NBC un-plugs Kucinich from Presidential Debate

[Bunkie0913]

Source: Dennis4President.com

Re-writes criteria to exclude candidate with ’dissenting’ positions

Less than 44 hours after NBC sent a congratulatory note and an invitation to Ohio Congressman Dennis Kucinich to participate in the Jan. 15 Democratic Presidential debate in Las Vegas, the network notified the campaign this morning it was changing it announced criteria, rescinding its invitation, and excluding Kucinich from the debate.
NBC Political Director Chuck Todd notified the Kucinich campaign this morning that, although Kucinich had met the qualification criteria publicly announced on December 28, the network was “re-doing” the criteria, excluding Kucinich, and planning to invite only Senators Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama and former senator John Edwards.


The criteria announced last month included a fourth-place or better showing in a national poll. The USA/Gallup poll earlier this month showed Kucinich in fourth place among the Democratic contenders.

In an email to the Kucinich campaign at 2:35 p.m. on Wednesday, January 9, Democratic Party debates consultant Jenny Backus wrote:


“Congratulations on another hard-fought contest. Now that New Hampshire is over, we are on to Nevada and our Presidential Debate on Tuesday January 15. This letter serves as an official invitation for your candidate to participate in the Nevada Presidential Debate at Cashman Theatre in downtown Las Vegas. You have met the criteria set by NBC and the Debate.”


Read more: Dennis4President.com

---

I've never posted anything except comments to other people but this seems like late breaking news to me.

[WilmywoodNCparalegal]

1. I'm sure this is true and tragic but

I don't know if www.dennis4president.com can be considered an unbiased news source, any more than a LBN from an Obama or Clinton or XYZ site.

[DissedByBush]

87. It's what they did to Perot

Find out exactly what criteria will disqualify the person who is a danger to the status quo then set the qualifications for the debate just above that. Exclude him from the debate, you eliminate the possibility of him winning.

[Telly Savalas]

115. Danger to the status quo? How?

He was in quite a few debates up to this point, and the status quo doesn't seem very threatened?

I'd like to see him in the debate, but let's not get carried away.

[NikolaC]

119. Not "Quite A Few"

He has been excluded from at last several debates. The rules seem to change where Kucinich is concerned, primarily because he tells the truth and is seen as a troublemaker. Kinda hard to get supporters and the message out when you are stymied at every turn.

[DissedByBush]

145. A Threat

The status quo is threatened if Kucinich wins; therefore, he cannot be allowed to win. Exclusion from debates is practically guaranteed to eliminate him.

[RaleighNCDUer]

165. To hell with winning -

the status quo is threatened by him simply being heard.

Hillary speaks: reaction: Uh huh.
Obama speaks: reaction: Uh huh.
Edwards is ignored.
Dennis speaks: reaction: Wow! I never thought of it THAT way before.

[donkeyotay]

181. Exactly. Kucinich doesn't have to win the election to win. He wins by getting his message out.

Similar to Ron Paul on the right, both candidates get a lot of support from the people and silence from our corporate rulers. Who got the biggest applause when he was heard in the debates? Kucinich. Who exposes the "change" mantra so popular this election as the complete fraud that it is? The media has edited out any talk of real change. What we will get is a rearrangement of the deck chairs.

[coalition_unwilling]

150. Kucinich is the only Democratic candidate calling for the

Defense Department budget to be CUT!!!! You think that isn't a threat to NBC, owned by GE (nation's second largest defense contractor)????

Imagine if Kucinich actually were Prez and actually submitted a budget to Congress with a 15% cut in the U.S. Defense Department budget! Just imagine it. It's what keeps me going through this long night.

[laconicsax]

156. That's dangerous thinking

I mean, if the DoD's budget gets cut, then we might not make it to 50% of global military spending. We're at $644 billion right now. A 15% cut would take us dangerously low--down to $547 billion. That's more than it was in 2005 but think of the message it sends to our enemies--that we're not willing to account for at least half of all global military spending. We might as well throw in the towel and let the terrorists win.

http://www.globalissues.org/Geopolitics/ArmsTrade/Spending.asp#USMilitarySpending

[DissedByBush]

169. Can we afford a 15% cut?

Of course we can. We can probably increase readiness, equipment and servicemember quality of life even with the cut if we quit sending our troops all over the world (not counting small contingents with our allies and the embassy Marines) and buying equipment we don't need (we've built ships the Navy didn't want because of pork). Did you know we have troops in Djibouti? WTF? Why?

[RaleighNCDUer]

164. The status quo in regards to what messages are being heard.

And tho Edwards comes close, NOBODY is saying the things Dennis is. If the M$M had its way the debate would be nothing more than tweedledum and tweedledee. They just haven't quite figured out how to exclude Edwards, however, other than proclaiming it to be a two person race.

[AikidoSoul]

168. If DK is able to participate he can do in other primary states like he's

doing in New Hampshire -- ask for a recount in the name of
election integrity.

We may need more than New Hampshire to show how these elections are routinely
being stolen. But DK MUST focus on the chain of custody of the
ballots. If they're paper he has a chance and might be able to get a fair recount.

Unlike the previous elections cycle recount in New Hampshire when the precincts were NOT
randomly chosen and highly questionable persons conducted the recount.

[Sherman A1]

2. Well, no real surprise, I suppose but it

still makes me want to :argh:

[Kikosexy2]

39. These so-called...

debates on TV are a crock of sh*t!...I say boycott...don't watch and let the networks know it...If they include all candidates then it's not worth viewing....

[defendandprotect]

67. Whose watching this garbage, anyway? NBC . . . GE? No thanks!!

Kucinich and the other candidates all deserve better than this privatized garbage they're
putting out --- and we all deserve better ---

BOYCOTT !!!

