Atheist soldier alleges discrimination by military

[Newsjock]

Source: Associated Press

Topeka, Kan. (AP) -- An atheist soldier says in a federal lawsuit that his superiors required him to be present for Christian prayers, and that the military allows fundamentalist Christians to proselytize.

Spc. Dustin Chalker, a combat medic with an engineering battalion, alleges he was required to attend three events from December 2007 to May 2008 at Fort Riley in which Christian prayers were delivered. Chalker has served in Iraq and Korea.

Chalker and and the Military Religious Freedom Foundation filed the lawsuit against Defense Secretary Robert Gates on Thursday in Kansas City, Kan. It alleges violations of the soldier's religious freedoms.

The lawsuit alleges the military allows religious discrimination by fundamentalist Christians who try to force their views on others, especially subordinates. Its examples include programs for soldiers, presentations by "anti-Muslim activists" and a "spiritual handbook" for soldiers endorsed by Gen. David Petraeus, the commander of U.S. forces in the Middle East.

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2008/09/26/national/a163315D93.DTL&tsp=1

[JonLP24]

1. I thought it was impossible to sue the military

But yeah, that's not right. I have no religous preference myself but I attended prayer breakfasts and other church related activities to get out of work.

[qazplm]

6. it is if my understanding is correct

your family members can sue on your behalf depending upon the situation (say a widow suing the military for wrongful death or something), but there is federal law that says you can't sue the military if you are on active duty. This prevents soldiers from suing their commander every time they get an order they dont like.

[TomInTib]

13. He's not suing the military.

He is suing Gates, who is SecDef and a civilian.

[Zhade]

17. "I have no religous preference myself" - which means you're like the atheist in this story.

Since we don't have a religion, imposing any religion on us via a government official is very wrong (as you note).

[shadowknows69]

2. Call me crazy, but the last person I'd want to piss off in my unit is my medic

[JonLP24]

3. combat medics are heroes

they are even trained to treat enemy causualties but there is an order of importance, US troops first

[shadowknows69]

4. My point exactly

"Oh, so I'm an asshole for not believing in Jesus huh? Well let's wait a bit and see if the Big J is gonna come and stop that bleeding."

[sce56]

5. No not crazy SMART! When I was in if your shot record was lost you would have to get them all again!

http://web.archive.org/web/20030602211200/

[Submariner]

7. When I rode the boats

we had to all be christians because we had nuclear tipped weapons onboard. Unofficially, the Navy did not want non-believers on the subs, because a sailor who believes in the after life was much more apt to follow orders to fire nukes than someone who might have second thoughts.

Scary scenario, but I was a believer back in the day, and it made sense then.

[cosmicaug]

9. Wow!

When I rode the boats we had to all be christians because we had nuclear tipped weapons onboard. Unofficially, the Navy did not want non-believers on the subs, because a sailor who believes in the after life was much more apt to follow orders to fire nukes than someone who might have second thoughts.

Scary scenario, but I was a believer back in the day, and it made sense then.

Wow!

[hack89]

12. I call BS

I spent years dealing with nukes - I have never heard of such a policy. It is so blatantly un-constitutional - can you substantiate this with a link or two?

[Submariner]

14. No links

I was not a nuke, and I rode the pig boats with ALL non-nuke ratings. Something got hot while playing chicken of the sea with the Soviets, and in '67 we loaded two MK-48 fish in the forward room of the Croaker (SS-246). I was IC forward watch and had to monitor the litmus color through the view window on the nose of the nuke torpedo.

The week before we loaded the torpedoes, US Naval Intelligence reps visited the boat and individually interviewed every non-enlisted, and maybe officers too. We were told that with our old 1943 era pressure hull, if we did fire a torpedo, we would probably be destroyed along with the target, even though we may be up to 12 miles away from the ground zero explosion. So I was asked (1) "Do you have a problem with the use of nuclear weapons?", and (2) "Do you believe in God?"

The pat answer for question 1 was, "If used as a deterrent, for national defense, I have no problem with nukes", and for question 2, the obvious answer about God was "Yes".

A MM and TM were transferred to another Squadron 8 boat at Groton, because they answered "No" to the God question. They were not disciplined in any way. It just seems the Navy did not want non-believers going to sea with nukes, lest they "hesitate" if the order came to fire.

As a nuke, you probably got a Top Secret clearance while you were being profiled, and I assume you did not categorize yourself as an atheist, so you and all your brother nukes did not run into a "policy", if that's what it was. On the diesel boats, most of us did not have or need Top Secret clearances, so I assume when COMSUBLANT ordered the Croaker to carry nukes, they did a quick screening of the crew to make sure we were not psychotics of the sea.

Once we convinced Naval Intelligence that as smoke-boaters we were babe magnets of superior intelligence,in the proud tradition of the submarine Navy, they let all us good christians go to sea with nuke warshots.

[hack89]

15. I have been an atheist since high school

and I never hid that fact from anyone during my 20 years in the Navy. It was never an issue.

More to the point - as an officer I managed nuke weapons security. I was never trained to disqualify people for their religious views.

[Submariner]

16. I never saw religion come up before or since either,

only in this instance. The interviews seemed logical to us, and no one was bothered by it. There was no sense of any sort of discrimination.

[The Backlash Cometh]

8. Our military is increasingly being undermined by cronyism.

Republican cronyism. They will break the rules for their own in ways that have nothing to do with integrity.

[corkhead]

10. When they say "No athiests in foxholes", by golly they mean it!

[Torn_Scorned_Ignored]

11. I hope Spc. Dustin Chalker

wins his case. This is just wrong. No wonder we are in such a jam. The requirements, some (unspoken) such as this one and the No Gays in the military, forcing out vital linguists and other personnel over religious beliefs.

Whose jihad is this anyway?