Waxman dethrones Dingell as chairman

[EconomicLiberal]

Source: Politico

California Rep. Henry A. Waxman on Thursday officially dethroned longtime Energy and Commerce Chairman John Dingell, upending a seniority system that has governed Democratic politics in the House for decades.

In a secret ballot vote in the Cannon Caucus Room, House Democrats ratified an earlier decision by the Steering and Policy Committee to replace the 82-year-old Dingell with his 69-year-old rival. The vote was 137-122 in favor of Waxman.

The ascension of Waxman, a wily environmentalist, recasts a committee that Dingell has chaired since 1981 with an eye toward protecting the domestic auto industry in his native Michigan. The Energy and Commerce Committee has principal jurisdiction over many of President-elect Barack Obama's top legislative priorities, including energy, the environment and health care.

The vote Thursday allows Waxman to unseat the dean of the House just three short months before he was set to become the longest-serving chairman in the history of the institution.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1108/15822.html

---

The liberal environmental wing of the Democratic Party wins an important battle. Nancy Pelosi did a good job here. She supported Waxman.

[Phred42]

1. Good. K&R

[RamboLiberal]

2. Good - K&R off to Greatest

Dingell in protecting the domestic auto industry is one of the factors in killing it.

[proud progressive]

3. JUST GOES TO SHOW THAT LOOKS AREN'T EVERYTHING!

[question everything]

4. Good riddance (nt)

[truebrit71]

52. Amen to that.

Obstructionist twat that he was...

[cyclezealot]

94. Dingell might have been wrong about Cafe standards.

Good riddance. Really an ungrateful stand.. Few members of Congress have been such strong defenders of FDR, LBJ and all our proudest Democratic traditions.. Few have been as much a pain to Reagan and Bush I, II than the fighting spirit of John Dingell. With the exception of Cafe standards and his NRA connections he has been one of our best fighters of the de regulators that got the US in the Bush II de regulatory fix.. Such comments as above are totally unfounded and wrong.. The question I ask. Why would Waxman leave Government Operations , that would be my plum appointment... Not Dingell's chairmanship..

[John Q. Citizen]

5. In with the change. Alright.

[Purveyor]

6. Well this will certainly hasten the demise of the Detroit automakers and those pesky unions.

Hell, we didn't need those 'low-skilled' meaningless jobs anyway. This country is made up of only highly intelligent and articulate people.

:sarcasm:

[kristopher]

9. I think this is good for the automakers

The heart of their competitive disadvantage is that other countries have used tax policy to maintain a high steady price for petroleum. If we'd done that, our domestic market would have consistently demanded energy efficiency in our transportation and our domestic auto industry would have delivered the goods. The writing has long been on the wall that the low energy prices we've enjoyed were not sustainable. The sort of long term planning needed to deal with that is a governmental responsibility, not a corporate one.

Dingell and his ilk had the responsibility to lead the nation, not follow the same "next-quarter's profit" myopia that corporations are bound by.

[Romulox]

59. THe heart of the competitive disadvantage is massive "legacy costs"

[kristopher]

62. Spoken like a true republican

The main critique of US automakers is their failure to be prepared for high fuel prices. I understand the relationship of legacy costs to profit margins and large vehicles, but I don't consider the development of that relationship to be an inevitable law of nature. It developed because it was the easiest niche to carve out that yielded high profit margins.

If the cost of fuel was a greater consideration for consumers (say gas had remained at the equivalent of 5 2007 dollars/gal since 1984) then the actions the automakers would have taken to ensure their profitability would have been different.

As it is, I see people every day *pay considerably more money* for comparable imports because they like or trust the cars more than a Big 3 product. The fact that they are willing to pay considerably more for comparable quality proves that the cost argument (designed by Reagan to demonize unions) is fallacious.

[Romulox]

66. Spoken like a true idiot. The "legacy costs" exist, even controlling for every other factor.

[kristopher]

71. No one said they don't exist.

I said they aren't the root cause of the problem, made a logical argument as to why I believe that, and gave a proof to support my opinion.