Save your electricity!!!


And, as a matter of fact, I think the other candidates should also support him ---
I doubt they will; not wanting to poorly influence their coverage on NBC ---
but they should!!!

[ixion]

3. so it's a debate with no dissenting opinions

yeah, gee, that makes sense. :crazy: :grr: :argh:

[Freddie Stubbs]

6. All three candidate agree on everything?

It would seem that Edwards' supporters would disagree on that point.

[maxanne]

161. Edwards supporters

should be concerned. Their candidate will be the next to be silenced.

[Ignis]

4. Nice bait-&-switch on the criteria, NBC.

Can we cut this shit out and have fully transparent, publicly-funded campaigns now, please?

[Maat]

5. Exactly (n/t)!

[Ignis]

7. Isn't it amazing how quickly we circle the wagons to debunk MSM smears...

Yet when obvious corporation control of US elections rears its ugly head (as it has here), there's a great collective "Yawn" from DU.

:banghead:

Information is power. The media is the message. Allowing corporations (and warmongering ones, at that) to control our access to political information is suicide.

[Stewie]

40. I doubt it was a corporate conspiracy.

More likely, one or more the other campaigns went to NBC and said they wouldn't come if Dennis were included. The last thing the Clinton campaign needs right now, for example, is someone really riding her on impeachment or her Iran vote.

[FREEWILL56]

41. I am assuming that was total sarcasm.

[freefall]

106. Why would you assume that?

It was one of my first thoughts also although I think it more likely that it was a corporate decision or that it was the Democratic establishment rather than one of the actual campaigns that made the request of NBC and NBC was more than happy to oblige.

I used to be a Dennis supporter and I fully support his request for a recount but I can no longer support his campaign as long as he chooses to remain part of the Democratic party. It is my hope that Kucinich, Ron Paul and Michael Bloomberg will all run as independents. Now that would be an interesting and exciting election. Somehow we must break the strangle hold of the two corporate parties on American politics.

Peace,

freefall

[ProudDad]

184. Dennis should re-register Green before his next election (n/t)

[defendandprotect]

69. No corporate conspiracies . . . ??? Really --- ???

So . . . Hillary did it, eh???

[AikidoSoul]

80. You are either naiive ....or complicit in the game

Or ignorant?

[Maat]

48. As a DK Team Leader out here in SoCal ...

I'm somewhat disappointed in the relatively apathetic response.

Take care, and keep up the good fight! NGU.

[Ignis]

170. Taking back the Media is our key to long-term progress.

Thanks for your work for DK. :hi:

[Maat]

178. And thank you.

Thanks to all the DUers who fight the good fight.

[KoKo]

14. Chuck Todd's Wife is a Political Operative...he turned and is scum...and

he's gone to the dark side.

[KoKo]

16. Dennis needs to do another law suit. You guys laugh at him...but he's STANDING UP for ALL OF US

when he does these lawsuits. The good souls are always ridiculed. When they aren't eliminated by violent means by those they challenge.

Dennis is doing good stuff SHOWING how hard it is for ANYONE in the Dem Party to get Noticed past the ANNOINTEDS. Look at the Repugs...they are better than us DEMS...they have a full slate of what ...7 Candidates still in the race and debating and some with the same lagging funds as Kucinich.

Tell me Dems are better than Repugs? Howard Dean needs to do something about this. Where IS HE?

[puebloknot]

31. Yes, he *is* standing up for progressived!

Dennis Kucinich was awarded the 2003 Gandhi Peace Award.

"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win."
-- Mahatma Gandhi

The first three are already happening. Let's hope for a "win," in the sense of the American people waking up to the manipulation that is taking place in our politics!

[AikidoSoul]

86. You make several good points

Hope people listen to you.

And to DK

[countmyvote4real]

98. Indeed, Dean should intervene and the "approved" candidates should recuse themselves.

Of course, none of them will stand up for the myth of the big tent. As others have stated, we should not watch these pageants. If anybody here is still on the fence for a candidate, then all I can gracefully say is, "Bless your heart." If you're from the south you understand the subtext.

[kikiek]

138. My eyes have been opened up. I found a website that has the true records of them all.

The only real one in the bunch is Dennis. Talk is cheap, and that's all the others are.

[fascisthunter]

187. Very True (nt)

[PADemD]

64. For whom does she work?

[defendandprotect]

70. I think the pay is better on the dark side . . . how much for torture?

[peaches2003]

82. Anyone we would know?

Is his wife someone we political junkies would recognize?

[coalition_unwilling]

153. National Bullshit Company. Bye-bye Tim Russert and Chris Matthews

I'm now boycotting ABC for Sephanopolous allowing George Will's redbaiting comment directed towards Edwards last Sunday (Will called Edwards the "Trotsky of the Democrats".)

I'm now adding NBC to my list, thanks to this bullshit.

I'm also emailing all friends and relatives and asking them to boycott both.

[EFerrari]

8. We need to write Keith about this.

This is facist bullsh1t.

[defendandprotect]

71. Well, why doesn't someone write something for DU-members and we'll all shoot it to NBC --- ???

[EFerrari]

143. I volunteer you!

:)

And, you can include the fact that on Wednesday the President of the Commission on Presidential Debates said this was now a two person race and that the other DEMOCRATIC candidates should drop out. He said that about two minutes after he said that registered Democrats should choose their own candidate.

[pink-o]

173. I wish Keith would have in on "Countdown"

...although it's kinda preaching to the choir for Dennis to put forth his issues on that forum.

[mikelgb]

9. blatant censorship... what fuckheads

K&R

[Phred42]

10. Fascist Media still at it

The MSM (in this case NBC) couldn't be more clear in their message to all of us that they fully intend to control OUR election process and ram THEIR candidates down our throats - whether we see it or like it or not.

