Conservatives simmer as spending mushrooms under Bush

[dave29]

Meanwhile in GOP land....

http://usatoday.printthis.clickability.com/pt/cpt?action=cpt&title=USATODAY.com+-+Conservatives+simmer+as+spending+mushrooms+under+Bush&expire=&urlID=8709516&fb=Y&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.usatoday.com%2Fnews%2Fwashington%2F2004-01-05-bush-spending_x.htm&partnerID=1660

What has vexed conservatives most is the 31.5% growth since Bush took office in discretionary spending. That is the one-third of the budget lawmakers approve annually for defense, domestic security, school aid and everything else except Social Security and other benefits.

Such spending grew by an annual average of 3.4% during Clinton's eight years.

Further infuriating conservatives, Bush and the Republican-run Congress have enacted a $400 billion, 10-year enlargement of Medicare; $87 billion in expanded benefits for farmers; and $40 billion for increased veterans' payments and the Air Force's leasing and buying of refueling tankers.

"Re-election has become the focus of Republicans in the White House and Congress. And those in power have determined the road to staying in power is paved with government spending," said Brian Riedl, who monitors the budget for the conservative Heritage Foundation.

And the net result... depressed voter turnout from the hardcore conservatives who feel burned - or a whole new set of fiscally conservative Republicans who are more inclined to be socially liberal turned on by centrist candidates who balance budgets ;)

[POed_Ex_Repub]

1. Now all we need is a conservative to run as an independant

Run on the economic issues budget/outsourcing and split the vote. :evilgrin:

[alapolitical]

5. We should not pander to the conservative right

I live in the midst of the red zone and interact with many conservatives on a daily basis. This group is constituted of some of the most socially and intellectually devoid people in the country. Please, let's not push the party further right by throwing these people a bone.

[dave29]

7. Repeat after me

BIG TENT PARTY

If we help them get a better education - and to stop voting against their economic best interest, they may not scare you so much in the future. However, these are not the folks we're talking about in this scenario - these are intellectual fiscal conservatives - who are hardliners on spending. I myself am somewhat fiscally conservative, although I'm more socially liberal than Ghandi ;)

[Stuckinthebush]

14. Hi, alapolitical!

You do indeed live in the midst of the Red Zone! Jasper! e-gads!

I'm a few miles south of ya in B'ham. Glad to have you on board DU.

[WannaJumpMyScooter]

2. Now this is good news. Perhaps we can make inroads with

this bunch. It has happened before.

[LuminousX]

4. Well, presenting a fiscally conservative agenda might be the ticket

to winning their support.

I hate the politics of voter suppression (i.e. making the candidate look so bad that that candidate's supporters just stay home) but I think it may be a factor of Bush in 2004. People who don't despise him may not vote for him because they don't necessarily like him either.

[H2O Man]

8. Hit your enemy where it hurts: his weak spot!

Look, there are thousands of fiscal conservatives in this country who are very upset by what this administration is doing to the economy. A person who owns a small business, for example, may have conservative views about public spending. Bush is the big spender! Can't deny it, can they? Jobs are going over-seas. Can't deny it. Unemployed neighbors can't shop with their small business. Remember: bush is destroying all of America.
One of the things that I am thinking that many of the Dean supporters do not fully appreciate is that my generation (older hippies & YIPPIES!) started to grow fat and bald, and were morphing into our parents. You young people have served as a moral alarm clock! A lot of people my age are starting to believe again!
See, when the election was taken from Gore, and given to that slime of an administration, for folks my age, it was as hard a blow as was Watergate to my father. He didn't support Nixon (my family is FDR-Kennedy style democrat)but it blew his mind that the system he believed in was so corrupt! Same deal in 2000.
Now, I don't mean everyone my age had gone into hibernation. But most have. And you young people, with your energy, have woke the nation up!
Thank you. But be patient! Not everyone supports Dean. It doesn't mean that we aren't on the same team, though. Let's keep discussing issues, even have heated debates. But no name-calling, no insults, and no hurting other peoples' feelings. Be civil.

[joeunderdog]

12. This is the Bush Achilles for voters not going to the polls

Don't beleive the polls--people who have spent their lives demanding to pay less for taxes and have more money for themselves won't be fooled into not noticing their tax breaks go to the Rich and their jobs go to India. Check your portfolio lately? Up alot recently, but still down 30-50% in the Bush term. People can still count. I have a RW friend who won't vote for Bush. Dubya's seen as reckless and liberal by true conservatives. They might not vote for a Dem, but they might just stay home. They're mad too.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/12/11/opinion/meyer/main588015.shtml

[WannaJumpMyScooter]

16. exactly. as we know, it will be another close vote, everyone

who otherwise would have, does not vote, or decides (for whatever reason) to vote against * is as good as another vote for the Democratic Candidate.

