Venezuela Opposition Fights Chavez Constitution, Universal Says

[Judi Lynn]

Source: Bloomberg (quoting opposition paper)

Venezuela Opposition Fights Chavez Constitution, Universal Says

By Theresa Bradley

Aug. 28 (Bloomberg) -- Venezuelan opposition leader Manuel Rosales unveiled plans to form 130,000 local teams to campaign against President Hugo Chavez's proposed revisions to the nation's 1999 constitution, El Universal reported.

Rosales, governor of the oil-rich Zulia state, urged Chavez to let voters pass on each of the 33 proposed changes separately, or at least in two political and social categories, rather than bundling them together with popular plans to boost social security or reduce the workweek, the newspaper said.

Chavez last weekend threatened to withdraw his entire proposal if the legislature or elections board alloweds voting on anything other than the entire package, the newspaper said. The new constitution, which would eliminate presidential term limits and redefine private and ``social'' property, was unveiled Aug. 15 and faces popular referendum late this year.

Rosales, head of the A New Time party, who took 37 percent of the vote in losing to Chavez in December, didn't deny that Chavez's opponents may boycott that referendum, but urged them not to ``hide or stay at home,'' the newspaper said.



Read more: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601086&sid=aUayhc2KkUwQ&refer=latin_america

---

You may recall it's the OPPOSITION which is given to boycotting voting, not the Chavez supporters. Chalk this up to the source, El Universal, whose owner, Andrés Mata, was a heavy coup participant.

[David__77]

1. Rosales can eat dirt!

I'm sure his masters in Washington are feeding him his political line. The fascists know they cannot win this fight at the ballot box, try as they may.

[LaPera]

2. Fuck Rosales! VIVA Chavez - Offers Billions of dollars to Latin America countries....Bravo Chavez!

Laid-off Brazilian factory workers have their jobs back, Nicaraguan farmers are getting low-interest loans and Bolivian mayors can afford new health clinics, all thanks to Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez.

Bolstered by windfall oil profits, Chavez's government is now offering more direct state funding to Latin America and the Caribbean than the United States. A tally by The Associated Press shows Venezuela has pledged more than $8.8 billion in aid, financing and energy funding so far this year.

While the most recent figures available from Washington show $3 billion in U.S. grants and loans reached the region in 2005, it isn't known how much of the Venezuelan money has actually been delivered. And Chavez's spending abroad doesn't come close to the overall volume of U.S. private investment and trade in Latin America.

But in terms of direct government funding, the scale of Venezuela's commitments is unprecedented for a Latin American country.

Chavez's largesse tends to benefit left-leaning nations that support his vision of a Latin America with greater independence from the United States. But he denies the two countries are in a competition.

"We don't want to compete with anyone. I wish the United States were 100 times above us," Chavez told the AP in a recent interview. "But no, the U.S. government views the region in a marginal way. What they offer is a pittance sometimes, and with unacceptable pressures that at times countries can't accept."

U.S. aid tends to be low-profile, constrained by strict guidelines.

Venezuela offers money with few strings attached and a personal Chavez touch that aid experts say generates more good will dollar for dollar.

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=3525581

[Judi Lynn]

3. "few strings attached." Oh, that's a HOT one, isn't it? How are we supposed to forget

that in elections in South America and Central America since _Bush has been squating in the White House, he has had his people meddling in EVERY goddamned election without exception, offering inducements for pro-_Bush votes, and THREATS to the countries if they dared to vote in candidates who are left-wing.

We've heard about this over and over and over, that is, those of us who have been keeping track of things. You may remember he used the information that Evo Morales in Bolivia was undoubtedly going to win by a hefty margin in the approaching election in 2006, and went directly to the Bolivian upper echelon military officers, through Rumsfeld, and had them destroy some missiles which Bolivia had been keeping. He did it because he knew Morales wouldn't allow it if he were the President.

In other small countries, he threatened he would make it impossible for their citizens who are living and working here to send home remittances: he even sent Jeb down to Nicaragua, or some other Central American country to tell them in person.

"NO STRINGS ATTACHED." Oh, someone shoot me. How much disgust can we live with?

To echo DU'er LaPara, DITTO THAT "VIVA CHAVEZ."

[sabbat hunter]

4. if he is pro democracy

then Chavez should allow the items to be voted on seperately. If they are popular as he says, they will pass.

Chavez says if they don't allow the entire package to be voted on as one large item, then he will pull the entire thing. (it does include positive items such as SS and a 6 hour work day)

What is Chavez's fear of voting on each item instead of as a package?

[Judi Lynn]

5. The people will be voting on this in a referendum. Didn't you know that? n/t

[sabbat hunter]

6. yes I did

they are voting on a whole slew of changes, some of which gather more power to Chavez from the states.

Why not have each item voted on seperately?

[Judi Lynn]

8. Maybe you should do a little research into that. Sounds like a good project for someone with some

time. Be sure to remember DU'ers are very well aware of the right-wing spin in our corporate media, have been for a very long time.