Once again We the People are given the One finger salute from Corporate America.

[defendandprotect]

72. And, it's like the closing plays in a checker or chess game . .. soon you have fewer options and

they have them all!!!


I keep asking . .. what's the plan if there's another steal in 2008????

[RaleighNCDUer]

167. Another? What are you, one of them conpeercy thereists?

The plan: Hillary or Obama, nothing; Edwards or Dennis, fight, count, re-count, and force the Supremes to steal it again.

[Mira]

11. Utterly disgusting. We need to write and complain. Thanks for posting it.

[defendandprotect]

73. I agree --- but I hesitate to confirm that none of that seems to be doing much!!!

[QUALAR]

12. OUTRAGE

This decision cannot be allowed to stand. I am not a Kucinich supporter, but I do believe in free speech. NBC is following ABC's lead in censoring the debate. Neither corporation wants to hear the word "impeachment".

Hillary Clinton is making a big issue of "no person's voice will go unheard". If she truly believes that she should demand a place for Kucinich at NBC's upcoming debate. Failure to do so will result in loss of my vote, because her reawakening is a BIG FAT LIE.

[idiocracyhell]

56. Good Point

If the Democratic candidates believed their own rhetoric, then they would boycott the debates! I lose more and more respect for Obama, Clinton, and Edwards, when they allow this subterfuge of our democracy by MSM.

"The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil, but because of those that look on and do nothing."
- Albert Einstein

[loudsue]

151. We need to write to their SPONSORS, and send out word for a BOYCOTT of

all the sponsor's products if the networks keep censoring the debates. It's the $$, and the sponsors/advertisers are the ones who want our money. They could care less about anything else....which is exactly WHY corporations have NO BUSINESS IN GOVERNMENT!!!

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

13. Gotta love that MSM...

...they will be/are the death of this country.

[Drum]

15. "...with ’dissenting’ positions."

[northzax]

19. funny

i see nothing about 'dissenting opinions' except in the title.

[kster]

17. Edwards, Hillary, Obama, I need to see is some "CHANGE"

will you stand up for Kucinich, this time? After all he is one of our own. :grr:

[Zorra]

20. Excellent post, kster! Which "big three" candidate will stand up for fairness

and integrity?

They should all boycott the debate in order to serve the interests of our democracy.

[defendandprotect]

74. Exactly how I feel . . . do they feel powerless against NBC --- ???

Do they feel they need to kiss NBC's ass --- ???

[99th_Monkey]

152. This should answer your question

<a href="" target="_blank"><img src="" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

If ONLY Edwards boycotts tho, it would just play into the M$M's game, not to mention be self-defeating for him...

what to do? :shrug:

[fascisthunter]

22. If None of Them Do, I WOn't Vote for any of Them

I'm serious about that. I have seen enough BS.

[Zorra]

32. You know, I'm sick of it too. I've voted strictly Dem all my life. But

if our Dem candidates don't even have the decency and integrity to stand up for what is good for democracy, I might begin to seriously believe that I am wasting my time supporting a party that no longer stands up for the democratic process.

I mean, I'm a Democrat. Which means "democrat" to me.

At least it used to, anyway.

[fascisthunter]

34. I Will Work to Get Other Dems into Local Office

but if these candidates don't do the right thing here, I will write-in Dennis name and not vote for any of them. Don't give up on the party, please. I'm sure you have ssen more than me, but there are many of us youngsters getting into the mix, and we will need your wisdom.

[Zorra]

62. Ah, I'm not giving up...I'm an idealist hoping for a collective epiphany,

I suppose.

Yeah, let's kick fascist ass any way we can this year, and then fix whatever we didn't fix this time after that as much as we can.

Peace!
;-)

[Dragonfly]

96. You might have just intuitively landed

on a major "scouting spot," riding within a spiritual plane becoming more visible to ally weavers every day.

Great line that I can relate to: "I'm an idealist hoping for a collective epiphany, I suppose."

In my view, it has been attitudes like yours which are tangibly bringing about said "collective epiphany."

Thanks...

[fascisthunter]

120. Yup... (nt)

[defendandprotect]

76. You have to understand that the Democratic Party is severely compromised . . .

co-opted by the DLC and the "blue dogs" ---

the percentage may be as high as 40%++

[fascisthunter]

99. Absolutely, I do

I hope to help to diminish the DLC's influence.

[defendandprotect]

75. Well, unfortunately, I'm not sure if we are talking big "D" or little "d" ---

I'm here for little "d" ---

[AikidoSoul]

90. You can vote for Dennis. He stands for what the others

can only sit and silently ignore

[freefall]

107. I'm with you, facisthunter. I've pretty much had it with both corporate parties! n/t

[fascisthunter]

121. Stick with Us, Though

we are principled and America needs that right now, especially the Democratic Party. I may be cynical and very critical of our Party but I really just want honesty and integrity.

[frog92969]

18. Yet another debate I won't be watching.

I've already seen all I need to anyway.

Think the big three will complain? :rofl:

[cyclezealot]

25. Have not listened to the last two debates

They are not debates. Why would I care. Just personality clashes and the means to not be brought to terms with their past mistakes.

[frog92969]

46. I really wish they'd invite him

for a frontal attack.
That's a debate I'd pay money to see.

[cyclezealot]

109. Agent of Change. I am sick of the term.

Is this the best we can do.

[fascisthunter]

21. Privatized Democracy

what's not to be proud of?

[FREEWILL56]

44. No it's more of a selective democracy with the most money and power

from corporations. What democracy is that? The republican party backs their candidates that all may debate, but not us, because why?