[Richardo]

3. Mmm - simmering mushrooms....

*gggorgle gorgle*

[underpants]

24. Actually mushrooms might explain a lot of what is going on

There has to be SOME explanation

[cthrumatrix]

6. share this with your repug friends ..... appeal to their "wants"

repugs hate to hear these facts.

[demsrule.com]

9. and we are supposed to be the "spenders"

My first post here. Glad to be aboard. I love how my conservative friends say democrats tax and spend. Seems like Bush likes to cut taxes and spend. Those two don't equate to a balanced budget as we can see from our current situation. I fear though that if he gets re-elected he will not care about spending and start cutting funds to much needed social programs. Any thoughts on what/ if any programs need to be cut or do we just need to raise taxes on the filthy rich and make them pay their fair share!

[Indiana_Dem]

10. Welcome to DU!

I'm fairly new, too, but I'm addicted!

I think, herein, lies the key. We need someone like Pat Buchanan to run and bring these issues up and it will split their vote!

I'm a fiscal conservative myself as I think taxes will have to be raised in the future because of the combined retired babyboomers and federal deficit. This will cause many programs like SS to be at risk. So we either raise taxes (repeal the cuts) now or we will face HUGE tax increases in about 10-13 years.

Another thing I've pondered...(looking at the large scale of things)...since we are currently paying as we go for Social Security benefits for the ones receiving SS now, how on earth will those that follow the babyboomers be able to support SS for them? My thought: I just read an article in my local paper that although there have been millions of job losses currently, they say there will be a labor shortage in the future as the babyboomers retire. I think this is why immigration is an important factor. They could make up for the shortage and be able to make up for the taxes needed to support SS and Medicare and the like. The only hangup would be that they can go back to their country and still collect on what they've paid into the system if they wish. I think this is a law now. Immigrant taxpayer support could pick up the slack into the future for our federally funded programs.

Sorry to go off on a tangent but I've been thinking about how this will all work in the future.

[snippy]

11. You should point out to your conservative friends that republican

presidents are the big spenders. Of the $3.3 trillion in total federal deficits accumulated since 1960, about $3 trillion was accumulated under a republican president's budget. The federal deficit has exceeded 3% of GDP 13 times ( not counting last year) in that time and every time it was under a republican president.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/fy2004/sheets/hist01z3.xls

Welcome to DU.

[GRClarkesq]

13. Fiscal conservative means different things

to some more just a balanced budget, to the intellectual fiscal conservatives that government should spend less and do less.

The balanced budget types might be approachable, but the hardcore "movement" conservatives will never believe the Democrat party will spend less than the Republicans. See the prescription drig plan as an example.

[BadGimp]

15. Not since Bush I: "not ...since 1989 to 1991."

"That is up from $1.86 trillion in President Clinton's final year, a rate of growth not seen for any three-year period since 1989 to 1991."

[leesa]

17. spending usually skyrockets with Repubs....they just don't count

military spending and the corporate welfare for the rich.

[wildwww2]

18. Killing Iraqi`s for what Saudi`s did to us takes alot of our tax dollars.

You are so correct about the Repubs. They just have to feed the war machine and their corporate contributors. They are addicts like Rush.
Peace
Wildman
Al Gore is My President

[2cents]

19. It's really an election year puff piece for dopey

imo, it's meant to deflect the "right wing lunatic" label.

[stickdog]

20. Dean will attack Bush from the right on his out of control credit card

spending.

He will also attack Bush from the center on the Bush adminstration's record graft & inefficiency.

I know several hardcore Conservatives who say they're voting Libertarian.

And I know quite a few Republicans (as opposed to Repukes) who are voting Dean because fiscal responsibility is their number one issue.

[revcarol]

21. Are they willing to wait until the 6th or 7th year of his

Presidency? LOL

[stickdog]

29. What they're not willing to wait for is the 6th or 7th year of Bush's. n/t

[dusty64]

22. Taxcuts for the superwealthy

and spend rethugs are at it again. After four years of poppy and another of chimp sandwiched by eight prosperous years under Clinton, how does anyone still buy the fallacy that rethugs are good for the economy?

[dusty64]

23. Kick!

:kick:

[loudsue]

25. How?

"how does anyone still buy the fallacy that rethugs are good for the economy?"

Because the ones that truly benefit are among those who own the media. Therefore, the masses are told the same lie 24/7 over the airwaves.

:kick:

[cthrumatrix]

27. let's have the repugs talk about this "factoid".....they stay away from

facts which show exactly what they voted against when they elected shrub...

[Norquist Nemesis]

26. How?

Because they keep listening to repukes like Hannity that spew things like "the Clinton-Gore recession." That one's beginning to be ingrained in their brains and they forget the prosperous years so quickly. They have to blame somebody for the situation we're in and the road we're going down...it just can't be a conservative or republican administration. *idiots supremo*

[snippy]

28. They also talk about the Bush recovery which began this summer.

But we are in the tenth quarter of this recovery.