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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 02:00 AM
Original message
Lambeth conference: Archbishop blames liberals for church rift
Source: The Guardian

Consecration of gay clergy must stop to end Anglican crisis, says Williams
Riazat Butt, religious affairs correspondent
Monday August 4 2008

... On the final day of the Lambeth conference, a 10-yearly gathering of the world's Anglican bishops, Rowan Williams said practices in certain US and Canadian dioceses were threatening the unity of the Anglican communion.

"If North American churches do not accept the need for a moratoria <on same sex blessings and the consecration of gay clergy> we are no further forward. We continue to be in grave peril," he said ...

Making his third and final presidential address Williams said the "pieces are on the board" to resolve the wrangling over homosexuality. He put forward the idea of a "covenanted future" involving a "global church of interdependent communities". But even as he was speaking disaffected primates from developing countries expressed regrets about the conference. A statement signed by more than a quarter of the world's Anglican archbishops said theological voices outside the west had been missing from some key sessions. "We are concerned with the continuing patronising attitude of the west towards the rest of the churches," they said.

Williams also faced disenchantment at home, with some English bishops questioning the nature of the conference. Michael Scott-Joynt, the bishop of Winchester and the fifth most senior churchman in England, said: "The Lambeth Conference is required to do something rather than live down to the worst expectations of the bishops who stayed away" ...


Read more: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/aug/04/anglicanism.religion?gusrc=rss&feed=networkfront



Anglican leader urges ban on gay bishops
By RACHEL ZOLL

... The 77-million-member Anglican Communion has been splintering since 2003, when the U.S. Episcopal Church consecrated the first openly gay bishop, V. Gene Robinson of New Hampshire.

Williams barred Robinson and a few other bishops from the assembly, and designed the event without legislation or votes, instead focusing on rebuilding frayed relationships.

Still, more than 200 theologically conservative bishops boycotted Lambeth, which ran for 20 days. In June, just before Lambeth began, these same bishops formed a new global network within the communion that challenges Williams' authority but stops just short of a permanent split.

Williams does not have the authority to force any agreement among the conflicted groups. The 38 Anglican national churches, including the U.S. Episcopal Church, are self-governed and loosely connected by shared roots in the missionary work of the Church of England ...

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hbwqRpKPP0CMUkcRH7F8tsZ_fpOAD92AV5H80

From Times Online
August 4, 2008
Dr Rowan Williams restores peace at the troubled Lambeth Conference
Ruth Gledhill, Religion Correspondent

... For Dr Williams’s strategy to work, conservative primates from Africa must also pledge a moratorium on consecrating cross-boundary bishops to minister to evangelical congregations in liberal dioceses.

Bishop Trevor Mwamba of Botswana, a favourite for the vacant post of Primate of Central Africa, said: “The conference has been excellent, I would even say it has been divinely inspired. There was a growing sense of oneness, a sense that we all have a lot in common. We have been transformed by the relationships we have formed.”

However, early indications from other provinces in Africa and Asia are that the illicit consecrations will continue. In addition, Bishop Gregory Venables, the Primate of the Southern Cone, who has taken an entire US diocese into his province, is expected to continue poaching conservative parishes and dioceses from the US.

Liberals in the US are determined to fight the moratorium on gay consecrations and same-sex blessings agreed by the Episcopal Church’s convention two years ago. The Rev Susan Russell, of the gay lobby group Integrity, said: “It is not going to change anything on the ground in California. We bless same-sex relationships and will continue to do so" ...

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article4452635.ece

Anglicans to Seek Pact to Prevent a Schism
By JOHN F. BURNS
Published: August 4, 2008

... Archbishop Williams told reporters that he hoped Anglican leaders could agree on a draft covenant within a year, but said that winning approval for it among the 44 national and regional churches of the Anglican Communion could take until 2013. That period might coincide with a push among the bishops here to hold another Lambeth meeting after only five years ...

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/04/world/europe/04anglican.html?ref=europe


Healing the rift: how Williams kept his flock together
Despite the boycotts and recriminations, the Anglican church is still in one piece
Riazat Butt, religious affairs correspondent
The Guardian,
Monday August 4 2008

The Lambeth conference, one of the four symbols of Anglican unity, takes place every 10 years in Canterbury, but the 2008 summit, which finished yesterday, was held amid an atmosphere of boycotts and recrimination - over the 230 bishops that stayed away and the one that was never invited ...

