CIA chief to drag White House into torture cover-up storm

[maddezmom]

Source: Times online

THE CIA chief who ordered the destruction of secret videotapes recording the harsh interrogation of two top Al-Qaeda suspects has indicated he may seek immunity from prosecution in exchange for testifying before the House intelligence committee.

Jose Rodriguez, former head of the CIA’s clandestine service, is determined not to become the fall guy in the controversy over the CIA’s use of torture, according to intelligence sources.

It has emerged that at least four White House staff were approached for advice about the tapes, including David Addington, a senior aide to Dick Cheney, the vice-president, but none has admitted to recommending their destruction.

Vincent Cannistraro, former head of counterterrorism at the CIA, said it was impossible for Rodriguez to have acted on his own: “If everybody was against the decision, why in the world would Jose Rodriguez – one of the most cautious men I have ever met – have gone ahead and destroyed them?”

The tapes recorded the interrogations of Abu Zubaydah and Abd al-Rahim al-Nashiri, two suspected Al-Qaeda leaders, over hundreds of hours while they were held in secret “ghost” prisons. According to testimony from a former CIA officer, Zubaydah was subjected to waterboarding, a form of torture that simulates drowning, and “broke” after 35 seconds. He is believed to have been interrogated in Thailand. The tapes were destroyed in 2005. Both men are now held in Guantanamo Bay.



Read more: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article3087293.ece

[Beetwasher]

1. CIA Vs. Bushco.=Clash Of The Titans

They're going to the mat.

[Fovea]

26. And the current generation of CIA admins hand

A big warm bowl of fuck you to Poppy Bush.

[EFerrari]

55. To Cheney and Addington.

Buckle up!

[xchrom]

2. WHEEEEE!!!

:woohoo:

[acmavm]

3. Good. Whereas there are some things that are just a given (like White

House involvement) proof is always a wonderful thing to have. It makes it harder for that 25% (or whatever proportion) of idiots in this country to justify their support of a bunch of criminals that are running this country.

Although it also makes it impossible for some of us to support certain democrats who were in on the 'torture' secret long before the rest of us were told about it.

[WillyT]

15. Hell... That 25% STILL Doesn't Believe Valerie Plame Was A Covert Operative...

despite all sorts of proof.

That 25% has a firewall for facts and reality.

:shrug:

[Thor_MN]

4. Make the immunity contingent on a conviction of war crimes against white house officials.

Do not give a blanket immunity or his testimony will evaporate to a series of "I don't recall having any recollection of remembering that I had any memories of those events."

[Shipwack]

45. Exactly my thought, except....

I have a sneaking suspicion that they are going to do that anyway, if not outright saying they destroyed the tapes on their own and that Bush and company had nothing to do with it.

[sellitman]

5. Time to slime Rodrieguez.

Like clock work the Whitehouse spin meisters will be digging up all the dirt they can on this guy. I expect Rush to have breaking info on Monday.

Its just the way they work.

[zabet]

6. This could get real interesting..

the CIA has been playing dirty
longer than current administration.

[Lugnut]

41. My money is on the CIA

I hope it gets darn interesting and soon.

[zabet]

42. Dollar to a doughnut

the CIA kicks the
White House's ass
without overtime.
;)

[Thor_MN]

48. There's a saying that *'s economy is destroying.

Getting to be a dollar vs. a doughnut is a even bet.

[nikto]

59. Wow...

That's a truly scary thought.

Sounds so...Soviet.

[bemildred]

7. It would be just excellent if Addington got enmeshed in this. nt

[SpiralHawk]

8. "It's true. Me and my cronies are guilty." - Commander AWOL

"We doubtless deserve the same EVIL treatment we have been handing out. Go ahead. Punish us. Ever since official Bush White House Male Prostitute and B & D republicon kinkster Jeff Gannon started hanging out with us, we have become devotees of 'punishment.' Smirk, smirk, smirk."

- Commander AWOL

[fascisthunter]

9. Who Was It That Said Something Like This:

"What is about to happen in this country is like tectonic plates shifting".

It's not an exact quote but it's close to what I remember hearing an ex cia official say. This was 4 years ago if I remember correctly.

