Clinton has lead with party insiders

[sabra]

Source: Chron/AP

WASHINGTON — Hillary Rodham Clinton retains her lead among suddenly critical Democratic Party insiders even as Barack Obama builds up his delegate margin with primary and caucus victories across the country, according to a survey by The Associated Press.

Of the 796 lawmakers, governors and party officials who are Democratic superdelegates, Clinton had 243 and Obama had 156. That edge was responsible for Clinton's overall advantage in the pursuit of delegates to secure the party's nomination for president. According to the AP's latest tally, Clinton has 1,135 total delegates and Obama has 1,106, with three delegates still to be awarded from Sunday's Democratic caucuses in Maine. A candidate must get 2,025 delegates to capture the nomination.

The numbers illustrate not only the remarkable proximity between the two candidates, but also the extraordinary influence superdelegates could wield in determining who becomes the nominee. Both campaigns are aggressively pursuing superdelegates, trumpeting their endorsements the moment they are secured.

"I told my wife I'm probably going to be pretty popular for a couple months," chuckled Richard Ray, a superdelegate and president of the Georgia chapter of the AFL-CIO. Ray said he will remain undecided because the labor federation has made no endorsement.

"If they endorse, then I will, too," Ray said.



Read more: http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/politics/5529727.html

[bluestateguy]

1. An AFL-CIO official is a superdelegate?

Oh brother.

[bigworld]

11. Here in Pennsylvania as well.

[ursi]

2. our party is corrupt

[Name removed]

8. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Obamaniac]

3. She's ahead for the time being.

Let's wait and see.

[harmonicon]

4. I'm not the only person who thinks this is totally nuts, am I?

I'm already pissed enough that I didn't get a primary vote (Michigan), but if whoever the nominee ends up being gets that nomination by having more super delegates but fewer primary votes, I think my head will actually explode.

[spartan61]

5. No, you aren't the only person who thinks this is nuts!

I do too and if the Super Delegates are the ones who choose the nominee with no regard to the pledged delegates, then it will be time for me to change my affliation to Independent. This is insane.

[Baby Snooks]

9. "But WE are the people"

It would be interesting to try to track it all but of course good luck to anyone trying to track all the "coincidental" campaign contributions being made to the superdelegates.

And if they override the will of the people, they will merely reply "but WE are the people, not you."

[karynnj]

10. Before you do, notice that there are some prominent Democrats who agree with you

Obama:
Mr. Obama, talking to reporters in Seattle on Friday, said he believed superdelegates should follow the will of the voters.

“My strong belief is that if we end up with the most states and the most pledged delegates from the most voters in the country, that it would be problematic for the political insiders to overturn the judgment of the voters,” Mr. Obama said.

Kerry:
“My personal opinion is it would be a mistake and disastrous either way for the superdelegates — insiders, establishment politicians — to come along and overturn the expressed view of those pledged delegates,” Mr. Kerry said.



http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/10/us/politics/10superdelegates.html?ref=politics

[boricua79]

27. welcome to the United States of America

where popular votes get trumped by delegates, superdelegates, and some weird institution called the electoral college.

Why don't they just call these things what they are....mechanisms of the rich to "check" the democratic will of the masses.

Hell, if you read the Notes of the Debates of the Constitutional Convention (by James Madison), you'll be surprised to know how much time and debate they had on exactly what parts of the Republic would be "representative". They hated democracy...they were scared to death of it. That's why the Senate originally was not elected by the people. The entire system was designed to check a popular vote actually electing a president of the people.

[Zhade]

6. How antidemocratic of the party if they allow the people's voice to be denied.

But then, that's why I left the Dem party years ago. Par for the course, sadly.

[aquart]

7. Oh, thank god!

Not everyone has turned into a rhinoceros.

[NoodleyAppendage]

12. Of course she does. Corporate Power doesn't go away quietly.

Hillary is the last bastion of the status quo standing against a populist revolution that scares the crap out of the DINO/DLC corporatist wing of the Democratic Party.

J

[PassingFair]

13. Lieberman still held on to his committee posts, didn't he...

We're gonna need CROWBARS to get these thugs
out of our party.

[boricua79]

25. ding ding ding! We have a winner

clear and concise.

And that's why I vote Obama.

[BearSquirrel2]

14. I get the idea ...

I get the idea that Obama is pulling away and he will ultimately have enough with his pledged delegates and super delegates.

[badgervan]

15. The So-Called "Super"Delegates....

.... had best listen to the voters.

[Thothmes]

16. Looks like an opportunity

for the old white guys to reassert their control of the Democratic Party from a smoked filled back room at the convention. JMO

[EFerrari]

17. Maybe they'd do a better job than the DLC. Hell, I'll spring for the

Macanudos.