You haven't, but you still have the chance to do more than stick your fingers in your ears and shout "na na na na na na na na na na". If you can refute what I wrote, please have at it.

[Romulox]

73. No, but you did call me a "Republican" for being a member of the fact-based community.

"I said they aren't the root cause of the problem, made a logical argument as to why I believe that, and gave a proof to support my opinion."

No, your argument makes no sense. GM could equal Toyota in every efficiency, and their cars would still cost more, and/or have a much smaller profit margin. QED.

[tclambert]

77. You guys shouldn't even be arguing. You are both wrong.

The flaw in your arguments, both of you, is that you claim "X is the root cause of their problem." Both of you would be correct if you had said, "X is a root cause." It's not an either/or situation, not a single cause situation. Both "legacy costs" and "government allowing cheap gas to encourage inefficient vehicles" contributed to the car companies' current difficulties. You could also say the disastrous behavior of the financial sector is a root cause. And here's my logical proof for why that's more important in the short term than the other two: Toyota is struggling as well. Their October sales plunged 26%. But both of your causes add to the problem for American carmakers. And their October sales figures were even worse.

My point is you are essentially working up a froth over misuse of a preposition. You're that close to agreement. Even more amusing are arguments between people who actually agree with each other totally.

[Romulox]

79. I never mentioned any root cause. Just that legacy costs won't disappear even if all else is equal

[tclambert]

85. OK, you said "THe heart of the competitive disadvantage"

My bad. But I'm saying it is a root cause. You wanna argue hearts vs. roots? "I say it's at the heart of the problem." "Well, I say it's a root cause of the problem." See, that's how we could argue about it while being in complete agreement. I think both you and Kristopher identified valid problems. But I don't think the Highlander rule applies ("There can be only one!").

For instance, another thing at the heart of the competitive disadvantage could be tariffs. (I can't find verification, so if I'm wrong on the numbers here, someone please correct me.) A recent post said we charge 2% on Japanese cars imported into this country. Japan charges 20% on American cars imported into Japan. Free trade? Fair trade? I think not. In Russia, they had a 30% tariff on Japanese car imports because they wanted to encourage development of their own automobile industry.

[MindMatter]

82. You left out one very important factor: Volume

The Reaganites, and their enablers like Dingell, didn't give a damn about our industries or our workers. The goal was always to maximize profits, and that is best done with the shortest of short-term thinking. Yeah, Ford made billions cranking out Explorers when they should have been investing in products that would allow them to maintain market share. The biggest factor putting "legacy costs" out of control is the reduction in market share. GM can't pay for pensions for a work force from the heyday of 60% market share when they are only getting 30-some market share.

[lumberjack_jeff]

95. It also developed in the vacuum created by the lack of social supports.

If an adequate social safety net were provided (read: universal healthcare) by this country, it would be a less important issue during contract negotiations.

[Odin2005]

68. So you think all those retired folks should loose thier pensions?

Fuck that shit! :grr:

[Romulox]

69. No, I think we need single-payer healthcare. nt

[ImOnlySleeping]

76. the problem

The problem is that instead of keeping a separate, diversified pension fund, the big 3 invested all of the money budgeted for pensions back into company stock (raising their options values). Which works out well as long as people kept buying ridiculous cars. If that was the plan they should have been giving union members stock options.
Whether or not the economy had tanked, anyone reviewing the finances of these companies could have foreseen this as an eventuality.

[Indenturedebtor]

99. Nonsense. Those "legacy costs" have been reduced constantly over the last 30 years

as executive expenses have gone up and bad decisions have ground these companies down.

Japanese automakers pay their employees more, and offer more benefits and they've been kicking our asses for years.

[MindMatter]

81. Dingell actively blocked CAFE standards for decades

This was the worst possible thing for the workers because it was the most central reason for the failure of the US auto industry. Had there been a steady increase in CAFE standards, our companies would today be producing products competitive on the world stage.

[John Q. Citizen]

12. Wrong. This will mean a more responsive industry and new life into the unions. They

were dying a long slow death under Dingle.

[JerseygirlCT]

13. Do we need them at any cost?

Even if the cost of keeping them is the death of their industry?

