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Rage for Order Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-08 09:24 PM
Original message
(Venezuela's) Chavez Opponent Faces Corruption Allegations
Source: AP

CARACAS, Venezuela – Venezuela opened a corruption probe of a leading opponent of President Hugo Chavez on Tuesday with less than a month to go before nationwide elections. Attorney General Luisa Ortega said prosecutors should decide whether to file criminal charges against Gov. Manuel Rosales by year's end, throwing up a cloud that will remain through election day on Nov. 23. Rosales, a two-time governor, is running for mayor of Maracaibo, Venezuela's second-largest city.

Rosales denied any wrongdoing and accused Chavez and his allies of raising false charges to prevent his victory next month. "They have always dreamed of taking me out of the political game," said Rosales, one of four opposition governors in Venezuela's 23 states. "They cannot win with votes, so they try to win with tricks."

Chavez has called for Rosales's imprisonment, without providing any details why. "I have decided to make Manuel Rosales a prisoner," he told business leaders Saturday in Maracaibo. "He cannot continue in office. ... He is one of those who wants to see me dead."

The allegations piled up on Tuesday, when Giancarlo Di Martino, a close Chavez ally running to replace Rosales as governor of western Zulia state, accused Rosales of extortion and misusing public funds. Di Martino also alleged that Rosales was involved in the murder of Julio Soto, an student protest leader shot to death last year, but did not explain explain why Rosales would be involved in the slaying of a fellow opposition leader.

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081028/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/lt_venezuela_opposition_leader;_ylt=AjO1c.asAXJPYL_r9l5o8btvaA8F



The timing of this corruption probe certainly is suspect. Can you imagine the outcry if Bush had told the US Justice Department to begin a corruption probe on Obama at the beginning of October, after saying publicly that "I have decided to make (him) a prisoner..."?
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-08 09:32 PM
Response to Original message
1. I have decided to make Manuel Rosales a prisoner..hmm
I am sure the pimps will be happy to explain how that is ok. Remember chavistas, 1 week before hugo bcomes our problems. He was called out by name in the debates.
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-08 09:47 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. "our!" Oh, wonderful! That's hilarious.

Will be looking forward to your wisdom during the terrifying years to come, when Hugo Chavez becomes "our" problem.


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ronnie624 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 01:20 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. Pimps?
Ever will you defend your 'position' with nothing but hand waving and insults. Your messages are worthy of little more than a sneer and prompt dismissal.
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #4
34. walking on water
is an impressive thing. The unflinching support for hugo here, even after his position in the debates is more impressive.

He will be a case of jock itch after the november election. We win, and he is still an idiot.
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Guy Whitey Corngood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 10:00 PM
Response to Reply #34
46. .
Edited on Thu Oct-30-08 11:39 PM by Guy Whitey Corngood
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 01:58 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. So, you call out DUers over a crappy translation?
Wow, how disgusting.
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Tandalayo_Scheisskopf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-28-08 10:08 PM
Response to Original message
3. This looks rather hinky. nt
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 02:21 AM
Response to Reply #3
8. It's the framing. Judi Lynn, who is not a gadfly like me, has been posting
about this story for weeks. I've been working other stories but iirc, this one is between 4-6 weeks old.

But, this OP is the second one in a few days that makes the whole thing sound as if it just started and as if Chavez is dragging people in off of the street.

I don't pretend to know this guy but the way he gets reported in our media is ridiculous.

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 01:56 AM
Response to Original message
5. Except this had been going on for weeks.
This story makes it sound like it's new, it's not.

There are at least three stories in the Latin America forum that are weeks old.
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 02:19 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. Very old news, you're right. By the way, it looks as if Rosales is dragging his heels on that
Edited on Wed Oct-29-08 02:21 AM by Judi Lynn
investigation of that 31 year old opposition student, who was involved in car thefts, narcotrafficking, and bootlegging the student bus tickets which were subsidized by the Venezuelan government to allow them transportation at reduced rates.

You noticed they got only so far, arrested from 6 to 8 people several weeks ago (he was killed around the 1st) and that was the end of it, after the news got out that he was involved in criminality, and had an ENORMOUS bank account, waaaaaaay beyond anything students would ever have.

They tried to make it appear political at the beginning, played it for all it was worth, even kept the story of the "political" angle, a lie, going when one of the opposition clowns went to the European Parliament and used the bogus version to claim his "rights" had been violated when he was killed. Uh HUH. He was most assuredly killed by someone in the crime community. That part appeared inevitable after they got his cell phone and ran down the numbers.