What about schism?

The word is rarely used to describe the obvious divisions between ideologically opposed churches. Bishops prefer to say "rift", "walking apart" or "wound" to describe the impact of the 2003 consecration of the gay US bishop Gene Robinson (who was a constant presence on the fringes of the conference despite not being invited), subsequent interventions by African churches into the US and the launch of the Global Anglican Future Conference (Gafcon), in Jerusalem last June, by an international network of traditionalists ...

The absence of 230 bishops has been keenly felt. The Lambeth delegates said their experience was "diminished" by the boycott and pledged their commitment to building bridges with them. Gafcon has other ideas. Last week the Archbishop of Uganda and one of the missing bishops, the Most Rev Henry Luke Orombi, launched a salvo at the hitherto peaceful proceedings by accusing Williams of betrayal and, more damagingly, saying that Williams was a lone figure, the lynchpin of the Communion, appointed by a secular government and a remnant of British colonialism ...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/aug/04/anglicanism.religion1

Way ahead found in Church gay row

... The man whose ordination triggered the crisis - the Bishop of New Hampshire, Gene Robinson - told Radio 4's Sunday programme that some traditionalists were actively working towards schism.

"Bullies always come back for more. And the one thing that I think the archbishop is blind to is the fact that nothing short of total victory will satisfy these guys" ...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7539323.stm

Anglican leader appeals for unity as Lambeth Conference closes

... Earlier Sunday, Bishop Keith Ackerman from the American state of Illinois said the church was "already divided" and added that "some people are for the very first time now accepting that there is a crisis" ...

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5g_qFWRaqED_10PSnvSL6pgMet42A

Gay Bishop Dispute Dominates Conference
Anglican Event Ends With Leader's Plea
By Karla Adam
Special to The Washington Post
Monday, August 4, 2008; Page A08

... Diarmaid MacCulloch, a professor of the history of the church at Oxford University, said many of Williams's efforts to "prevent some from grandstanding," like meeting in small groups, were "sensible in trying to keep the temperature as low as possible."

MacCulloch predicted that the controversy about homosexuality would "rumble on because it can't be resolved with two great cultural gaps" but that in time, the factions might learn to live with their differences.

"Overall, the conference did less damage than it could have," he said, "and that's something to be thankful for."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/03/AR2008080301542.html?hpid=sec-religion

From The Times
August 4, 2008
Gay clerics certain to win struggle, Right Rev Gene Robinson says
Scotland Staff

... The Right Rev Gene Robinson, the Bishop of New Hampshire, said that the worldwide Anglican Communion was eventually bound to recognise that it could not block out people who were attracted to people of the same sex. Bishop Robinson, who has become a hate figure among Christian fundamentalists because he is gay and living with another man, said: “The reason I can be calm in the middle of this particular storm is because I know how it is all going to turn out.

“It is going to end with the full inclusion of all God’s people in God’s Church. I don’t know when; it doesn’t matter when. But that is where we are headed and we must work hard to bring that Church about.” Speaking in a sermon to a packed congregation at St Mary’s Episcopal Cathedral in Glasgow, Bishop Robinson, whose ordination as bishop five years ago caused a split in the worldwide Anglican church, said that it was not for Christians to judge others.

“None of us is on the selection committee,” he said. “God is on a committee of one, and he is the selection committee. We are all brothers and sisters in Christ. The most likeable and the most unlikeable, the most loving and the most hateful are all God’s children. It’s time for us to stop worrying so much about the Church. The Church is not ours to win or lose. The Church is God’s” ...

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/scotland/article4454696.ece

Gay bishop thanks Scottish Church for recognising 'all God's people'
Published Date: 04 August 2008
By MARTYN McLAUGHLIN

GENE Robinson, the openly gay American bishop barred from attending the Lambeth Conference, yesterday praised the "inclusive" outlook of Scots clergy as he spoke of his belief that worldwide Anglican Communion would eventually recognise "all God's people".

The bishop, who was invited to Scotland to preach, said no-one ought to be apprehensive of change within the Church, but that it would adapt and survive ...