[Jackpine Radical]

36. Actually, that may have been Josh Marshall iirc.

[fascisthunter]

66. I Think It Was Josh Marshall

his name does ring a bell.

[wordpix]

49. Let's hope those tectonic plates shift soon.

[Brrrp]

10. Every step forward always looks bigger than it really is.

And ever Congressional investigation after Watergate has been a coverup.

[Joe Chi Minh]

11. Patience. Everything takes time.

[Brrrp]

14. You will wait forever. Every Congressional investigation is a coverup.

[nashville_brook]

12. (off to Greatest you go) glad that British journos caught this story... it's not like

the MSM in the US is going to report it, i suppose.

[ptolle]

19. irony

I agree that it's excellent that any journos caught this, but the irony to me is that it's British journos working for a now Murdoch rag.The thing that remains to be seen, as pointed out earlier, is whether this gets picked up and carried any further.Recall how the downing street memo seemed to sink like the titanic after the initial revelations.IMO you may be sure that the busheviks and the SCLM will do their best to bury this along with the revelations that the CIA may have withheld evidence from the 9/11 commission.

[nashville_brook]

27. for reals.

[Fiendish Thingy]

13. Sounds like a hint for a Christmas pardon n/t

[KoKo]

16. Kick and Recommend.....

[rodeodance]

17. I would love to see this day when he is granted immunity and squeels on BUCHCO!!

[rodeodance]

18. WHO WILL BE THE 'LIBBY' THIS TIME?????????

[wordpix]

50. the difference is, Rodriguez is no WH stooge, he's CIA

so that could get very interesting very quickly :evilgrin:

[NoodleyAppendage]

20. Sound advice. Stay out of small planes and avoid tea at sushi restaurants.

If Rodriguez is going to flip on the BFEE, then he may very well be a marked man. Odds are this "chatter" is just a means to buy some hush money and comfort from the criminals in chief and soon we'll be hearing that Rodriguez is either going to fall on the sword or doesn't remember anything.

J

[Stalwart]

35. Power of Fear

While immunity may protect from what the law might do, there is nothing like old fashion fear to influence things.

The fear of prosecution that immunity might remove simply has to be overcome by a greater fear of something that cannot be avoided.

How can they let anyone get away with telling the truth when the soft tools can't prevent? What he might say emboldens others?

In some dark, secret way an example has to be made. I fear for his life and well being but doubt that any direct physical action will be taken. They are more sophisticated than that. If they are good at making an example out of him we will never know it but those for which the example is set will certainly know it.

No records, no tapes.

[formercia]

21. I hope this doesn't turn into an Ollie North moment.

He was granted immunity, said he did it the thumbed his nose at Justice. Poppy gave everyone a pardon, including himself,and they high-fived each other as they exited stage right.

[wordpix]

51. yes but where there's a free press via the internet, there's more hope this time

Trying to hang onto hope, here. :grouphug:

[formercia]

64. The World is watching.

I watched Ollie North testify before Congress, knowing all to well a lot of what really happened. I was there. I had to participate, even though I had made the case to my superiors that it was illegal and that "When Congress gets wind of this, they are going to cut our balls off." That was in January of 1982, long before the World became aware of what was going on.

I also watched in horror as they got away with it, but then I had literally seen them get away with Murder.

[susu369]

22. Opps - there goes that medal

Linda Chavez wanted to give him. Guessing Tony Blankley is wiping egg off his face about now.

:evilgrin:

[whistle]

23. Here we go people, turn up the volume and hold onto your socks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjYhTnh6Zaw

[grahamhgreen]

24. I can't imagine copies are the original tapes were not made, especially digitally...

After all, these are the days of youtube.

If somebody digitized these tapes, they could be lurking anywhere....

It would be a good idea to track the exact movements of these tapes from the second they were removed from the camera.

[wordpix]

52. wondering the same---and someone might have wanted to keep them for personal files

[Joanne98]

25. Has the House Intell Committee responded yet?

[AllyCat]

28. They'll grant immunity. He'll testify. Nothing will happen

This Congress won't do jack $hit to stop this administration from anything. They are a pack of complicit criminals with a few sensible ones thrown in that are constantly painted as "radicals".