Several papers did publish the info. that it looked like a contract killing.

Also, the newspaper Panorama was doing its own investigation on Julio Soto, and the opposition at the university turned rabid against it, took a truck, went around gathering up copies so people couldn't read it from the machines, and they launched an attack on the paper itself, trying to intimidate the publisher, suppress the story.

Sooner or later, that damned story is GOING to get out. I'm sure Manuel Rosales intends to sit on this investigation until after the election, whaddya want to bet!
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 02:29 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. I don't think that kid could put together such a big operation
without Rosales knowing about it.
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 03:14 AM
Response to Reply #9
12. No way! I just found this, written in English. Not too much appearing in English on this guy!
Edited on Wed Oct-29-08 03:17 AM by Judi Lynn
~snip~
Soto was killed when he and his fellow student leader Hernan Chirinos were stopped by unknown gunmen while driving through the city of Maracaibo. The gunmen blocked Soto's vehicle, fired multiple shots and then fled the scene. Chirinos remains in critical condition.

Soto was a member of the Copei Opposition party. Zulia's governor, Manuel Rosales, is one of President Chavez's most vocal opponents. President Chavez has accused the governor of aiding paramilitary groups just across the border in Colombia and of being a drug trafficker. In addition, President Chavez has accused the United States government of having CIA offices in the region to launch a coup against him. Soto had successfully worked to help defeat President Chavez's constitutional reforms last December. Government officials were at first reluctant to call Soto's murder a politically motivated assassination. Jose Gonzalez is the local chief of police in the city of Maracaibo where the killing took place. He stated he believes that Soto was the victim of a contract killing. He cited the fact that the gunmen fired twenty shots at Soto's vehicle and then left without taking anything as proof that Soto was targeted. Random shootings do occur in the state of Zulia.
The government of Venezuela called for calm after the shootings on October 1 and had promised a thorough investigation. Todays arrest warrants come less than two weeks after the promise. However, the fact that police officers have been implicated in the killing does not bode well for the tension in the region. The Venezuelan government has implicated the regions ties to the drug trade as a possible motive. Opposition leaders claim that President Chavez's government was behind the killing. Nationwide elections for hundreds of mayors and many governors are scheduled for this November. The region cannot afford to have accusations of police involvement in a politically motivated murder at this time.

http://www.impunitywatch.com/impunity_watch_south_amer/2008/10/arrest-warrants.html

Wierd, isn't it? This gives you the impression they REALLY don't want information out right now, doesn't it?

On edit, adding snip:

~snip~
Authorities say they are close to clarifying the Oct. 1 shooting death of University of Zulia student Julio Soto.

The Attorney General's Office said in a statement released Monday that a court has issued arrest warrants for eight suspects, including "police officers and representatives of private businesses."

http://au.ibtimes.com/articles/20081013/venezuela-to-arrest-8-suspects-in-students-murder.htm
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-08 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #7
52. I feel so CONCERNED that our media, which got the news of poor, struggling opposition leader,
poor, browbeaten school lad, Julio Soto's killing to us the minute it happened, and the opposition started trying to turn it to their advantage, blaming it on the people of Venezuela's elected President, claiming he had the P.O.S. "silenced," would ALSO have been right on the spot, shooting us all the information which has been deleted from the news we should ALSO have gotten up until this news appeared in Venezuela, unbeknownst to us, of course.

Here's the google translation of the latest article I've seen taken from their virulently anti-Chavez opposition "newspaper," El Nacional:
10 kingpins of drug trafficking have been arrested in Venezuela so far this year

November 03, 2008 - EFE

The chairman of the National Anti-Drug Office, Nestor Reverol, said that the Croatian drug trafficker arrested this weekend will remain in the country until the authorities determine whether to answer for any crime to justice in Venezuela

The Croatian citizen Slobodan Kasic was captured in Venezuela, reported the National Anti-Drug Office (ONA), to clarify that this arrest rises to ten the number of kingpins of drug trafficking requested by international agencies apprehended this year in the country.

The president of the ONA, Colonel Nestor Reverol, said during a news conference in Caracas that Kasic, 66, was sought by Interpol and was arrested during the weekend, "without specifying further details, outlined the Bolivarian News Agency.