In Glasgow yesterday to deliver a sermon, he said Scotland represented a "very appropriate" location for his return to the altar, given it was the Scottish Church that consecrated a bishop for Connecticut in the 18th century, effectively planting the foundations for the Anglican communion in the country ...

Speaking to The Scotsman, Bishop Robinson said he was given a "warm and hospitable" welcome on arriving in Glasgow to celebrate Eucharist at St Mary's Episcopal Cathedral ...

http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/scotland/Gay-bishop-thanks-Scottish-Church.4353058.jp
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and-justice-for-all Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 05:05 AM
Response to Original message
1. When people come to reason and reality...
they tend to ditch the dogma and superstition.
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no_hypocrisy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 05:13 AM
Response to Original message
2. Too many damned Christians ruining an otherwise pristine church.
What would Jesus do?
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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 07:02 AM
Response to Original message
3. Tolerance is the only solution to divisive, polarizing issues that only affect individuals or groups...
of consenting adults.
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JerseygirlCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 07:39 AM
Response to Original message
4. I will never, for the life of me, understand how consecrating
Gene Robinson has any effect whatsoever on other provinces. Do we get a say in evil, totalitarian Archbishops in Africa? Their position definitely bugs me; so I guess they're walking away, too, right?

It's horribly sad to see Wms. doing this. He's become a complete appeaser, interested only in keeping some sort of false peace rather than standing strong for justice and letting the bigots go their own way.
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 08:34 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Right, the bigots are basically threatening to hold their breath till they turn blue
Edited on Mon Aug-04-08 08:35 AM by Lydia Leftcoast
if they don't get their way.

It would be sad if the Anglican Communion split, but not an irredeemable tragedy.

I suppose the consecration of a gay bishop harms the Third World churches in the same way that two same-sex people in a committed relationship harms straight marriage. :sarcasm:
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JerseygirlCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. Exactly!
I don't think the association with the Communion is anywhere near important enough to put in peril our commitment to justice, not to mention our baptismal pledge to respect the dignity of every human being...

And far more harm has been done - physical, emotional, financial harm - by the likes of Akinola - the guy who is happy to imprison people for *associating* with gay people. He's simply evil, and why in the world anyone else in the communion would even consider giving in to his well-financed blackmail is beyond me.
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TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-05-08 07:49 AM
Response to Reply #9
14. ahh - he should just kill off his oponents like the FIRST head of that church did...
and be done with it already...!!!

after all, they have started that church on SUCH a "strong" moral foundation....
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JerseygirlCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-05-08 09:25 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. Well, obviously it's a bit more complex than that
the movement toward reformation had started just at the time that Henry was looking for an out... I'd say more a convenient convergence of events. Henry actually considered himself nothing but a good Catholic his whole life.
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CatholicEdHead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 10:05 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. Big money behind the scenes
Homosexuality is also a major plank in the Catholic Church at the moment, being financed by some rich, ultra-conservative Catholics with business interests first and they have control in Rome at the right places.
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JerseygirlCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Yup. Ahmanson and Scaife and the IRD
spending their money here and abroad simply to further their insidious political goals.

And I find it interesting that the folks who are really spending money where it's needed in the provinces abroad headed by the most virulent bigots and tools of the IRD are the liberal churches in the US. Hateful Akinola hasn't stopped many, many programs begun by parishes here to actually help the people in Nigeria. Meanwhile himself lives quite nicely and plays dress-up.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-05-08 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #4
17. They are Bigots with an Agenda
Edited on Tue Aug-05-08 12:24 PM by fascisthunter
plain and simple...

bigotry hiding behind a god.
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JerseygirlCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-05-08 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Yup.
I guess you could see where someone like Akinola would be thirsting for the power such a position gives him - doubtful he'd gain it any other way. But knowing that makes it even more puzzling why guys like those backing IRD do this: they're richer and more powerful than almost all already. I guess for some there's never enough.