Had the changes that needed to occur happened years ago, their industry would likely be in better shape today. This isn't about, and shouldn't be about, unions vs. the environment. There has to be a way to make unions winners with an industry that acknowledges the realities of today and our addictions to fossil fuels.

The status quo isn't working, period. We need a new paradigm here. Dingell surely wasn't going to allow that.

[tclambert]

78. I think you're overlooking the lag time in car design.

The sea change in Detroit regarding hybrids and alternative energy cars occurred 2 to 3 years ago. That area of car research, design, and development has been in high gear for a while now. But the Chevy Volt won't come out until 2010. It was shown as a prototype at the 2007 auto show. It took time to put that prototype together, months, possibly a year. Getting it from prototype to showroom floors in 3 years is actually pretty quick.

[Strawman]

14. Last nail in the coffin

Used to be a time in the Democratic party where crossing the UAW was sucidal. Now the UAW is powerless next to the House leadership like Pelosi and the leadership PAC's and campaign money she controls.

So it looks like we're getting real environmental reform. That's nice but I am very frightened that these people don't care if the Big 3 came in for a hard landing rather than the soft one I think Dingell would have had tried to engineer.

Make no mistake this is a sea change. Power in the House is centralized. the old days of the powerful committee chairs like Dingell ruling their policy areas like fiefdoms are completely dead.

Normally I'd say that's a good thing, but I don't think people like Waxman and Pelosi and Chris Dodd can really grasp the magnitude of the impact of collapse of the domestic auto industry.

Detroit's dead. And I shudder to think what that means for this area.

[1gobluedem]

15. I agree

This is devastating to our very troubled state economy. Posts on this liberal board have already shown so much contempt for Detroit and our state's major industry and now we have lost our strongest advocate in power to someone who doesn't give a damn about the domestic auto industry.

It really upsets me.

[Strawman]

18. I can understand it but its hard

Dingell played hardball. People see what is happening to the environment and are upset that this guy has blocked CAFE at every turn. They see an industry that made SUV's and didn't give a damn and think it is just deserts. And Dingell and his wife are not the most likeable people in Democratic politics. This honeymoon period is a rare window to pass sensible environmental regualtion and it is understandable that Dingell was seen as a roadblock. I would have preferred some kind of quid pro quo for a greener Dingell chairmanship in exchange for Detroit aid. But instead the leadership just ran him over like roadkill. What a sea change in Democratic politics. The UAW really has no power any more.

I think about bankruptcy for these companies and what it might mean in human terms. I think about old people whose worked for the Big Three and thought they were safe in their retirement. My uncle worked for Chrysler for 40 years and my aunt lives off his pension in an assisted living facility that costs like $2000 month. If those committments are shed in bankruptcy, people like my aunt will be lucky if they have a family member to take them in like she does. Others won't be so lucky. They will lose everything they own to qualify for Medicaid. And if they are lucky they will find a spot in a shoddy nursing home that will take them.

Then there are cities in SE Michigan that rely on revenue from factories that will go bankrupt and have to lay off workers and cut services. The state unemployment and Medicaid coffers are already empty.

So I know this sounds bad but I feel like yay we saved three newts and told these people tough shit. Hope it feels good to all those people who think we should all ride bikes or some shit and have an axe to grind against the domestic auto industry.

[tclambert]

83. If you want to see what auto company bankruptcy would look like,

watch Michael Moore's Roger and Me one more time. Now picture what Flint looks like in that movie, only this time picture it as the entire country. "Rabbits for sale. Pets or food."

Oh, and go green!

[Strawman]

20. And Go Blue this weekend.

I'm not one of these Sparties so blinded by hatred of Michigan that I want to sacrifice a chance to play for the Rose Bowl!

I hope you guys win. It's been a tough season and I know that that is like. A win against OSU and an MSU Rose Bowl would be a temporary lift for alot of people around here right now. Lord knows it isn't coming from the Lions.