Sorry. I just can't get excited about any of this anymore.

[LeFleur1]

68. Exactly

"These people" have broken every law imaginable as far as our Constitution is concerned, they have thumbed their noses at International Law. I'm afraid they'll get away with it. They haven't been carted off to jail yet, and I don't think they ever will be. But it would be a sweet sight to see them kicking, screaming and crying their eyes out as they are led away, wouldn't it?

[rateyes]

29. Rodriguez better lay low and stay out of sight in a secure location

until time to testify. Better stay off aircraft, too.

The committee needs to meet and grant immunity NOW.

[boricua79]

30. oh please please please...somebody get this little bird a microphone!

it's ready to sing!!!!!!!

Finally, an administration hack that's not willing to be a fall guy like Libby and the others.

Sing me a tune, Mr. Rodriguez...sing me a beautiful impeachment-worthy tune!

[MetaTrope]

31. Sure is nice to see that citizens of Great Britain get to read this story

Maybe they can pass the news along to their American friends.

[debbierlus]

32. Good. He is scum, but it is more important to expose the whole administration

And, he knows damn well that everyone is a sacrificial lamb for Bush & Cheney.

[ScooterFibby]

33. The CIA isn't going to take another beating here

I'm sure there are politics within the CIA, but as an organization they've taken a lot of blame.

The CIA is blamed for Iraq, for the "failure of intelligence" BS.

They knew, and communicated what they knew, with appropriate qualifiers. The Bushies just wanted to go to war with Iraq.

They aren't going to be the fall guy again.

[wordpix]

53. I would think CIA is still pissed at the Plame outing

They should be, anyhow. :shrug:

[femrap]

34. Can we impeach now?

Just hold the damn hearings and we can have the CIA testify then.

[lovuian]

37. I think the CIA has had it

as well as the millitary

[99th_Monkey]

43. That's my take too.. Mukasey should join them soon if he has any sense ... or

else Shumer and whoever that other Senator was who "recommended" Mukasey should lead the charge to
force him to uphold the law or resign.

[jamesinca]

58. that other Senator is my other Senator

the malignant bitch Dianne Feinstein.

[DavidMS]

38. This all should be premature.

Let the Judge finish hauling people up to the bench and figuring out who violated his order and then hold hearings. I always thought that federal judges whose court orders were ignored were much scarier than congregational committees.

[truthisfreedom]

39. Hey José! Stay out of small planes!

Stay off the phone as well as the internet.

[brentspeak]

40. The headline contradicts the article

Headline says that Rodriguez will testify; the body of the article says that he may testify.

So, so far, this is just rumor, British-tabloid style.

[bluesmail]

44. KICK & RECOMMEND

[ejbr]

46. One doesn't need immunity from this lame ass congress n/t

[Divernan]

65. Witnesses need immunity from subsequent criminal prosecution -

not immunity from Congress. Hence the catchphrase: "I decline to answer on the grounds that it may tend to incriminate me." Testimony under oath may be used in subsequent civil OR criminal actions.
From Wikipedia:
"Civil or criminal proceedings
Fifth Amendment protections apply wherever and whenever an individual is compelled to testify. The U.S. Supreme Court has ruled that the right against self-incrimination applies whether the witness is in Federal or state court (see Malloy v. Hogan, 378 U.S. 1 (1964)), and whether the proceeding itself is criminal or civil (see McCarthy v. Arndstein, 266 U.S. 34 (1924)).

