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45th Med Donating Member (559 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 11:22 PM
Original message
7 Flights to U.S. Canceled on Terror Fears
Jan 31, 6:11 PM (ET)

By BETH GARDINER

LONDON (AP) - British Airways (BAB) and Air France on Saturday announced the cancellation of seven flights to and from the United States because of security concerns. The United States has indications of AL-Qaida's continued interest in targeting international flights to America, a government official said.

7 Flights to US Canceled
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Whoa_Nelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 11:30 PM
Response to Original message
1. But no flights within the US are a prob
even though it was flights within our borders on Sept.11 that were hijacked...

True or not, I suppose responding to "chatter" has its "place", whether to really keep us safe, or to just rachet up the fear factor.
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gulfcoastliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 11:31 PM
Response to Original message
2. I was watching 'CNN Saturday Night'
And the talkback segment concerned this. One woman commented on how it is just all about misdirection and an attempt to distract people. Another BFEE lie exposed, another new terror warning.
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legin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 11:36 PM
Response to Original message
3. Someone on the TV in britain
suggested that there might be an underlying political motive that the u.s. wants European airlines to employ Air Marshalls on European flights to the u.s., and these cancellations are a way of turning the thumbscrews.
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csw77 Donating Member (27 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 11:38 PM
Response to Original message
4. But....but...
I thought we were safer now that Saddam has been found. :eyes:

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The_Casual_Observer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 11:40 PM
Response to Original message
5. More idiotic nonsense
Clearly there is no rgood reason to do this. If you suspecetd that someting was going to happen, why would you broadcast it over then entire globe??????
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Newsjock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 11:43 PM
Response to Original message
6. Read this crap from the AP story
U.S. officials have been concerned for some time that al-Qaida wants to use chemical, biological or radiological weapons aboard an airplane. However, the threat information that led to the canceled flights this weekend did not indicate a specific method to bring down a plane or spread an illness such as smallpox, said a U.S. official speaking on the condition of anonymity.

Instead, the official said intelligence analysts use threat information about the flights, and marry it up to information about types of attacks al Qaida may want to launch, to come up with possible scenarios for an attack at any particular time.


In other words, tonight's big headline -- "Al-Qaida wants to do bioterror on a commercial airliner! Be afraid!" -- has absolutely no evidence behind it. It's the wild, fear-driven speculation of the madmen at Homeland Security.

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blackcat77 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 11:51 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Damn...
I'll admit the bioterror angle made me pay a little more attention than usual this time. But it was all nonsense yet again.

My own theory about this is that Kerry's been getting too much ink lately and Bush has to do something to remind us why it's necessary to keep the Warrior King in office.
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mike1963 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #6
23. If they wanted to do some bioterror, wouldn't it be a little easier to
do it in, say a big mall, or the stadium in Houston?...
:eyes:
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54anickel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #6
24. Did they re-enact that "gambling" deal for terrorist threats? Can't
Edited on Sun Feb-01-04 01:17 PM by 54anickel
remember what it was called. This sure sounds like it would be from that.

On edit:
Found it - Makes you wonder...
http://money.cnn.com/2003/11/17/news/terror_futures/index.htm?cnn=yes
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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-31-04 11:58 PM
Response to Original message
8. The worst form of "terrorism" is in charge of this country,...
It is completely beyond me that people in this country do not get that they have better odds of winning the lottery than dying from an act of "terrorism" by the hands of someone outside their country.

Insanity is let loose from the "Pandora's Box" of profiteering propagandists. I pray God give us all "anchor" to reality.
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Fovea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 12:35 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. It isnt even subtle anymore.
But they don't have time to be subtle.
They have got 7 knifes in the air at once.
If you asked them for the time they would
be sliced like juienne fries.
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MikeG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 12:36 AM
Response to Original message
10. How do they know this? I think its all BS.
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rustydog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 01:04 AM
Response to Original message
11. The media mush change "Terror Fears" to re-election fears.
It is so predictable that the return of these alerts coincide with Bush ratings fall and the upcoming primaries.