[iamjoy]

22. Don't You Have Contempt

Don't you have contempt for the big three? They've been closing down plants all across the mid-west. They play tough with the Unions gettting wage and benefit concessions so they can reward their executives with big bonuses. Now, the CEOs take private jets to ask Congress for taxpayer money! You can bet if they do go under, or do get a bail out that the executives will continue to receive their ridiculous compensation, even as the workers face dramatic cuts and layoffs. You can bet the executives will try to worm their way out of pension obligations (or stick taxpayers with the bill) while they keep their bonuses and retirement payouts.

Doesn't that disgust you? They're screwing you.

We should not be divided on this. The big business interests are succeding in driving a wedge between labor and environmental groups by blaming the latter for economic problems leading to workforce and benefit reductions. Then they tell the environmental groups we can't take care of our planet because it will cause people to lose their jobs.

[AllyCat]

24. It's too bad that people are showing contempt in their posts here.

Most of the posts I've read seem more related to the "dinosaur" status of the Big 3, an opinion with which I have to agree. I'm frustrated with the leadership that could not possibly imagine that people might want fuel efficient cars and kept building more and more guzzlers because they said that's what the market wanted. At that same time (2004 or so) there was an 18 month waiting list to get a Prius. Toyota was able to plan, build, or retool as necessary to get more of them produced here. GM closes plants and then asks for taxpayers to help them out.

I'm union and I don't want to berate the UAW and see people (union or not) out of work. But something has to change to make American cars competitive sellers worldwide to improve our economy, and it has to be something that helps the environment to be that kind of a business.

I've never been to Detroit. Sounds like it must be really hard living there. I hope Waxman helps protect the environment and makes the Big 3 profitable and sustainable.

[1gobluedem]

58. How will Waxman be on Great Lakes protection?

Will he give a damn? Or will he think we should ship all that water off to fight California wildfires?

I know. Why don't we saw Michigan off at the bottom and forget about it. Then the rest of the country can have our water and not even pretend to care anymore.

[bluecollarcharlie]

64. All you need to do is Google anything about...

...water and Southern California. Or maybe rent the film Chinatown. he'll keep finding creative ways to screw Michigan and the rest of the Great Lakes. First, take all their jobs. Second, wait for everyone to move to other states to look for work so the states lose more congressional seats. Three, legislate air tankers to take the water and ship it back to L.A so LA-LA land residents can wash all those shiny Lexuses, Infinitis, and Acuras all the while professing to care about those poor hungry out of work pepole in the once great midwest.
BTW, none of that is sarcasm. I truly believe that in some form will happen. Just watch.

[Ken Burch]

30. Can we assume that Waxman will be antiunion, though?

It's not like the guy's a DLC'er.

[Strawman]

35. My concern is there won't be a domestic auto industry around for union workers

He may be as pro-labor as Dingell I don't know. But if the Big 3 go under it kind of makes that a moot point around here.

[BrklynLiberal]

49. Based on his votes, I would say he is pro-union.

http://www.ontheissues.org/CA/Henry_Waxman_Jobs.htm

Rated 85% by the AFL-CIO, indicating a pro-union voting record.
Voted YES on restricting employer interference in union organizing.
Voted YES on increasing minimum wage to $7.25.
Voted NO on zero-funding OSHA's Ergonomics Rules instead of $4.5B.
Waxman co-sponsored allowing an Air Traffic Controller's Union

[backscatter712]

38. Doesn't have to be.

I can see Detroit retooling, rebuilding and making a hell of a lot of money making a new generation of green vehicles. Also retooling and building things like passenger trains, commuter trains, subway cars, that sort of thing - we need to build far more mass-transit in this country. Also building wind turbines, solar panels, geothermal equipment.

There's money to be made in all this, it's just that the Detroit auto executives, and even the UAW is too myopic to see it.

If we do what FDR's generation did - rebuild, retool, build new infrastructure, build a new America, there's plenty of money in it for Detroit's autoworkers and out-of-work steel-workers and so on.

[Strawman]

41. Sure but they have to survive first

They are bleeding cash and will run out early next year.

If they go into bankruptcy millions of people will be devastated and there will be a particular concentration effect on SE Michigan.

General Motors is running out of cash. Think about that for a minute and what that says about the fundamentals of the US economy. It's hard to believe that even outside of Detroit that doesn't really scare people.