Kasic in Croatia was sentenced to 13 years in prison in 1998 for drug trafficking from Ecuador to his home country and according to Reverol remain in Venezuela to "determine whether you must answer for any crime" committed in the country.

"If not charged by national authorities coordinate with the Croatian justice for effecting the surrender of this citizen in the short term," he added.

Reverol also reported the seizure of 43 tons of narcotics and the arrest of more than 5,700 individuals linked to drug trafficking so far this year.

The president of the ONA added that the Colombian Wilmer Villadiego Henry and Fortis, the two captured two weeks ago in connection with the murder of student leader Julio Soto, are requested by the U.S. government for 16 charges related to the alleged trafficking drugs.

According Reverol, are under the relevant paperwork with the government of Colombia and the U.S. embassy to the deportation of Villadiego and Fortis "in the coming days."

Of the 10 kingpins of drug trafficking requested by international agencies arrested in Venezuela this year, five were in Zulia state, bordering with Colombia.

Among those captured in 2008 are the Colombian drug lords Marcos Orozco and Aldo Alvarez, deported to Colombia last September 11 or Italian Giovanni Civile.
http://www.el-nacional.com/www/site/p_contenido.php?q=nodo/52493/Sociedad/10%20capos%20del%20narcotr%C3%A1fico%20han%20sido%20detenidos%20en%20Venezuela%20en%20lo%20que%20va%20de%20a%C3%B1o
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bitchkitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 02:34 AM
Response to Original message
10. A bit of context:
From venezuelanalysis.com

<snip>
The president also said Rosales is "one of those who want to see me dead," citing intelligence reports and the arrest in Zulia of two men who allegedly intended to shoot down the presidential plane with grenade launchers last month.

Rosales is well known for his participation in the coup against Chávez in April 2002 and for having signed the decree that dissolved the constitution during that event. Rosales never went to jail for his involvement.
</snip>

Sounds to me like a prisoner is precisely what he should be.

I wish you guys would come up with something new, a new slant, anything. This gets old.
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 03:10 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. That Carmona Decree he signed buried the Venezuelan government, or would have,
if the people hadn't overthrown the coup.

Rosales signed on to something which "....dissolved the National Assembly and Supreme Court, erased the Constitution, and ended Bolivarianism for the people." They also sent out soldiers to find and arrest the members of the Chavez cabinet, and others. Simply unbelievable.

What the hell would happen to people if they tried that crap on George W. Bush? Would THEY be walking around loose, and running for office now? I don't THINK so, do you?

You're right, it does get old, and they keep hoping they'll catch us all gone sometime and smear the hell out of Latin American leftists without someone stepping up to deliver some real information.
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ronnie624 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #10
15. There are so few slants available.
Edited on Wed Oct-29-08 10:50 AM by ronnie624
When one must defend ones position through the meticulous avoidance of reality and truth, there are few options left. Those who attack Chavez, seemingly without thought, usually advance arguments that tend to leave you scratching your head in puzzlement over their fractured logic. Their opposition is purely ideological and in direct conflict with the will of the Venezuelan majority, so there isn't too much to stand on. Perhaps frustration over such weak arguments is what drives the constant ad hominem attacks.

Thanks for the link.
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Zorro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
13. The Chavistas continue to display their poor reading comprehension skills
To whit:

...."Chavez has called for Rosales's imprisonment, without providing any details why. "I have decided to make Manuel Rosales a prisoner," he told business leaders Saturday in Maracaibo. "He cannot continue in office. ... He is one of those who wants to see me dead....""

Funny how it's claimed Chavez' remarks from last Saturday have been reported "going on for weeks".

The point of the article is that Chavez has ramped up his attacks on one of his political rivals, as national elections approach. I say that's hardly a coincidence, and just more evidence of Chavez' abuse of power.