People have asserted the right in grand jury or in congressional hearings in the 1950s, where witnesses testifying before the House Committee on Un-American Activities or the Senate Internal Security Subcommittee claimed the right in response to questions concerning their alleged membership in the Communist Party. However, due to the Red Scare hysteria of the times, frequently referred to as McCarthyism, people who have asserted the right were popularly seen as guilty as accused, and sometimes referred to as "Fifth Amendment Communists"; people have lost their jobs, lost their leadership positions in union or political organizations, or had other negative repercussions after "taking the fifth." Senator Joseph McCarthy (R-Wisc.) was famous for his question, "Are you now, or have you ever been a member of the Communist party," while he was chairman of the Senate Government Operations Committee Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations. Even admitting to previous Communist party membership was not sufficient; people were also required to "name names," that is, to implicate others they knew to be Communists or who had been Communists in the past. For example, Academy Award winning director Elia Kazan testified before the House Committee on Un-American Activities that he had belonged to the Communist party briefly in his youth; in addition, he "named names," which earned him the enmity of many in Hollywood. Other entertainment professionals, such as Zero Mostel, found themselves on a Hollywood Blacklist after taking the fifth, and were unable to find work for some period afterwards in the entertainment industry."

The amendment has also been used by defendants and witnesses in criminal cases involving the Mafia. The Supreme Court has also used the incorporation doctrine to apply the self-incrimination clause against the states under the Fourteenth Amendment.

[ejbr]

67. Oh...I see. n/t

[Android3.14]

47. They'll get 'em this time, by jiminy!

It's not going to be like alllllll those other times. Nope. The Democrats have been keeping their powder dry for just this moment. You watch, all you worn out cynical patriots. The system is going to work fer shur this time.

Gore kept the powder dry, Kerry kept it dry, Edwards powered up the dehumidifier, and Pelosi has kept the powder so dry it sucks the moisture right out of her eyes, and we can all remember Merry Fitzmas.

Gosh, I am...like...so thrilled to see this administration finally get what it deserves. In fact, I am going to invest in champagne and cigars just so I can cheer and light one up just like a proud daddy when they finally haul Bush off to jail.

/sarcasm

[Swagman]

54. yeh he better worry because that's what's coming for him

but maybe the CIA will do in the White House.

[humbled_opinion]

56. Ooh Pop the Popcorn...

:popcorn:

[FlyingSquirrel]

57. Gee... I wonder who will take the heat then. ADDINGTON?

Duh.

Anyone but Cheney or Bush. Or Condi.

:banghead:

Oh well... might as well sit back and enjoy whatever happens.

:popcorn:

[Fovea]

61. Having commuted Scooter

the Bushies think Congress hath no sting, or unemployment any victory.

These boyz in the exec think they are the all highest.
Truth is, Cheney's prowess with a shotgun is small beans compared to what the CIA has in its arsenal.

I think they may experience a rude shock to the system as they are re-introduced to the reality based community with a resounding smack.

[LaStrega]

60. putting it lightly?

"Silvestre Reyes, a Democrat who is chairing the committee, has said he was “not looking for scapegoats” – a hint to Rodriguez that he would like him to talk."

Would *like* him to talk? Understatement much?

[woundedkarma]

62. My completely made up timeline :)

OKay so...

Plame gets outed by the white house.

The CIA finally wisens up and decides to fight back and stops delaying the NIE. (they said the WH ran out of political muscle in the intelligence agencies that they were using to hold the report back for more than a year already)

The White House(anyone know where the tape information first got leaked????) leaks the tape information in the hopes it will hit the CIA where it hurts and frame them for the whole torture scandal.

The CIA points out it was TOLD to destroy the tapes by the White House.

It might be my imagination here but it DOES seem like there's a war going on between the White House and the CIA. The WH has been trying to screw the CIA a lot lately and umm... it's a mistake if you ask me.

Until Plame got outed... I think the CIA was still happy to be in league with Bushco.. simply cause his father and Cheney. NOW however, first they blamed a lack of intelligence of 911 on the intelligence community. Then they betray a covert agent. Now the tapes and the WH may not have leaked the information but they sure as heck aren't standing up for the CIA... in fact they're pointing all fingers at them.

I think this is a good thing if the CIA has finally realized that Bush is willing to attack even his best allies to keep himself safe.

[DemReadingDU]

63. Check out emptywheel's timeline

Emptywheel, aka Marcy Wheeler, is the best at putting together timelines...

http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/22/recycling-torture-timelines/

[Subdivisions]

69. If he sings, it's going to be one delicious song! n/t

[goclark]

70. Who is guarding this man 24 /7 nt