[fascisthunter]

53. I Agree

and I'm sick of it and the phony people who support this crap. They can talk about morality, civil liberties, democracy, fairness, the shrinking middle class, blah, blah, blah all they want, but they are all part of the problem. They can't wash that truth away by rhetoric alone. A democracy does not reflect what you state. You are right....

[FREEWILL56]

160. The Democratic party needs to address the problems the MSM is creating

for our presidential candidates in debates. It is the MSM preselecting who debates and even the questions are more geared to insight controversy and fights (they'd love a Springer type debate) rather than key on issues pertinent to a real debate. This gives them higher ratings and is why they do things the way they do. They should not be allowed to continue to marginalize and make a mockery of the election process based on their tv ratings potentials. Our Democratic leadership needs to step in here and back our candidates, popular or not, for the real purposes of getting a presidential nominee elected to run against the republicans. Popularity could come from debate exposure and we don't control what is being exposed or for whom and that is wrong. Republicans do know what the MSM does and it's only for the ratings and thusly for more money, so they do set some standards backing all of their candidates as it should be. All nominees for republicans are debating, but not all Democrats still in the running are? I guess the MSM runs the Democratic party then or at least they may as well by the result.

[peace13]

23. Wake up people!

Anyone who thinks this is a good thing is really not thinking. Peace, KIm

[defendandprotect]

78. The four of them could go to the Senate and ask for a debate on the floor --- C-span would cover it

[peace13]

113. Yes, the solution would involve the four of them.

Unfortunately it is to the advantage of the 'top three' if Kucinich is kept off of the stage, hence their resistance to doing the right thing. Now I understand why these primaries started so early. It gave control of the debates to the media. It's kind of like a mom preselecting three cereals and then letting the kids 'decide' which one they want to eat. The corporations will spoon feed us someone that will do their bidding. Peace, Kim

[defendandprotect]

179. Our elections have been privatized . .. so have the parties ---

[Hulk]

24. I won't bother listening to the debates IF he is excluded. Such a crock of shit!

Even the despicable repugs backed out on the pravda network for excluding the lunatic, john paul jones. I wonder if the Democratic candidates can at least keep up with the fascist party when it comes to excluding viable candidates and important voices in our election process.

[fascisthunter]

27. "Even the despicable repugs backed out on the pravda network...."

Indeed

[johncoby2]

26. This is such a "So what" issue!

Move on.

.org

[fascisthunter]

28. no... you move on (nt)

[johncoby2]

29. No you.

tag you are it.

[fascisthunter]

30. no thanks... baiters smell bad

[Ricki]

35. Not "so what" issue to me!

As long as he is a candidate, I want to hear what he has to say.

[defendandprotect]

79. So what?

[AikidoSoul]

92. You move on. And move over--- that's it.... over there to the right

keep going.... yeah... that's it....

Just where you belong.


Just saying....

[greyghost]

33. I'm sure the fact NBC is owned by GE didn't figure....

into their decision at all.:sarcasm:

[vanboggie]

36. Chuck Todd is a jackass - or should I say elephant

I can't stand that arrogant little toad ..er, Todd.

This is very, very wrong. I'm an Edwards supporter, but I have emailed MSNBC to register my disgust with little Toadie's decision.

[awoke_in_2003]

57. I agree

and support Edwards. Hopefully he will have something to say about this.

[Divine Discontent]

37. if he met their damn preset rules

then he belongs in the effing debate!


pathetic Chuck Todd!

[fightthegoodfightnow]

38. THE POWERS THAT BE ARE CIRCLING THEIR WAGONS

"Keep them down"

[Peregrine Took]

42. The DLC rules, once again. All hail and genuflect to the power of the DLC.

So many victims in their wake...

[fightthegoodfightnow]

45. F*CK the DLC

They are apologist for the RNC and the Bush administration.

Nothing p*sses me off more about the "Democratic Party" than the DLC !!!

DLC ................ please join the RNC and find the dignity that comes with self acceptance.

[fascisthunter]

52. F*ck the DLC

I'll second that.

[Binka]

59. Sorry I'd Rather Not Fuck The DLC

I like my Dick to be attached to a Brain.:evilgrin:

[fascisthunter]

100. good point

zippin' up


}(

[wundermaus]

43. What is it going to take?

Really, now... haven't we all had enough of this BuShit?
Are we Citizens or slaves?
Are we victims or just too f#$%ing lazy to get off our A$$es and organize?

ORGANIZE...

Now there is a term some of us have a hard time with...
Being a herd of cats makes for easy prey...
but an army of cats... hell, Tigers...
Hummm... The New Democrats... http://www.bluetigerdems.com/

[defendandprotect]

81. Anyone feel a little "shock and awe" at this ....???

And the resulting feeling of helplessness and not really having leverage to fight back?

[Rex]

47. They hate DK, he stands against everything the M$M loves.

[defendandprotect]

83. Hey, maybe this is part of the US Chamber of Commerce campaign to kill populism--!!!

[Rex]

97. Could be.

The shoe fits.

[LWolf]

49. You can't get much more blatant than that.

That's another debate I won't bother with.

Are there any Democratic "leaders" who will stand with DK on this one?

Or are they as eager to hang him out to dry as the MSM?

[stimbox]

50. Contact info...

...NBC and MSNBC have made a corporate decision to exclude the one and only voice who represents you and those things that the Democratic Party should stand for. If you are as outraged as we are, feel free to call:

NBC/MSNBC at 212 664-4444 and ask for the Comment Line or
email NBC/MSNBC at [e-mail]

More bullshit from the corporate media.

[Caretha]

110. Instead of contacting NBC

maybe we should all be contacting and concentrating on one of the "Big Three" candidates to boycott the debate. My choice would be contacting the Edwards campaign. He supposedly is the candidate that would stand up against big business & corporations, maybe it's time he "walked his talk" and prove that he means what he says before he receives Democrats votes.