He's a Republican in a red beret.
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AlphaCentauri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. well, after reading that the Zulia Governor was giving 40 millions watches
to member of the press, there is something fishy about it.
I didn't know that Cartier and Pasha watches were so expensive.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #13
23. pro-FARC? What's that about, oh dedicated one? (nt)
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. Check its profile. n/t
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 05:52 PM
Response to Reply #13
24. Yes, that's why the most liberal posters to DU support him.
Edited on Wed Oct-29-08 05:53 PM by sfexpat2000
Work it, baby.

lol
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David__77 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 10:36 AM
Response to Original message
14. He should have been barred from running in the first place.
He signed the Carmona decree, and should therefore be deprived of political rights.
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ronnie624 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. Imagine the consequences of a prominent politician in the U.S.
Edited on Wed Oct-29-08 12:15 PM by ronnie624
committing treason by publicly endorsing a coup d'etat against his government, only to see it reversed a day or so later. At the very least, such a person would never again see life outside of a prison wall.
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David__77 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. I was always amazed at the lenient treatment of these coup plotters.
I guess he was constrained by the threat of yet another coup. But I think the army is pretty pro-people now, so he should really tighten the screws.
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 03:08 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. you do realize that Hugo Chavez himself was involved in an
attempted coup?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuelan_coup_attempts_of_1992

Does your reasoning -

"such a person would never again see life outside of a prison wall."

also apply to him?

just curious...
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reorg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. in the US
Edited on Wed Oct-29-08 03:29 PM by reorg
it would certainly apply.

Especially since the coup attempt was directed against the government of a president who had

"proposed to implement free-market reforms in his second presidential term (1989–1993), following the recommendations of the International Monetary Fund (IMF). (...)

Measures taken by Pérez included privatising state companies, tax reform, reducing customs duties, and diminishing the role of the state in the economy. As a result of his economic measures, petrol prices rose by 100%, and costs of public transportation rose by 30%. (...)

The protests and rioting began in Guarenas (a town in Miranda State, some 30 km east of Caracas) on the morning of 27 February 1989, due to a steep increase in transportation costs to Caracas. They quickly spread to the capital and other towns across the country. By the afternoon, there were disturbances in almost all districts of Caracas, with shops shut and public transport not running.

In the days that followed there was widespread international media coverage of the looting and destruction. For many months, there was discussion about how something so violent could occur in Venezuela.

Overwhelmed by the looting, the government declared a state of emergency, put the city under martial law and restored order albeit with the use of force. Some people used firearms for self-defence, to attack other civilians and/or to attack the military, but the number of dead soldiers and police came nowhere near the number of civilian deaths. The repression was particularly harsh in the cerros — the poor neighbourhoods of the capital.

The initial official pronouncements said 276 people had died; however, the subsequent discovery that the government had buried civilians in mass graves and not counted those deaths raised the estimates. Unofficial estimates of the death toll go as high as 3000.

Congress suspended constitutional rights, and there were several days during which the city was in chaos, with restrictions, food shortages, militarisation, burglaries, and the persecution and murder of innocent people.

The clearest consequence of the caracazo was political instability. Next February state called to the army to contain sequel to "Caracazo" in Puerto La Cruz and Barcelona and again in June, when new rising of transportation costs ended in riots in Maracaibo and some other cities. The free-market reforms programme was modified. In 1992 there were two attempted coups d'état, in February and November. Carlos Andrés Pérez was accused of corruption and removed from the presidency. (...)

In 1998, the Inter-American Commission on Human Rights condemned the government's action, and referred the case to the Inter-American Court of Human Rights. In 1999, the Court heard the case and found that the government had committed violations of human rights, including extrajudicial killings. The Venezuelan government, by then headed by Chávez, did not contest the findings of the case, and accepted full responsibility for the government's actions."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caracazo

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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. Do you realize he served time for it? Unlike the character in the OP?
just curious...
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 06:50 PM
Response to Reply #21
27. the "charactor in the OP" hasn't been convicted of anything
illegal. Maybe that's why he hasn't served time.

Do you think it's ok for for the leader of a country to publicly announce the guilt of a political rival, even before that rival has been convicted or even charged, a month before an election? Do you think this is ok because said leader is on the left of the political spectrum and his rival is on the right? If you do think that's ok, would you still think it ok if their political positions were reversed?

just curious...
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 07:11 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. Both sides are making their cases in the media. Venezuela is not the U.S.
Do you think Chavez should shut up and simply allow the privately owned media to make their case?

Just curious.

This conversation in the media has been going on for weeks. Do you think it's honest for US outlets to pretend it just started in the run up to this election?

Just curious.

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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 07:36 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. didn't Chavez shut down the opposition tv stations in VZ?
or is there some other "privately owned" media that may not be taking his side that you're talking about?

------

The statement of guilt by Chavez is recent, so I don't see how your point is relevent. In fact, it seems something of a dodge on your part.