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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-05-08 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Remember this Tune?:
The handshake
Seals the contract
From the contract
Theres no turning back
The turning point
Of a career
In korea, being insincere
The holiday
Was fun packed
The contract
Still intact

The grabbing hands
Grab all they can
All for themselves
After all

Its a competitive world
Everything counts in large amounts

The graph
On the wall
Tells the story
Of it all
Picture it now
See just how
The lies and deceit
Gained a little more power
Confidence
Taken in
By a sun tan
And a grin

The grabbing hands
Grab all they can
All for themselves
After all

Its a competitive world
Everything counts in large amounts

The grabbing hands
Grab all they can
Everything counts in large amounts

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JerseygirlCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-05-08 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Sad but true. nt
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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
6. Be reasonable; give us everything we want
How's that for negotiation and compromise. If someday I'm called to account before some supreme being and eternally condemned for being insufficiently hateful toward my fellow human beings, I would be all right with that. But somehow, in the midst of all that "serve one another in love" jazz in the Christian testament, I don't think that shutting the church doors in the faces of my sisters and brothers, quite rises to that standard.

I'm far from perfect, but I'm trying to do better all the time with the grace of God and the help of my church family. What grace and help is Bishop Williams proffering?
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DeepModem Mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 10:53 AM
Response to Original message
8. This is deeply disturbing, this unity at any cost. I say let the "conservatives" go...
Edited on Mon Aug-04-08 10:54 AM by DeepModem Mom
along with their hatred and misogyny.

On edit: Thanks so much for this collection of articles.
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TrogL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
11. it's time for the schism
The evangalicals and conservatives can go their merry way and us traditional, socially conscious Anglicans can get on with it.
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 08:58 PM
Response to Original message
12. What would Jesus do?
Coz He was such a total anti-gay rightwing type.

:eyes:
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TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-05-08 07:48 AM
Response to Original message
13. Awwwwe - poor ting...
this is especially rich comming from a church whose SOLE EXISTENCE is due to the fact that the existing power structure wouldn't let a fuckwad murdering sexually deviant KING divorce his current legitimate wife to marry his latest younter plaything, then proceeded to KILL OFF his subsequent succession of WIVES till he was to old and feeble to care any more...

Nice...good foundation with which to lecture the rest of "us" on "morality"...

fucking losers all...
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kwassa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-05-08 09:57 AM
Response to Original message
16. here is an interesting guess about the future of the Communion
from Robert Piggot of the BBC

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7509125.stm

It seems dubious that for their part conservative African archbishops would commit to something that ruled out their interventions in America to provide a home for traditionalists.

Until now, both sides have seemed to have a veto, a final say - condemning the communion to an unsustainable status quo, and what Dr Williams referred to as "further disintegration".

But that's where Dr Williams' Lambeth Conference coup might emerge.

Call the bluff of both sides - traditionalist and liberal - and allow a revamped "centre" to sign up to a covenant whether or not the Americans or their conservative critics in Africa and elsewhere choose to join in.

Remove their veto, and create a new communion able to move forward without them.

If this is the strategy - and it looks highly likely - it could explain the increasingly frank acceptance of senior figures that some will choose not to commit to the covenant.

It has come to look like a declaration of independence by the moderate middle of the communion, and Dr Williams himself.


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JerseygirlCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-05-08 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #16
21. I'm certainly opposed to any such "covenant" that removes our
autonomy. No thanks to that. I left the RCC, and I'm not eager to take steps toward that again!

I can also see, in this scenario, a new coalition of the more progressive churches - NZ, Canada, Scotland, the churches in Europe proper with the US church. And the irony might be that the church in England would move toward that group.

It would also be interesting to see how the bigots of Southern Cone and Africa (not all Africa of course) fund themselves going forward. I doubt, once the separation happens, that IRD money will continue to flow - to what purpose then?
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kwassa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-05-08 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. well, Piggot says that is a possibility
The rich Episcopal Church might envisage its own mini-communion, including Canada, Mexico, Brazil, New Zealand and most of Australia among other churches.

The traditionalist alliance established in Jerusalem last month might see its future outside the communion.

Dr Williams, and the other leaders of the "intensified centre", are counting on the continuing attachment to the communion, the distinctive "reformed Catholicism" it represents, and its long history and shared traditions, to persuade those who reject the covenant to accept their second-class status and stay more or less within the fold.


The tricky part is what relationship the Communion has with the conservative churches in the US aligning themselves with the Gafconistas. Piggot seems to thing that Williams might support them. Who knows?

I also oppose the covenant and most Episcopals do. We will give up neither our autonomy, nor our stand on including our gay members on all levels of our churches. We do represent a specific viewpoint that is really spread throughout the communion, not just in the U.S.
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