exposures, working closer and closer from the same direction. I did not ask her name or her history. She told me her age, that she was thirty-two. She said that they had been living on frozen vegetables from the surrounding fields, and birds that the children killed. She had just sold the tires from her car to buy food. There she sat in that lean- to tent with her children huddled around her, and seemed to know that my pictures might help her, and so she helped me. There was a sort of equality about it. (From: Popular Photography, Feb. 1960



Dorothea Lange's "Migrant Mother," destitute in a pea picker's camp, because of the failure of the early pea crop. These people had just sold their tent in order to buy food. Most of the 2,500 people in this camp were destitute. By the end of the decade there were still 4 million migrants on the road.


Part of an impoverished family of nine on a New Mexico highway. Depression refugees from Iowa. Left Iowa in 1932 because of father's ill health. Father an auto mechanic laborer, painter by trade, tubercular. Family has been on relief in Arizona but refused entry on relief roles in Iowa to which state they wish to return. Nine children including a sick four-month-old baby. No money at all. About to sell their belongings and trailer for money to buy food. "We don't want to go where we'll be a nuisance to anybody." Children of migrant workers typically had no way to attend school. By the end of 1930 some 3 million children had abandoned school. Thousands of schools had closed or were operating on reduced hours. At least 200,000 children took to the roads on their own. Summer 1936. Photographer: Dorothea Lange.

[L0oniX]

53. And yet they didn't kill themselves. n/t

[acmavm]

54. True, but who knows what an individuals limits are? Some people

just can't cope.

[mntleo2]

30. I don't blame them ...

...life in poverty is hard and you are treated as if it is all your fault when in fact poverty is an institutionalized, racist, classist system that WILL keep you down once you have been there.

Been there, done that, have the t-shirt to prove it ...

Cat In Seattle

[RobinA]

39. You Don't BLAME

them for killing the kids???

[mntleo2]

41. I am not saying it was wise but ...

...leaving 5 children to live the nightmare of parents who committed suicide as well as growing up in the Foster Care System it might have seemed like a loving thing to not let them suffer that fate. I have worked with kids who grew up in the foster care system and they have lived some pretty rough lives, getting abused, being treated like servants, left to fend for themselves the moment they turned 18 with nobody as family. They have nobody who loves them (so they think) and no connections to anyone.

And believe me living in poverty is no party. Sometimes you think it would be better if you were dead according to the way people think about and treat the poor. After all, according to THEM the poor "just take up space" they are not worth anything (except to exploit for wages that would not support a cat but WILL add to the riches of the ones who employ them). I don't feel that elitist way because the classiest, most cool people I know are poor and people who contribute more to this world in five minutes than some self absorbed deadbeat rich person ever thought of doing. I think elitism is a way of validating themselves because most upper income people know they are not doing anything for the world, while the poor are, but still they find it quite the past time to look down their noses and believe they are somehow better than poor people. They like to pass laws like not allowing people to sit on the sidewalk, or sit too long in the park, or making ghettos for "those people" to live in (that they get rich from), creating job barriers that only allow certain people (like rich white males), expect your kids to die in unjust wars while theirs go to college and live in frat houses, make it impossible to get any support when you have kids (especially if you are a woman, nobody asks where the dads are and why they aren't supporting the kids they made and even more of the above if you are a woman of color).

THIS is just a portion of what their children and themselves faced if they lost everything and wound up on the street.

I am just saying that these parents, if they were insane enough to make a suicide pact as they obviously did, thought it was an act of love to take their children with them with the fate they knew these kids would face and, I hate to say it, in many ways they would be right. To be honest with you, I would not wish poverty on my worst enemy, it is the worst sort of abuse, therefore I certainly would *not* wish that for anyone I love. But I am *not* saying it was a good idea!

Sheesh

Cat In Seattle

[L0oniX]

55. Ya know what's weird is these folks probably were pro life.

[Abq_Sarah]

49. I blame them

Those children were murdered. There are always alternatives.

[undergroundpanther]

46. Fear of poverty and homelessness

Is what keeps corporations rich and the classes able to spit on those on the hierarchy rungs beneath them. It is about losing social status.Being on the lowest rung has real and serious consequences on your health,life,sanity...Fear of job loss is what lets corporates drives wages down,and makes people scared to offend the boss by asking for a livable wage.
The disease and suffering of disadvantaged people in all countries are a result of the way we organise our societies.

he social gradient in mortality is a broader issue than that of poverty and health. A study by Marmot of government workers in Whitehall, London, found that while everyone had access to clean water, sanitation, abundant food, and shelter, the risk of dying was related to where they stood in the social hierarchy. In England, the life expectancy gap between men living in rich and poor areas is 11 years and the gap is even bigger in the United States of America between whites and blacks in the same geographical region. Even in Sweden, with the least economic gap between rich and poor, there is a social gradient in mortality. A social gradient in health is also observed in many poorer countries, but there is little systematic longitudinal data.

There is a clear relation between a country's affluence and the life expectancy of its population,

Snip

Power, then, is the key. Control, autonomy, and freedoms might sound like psychological properties of the individual. Power relations in society, as they operate through social institutions and the opportunities afforded to those in relatively disadvantaged positions, are the social causes of degrees of empowerment. Freedom does not imply privileging the rights of some individuals at the expense of the well-being of others. Human rights can be taken as implying an obligation on society to do what is necessary to bring about the important freedoms for everyone.
http://www.issuesinmedicalethics.org/152ss87.html

[NashVegas]

59. I Think We're Going to See a Lot More of This

This is a tragedy; if it had just been one, or the other, they would have had a lot more hope to go on, as far as providing for their family goes.

These are people who probably didn't expect help, or didn't know how to ask for it and receive.