Based on what I've seen so far I have zero confidence in our congressional leadership to keep them afloat.

I really hope I am wrong and you're right.

[backscatter712]

43. Fine, bail them out...

in exchange for having them retool to build green cars. I'm not against a bailout, and I do want to find a way for the auto workers in this country to make a decent living. I just want assurances that the bailout won't be used to prop up the same old shit for three more months, then have us right back where we started. If they're to be helped by the taxpayer, they're clearly doing something wrong, and need to be steered in a new direction.

Oh, and break the car companies up. We should have 20 little car companies, not 3 big ones - Chevrolet, Buick, GMC, Cadillac and Saturn should be separate companies. So should Ford, Lincoln and Mercury, as should Chrysler, Dodge and Jeep. Sure, give them financial aid so each small auto company has its own manufacturing infrastructure, but we could have a far more competitive auto industry if we did this.

If they're too big to be allowed to fail, they're too big to be allowed to exist in their present form.

[Strawman]

44. Yeah. I'd welcome that

But it isn't happening. There is no urgency in the Democratic caucus. We'll be lucky to get what Bush proposed to give them a lifeline (ironically saying they get $25 billion they were already getting before to do green retooling but with no green strings attached so they can use it however they need to stay afloat) thanks to Republican votes. That is if they can keep enough Senators in town who give enough of a shit about us to vote for it.

But whatever. This is tiring. Nobody cares. Easier to just bash Detroit and not think about the little people. Sorry to get in the way of everyone's celebration of our brave new green world.

[backscatter712]

46. Can't they hold out for 60 more days?

At least long enough to get Chimpolini out of the White House, and get a few dozen rethug assclowns out of Congress, then maybe we can come up with a bailout and a new direction for Detroit that actually makes sense.

Though my guess is that the executives, because they like their Learjets and 200 ft. yachts, are trying to create this emergency or at least make it more urgent, and will deliberately run their companies into the ground, so they can get a Bushie-style bailout. With an Obama-style bailout, they'll actually have to work for that money, and not just have it given to them for free so they have enough to declare bankruptcy, yoink the union's contracts and retirees' pensions and fly away on their golden parachutes. Classic Shock Doctrine - they're trying to rob us!

[Strawman]

48. Actually I don't know

GM has already mortagaged the Ren Cen. The biggest building in downtown Detroit that they own.

And that money is never released immediately. This money they might get now was approved months ago.

Not bailing them out introduces real risk and uncertainty into the situation. Maybe they can wait. Maybe not.

[PassingFair]

57. Half a month.

They virtually shut down in the month of December, anyway.

Although I live in the Detroit area, I have never liked
the Dingells.

Greener tech would have been achieved sooner without them.

Waxman impresses me.

[FarCenter]

63. Given the way that big corporates "slow pay" their bills, I'd think they could stiff their creditors

[tclambert]

87. They said on the TV that GM and Chrysler don't think they can hold out until January 20th.

Ford's in a little better shape, but if one goes down, the ripple effect through suppliers and consumer confidence may take them all down.

If it's on the TV, it must be true, right?

[Lithos]

104. There is always opportunity in change

And I think that if the Big 3 actually wake up and embrace change as opposed to fighting it like they've done for the past 25 years that they stand a reasonable chance to regain their dominance.

This is certainly a case where Government can influence, nudge, the Big 3 to start making some of the changes they need to make in their product lines and to focus once again on manufacturing.

Side note: I personally think the severe decline of the Big 3 was not due to their non-grasp of environmental issues (energy, etc.) or to the unions, but when they discovered their financing arms (GMAC, etc.) were much more profitable than their manufacturing arms. That is when they lost focus and became something other than a car company. Ie, they ceased being car manufacturers and something more akin to banks.


L-

[Strawman]

105. Changes are welcome. Crashes are not. At least not where I'm standing.

[BrklynLiberal]

50. Rated 85% by the AFL-CIO, indicating a pro-union voting record.

http://www.ontheissues.org/CA/Henry_Waxman_Jobs.htm

[mimitabby]

7. Waxman's my hero!! yay for him!!

[yellowcanine]

8. Feh. One old fart dethrones another old fart. We need new blood, imo.

There must be someone on that committee less than 69 years old who could lead it?