Also, if only Hillary & Obama showed up for the NBC debate it would make NBC look like the corporate fascist it is.

[stimbox]

122. Maybe both Obama and Edwards.

Imagine how it would look if just Hillary showed up?

Or if all 3 top tier candidates didn't show up.

If the party had any balls it would tell the candidates not to show up or it would force msnbc/ge to have all of the candidates.

why is the party silent on this?????

we know why the DLC is, but why is the DNC?

[eridani]

166. Obama has come out publicly for inclusiveness

Maybe it's time for him to start walking his talk?

[idiocracyhell]

51. When did MSM buy our democracy?

How is this even legal in our democratic process of choosing our next president? GE is the parent company of NBC, and opensecrets.org reveals who's campaign they've supported. Clinton and Obama are the top recipients for the Democrats. Mitt Romney and John McCain received the most in the Republican party.

It seems like a conflict of interest to have a vested interest in the candidates that are "allowed" to debate in a nationally televised presidential election. Where is the FCC in all of this?! Or the Democratic Party for that matter! The thing that is so disillusioning with this blatant media manipulation of our democratic process, is people keep voting for these candidates that MSM has preselected for our benefit! When will people realize the candidate they don't want you to hear, the one they exclude from debates and state primaries, is the greatest threat to their corporate greed. The one candidate that will give us back our democracy and honor our Constitution, is a man of such integrity and fierce moral courage, he can't be bought off like the other candidates that are playing by the corporate rules.

[awoke_in_2003]

58. Control of debates

should be returned to the League of Women Voters. They did a much better job.

[defendandprotect]

84. I think it was 1963 . . . maybe a bit earlier, like McCarthy Era ....

[AikidoSoul]

94. All good points

Welcome to DU! :hi:

Keep it up. Your meesage needs to be told over and over in a thousand different ways.

[gsplfnk]

54. Dennis dissed

Clinton, Edwards and Obama have proven themselves unworthy. The real difference between them and Kucinich is that Kucinich and Ron Paul have refused to sign on to the gravy wagon bottom line of AIPAC. That is what this is really all about. Kucinich and Paul are "at liberty" to advocate pulling the troops out immediately because they have not been paid well in advance by Zionists to support Israel's "security."

Kucinich and Paul are not owned by the Zionists, they have not accepted payment to keep military options on the table with Iran.

They are "at liberty" to advocate for peace.

Clinton, Edwards and Obama have made financial agreements with AIPAC, and they have each spoken at AIPAC events of their undying support for Israel.

Perhaps we need to look more closely at the two men in this entire field of candidates on both sides of the aisle who put American interests first and foremost, who are not bought and paid for by the Likud.

You want an AIPAC shill for your next president? Be my guest. With Edwards, Obama or Clinton, you are likely to get full force what George Bush could only hint at.

[pjt7]

55. I'd like to see Obama make a classy move &

ask for Kucinich to be heard.

[951-Riverside]

60. I'm not voting from him but this is uncalled for.

Let the man speak! :mad:

[defendandprotect]

85. As a Kucinich/Edwards supporter --- thank you!!!

[harmonicon]

88. why would you vote for a candidate who would let this stand?

Do you think a person who won't even stand up to principles that their party was founded on will stand up for your voice when they're in office?

[rayofreason]

61. This is ridiculous...

Kucinich speaks for a significant section of the Democratic party. He should be heard.

[NoodleyAppendage]

63. SUE. SUE. SUE. It's hightime to make the GE warmongers pay for their decades of bullsh*t.

This is the last straw. I'm donating $50 to the Kucinich campaign right now. He may not have a great chance at winning the Presidency, but I'll be damned if I'm going to let corporate warmongering propaganda masters further diminish his chances or any other American.

CHUCK TODD is an ass clown.

J

[peacetalksforall]

65. I vote - the three of them should cancel. They should stand down.

[orleans]

66. media assholes. n/t

[defendandprotect]

68. What of the reference to "dissenting positions" --- what does that mean???

[Janice325]

77. That totally sucks!!!

I wonder what Olbermann thinks.

[newburgh]

89. The Challenge: Any other candidate not boycotting this debate...

will not get my vote, even if they win this more and more fixed primary "race"...

This is not about Kucinich, this about corporate control. If the others are okay with that, then they don't get my vote.

[wundermaus]

140. I think you nailed it. - Spread the word!

We need to go viral with the message -

Boycott the NBC Debate!

Where as the M$M thinks it can dictate who the candidates by blocking viable candidates from participation are and not by the election process of citizens, be it resolved that We, The People of the Untied States will not participate in a corporate manipulated debate.

[km7368]

91. Not very democratic if you ask me

I commend our governmental system for its democratic values in many ways, but certain aspects of the presidential race far from uphold democratic ideals. The notion that you have to (in this case, it seems) be a front-runner with a viable chance at winning the nomination in order to even debate is, frankly, unfair. Personally, I want to and like hearing what the lesser known candidates have to say, what their positions are, if for no other reason than to compare them to the front-runners to get a better idea of who I'm voting for. When the media stifles the voice of a candidate presumably to cut costs and ensure more moderates, it makes me lose a little faith in the system I hold in such high regard.

[kevinbgoode]

93. Frankly, someone needs to remind NBC that their "debate"

is only carried by affiliates who have access to the public airwaves because of an obligation to serve the public. No one has elected or appointed NBC to decide which candidates the American people are entitled to hear - in my mind this act is an unwarranted interference with the election process.

Perhaps people should boycott viewing this "debate" and the conditions the network has set on dictating what ideas the American people are allowed to hear from their candidates for President. I am increasingly getting sick and tired of having some executive at a broadcasting network which exists because it uses the PUBLIC airwaves making decisions for me.