[ecstatic]

60. Human nature is inclined towards survival; suicide implies severe depression

in most cases. Suicide is not an option that someone with a healthy chemical balance in the brain would consider.

[BootinUp]

15. so sad.

the pressure on people is getting intense, sounds like the company handled it very badly.

[wundermaus]

16. You know about that 825 Billion dollar bailout...

It didn't do a thing for that family of 5, did it? Folks, we gotta get our heads screwed on straight and stop handing tons of cash over to the crooks and start giving a hand up to those who are free falling through the ripped safety net of our society. Throwing money at the rich just makes them richer - there is no trickle down - that is a fantasy cooked up by a bad actor. Citizens by the MILLIONS are going to be staring down the business end of a loaded gun with no way out. Some will point it at them selves thinking they have failed... but most others will have an epiphany, and turn that little equalizer in a whole new direction... and it could get real messy. The bosses are worried about the workers turning the US into France... well they might be right in one sense... and heads may roll. Cake or Death?

[corpseratemedia]

26. somehow many of our leaders do not understand this basic fact you pointed out

taking money from ordinary (poor) people and giving it to a bunch of selfish bankers didnt do one good thing..agree with everything you wrote!

[undergroundpanther]

42. Why doesent Obama

MAKE them pay it BACK!! They didn't use it for what it was for,so MAKE THEM GIVE IT ALL BACK to the US treasury/taxpayers.

[childslibrarian]

17. They most likely had inadequate or no health coverage

How were they supposed to get their mental health treated?
Most plans do not adequately cover mental health problems. That is why I am a librarian and not a MSW anymore.

[lonestarnot]

20. OMG! That is so terrible!

:cry:

[al bupp]

21. fnord

[ozu]

22. selfish

They should rot for taking the kids with them.

[independentpiney]

23. They are going to rot, that happens when you're dead

unless cremated. As selfish and inexcusable as it was, judgement doesn't belong to you or I.

[Sequoia]

25. I agree.

I can't read the whole story. I don't want to.

[leftofthedial]

28. where did he work?

There are JOBS open!!




Gotta love capitalism, don't you?

[us_citizen]

29. it was nearly certain that we would be hearing stories like this

recessions/depressions are a very ugly thing

[Thickasabrick]

31. What a fucking asshole. I don't give a shit what drove him to do it.

No.Fucking.Excuse.

[Jim Sagle]

32. Who died and made you god?

Your post is almost as hard to take as the story itself.

[Generator]

33. Who died and made you God?

Goose for the gander. NO, asshole, there is no excuse for killing your five children under the age of eight. AND WHY DO I have to come on DU and see this shit-toddlers begging for their lives-I'm in tears and horror here. Thanks, GOD. You are always there for us.

[Thickasabrick]

34. I have sympathy for people who kill themselves, but when they

take innocents with them - that sympathy goes out the door. I hope there is a hell just for this guy.

[undergroundpanther]

44. As weird as you might think

This guy was probably thinking if his kids go into foster care they might end up being abused,beaten raped or worse. That does happen,in foster homes sometimes .There is not enough funding money going to child protective services to protect kids from bad parents, bad foster parents bad adults.If you compare CPS budget to to the pentagon budget or wealth fare for corporate pigs,you see the"leaders" priorities are fucked up right there. Child abuse can lead to suicide later on.If these kids went to a bad foster home or were shifted from place to place they might make it, or they might be one of the walking wounded.Child abuse is more common than many think that is the reality of child abuse .

Maybe in his own weird way he was trying to spare his kids a potentially horrible future.If this guy saw no hope in the future saw it as bleak,and painful I could see why he would do it.

BUT I agree he had no RIGHT to kill his kids over his own fears and hopelessness about the future.He was killing innocents and it pisses me off.But than again corporate greed and capitalism make them kill each other because their means to survive in their minds was cut off..Why are we blaming the desperate and giving them the most shit? We need to blame the cause of poverty, the greedy, the corporations and the sick system of capitalism.That is what caused this whole thing.
Look upwards to find the source of poverty.

[Catherine Vincent]

35. Pic of the deceased...

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/01/27/family.dead/index.html

:-(

[CountAllVotes]

36. sad as all hell

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090128/ap_on_re_us/bodies_found

In his letter, Ervin Lupoe claimed he and his wife both had been fired and that she suggested they kill themselves and their children, too. Police described the fax but did not release details.

The letter indicated that Lupoe and his wife had been under investigation for misrepresenting their employment to an outside agency in order to obtain childcare. He claimed that an administrator told the couple on Dec. 23: "You should not even had bothered to come to work today you should have blown your brains out."

The couple complained to the human resources department and eventually were offered an apology but two days later the Lupoes were fired, according to the letter.

"They did nothing to the manager who stated such and did not attempt to assist us in the matter, knowing we have no job and five children under 8 years with no place to go. So here we are," the note said.




May they all rest in peace! :cry:

:dem:

[Brooklyns_Finest]

43. Mental illness is a bitch eom

[eilen]

47. Yeah, this is not an appropriate response

to a lay-off. It is not normal. I wonder what kind of med techs they were? They had all those kids and one lay off they take them out? That's cold.

[undergroundpanther]

48. they might have been under

an abuser at work.Work abuse is not uncommon.

[JVS]

52. He should have gone after the administrator who fired him and his wife.

[hamsterjill]

56. So very tragic for the children

When I heard this story, I felt really angry that the father made the decision for the rest of the family. I mean, to kill oneself is one thing, I guess, but to murder the rest of the family, is another thing in my book. Since I don't know the whole story or his mental situation, I'll try hard not to judge him.

But those poor little children!!! It is so horrible for children to be harmed by someone that they expect would protect them and keep them safe.

And the news is full of parents killing children right now. It's all sickening.