[EconomicLiberal]

10. Who cares if Waxman is 69 years old?

The man is one of the most progressive congressman in our caucus. Why does it matter if he is 69?

[izquierdista]

11. Wile E. Environmentalist??

I hope he goes after ACME's defective products!

[orleans]

16. what about his chairmanship for the committee on

oversight and government reform?

who is going to head that committee now?

i was hoping henry would still be investigating the fuckhead administration and finally be able to bring them up on charges for some shit.

[cascadiance]

53. Kucinich was mentioned on Thom Hartman's show just a bit ago...

The sub in for Thom Hartmann was talking to someone else about it, and a couple of other names came up, but last but certainly not least Kucinich was mentiond as a possibility!

Let's PUSH Kucinich for this folks! It could be actually a big improvement! Waxman's been someone that's gone after a lot of things, but I think his AIPAC ties, etc. have kept him on a leash when it came to things like putting Sibel Edmonds on the stand to really substantively go after wrongdoing. I think Kucinich would be absolutely GREAT with a take-no-prisoner attitude that he has! In some respect, I'd look forward more to him in charge of this committee than Waxman of his new committee chairmanship!

[suzie]

103. Waxman spent his time overseeing, not running for President

or appearing on talk shows.

With Kucinich are we likely to get far more of the latter and very little of the former? Not a good change in my mind.

[cascadiance]

107. I think Dennis would be better at overseeing what Sibel Edmonds knew about...

Waxman dropped the ball BIG TIME on that issue. I have a feeling it was due to AIPAC influence, but it's hard to guess what was really going on behind the scenes. But it was obvious that Waxman was being "gagged" just as much as Edmonds was on getting her to testify.

I have a feeling that Kucinich would be less "owned" by those in the hierarchy and would have brought in Edmonds to testify. Kucinich wasn't doing what he was doing just to "run for president". He carried on his impeachment efforts long after he dropped out of the race, and trying to get a *REAL* set of hearings on impeachment, whereas one might argue that a lot of what Waxman did turned out to be more for sure than actual prosecutions.

[orleans]

106. well, if dennis gets it then i'm all for it. i adore dennis! n/t

[DinahMoeHum]

17. Good riddance to "DingDong" Dingell - a bone in the throat

to progress and reviving the economy.

Now, can we figure a way to primary him out in 2010??

:kick::kick:

[Taverner]

21. Good luck with that - He's done A LOT for labor unions

[Ken Burch]

34. Dingell has stood in the way of retooling to make fuel-effecient cars

from what I can see. And in doing that, he's helped damage auto sales and thus hurt unions.

[Taverner]

39. I didn't say he was an angel, just that it will be hard to remove him in the primaries

[Strawman]

47. I wouldn't be surpirsed if he retired now

And his wife, a GM exec and a descendant of the Fischer's, takes his spot. She'd win a special election easily.

Dingells have held that seat for almost 80 years. Nobody is going to unseat him or her. Even Nancy Pelosi's leadership PAC doesn't have enough cash to buy that result. That would require some serious redistricting by the Michigan state legislature. I don't see them doing that to Dingell's district.

[iamthebandfanman]

19. woohoo n/t

[bluecollarcharlie]

23. Progressives= bullshit!!!!!!!!

All you so called progressives will be glad to come after us during the election for our votes, but when you get in you stab us working people right in the back. At least the republicans will look you in the face while they are fucking you over.

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[defendandprotect]

33. Daschle is not someone I'm enthused with --!!!

[AllyCat]

40. I am a working person and I'm union

The Big 3 need to change their ways to remain competitive and provide jobs for Americans, union or not. It's that simple. Dingell has not shown in 27 years that he will foster that. He needed to go.