[peaches2003]

18. Dem Party beginning to realize

that if the superdelegates are allowed to change the results of the primary/caucus by voting to give the nomination to the person who did not get the highest # of total votes that it will be the end of that candidate's chances to be Pres and the Dem Party for yrs to come. I think that finally the voters are sick of being jerked around by a bunch of party hacks. :wtf:

[boricua79]

28. My message to the Superdelegates

you vote against the candidate of the people, and I stay home on election day.

That should be EVERY voter's message.

They can keep their corrupt, DLC-status quo DINO party to themselves, if that's how they're going to play it. and they can keep it in opposition forever.

[Claire Beth]

19. This is just what the right wing wants

Fighting amongst ourselves, is exactly what the GOPers want and we are falling prey to that very thing. I will vote for WHOEVER the democratic nominee is PERIOD!!! Obama does NOT stand a chance of winning in a GENERAL ELECTION but I would stil vote for him. Can the Obama people say the same thing about Hillary. We should be DEMOCRATS, not Obamalites or Hillaryites!

Does it ever fail that Democrats can pull defeat from the jaws of victory?!?!?!

[boricua79]

26. I don't have blind party loyalty...thank you very much

I vote my conscience, whatever the outcome later.

I will not give me vote for DLC-status quoist Hillary Clinton.

[Claire Beth]

20. This is just what the right wing wants

Fighting amongst ourselves, is exactly what the GOPers want and we are falling prey to that very thing. I will vote for WHOEVER the democratic nominee is PERIOD!!! Obama does NOT stand a chance of winning in a GENERAL ELECTION but I would stil vote for him. Can the Obama people say the same thing about Hillary. We should be DEMOCRATS, not Obamalites or Hillaryites!

Does it ever fail that Democrats can pull defeat from the jaws of victory?!?!?!

[Claire Beth]

21. This is just what the right wing wants

Fighting amongst ourselves, is exactly what the GOPers want and we are falling prey to that very thing. I will vote for WHOEVER the democratic nominee is PERIOD!!! Obama does NOT stand a chance of winning in a GENERAL ELECTION but I would stil vote for him if he is our nominee. Can the Obama people say the same thing about Hillary???? We should be DEMOCRATS, not Obamalites or Hillaryites!

Democrats will find a way to pull defeat from the jaws of victory!!! Come on folks, don't let this happen.

[Windy]

22. You let them get away with this, we all lose!! If they subvert the will of the people

then the people should pull their support!! Let the damn chips fall where they may.

This is a democracy!! A lot of people have died to give us our say in how this country is run. We better not let it slip away from us. To do so is to spit on the graves of all those who gave their lives.

The party will do this to themselves. Hopefully, the less corrupt will prevail. They do exist in Barbara Boxer, Donna Brazille, John Kerry and yes, Barack Obama.

[Megahurtz]

23. Unfair!

[boricua79]

24. but of course, she's the "people's candidate"

:sarcasm:

whenever I hear shit like "has the lead with party insiders", that tells me I want to vote for the OTHER person.

I'm not a party insider. I'm not an insider..or an upperclass elitist. I'm a regular person, and I want a candidate that is of my class. Barring that, I want one of the upper class who inspires me and who I think would be more amenable to persuasion by working class and middle class voters.

Being part of the DLC, and being "in the lead with party insider" is not the way to get my vote.

[peaches2003]

29. Heard one of the Dem strategists on tv today-

what a hack- Richard Goodsomething. He is all for the superdelegates making the decision no matter what the people have voted in the primaries. His attitude was that the superdelegates know best. He was disgusting and lauhging about the whole thing.

Then some kid got on- a college student- who is a superdelegate for God's sake! He was full of himself- Bill had called him, had lunch with Chelsea, etc. Hadn't made up his mind yet- ha, like hell he hasn't. Probably has a job waiting for him on Wall St if he votes right.

I was sick to my stomach with both of these superdelegates. It is all a joke to them and like a lottery where they have the winning tkt if they play their cards right. We like fools line up and vote thinking it means something. :puke:

[boricua79]

30. they keep playing that upper-class game

and WILL keep playing that game until voters abandon them, form their own party or stay home.

I, for one, will not go out and vote Democratic if Obama is not the candidate, and I don't care if that leads to 4 more or 8 more years of Republican rule. I think that the best medicine to arrogance and wrong decisions is to keep burning your hand at the stove. So if the American people haven't learned yet, let them touch that hot stove again and again and again.

They didn't learn with Reagan...they didn't learn with Bush 1...and if they didn't learn with Bush 2, let them keep voting in centrist DLCists and REpublicans...keep touching the hot stove again and again and again.

I don't mind it. I actually enjoy it. I'm so tired of seeing dumb people keep voting wedge issues and stupid "morals" or "values" or "ideologies" and not vote their rational economic interest. So, let them keep touching the hot stove again and again and again.