[AikidoSoul]

95. Thanks for the relavant post newbie!

Welcom to DU! :hi:

Where have you been?

[philly_bob]

101. I want to hear Kucinich. nt

[rudy23]

102. I guess they don't wan't to talk about impeachment in a prime time, Network debate

and a bunch of other stuff.

[Usrename]

103. They are trying their hardest to destroy this country.

Hell, they are destroying the world. What is wrong with these people?

[waterdancer]

104. Board of Directors of major media corporations who also sit on the boards of other Fortune 500 corps

Theyrule's information is somewhat outdated, but I've made a Board of Directors map there and added in some more current info.

For GE/NBC/Universal, I've got the following Board of Directors list with the other Fortune 500 companies which they also sit on the boards of-


Ralph S. Larsen- Xerox, AT&T Wireless
Robert W. Lane- Deere
Alan G. Lafley- Proctor & Gamble, General Motors
Claudio Gonzalez- Kimberly-Clark, Kellogg, Home Depot
Samuel A. Nunn- Chevron Texaco, Dell Computer, Coca-Cola
Andrea Jung- Avon Products
Kenneth G. Langone- Yum Brands, Home Depot
Roger S. Penske- Home Depot, Delphi, United Auto Group
Douglas A. Warner III- Anheuser-Busch, Motorola
James I. Cash- Microsoft

GE/NBC/Universal owns-
Vivendi, Universal Pictures, MSNBC, Bravo, CNBC, Telemundo, Pax TV, History Channel


http://www.theyrule.net/2004/index.php?mapid=5186

for how this one company fits into the bigger picture, see this map:

http://www.theyrule.net/2004/index.php?mapid=5182

Conspiracy? Nah. Nope. Just the ever expanding media mindspace monopoly.

[deacon]

105. and they are not trying to steer the election right? n/t

[TomClash]

108. Not fair

He's a comparatively "minor" candidate but he is still an elected representative of the people in Ohio 10. He has a constituency and he's not some private nutjob on a quest to hear his own voice. Plus, he actaully has something different to say.

Let him debate you corporate fascists.

[ashandaurynsgramma]

111. they wouldn't ask

him any questions anyway - They would avoid him - so he can say more about what he stands for during that time doing something else. I can't stand to watch those things and watch him stand there while the 'higher tier' candidates bicker over what color red they are.

[MuseRider]

112. Could someone please explain to me

why in the hell he is being lambasted for not signing an oath to vote for one of these people? They will not stand up for him but he is supposed to give up everything he stands for and vote for them?

[MaineDem]

114. Who, besides DK, says it's because of dissenting opinion?

This is from a DK website. They can say what they want.

A link at http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/nbc-disinvites-kucinich-from-debate-2008-01-11.html says "...NBC changed its criteria to focus the debate on the three candidates with a realistic shot of winning the nomination — Sens. Hillary Rodham Clinton (N.Y.), Barack Obama (Ill.) and former Sen. John Edwards (N.C.)."

[idiocracyhell]

116. GE Memo to NBC

"Exclude any candidate that supports NAFTA, the WTO, ending the war, universal not-for-profit healthcare, and any other changes that would threaten our global empire. We have polled our GE workers and MSM journalist, and have found the word "dissenting" to be particularly effective in this mindf**k of the masses."

[7 of 11]

117. t's all about the peoples choice and with...

Kuchichich's numbers so low it tell us that he is not the people's choice.

[Stump]

118. I don't really give a shit...

I've watched several debates already I think we all know exactly where every one of the candidates stands on the issues. I'll be so glad when we finally nominate someone and I pray we'll rally around whomever that may be.

[hayu_lol]

123. Before too many of you crash and burn, you might consider a different...

perspective on what you feel is exclusion of St Dennis.

In late December, we had 7 candidates running. Three dropped out after Iowa. Whether Dennis got one vote or 2000 votes in NH, he was automatically in 4th place. Using that for a ruler, it can be seen that Dennis did not earn a 4th place spot. Had Biden, Dodd, or Richardson stayed in the race, one of them would have qualified for 4th place.

This is another example of how St Dennis and his surrogates demand a free ride. And, his surrogates are now loudly and clearly demanding something for Dennis that he did not earn. In true Kucinich fashion, you are blaming everyone and everything else for his failures.

As to the comment about the oath that Dennis refused to sign to support the party nominee in the GE, Texas has had so much trouble with Repugnants changing to Dem in various districts, and Tom DeLay's gerrymandering, that the oath was necessary. Why, if this is the case, would Dennis refuse to support the eventual nominee? Can any of you whiners and complainers answer this one?

[lynnertic]

142. What are you in Junior High or something?

1. You don't know that others would have beat out Kucinich in NH since they didn't run.
2. DK was INVITED and then immediately UNINVITED. The thing he didn't earn was the spurn. (hehe channeling Cochran here but you're probably too young to know who he was)
3. Nobody should be required to sign an oath to support anyone. That's not what free and fair (and secret ballot) elections are about.

How old are you? What's with the namecalling?

[idiocracyhell]

175. Kucinich has integrity

Kucinich is the only candidate that didn't vote for the war or it's continued funding. If he signs an oath stating he'll support the Democratic nominee, he will have to support a candidate that voted for the war and it's continued funding. Dennis is a man of integrity. It would be unethical for him to support anyone that voted for something he passionately opposes.

GE is the parent company of NBC. Kucinich's platform threatens their global empire. This is a business decision, but NBC has no right to dictate what the public airwaves are uses for in our democratic process of electing our next president. They invited Kucinich, then 44 hours later, changed their criteria. This is a continuation of the MSM manipulating our election process.