[Romulox]

60. "Solidarity!" (if it's convenient.) nt

[AllyCat]

102. How is wanting a better product for the workers to make not solidarity?

That is what will help them continue to negotiate good contracts, provide a safe work environment for their people, and make a difference to the world that unions have come to stand for! Instead of the Big Three going under because they can't/won't compete, lets make their bailout contingent upon something that will fix the problem? That's something we all wish would have happened with the financial bailout. Lets try to fix it here.

Our union is fighting to get real health care reform passed. That's a sea-change in the hospital/clinic/public health realm. Is that anti-union? We're fighting for the people we serve in addition to ourselves.

I've always felt the UAW is given crappy cars to build from the suits at the Big 3. They deserve to make good products that are in demand around the world that protect our country and the environment too.

[fascisthunter]

91. What Progressive Stabbed You in the Back and How?

would love to read something other than right wing BS.

[Romulox]

92. Al Gore and NAFTA, for one. nt

[harmonicon]

98. ya think so?

Well, this Michigan voter isn't unpleased with the change. I'm happy to wait and see where it leads us. I don't know who the "us" is that you refer to, but I imagine that it's included me (Michigan resident, and former holder of a union job).

[lostnfound]

101. You are jumping to conclusions.

The replacement of Dingell with Waxman doesn't mean the UAW will be stabbed in the back. It might mean that there will be a realignment of goals that includes a bailout of the Big Three (which, as a progressive, I do support) AND environmental goals AND jobs growth via new technology.

[natrat]

25. Yes Yes Yes More More More

[Strawman]

27. I wonder if Dingell will retire now

He might as well resign and let his wife run for the seat or be appointed by the Governor.

How can a guy like that want to be a back bencher at 82 after basically ruling this committee for nearly 30 years?

[Ken Burch]

29. She'd have to run. You can't be appointed to a House seat.

n/t.

[Strawman]

32. Debbie Dingell would be a shoo-in in a special election in that District

Probably a good time to make the transition.

[ooglymoogly]

28. I am not a fan of Waxman...

And I believe the congress is treating the downfall of the auto industry cavalierly and irresponsibly while behaving even more irresponsibly by giving the fat cat banking industry trillions of unregulated funds slopped into a pigs trough.

[defendandprotect]

31. Love Waxman ....if thy let him do his honest, ethical work we're in good hands --

[ooglymoogly]

36. Yes now we can rest assured that congress will spend inordinate amounts of time

making sure no athletes are on steroids and other such earth shattering matters will be completely delved into.

[Ken Burch]

55. The steroid thing was when the GOP still controlled Congress.

It wasn't Waxman's fault, for G-d's sake.

[defendandprotect]

89. Rep. Henry Waxman is the man who finally took down tobacco --

trust you were displaying sarcasm re Bush admin ....??

[MasonJar]

37. That is excellent news for the environment of the world and for the American

people. Kudos to the dems for doing the right thing. Maybe "Things...they are a'changin'" to paraphrase Bob Dylan.

[KamaAina]

42. Downside: Waxman backs the entertainment industry all the way

not terribly surprising considering he represents west L.A., but still, the dreaded RIAA just scored one. :puke:

[BrklynLiberal]

45. One small step for man, one large step for mankind..

[2Design]

51. kick

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

54. FINALLY! Score one for the liberals!!

[Romulox]

61. NEO-liberals, you surely mean. nt

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

65. What's the difference? I'm curious. Are neoliberals about balancing budgets?

They also tend to support a form of capitalism and free enterprise?

[Romulox]

67. "Liberalism" used to refer to laissez-faire economics.

A "neo-liberal" is, confusingly enough, actually an old-fashioned "liberal-- a "let the market decide!" type.

As you mentioned on another thread, there are many, many, MANY so-called "progressives" who style them self as free-market types. Waxman strikes me as one of these.

[David Zephyr]

56. I'm a huge fan of Henry Waxman. I wish he was A.G.

K&R.

[hangman86]

70. Careful what you say about Waxman

Those ears of his hear well across he country!

:rofl:

No, no, I'm glad he won.

[Mnemosyne]

86. I think he's kind of cute, in a Batboy kind of way.

:evilgrin:

I do like him some.