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rustydog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 01:05 AM
Response to Original message
12. Are they getting terror intel from the same source as WMD intel?
Makes you wonder when they aren't lying.
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RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 01:06 AM
Response to Original message
13. no orange alert? -a brief history of-
I think it's clear that the reason for this current action, if there is no threat...and who can know and why should we believe anything they say based upon their history of lies and manipulation...is because of the lies about the Iraq war which are now being discussed (finally) on American tv.

here is are some articles about the previous orange alerts, the last one was used when Cheney was in the news (tho I don't know how much this made American tv) because France was going to possibly indict him on bribery charges.

No doubt they are also doing this because it's Super Bowl Sunday. They issue alerts or raise the anxiety level around every American holiday...and since the Super Bowl is the most watched tv show of the year, they are no doubt worried that it would be seen as a big media event for terrorists if they could pull off an attack at such a venue.
--

December 22, 2003- was the 5th time, it seems.

Christmas holidays. On the Saturday that Saddam was revealed as captured to
the American people, Bush signed patriot act 2.

http://edition.cnn.com/2003/US/05/20/terror.main/

sidebar graphic which I could not open, shows the levels of terror alerts. if someone could post the graphic, that would be great.

http://edition.cnn.com/2003/US/05/20/terror.main/

Tues, May 20th, 2003
The raising of the threat level comes as the nation prepares to celebrate Memorial Day this weekend, when war veterans are remembered and large public gatherings are held.

'Reasonably spooky stuff'

On Capitol Hill, Undersecretary of Homeland Security Asa Hutchinson said intelligence indicates "terrorists continue to plan attacks against targets in the United States, and for this reason, the alert level has been raised.

"There is increased specificity in what we hear, but not necessarily in terms of the target," Hutchinson said.

It marks the fourth time the level has been raised to orange...

(This was also the time for the huge march on Washington before the invasion...also, Ashcroft and Bush had had patriot act 2 in the wings, waiting for the invasion of Iraq to shove it down America's throat, but had to pull back when someone in the DoJ leaked to The Center for Public Integrity.)

March 17th, 2003

" The last time was March 17, the day President Bush gave Saddam Hussein a 48-hour ultimatum to step down as Iraq leader. About a month later, it was lowered to yellow, or "elevated." No terrorist attacks occurred inside the
United States."

Feb. 17th, 2003

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/wnt/US/terror030213_falsealarm.html

"Feb. 13— A key piece of the information leading to recent terror alerts was fabricated, according to two senior law enforcement officials in Washington and New York.

The officials said that a claim made by a captured al Qaeda member that Washington, New York or Florida would be hit by a "dirty bomb" sometime this week had proven to be a product of his imagination.

The informant described a detailed plan that an al Qaeda cell operating in either Virginia or Detroit had developed a way to slip past airport scanners with dirty bombs encased in shoes, suitcases, or laptops, sources told ABCNEWS. The informant reportedly cited specific targets of government buildings and Christian or clerical centers.

"This piece of that puzzle turns out to be fabricated and therefore the reason for a lot of the alarm, particularly in Washington this week, has been dissipated after they found out that this information was not true," said Vince Cannistraro, former CIA counter-terrorism chief and ABCNEWS consultant."

(the article goes on to note that the informant was not given a polygraph before his information was used to issue the heightened alert.)

the first alert was on the anniversary of 9-11, 2002.