------

Yes, I do think that Chavez should shut up. I don't think it's proper for a political leader - on the right or the left, to announce the guilt of a political opponent. This is especially true when that opponent has not even been charged with a crime. You can say that it's not honest for US media outlets to pretend that this just started - but the fact remains that this is happening, it's happening right before an election, and when a government that is under as much control as VZ's is from one party (Chavez's party) decides to open a criminal investigation of an opponent just before an election, eyebrows get raised.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. No, he didn't. His government didn't renew the license
of the station that held a coup in their studios.

And as to the rest of your post, apparently you are shakey on free speech and due process.
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. are they still on the air?

or is that a distinction without a difference?

-------------------

I see that, as usual, you resort to insults when you don't have answers.



------

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. We've been over this ground before ad nauseum.
Edited on Wed Oct-29-08 08:04 PM by sfexpat2000
RCTV is not on the air, they are now on cable. When you try to get your president killed, your license tends to get not renewed.

And this answer has been given to you on multiple occasions.

There is a small knot of you here that love to bash Chavez. With no facts, with spun media, and at every opportunity. Have at it. There's always the 33% that needs to create its own reality.

:)


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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 08:34 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. I don't see the points I made on this thread as "bashing"

What happened to RCTV is not relevent to this discussion. You still haven't explained who this "privately owned media" that Chavez needs to make himself heard over is. Are you refering to RCTV, which is now only available on cable and satellite? Surely their reach is not as broad as the state run broadcast stations...

---------

I don't see your post as much of an argument - your ad hominems are just another dodge. The fact is that you don't have an argument and you don't know how to argue.

Why don't you answer the question I posed upthread?

If the situations were reversed, if Chavez was on the right of the political spectrum and his opponent on the left, would you still find his actions in this matter acceptable?

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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 04:30 AM
Response to Reply #33
41. You're the one who needed to drag in RCTV, post #29.
DU'ers have discussed this for ages, and ages. You should have attempted to inform yourself when the topic was still news, and was being discussed much more often, in Late Breaking News at length.

For any DU'ers who still haven't heard any of this, although that's completely unlikely:
RCTV and other commercial TV stations were key players in the April 2002 coup that briefly ousted Chávez's democratically elected government. During the short-lived insurrection, coup leaders took to commercial TV airwaves to thank the networks. "I must thank Venevisión and RCTV," one grateful leader remarked in an appearance captured in the Irish film The Revolution Will Not Be Televised. The film documents the networks’ participation in the short-lived coup, in which stations put themselves to service as bulletin boards for the coup—hosting coup leaders, silencing government voices and rallying the opposition to a march on the Presidential Palace that was part of the coup plotters strategy.

On April 11, 2002, the day of the coup, when military and civilian opposition leaders held press conferences calling for Chávez's ouster, RCTV hosted top coup plotter Carlos Ortega, who rallied demonstrators to the march on the presidential palace. On the same day, after the anti-democratic overthrow appeared to have succeeded, another coup leader, Vice-Admiral Victor Ramírez Pérez, told a Venevisión reporter (4/11/02): "We had a deadly weapon: the media. And now that I have the opportunity, let me congratulate you."

That commercial TV outlets including RCTV participated in the coup is not at question; even mainstream outlets have acknowledged as much. As reporter Juan Forero, Jackson Diehl's colleague at the Washington Post, explained (1/18/07), "RCTV, like three other major private television stations, encouraged the protests," resulting in the coup, "and, once Chávez was ousted, cheered his removal." The conservative British newspaper the Financial Times reported (5/21/07), " officials argue with some justification that RCTV actively supported the 2002 coup attempt against Mr. Chávez."