For the majority of people supporting the other candidates, I can only surmise it's because they haven't taken the time to research Kucinich's platform or his record. He is by far the greatest candidate we have. He is the only real threat to the status quo, and that's why he is marginalized, ridiculed and excluded from debates.

[coalition_unwilling]

154. How do you plan to rally around Hillary when the blood of 1,000,000

dead Iraqi civilians is dripping off her hands? Or have you forgotten that she voted to authorize this crime against humanity?

Oh, right, Hillary says she was "misled". Were you "misled"???? Don't you want a Prez who isn't so easily misled? Kucinich wasn't misled, nor was Obama.

[Stump]

171. So if it is Hillary...

Are you saying I should vote Republican?

[ursi]

124. Only top three invited to be at Tuesday's debate (NV-D)

Source: Las Vegas Review-Journal



When Las Vegas and CNN played host to a Democratic presidential debate in November, seven candidates were on stage to participate.

At the Cashman Center Tuesday, that number will be three for a debate hosted by MSNBC. Sens. Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama, the two leading in the polls, will be joined by John Edwards, a former North Carolina senator.

Lackluster performances in the Iowa caucuses and New Hampshire primary are responsible for much of the attrition. Sens. Joe Biden and Christopher Dodd, along with New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson, dropped out the race after they were unable to win one delegate among them. Though Congressman Dennis Kucinich and former Sen. Mike Gravel have remained in the race despite equally dismal results, MSNBC did not ask them to participate in the debate.

Candidates must have attracted a "double-digit" percentage of the votes in Iowa and New Hampshire in order to participate, according to Jeremy Gaines, a network spokesman. "This is now our criteria," Gaines said.

Read more: http://www.lvrj.com/news/13729172.html

[Double T]

125. The media has far to much control over WHO we vote for and what THEY.........

want US to hear. That's what happens when General Electric (GE) is controlling the message.

[TriMetFan]

126. This is why The Women's League of Voters

should be the ones holding all the debate's.

[and-justice-for-all]

127. Why dont they put the DEMs and the Thugs...

in the same debate?...I want to see Huckabee get his ass handed to'em by Edwards.

[RC]

128. I think you just answered your own question.

[and-justice-for-all]

129. Oh yeah.....

because it will make all the rethuglican selectees look like SHIT. Sad.

[midnight]

130. I love that this is the new criteria. The dems only get three

candidates. How do the repubs. stand up to this new citeria?

[peace13]

133. And the criteria changes from day to day...go figure. n/t

[flordehinojos]

131. never trust timmy the potatoe russert, nor brian the boxing boy williams.

[RuleOfNah]

132. What is keeping the excluded candidates from holding their own debates?

Holding their own debates. Showing us how they would organize a country, on a small scale, including how they would get around this chronic mainstream media problem (by doing it).

How expensive is it to have a debate? C'mon! Excluded runners and some microphones, CC the feed, let the net handle the rest. It would cost less than one media buy, a tiny media buy!

I would prefer debates every day. Not the pampered format popular since Nixon went down. Real, what is goin' on debates, without nets.

:patriot:

[FREEWILL56]

163. Rethink that one for even if the MSM would go for it

it's alot more expensive than all of them together could afford for even a half an hour. NPR would be a possibility, but even they are starting to get strangled with corporate strings being pulled on them. The real question is what is stopping the Democratic party from halting the unfairness being levied against our candidates? Could it be corporate money?
edit to add:
Welcome to the DU.

[RuleOfNah]

185. INSTEAD of a media buy.

INSTEAD of giving money to Murdoch and Clear Channel and GE. Release the content and let the people do the rest. Torrents, house party viewings, movie theater rentals (they could use the revenue), street projections.

[rockybelt]

134. MSMSELECTING OUR CANDIDATES AGAIN nt

[IndianaGreen]

135. Why do you think that General Electric, NBC's parent company, would do this to Dennis?

It isn't Dennis that is a threat, it is the ideas the Dennis expresses that threaten the elites!

The Bushes and the Clintons are two ruling families vying for power, but they both represent the interests of the same ruling class. The last thing they need is for the American working class to wake up and realize how they have been manipulated, fragmented, and kept in a state of confusion by the powerful interests that control this country.

Dennis Kucinich may not be a threat to them, electorally speaking, but his ideas and his voice are a threat. This is why General Electric, through its subsidiary NBC, decided to keep Dennis off the upcoming Presidential debate.

[humbled_opinion]

136. Can't handle the truth..

Alert:smoke:

[robinlynne]

137. mother fuckers. If we had the time and Americans were awake, I would say picket lines are in order.

[Orsino]

139. And they'll peel away Edwards as soon as they dare, too.

There's always an excuse to silence Kucinich.

[cloudythescribbler]

141. I'm voting for Obama, but consider it a GROSS disservice to the public to exclude Kucinich ...

Over time, especially if Edwards drops out before Tsunami Tuesday, which many expect, if Kucinich stays in, his lone progressive voice should be able to attract at least 5% support nationally. At that point, what are the media going to do, move the goalposts yet again? I say that Kucinich supporters, and others like myself who feel he merits access to the television debates, should gather together our support, somewhere like the old activist corps that DU used to have, and systematically address this issue, with militant protest if necessary.

After all, it's hard enough to get anywhere as an authentic progressive in US politics .(Obama has to be extremely careful not to stray too far in that direction, facilitating a lot of the vitriol here on DU directed against him). I feel the same way about including Nader in the debates, although frankly, the excuse for excluding candidates in the primary elections is much weaker; partial victories can yield important leverage at political conventions, unlike a third party finish in the general.............

[boricua79]

144. of course they cut him off

he's the only one GUARANTEEING substantive policies and promises to change business as usual.

I guess we'll have to settle for private-insurance company provided "universal" insurance, as envisioned by Clinton, Obama, and Edwards.

meanwhile, Canada and Europe LAUGH at us.