Welcome to DU, hangman! :hi:

[bluecollarcharlie]

72. Yea!! Score one for massive unemployment........

......score one for turning the midwest into a massive wasteland by legislating their jobs out of existence. Score one for the coal miner who will be turfed out and no longer be able to provide for his family. Score one for the lawyers for RIAA who will be able to bust your door down with impunity because your kid downloaded a file of the internet. Score one for the hypocrisy of going after high-profile steroids users, but not knowing the legal smoking/drinking age in this country. Score one for the low-income South and East L.A. residents who finally got to use the Red Line after the environmental demi-god dropped his opposition to building a tunnel through his very affluent area of L.A. (Can't have all those black and brown people coming in. They might steal or be dirty or remind me of what i'm supposed to doing in Washington. Other than grandstanding) Score one for the limousine liberals for they have finally found a champion to help explain away the latest hypocrisy crime of their ilk.

Yes, hip hip hooray for Windmill Hank. Now, excuse me while i go collect unemployment.

[ksimons]

74. K&R

woo hoo

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

75. Much better but not best.

General reaction: :thumbsup:

[BrklynLiberal]

80. Waxman's Win Paves Path For Obama Goals

Dingell's Ouster Sets The Stage For Legislation On Energy, The Environment And Health Care

But Waxman's longstanding criticism of the auto industry could foreshadow significant setbacks for Detroit just days after the Senate failed to act on proposals to bail out the Big Three automakers. "It may very well be that Waxman is the person to deliver the bad news to the auto industry that if they want federal help, they need to change the way they do business," said Linda Fowler, a government professor at Dartmouth College.

http://www.nationaljournal.com/njonline/no_20081120_7899.php

[depakid]

84. "with an eye toward protecting the domestic auto industry"

which ironically he worked hard to destroy....

[Beartracks]

88. Longest-serving chair?

Would Dingell have been the longest-serving chair of the Energy and Commerce Committee, or the longest-serving chair of ANY committee?

Just curious.

:dunce:

[tclambert]

90. Not sure if it's a net good or bad.

On the one hand, Dingell traditionally fought increased fuel economy standards. Waxman will certainly be more inclined to make the American auto companies build more fuel efficient cars. On the other hand, Dingell was very protective of the auto industry. Waxman will almost certainly not fight as hard for a bailout, or bridge loan. On the third hand (come over here, I need more hands), Dingell is even older than McCain. Waxman is not from Obama's generation, but is closer, so he may be more in tune with the new directions Obama wants to explore. On the fourth hand, Dingell's been doing this for frackin' ever. He knows the game better than anyone. Waxman still has a lot of experience, just not quite as much.

I think it might be a net positive.

Question, though: Dingell lost the center seat, but does he still have a seat on the committee?

[KamaAina]

93. Headline O' The Month from Slate: "Dingell Buried"!!!

http://www.slate.com/id/2205117

Dingell Buried
Henry Waxman's victory is the biggest gift Obama could have asked for.

By Christopher Beam
Posted Thursday, Nov. 20, 2008, at 7:08 PM ET

Out: Rep. John Dingell of Michigan, the tough, cantankerous eminence grise of the House Democratic caucus (he's 82), who was so deferential to Detroit as chairman of the House energy and commerce committee that Lee Iacocca once said he "stood up for the auto industry beyond the call of duty." In: Rep. Henry Waxman of California, the tough, mustachioed eminence slightly less grise of House Democrats (he's 69) known for his relentless investigations and aggressive proposals for combating climate change. Waxman's mustache—it even has a nickname—haunts Rick Wagoner's dreams.

Oh yes, the nickname: it's the "Mustache of Justice"!

[Canuckistanian]

96. The "Moustache of Justice" wins again

Now there's a Dem I'd like to see get more power.

Go, Rep. Waxman, Go!

[shellgame26]

97. Omg..

what's this strange new feeling I'm getting...I haven't felt this way in years...it feels like...like..HOPE :-)

[Jack Rabbit]

100. I first heard of Dingell when I was in high school

He was trying to pre-empt state auto emission standards we had passed in California.

That was 1967. Here in California, he's known to news junkies. We call him Cogressman Dingaling. Let's just say I'm quite pleased to hear the news.