-- excellent overview by the ever-wonderfulquakers..

http://www.fcnl.org/issues/terror/sup/code-orange_alert-sys.htm


The first use of Code Orange covered two weeks, September 10-24, 2002, and
was associated with the first anniversary of the attacks on New York and
Washington. The second orange alert, the "duct tape and plastic" saga, came
five months later and went for nearly three weeks, February 7-27, 2003. This
period included both Washington and Lincoln's birthdays and the federal
Presidents' Day holiday. The four week long March 17-April 16 third alert
covered most of the period of "major combat" in Iraq. The most recent Code
Orange was declared on May 20 specifically because of Memorial Day (May 26)
and ran through May 30. The fact that the last alert was the shortest may
reflect growing (and perhaps unwarranted) confidence that higher alerts act
to thwart terrorist incidents. Conversely, many observers think Washington
ended the alert after eleven days simply to break "siege fatigue" before
raising the alert level back to orange for the July 4 holiday -- as was
nearly done in 2002.

There seems to be a pattern of tying the higher alerts to specific
anniversaries or events, ostensibly on the premise (or Western bias) that
terrorists always will favor a combination of symbolism and occasions when
crowds might gather, thereby increasing the possibility of casualties. This
tendency to highlight anniversaries has undoubtedly not escaped the
attention of U.S. opponents. On the four occasions Code Orange has been
announced, the justification has rested largely on non-specific credible
indicators such as increased "chatter" on communications links identified as
related to "terrorist" cells.

Moreover, intelligence officials were forced to admit that the February 2003
alert was based largely on fabricated information from a detained senior al
Qaeda operative, as was a Christmas-time manhunt for five "infiltrators"
(for which the color code was not raised).

U.S. authorities should seriously consider that intentional deception is
being practiced. The fact is that since September 11, 2001, the only
"terrorist" attacks within the U.S. have been the anthrax contamination,
which authorities are inclined to attribute to a domestic source, and the
string of pipe bombs in the rural Midwest that were left by a domestic
misfit.

The suspicion that the color code system is being misused was further fueled
during the Iraq war. Government officials reportedly considered adding a
sub-level within orange -- one could imagine something like "flaming orange"

-- for very high risk. The reason Washington did not want to go to Code Red was economics: the Administration feared such a move might further damage the economy. Moreover, Code Red would involve shutting down government facilities, which would be costly, whereas with a "flaming orange" level, federal employees could be sent to alternate work sites. And at Code Red, state and local governments, which spent $2 billion dollars on extra security during the Iraq war period, would see another spike in costs (leading to Administration-induced "fiscal fatigue" from so much fear-spinning) even if there were no specific threats directed toward their jurisdictions.

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Whoa_Nelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 01:22 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Got'cher sidebar graphics right'cher, RainDog
Edited on Sun Feb-01-04 01:37 AM by Angel_O_Peace


and



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SheilaT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 02:23 AM
Response to Original message
15. All this b.s. about Al- Qaeda and international flights
reminds me of the bomb threats we used to have back in the 70's.

I worked at National Airport in Washington DC from 1969 to 1979. In the mid-70's we started getting occasional bomb threats phoned in. Early on, we'd shut down the airport and evacuate everyone while bomb-sniffing dogs searched the terminal. Eventually, the airport police would simply quietly notify the various airlines that a bomb threat had been called in and they were checking it out.

Needless to say, there was never a real bomb. The one time one went off in LaGuardia, I don't believe anyone ever claimed responsibility, and I'm pretty certain there was no advance warning.

After a while, we airline employees became convinced that the threats were being made by someone running late for a flight, who figured it was a good way to get the flight held.

I think the idea that Al-Qaeda is targeting international airlines is based on an analogous degree of misinformation and wishful thinking.

There are so many other ways to create a terrorist incident. Even I can think of several, and I'm not a terrorist. I have no interest in destroying things or killing people and creating havoc. But it wouldn't be hard. And if there is a next time, it will be something and somewhere that most of us have never thought about before.
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mrdmk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 04:49 AM
Response to Original message
16. These terrorist have us sussed
All they to do is send a phony E-mail from a place that has the landscape of dirt, rocks and caves and we proceed to shut down our systems. How convenient for the terrorist, they barely need to lift a finger.
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SheilaT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #16
21. You've got it.
Exactly like the nonexistent bomb threats three decades ago.
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joeunderdog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-02-04 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #16
35. "OK, terrorists, take the night off."
"We'll just terrorize our own country. We'll do your work and put fear in the hearts of Americans. We'll cancel flights, and tell Americans that the sky is falling again. We'll put economic strangleholds on our own budgets and it won't cost you a dime," Said the quivering Chimp.