As FAIR's magazine Extra! argued last November, "Were a similar event to happen in the U.S., and TV journalists and executives were caught conspiring with coup plotters, it’s doubtful they would stay out of jail, let alone be allowed to continue to run television stations, as they have in Venezuela."
More:
http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=3107

~~~~~~~~~~

An enlightening message sent from former news director at RCTV to Jackson Diehl, major propagandist and a-hole at the Washington Post:
A letter to the Washignton Post
Mr. Jackson Diehl:

It's impossible to believe that a journalist at a newspaper as important as
the Washington Post is so badly informed as you appear to be in your article
"Chavez's Censorship: Where Disrespect Can Land You in Jail," published
March 28.

You can believe, if you wish, that Venezuela used to be "the most prosperous
and stable democracy in Latin America" (with 80% of the population in
extreme poverty, civil strife, and military uprisings), put you can't write,
without lying, that in Venezuela, journalists are persecuted and the press
is censored, because there isn't a single case that supports what you say.

You say the truth when you affirm that "some newspapers and television
stations openly sided with attempts to oust the president via coup, strike
or a national referendum." Before being Minister of Information and
Communication, I worked as news director for RCTV, an important private TV
station in Venezuela. Immediately after the coup of April 2002 against
President Hugo Chavez, when hundreds of thousands of Venezuelans took to the
streets demanding the return of their elected president, RCTV and other
private channels decided not to report on this civil uprising, preferring to
broadcast cartoons and old movies. Since I couldn't bring myself to
participate in this censorship, I resigned.

As journalist Duncan Campbell reported for the (London) Guardian, "The five
principal TV channels gave publicity spots to those who convened the
demonstrations that supported the coup." Moreover, the principal media
owners in Venezuela assured Dictator Carmona, "We can't guarantee the army's
loyalty, but we can promise the media's support" (see "Coup and
Counter-Coup," The Economist Global Agenda, April 16, 2002).

The private media promoted all of the campaigns to discredit President
Chavez and his policies. For example, during the petroleum industry sabotage
of Christmas 2002-2003, more than 13,000 political propaganda advertisements
were broadcast in a two month period in order to "animate an economically
devastating and socially destabilizing general strike directed at
overthrowing Chavez. (These ads) energetically promoted opposition leaders,
while at the same time defaming the President and ignoring news that favored
him" (see COHA Investigation Memorandum. The Venezuelan Media: More Than
Words in Play," Council on Hemispheric Affairs, Press Memorandum 03.18,
April 30, 2003). However, despite all this, the openly conspiratorial media
were not persecuted, neither then, nor now.

You are lying to your readers, Mister Diehl, when you say, "Beginning this
month journalists or other independent activists accused by the government
of the sort of offenses alleged by Izarra can be jailed without due process
and sentenced to up to 30 years," because you are confusing the law that
protects children from obscenity in the broadcast media with the laws on
national security and the President's security, which are more strict in the
United States.

US Code, Title 18, Section 871, "Threats against the President and
presidential successors," prohibits any offense or threat made against the
President of the United States. Examples include July 2, 1996, when two
people were arrested by the secret service for shouting insults at President
Clinton ("You suck and those boys died...") on the occasion of an attack
against a military installation in Saudi Arabia in which 19 US soldiers
died; or a minister who was arrested for saying "God will hold you to
account" to President Clinton, concerning his decision not to prohibit a
certain kind of abortion.

US Code, Title 18, Section 1752(a)(1)(ii) declares that it is a crime to
intentionally enter a restricted zone during a presidential visit, and it
has been used to arrest more than 1,800 demonstrators during the Republican
Convention in August of 2004, despite the fact that the demonstrators were
several blocks from President Bush's location; it was also used to arrest a
gentleman for carrying a sign against war on October 24, 2002, during Bush's
visit to Ohio; also arrested was a dead soldier's mother for wearing an
anti-war t-shirt during a speech by First Lady Laura Bush in New Jersey; and
a couple in West Virginia was arrested for wearing anti-Bush t-shirts during
a rally.
More:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=2187974&mesg_id=2188203
Posted by great DU'er, plasticsundance, September 21, 2006

~~~~~~~~~~~
Venezuela: Not What You Think
By Robin Hahnel

~snip~
only the small fraction of Americans who access the alternative media learn that RCTV was not shut down because it campaigns openly against the government -- which it has for nine years. Instead, when its license came up for renewal, its application was denied because it had violated 200 conditions of its licensing agreement -- many violations having to do with its role in helping to organize a military coup that nearly toppled the duly elected President of the country. Moreover, the station continues to broadcast on a cable network, and the opposition in Venezuela still broadcasts on more major TV channels than there are channels sympathetic to the government. In stark contrast, the alternative media in the US cannot be viewed on any major channel. Consequently the vast majority of Americans receive all their news from a mainstream media which never questions whether the US has any right to dominate other nations, but only debates the wisdom of alternative strategies for doing so, and would never dream of questioning the desirability of an economic system dominated by their corporate owners. Nevertheless the storyline most Americans hear remains: Freedom of the press is dead in totalitarian Venezuela, but alive and well in the democratic United States.