[MuseRider]

147. Hell I laugh at us.

Democracy? Fuck no it isn't, hasn't been for a long while now but they are finally beginning to feel like they can get away with all this in the open now. What is next?

#1 huh? Yup, that is us.

[Dave From Canada]

146. The guy polls at 1% and that might be generous.. I don't see a problem with him not being included.

He's had several months to build support, and hasn't.

[DainBramaged]

148. Agreed, but his supporters want their pound of flesh

[peace13]

149. Not to be rude or anything but....

it is pretty hard to gain support when the corp owned media controls the show. We need Kucinich in the primaries to keep the other candidates focused on the issues. He may never get 51% but he is important here. Please know that Canada is not immune from the problems that America is facing now. Keep a diligent watch as your Conservatives follow in the path of our thieving, lying, murdering Republicans. Your freedoms will fall shortly after ours. Too sad.

[IndianaGreen]

155. Ron Paul polls higher than Fred Thompson, yet Fox excluded him from debate

The pattern is to shutout voices that express views not approved of by the establishment of both parties.

[lovuian]

157. so New Hampshire and Iowa are the deciders

this is a Agenda by the Corporations
I am shocked at NBC

ABC NBC AND FOX SUCK

[Desertrose]

158. The "game continues"...must sure be afraid of DK's message....

or why else bother to eliminate the one voice who speaks the truth......

[Jamastiene]

159. Well, that's just wrong.

So, we are going to be stuck with just those three choices in the primaries because NBC found a way to cancel him out too. Geez, don't they cancel enough good shows already without canceling someone out of the debates. This sucks.

[man4allcats]

162. Texas unplugged DK too - from the primary,

and it was Texas Democrats who unplugged him:

January 11, 2008

U.S. District Judge Lee Yeakel of Austin today ruled against Dennis Kucinich's bid to get on the Democratic presidential primary ballot in Texas. State party officials excluded Kucinich from the March 4 ballot because he had refused to sign a pledge to support all Democratic nominees. Yeakel upheld the party's decision.

Yeakel ruled that the Texas Democratic Party's right to set rules about who can associate with it outweighed Kucinich's free speech rights.

More here

[idiocracyhell]

176. Texas is Bush's home state

Bush and his billionaire buddies live in Texas. Don't think they don't have influence on the judicial process in the good ol' boy state. With Kucinich introducing articles of impeachment against Cheney, and saying Bush is next, I think this is good old fashioned payback from the cowboys in Texas.

[man4allcats]

180. But again, note that in this case

the cowboys are the Democrats. Judge Yeakel ruled against Kucinich and in favor of the Texas Democratic Party. Kucinich supporter Willie Nelson brought the suit to force the defendants, the Texas Democratic Party, to put plaintiff Kucinich on the Democratic primary ballot. The party based its refusal to do so on the basis of Kucinich's refusal to sign a loyalty oath to support all Democratic nominees.

From the article:

Kucinich had signed the oath in his 2004 presidential bid but refused to do so this time. The oath would have required him to promise to "fully" support the party's presidential nominee if it was someone other than himself.

Kucinich attorney Donald McTigue of Columbus, Ohio, said the difference this time is the war in Iraq is much more prominent and that Kucinich did not want to back a nominee who would not promise to pull out of Iraq.

Democratic attorney Chad Dunn told Yeakel that the oath is not legally enforceable so anyone who signed it would be bound only by their own conscience (my emphasis) to abide by it.

So, if you're a person of conscience as DK is, then the Texas Democratic Party isn't going to risk putting you on their ballot. Almost reads like a bumper sticker: Texas Democrats - No Progressives Need Apply.

[idiocracyhell]

188. Ruling for the Texas Democratic Party

to exclude Kucinich is what the Texas GOP buddies of Bush want. Kucinich is the only real threat to the status quo. If he's elected and implements single payer not-for-profit healthcare, it will cost the insurance companies billions in lost revenue. Kucinich wants out of NAFTA and the WTO which would threaten the global empire of many corporations, including GE, the parent company of NBC who excluded Kucinich from the debates in Vegas.

The ruling in Texas is just an extension of the power of corporate America to poison our democracy so they can maintain their wealth and power.

[fascisthunter]

186. And Some Hillary Supporters Defend What Texas Did

[idiocracyhell]

189. I believe it

Hillary is proven to be Bush-Lite. If you look at opensecrets.org, it's clear where Hillary's loyalties will lie if elected president.

[donkeyotay]

172. Between congratulations and sayonara, between Jan 9 and 11th

The Chamber of Commerce declared war on populism. Could be a coincidence, but I'll go out on this limb and say that before this election is over KO is going to have to decide how far he can compromise. I'm sure he's gotten the memo that defense contractors should be allowed to decide who gets to pretend they're running the country. The PTB want the peasants to sit down and shut up.

[martymar64]

174. FUCK NBC!!!

Rule changing cocksuckers!
Their programming sucks and they've proved themselves to be fascism loving motherfuckers.

Time to boycott any company that advertises on NBC.

[lovuian]

177. I called and heres the number

PHONE NBC- 212 664 4444
phone often.
email them @ [e-mail]
SUBJECT LINE: LET DENNIS DEBATE
oh and the DNC

PHONE the DNC: 202 863 8000

[Desertrose]

182. Done..again...thx n/t

[ProudDad]

183. Can't have any non-corporate tools

contributing their 2 minutes of Truth to the 88 minutes of bullshit the corporate capitalist masters have programmed for you!

[idiocracyhell]

190. Well said

Even if Kucinich was allowed to debate, he'd receive about two minutes of airtime. MSM are corporate puppets, and Kucinich is the only real threat to corporate power and wealth.