"ROFLMFAO!!!" said the terrorists.
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pinniped Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 05:17 AM
Response to Original message
17. Are British Airways and Air France the only airlines left in the worlld?
Shouldn't that color crap be changed too?
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moondust Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 05:31 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. My question as well.
I don't see any concern over smaller carriers like Virgin Atlantic or the other Euro carriers or return trips made by U.S. carriers besides a single Continental flight. Doesn't make sense.
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CJCRANE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 05:32 AM
Response to Original message
19. According to a BBC report
the cancellations were due to a re-examination of the info used for the last orange alert.
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Nile Donating Member (354 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 05:56 AM
Response to Original message
20. But if the flights were not canceled and then something happened...
what would we say then? We would be screaming for an investigation to find out who knew what and why they did not connect the dots. It is a no win situation.

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Whoa_Nelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. Hi, Nile!
Welcome to DU! :hi:
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bobthedrummer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
25. This is a power struggle over insistence of armed flight marshalls
by the PNAC crew IMHO.
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Chrysophylax Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. Yeah, you could be...
right, if Air France, BA and Continental have no flight-marshalls.

The pilots feel very unconfortable with them. It's also very easy to spot them in a plane.
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Chrysophylax Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 01:50 PM
Response to Original message
26. I have to fly next week, i am so scared.
Wait, this warning comes from American Homeland Security and is based on american Intel? Those Intel that ignored 9/11/01 warnings, is playing with color-codes, was clueless about WMD and likes to scare people.

Gee.. i feel so safe, that would mean flying now is completely secure.

And well, i am also using a german airline - why should terrorist attack Europe?
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myomy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
28. Makes you wonder who’s wining the “war on terror” doesn't it?
.
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xxqqqzme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 02:55 PM
Response to Original message
29. is this this same
'intelligence' that so brazenly and deliberately misled squatter N2 invading Iraq?


You notice there is no attempt @ subtle gestures anymore.

Irony dead my ass! It is the art of nuance the has been hacked 2 bits by this gang of ham fisted thugs!
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lebkuchen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
30. Since they're preventative measures taken just before the Super Bowl
who knows. Maybe Bush has decided to pay attention to his hired intelligence for a change.
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T Bone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. Have they given the actual flight numbers involved
in the cancellations?
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fortyfeetunder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-01-04 07:39 PM
Response to Original message
32. Gov't weenies were watching "The Sum of All Fears"
The SB bombing incident....

Al-qaida is going to get the US with its collective pants down. Doing this today would be all to obvious. They probably will wait until things settle down and everyone returns to a post-SB complacency stupor.
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SheilaT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-02-04 07:27 AM
Response to Original message
33. And don't forget that this "intelligence"
is from the same people that thought Niger was selling yellow cake uranium to Iraq, that the Communists were going to last forever in Eastern Europe -- what else did they miss. It seems they rarely have anything right. They simply cannot distinguish between real threats and mere idle talk on the part of the supposed terrorists.

I'll tell you what the problem is. The problem is the intelligence services should hire a whole bunch of housewives who are used to spending a lot of time in idle gossip and know how to evaluate the source and can tell the difference between gossip that has some basis in fact and that which doesn't.
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tinanator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-02-04 10:17 AM
Response to Reply #33
34. but they already have the fiction writers they want
Edited on Mon Feb-02-04 10:17 AM by tinanator
that is why it was so important to out and dismiss Arabic translators.
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