It is important to distinguish between whether mainstream coverage of issues like amendments to the constitution and the TV license is biased, whether there are grounds for reproaching the Venezuelan government, and whether the policies are wise. Clearly the mainstream media has failed to report relevant facts and their coverage has been grossly unfair. From what I know, the procedure that led to non-renewal of the TV license was unobjectionable, and the proposed constitutional amendment will be decided by a thoroughly democratic process. So while there are ample grounds for reproaching mainstream media coverage in the US, as far as I can see there are no grounds for reproaching the Venezuelan government in either case. However, this does not mean the policies are necessarily wise. Those in Venezuela who argue that the revolutionary government would be hammered by the imperial press in any case are surely correct. On the other hand, that does not mean either initiative is good policy, independent of the news coverage it receives. Moreover, giving one's enemies an easy chance to focus on a negative storyline seems unwise -- unless the policy has important benefits.

Unfortunately, the fact that only a tiny fraction of the American public are ever exposed to balanced coverage of the Venezuelan stories defined by our mainstream media is only one problem. A larger problem is that practically nobody in the United States ever hears anything about truly newsworthy stories in Venezuela. Stories about exciting new political and economic initiatives that are dramatically reducing poverty and challenging popular myths about the abilities of ordinary people to make good political and economic decisions for themselves go virtually uncovered in the United States.1
More:
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article18816.htm




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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 09:55 AM
Response to Reply #41
43. I "dragged it in" because I felt that it fit into the context of the
discussion I was having with another poster. Who still hasn't addressed what she meant by "privately owned media", btw.

I'm aware of the situation vis a vis RCTV, so you can take your condescending attitude and shove it, judylynn...



Your tactic of attempting to denigrate the intelligence of any poster who disagrees with you only serves to shut down discussion, which is perhaps your goal.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #27
42. nevermind
Edited on Thu Oct-30-08 09:13 AM by redqueen
pointless
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Not only did he do his time, but he went on teevee and took responsibility
for it.

And that was the moment when the people started appreciating him.
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ronnie624 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 01:02 AM
Response to Reply #19
37. Does my "reasoning" apply to Chavez?
I don't know what you mean. You appear to be assigning a position to me where I haven't really stated one. I only offered an opinion about what might happen to a U.S. politician who theoretically supported a coup d'etat against the U.S. government. I was contrasting the potential consequences to the apparent leniency of the Venezuelan legal system on such matters. I took no moral stance on the issue. Since Hugo Chavez isn't a prominent U.S. politician, my opinion couldn't possibly apply to him.

As for Chavez's involvement in an attempted overthrow of the Venezuelan government, I can't imagine how that rebuts anything I said. your triumphal 'revelation' seems irrelevant. If Venezuelan law considers his debt to society paid, then that's really all there is to it. It's that pesky sovereignty thing at work again.
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 01:27 AM
Response to Reply #37
38. oh, come on...
that is weak.

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ronnie624 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 02:05 AM
Response to Reply #38
40. Can you elaborate,
or is half a dozen words your limit? If you can't communicate beyond a few grunts and clicks, how the hell am I supposed to understand what you're saying?
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #40
48. that's really uncalled for, ronnie
but it makes you feel better, that's ok...
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happyslug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 12:00 PM
Response to Reply #17
45. Look at the Third Section of Amendment XIV to the US Constitution
Edited on Thu Oct-30-08 12:15 PM by happyslug
Section 3. No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any state, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any state legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any state, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.amendmentxiv.html

The above was added to the 14th Amendment to make sure President Andrew Johnson could NOT Pardon Southern Politicians and Officers who then could serve in as Government Officers. While aimed at President Johnson it is STILL the law of the land, and if this Governor had done what this Governor did in the coup he would be forbidden to be a governor, or hold any other government position in the US today.
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 05:53 PM
Response to Original message
25. It's the Associated Pukes. Total scumbag journalists. Look for the "ap" in the url.
They twist, lie, disinform, 'frame' things to suit their Corpo/Fascist masters, and outright make shit up. Above all, they forget--as all context, history and understanding slips into the corporate 'news' monopoly river of forgetfulness. They are as bad as the Miami Herald. In this case, it's probable that their bag of tricks includes mistranslation.