Good luck.

[sabbat hunter]

9. ok so you have

No problem with the referendum including provisions that take power away from the states and to Chavez.

What is wrong with voting on each item separately, please answer the question.

[David__77]

10. If Rosales wants that, he can go to congress to propose it.

Chavez supports all these changes, as do his supporters, so naturally they want to optimize the chances that they are all passed. It's not someone's job to do their opponents' work for them. One campaign is easier to manage than many campaigns. But Rosales can campaign to elect his supporters to congress, who can do exactly what he's proposing. This is democracy in action.

[paulk]

13. since Congress is controlled by 100% Chavez supporters

you know what the outcome will be. You can call that "democracy in action" if you want, but a large number of Venezuelans are not being represented. The essence of democracy is not just majority rule, it's majority rule while protecting the rights of minorities. The ham handed way Chavez has been going about things is hardly democratic as it's generally understood. In the long run it's a recipe for, at the least, social unrest.

The idea of splitting the vote into three is not unreasonable.

[David__77]

15. You mean Chavez supporters democratically won every seat in congress?

If people abdicate their participation in the democracy, it's a little whiny when they come back and nit pick over technical process. Again, if they want to amend the constitution in a certain way, they can propose it through the democratic means that are provided to them under the existing constitution. They are also free to campaign against the changes proposed by the Chavez supporters. If their proposal to split it is so compelling to the people of Venezuela, then I'm sure it will bolster opposition to the changes. In any event, there's no reason for Chavez's supporters to make the position of the opposition any easier than it must be under conditions of democracy. Their rights are respected, and that is certainly enough.

[sabbat hunter]

14. chavez

controls the venezuelan congress.

Seems as if it is Chavez's way or the highway....not very democratic.

[David__77]

16. The people's representatives "control" the congress.

It's like saying that the Democrats' "control" of procedure in the house of representatives is somehow "not very democratic." As a matter of fact, I'd prefer that in the house it be "Pelosi's way or the highway." I don't want the right wing given any aid here or in Venezuela.

[Joe Chi Minh]

11. Giving leeway to natural predators is not democratic. That good enough for you?

Actually, it's supine. Or soon would be. Guaranteed.

[Andrushka]

19. Wow

OK, maybe I can help you here.

Article 344 of the 1999 constitution outlines how these procedures take place, and there are provisions for separating the individual proposed changes. Unfortunately, the whole thing is as clear as mud.

“Once approved by the National Assembly, the draft constitutional reform shall be submitted to a referendum within 30 days from its approval. The referendum shall pass on the reform as a whole, but up to one third of the same may be voted on separately, if at least one third of the National Assembly so agrees, or if in the initiative for the reform, the President* of the Republic or a number of registered voters equivalent to at least 5% of the total registered with the Civil and Electoral Registry so requests.“

Arthur Shaw on VHeadline bravely goes into the details (with his own comments mind you) of just how messy it is, but also how it should go through as an 'all or nothing' vote: http://www.vheadline.com/readnews.asp?id=75655

Hope that helps. Would have been nicer to actually do the research yourself though, as Judi Lynn asked, instead of launching into an accusatory rant at her.

[sabbat hunter]

25. what rant

I asked simply why there was so much opposition to voting on each article seperately in a referendum. Chavez has said that it is all or nothing. That to me isn't very democratic.

[paulk]

12. so you speak for all of DU now?

should we ask your permission from now on before forming an opinion?

[IsItJustMe]

18. And why should 'we' be determining how 'their' politital process should work. If you have not

noticed it, I think we have some very serious problems of our own to deal with.

[Megahurtz]

7. Get Lost, Rosales!

Viva Chavez!

[Judi Lynn]

17. If anyone has a complete list of the changes being considered for the Venezuelan constitution,

please leave a link. A lot of us have to divide our time between things like researching and trying to attend our lives, so every little bit helps.

I found a look at some of the proposed changes here:

Sunday, August 26
Proposed constitutional changes to extend democracy in Venezuela



A statement from the Australia-Venezuela Solidarity Network

August 25, 2007

When Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez presented a series of proposed constitutional changes to the Venezuelan National Assembly on August 22, thousands of enthusiastic supporters rallied outside. The changes, supported by an estimated 70% of the population according to an August 16 BBC report, will not come into effect unless they are ratified by the Venezuelan people in a referendum.

The referendum itself will be preceded by an exhaustive process of national discussion, consultation and debate, including regular discussions on TV, thousands of specially organised community gatherings, and the active soliciting of input from social and community organisations, and political parties.

However, this democratic process has not prevented the unpopular Venezuelan opposition and the international media from labelling the changes "undemocratic" and even "a constitutional coup". Most of the international media have deceptively portrayed the proposed reforms as an authoritarian measure designed to keep Chavez in power for life.