It's interesting how rightwingers, Pukes, fascists and Bushwhacks--here and there--steal everything in sight and swim around in a cauldron of corruption, and then, while they're going this, set up the "talking points" for blaming THEIR crimes on leftist politicians, or, as in the case of ACORN, on an innocent NGO whose work is to register to the poor to vote, or on innocent poor voters who forget to sign their middle initial, or on combat soldiers who have changed addresses. THEY are stealing elections with 'TRADE SECRET' code voting machines and massive vote suppression, or are pulling off coups at the Supreme Court, or are perpetrating naked coups--kidnapping the president, suspending the Constitution, the National Assembly, the courts and all civil rights, as they did in Venezuela in 2002 (with Rosales as a signer of the decrees)--and they Chavez of oppressing them, or ACORN of stealing votes, or the Obama campaign, and they whine and they screech and they lie. Rosales' supporters in Venezuela are very good at this--screeching about election fraud (an absolutely absurd charge--Venezuela has one of the best election systems in the world)), yet they never cop to their real beliefs. They don't believe in democracy, is the truth of the matter. They want rule by the rich elite. And the Associated Pukes agree with them, and toady to them--in the service of their Corpo/Fascist masters--more than any other news service.

I am sick of them. This is scurrilous journalism. Let us hope and pray that its function as pre-war psyops does not result in an oil war in the hemisphere.
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-29-08 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #25
35. Oil is in free fall, the pero states
just lost 50 of the value of their product in a month. I still wonder about a guy in red, sporting a red che hard hat and kicking money to his family (npr story guess they are corpo too?).
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 12:32 AM
Response to Reply #35
36. with VZ's high inflation and the bottom falling out of oil prices
along with a hostile US govt no matter who takes the White House - the only thing left to "wonder" about Chavez is how long and by what method he will manage to stay in office...
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ronnie624 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 01:53 AM
Response to Reply #35
39. Embedded in your blather
Edited on Thu Oct-30-08 01:54 AM by ronnie624
appears to be an accusation that Chavez is stealing money or accepting kickbacks, though I can't be certain. Often, deciphering your messages is quite a chore. If my impression is correct, would you please provide a link to some information about this?

Thanks
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Guy Whitey Corngood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #39
47. You're a little slow aren't you.
Edited on Thu Oct-30-08 10:14 PM by Guy Whitey Corngood
What he is saying is - Blah, blah, blah, petro state. Blah blah blah red shirt, Animal Farm, crotch, sea monkey, whale's vagina. - I mean come on now. How much clearer can it be?
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ronnie624 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #47
49. Thanks for the laugh.
You had me going, there for a second.
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Guy Whitey Corngood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #49
50. Then my work here is done.
:evilgrin:
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-31-08 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #47
51. .
:rofl:
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-30-08 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #35
44. Venezuela has nearly $40 billion in cash reserves. They can easily ride out $70/barrel
without touching their cash reserves, and what is more, with that much cash, they have great flexibility in how to structure using any of it, if they have to (if oil remains under $70/barrel for a long period).

The Chavez government has not only done this--saved lots and lots money for a rainy day--they have cushioned Venezuela and their region in many other ways, for instance, in helping to bail Argentina and other countries out of ruinous World Bank/IMF debt, providing low cost or barter oil to the poorest countries, and investing in local and regional infrastructure; also supporting education, medical care and other social programs--for a healthy, productive work force--encouraging local manufacturing and small businesses, and producing a nearly 10% economic growth rate in Venezuela, over the last five years, with most growth in the private sector.

The Chavez government has used its oil profits in the best ways possible for riding out slumps and creating long term prosperity. What would you use the oil profits for, hm? To pad the pockets of Exxon Mobil execs?

Venezuela had two choices, as a country with vast oil reserves, whose previous rightwing governments had utterly neglected social programs and economic development: 1) keep doing that--letting the rich cream off the oil profits, and giving the bulk of the oil profits away to multinationals, while the vast majority of Venezuelans fall further and further into poverty, or 2) elect a sensible government that would re-negotiate the oil contracts, to give Venezuela a better share, and use the money for social and economic development.

You are blaming Chavez for Venezuela's existential condition as an oil state. His government is doing the best things possible, given that starting condition. Why do you keep blaming the Chavez government for that, and hoping for their failure--and even gleefully relishing that prospect?

And please tell us how YOU would manage Venezuela's oil profits--or do you think ALL the profits should be going to multinational corporations and none to benefit the people of Venezuela?
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