The proposed changes to the existing constitution, which was adopted by popular referendum in 1999 – a referendum also initiated by Chavez - are designed to deepen Venezuela's socialist revolution and extend the rights of its people to democratically decide the fate of their nation.
(snip/...)

http://leftclickblog.blogspot.com/2007/08/proposed-constitutional-changes-to.html

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Of course we know the power is being de-centralized, so any right-wing gibberish about Chavez trying to gobble up more power for himself is oddly improvised, and right-wing-serving. They thrive on misinformation, but everyone else needs facts.

[Matilda]

20. Pretty good rundown from Australian Green Left Weekly.

"The proposals also include measures to recognise the social missions that redistribute Venezuela’s oil wealth to the poor as official state structures; reduce the working day from eight to six hours; grant the right to social security for workers in the “informal economy”; give the government control over the state-owned Central Bank of Venezuela; further extend and protect the rights of indigenous Venezuelans; make it easier for the government to carry out nationalisations; introduce legal recognition for, and promotion of, new forms of collectively owned property as part of promoting a “social economy”; reorganise the military to transform the reserves into a “popular militia” and to codify the armed forces as an “anti-imperialist” force; and introduce a new branch of the state based on institutions of “popular power”."

(snip)

"Supporters of the proposals argue that with the latest polls showing a 70% approval rating for Chavez, opposition to allowing Chavez to stand for re-election is a tacit recognition that he would win the next election hands down. Supporters also argue that if the majority of Venezuelans want Chavez to continue as president after his current term finishes in 2012 then that is their democratic right. "

http://www.greenleft.org.au/2007/722/37477

It's a long article, but well worth reading.

[Judi Lynn]

21. Great article! It should be recommended to anyone with a need to LEARN something

about what's going on concerning the proposed reforms!

~snip~
Chavez spoke of the importance of the measures to recognise “popular power”, saying there was a need to decentralise and transfer power to the organised communities to create the best conditions for socialist democracy. “Sovereignty rests with the people”, Chavez argued, “and should be exercised directly through the organs of popular power”. Popular power would be expressed through various forms such as the communes, self-government of the towns and cities, the communal councils, workers’ councils, campesino (peasant) councils, student councils, and others councils indicated in the law.
(snip)

AN president Cilia Flores said during an August 21 parliamentary discussion on the proposals that the “same people that attacked the Bolivarian Constitution of 1999, are now using the same arguments to attack the reforms proposed by the president” — a reference to the April 2002 US-backed military coup led by the opposition, which briefly removed Chavez from power and installed Pedro Carmona, one of Venezuela’s richest men, as president.

Before a popular uprising of the poor restored Chavez, the coup junta issued a decree dissolved the constitution. The infamous “Carmona decree” was signed by more than 400 individuals, including a number of the opposition leaders — such as Rosales — who are currently opposing Chavez’s proposed reforms on the basis of defending the constitution the same constitution they dissolved.

Making opposition claims to be opposing a dictatorship even more hollow, during the junta’s brief time in power, police under the control of an opposition-aligned mayor gunned down protesters who took to the streets demanding Chavez’s return, killing dozens.
(snip)

No plans there to conceal the contents of their reform plans. This is STUPENDOUS!

After a special gathering to discuss the proposed changes, the August 21 AN meeting voted to give the proposals its initial approval. The assembly has launched a plan to facilitate a national debate and discussion on the reforms, including “parliaments of the streets” and a series of activities to ensure participation from all sectors of society, including the opposition.

The text of the proposed changes are being distributed in hard copy and CD format, house by house, as part of the AN-initiated “National Plan to Debate the Constitutional Reforms”, which aims “to activate a national political debate and the participation of the people in the process of constitutional reform aimed to strengthen revolutionary consciousness, stimulate popular mobilisation, and guarantee the sovereign expression of the majority on the occasion of the referendum”.
(snip)

The plan will conclude with the holding of a “National Assembly of Popular Power”, where elected spokespeople from state and municipal assemblies will deliver proposals and suggested changes to the AN, followed by a final extraordinary session of the AN to consider the changes. Once the reforms have been passed by the final AN meeting, they will have to be put to a national referendum within 30 days.
(snip)

NOW, we're talking!

Thanks, Matilda. :hi: :hi: :hi: This is excellent.

[Matilda]

24. You're most welcome, Judi Lynn

I find this website most helpful - of course it has a left-wing
perspective, but it presents the facts unskewed, and doesn't resort
to emotive generalisations such as we so often get from the right-
wing media shills.

[Vidar]

22. Fortunately in Venezuela, being a rich bastard doesn't mean you

automatically win, like it does in the US. Viva Chavez!

[Peace Patriot]

23. I want to know how much of our taxpayers money is being poured into

this opposition campaign and "its 130,000 local teams" by the USAID/NED, the CIA and other dirty players.

I will try to find out, but it's probably well-hidden, since it's against the law in Venezuela to take foreign money for political campaigns. Hasn't stopped them before, though. We'll see.

The fascists in Bolivia are taking a similar tack. They want to split off the rural provinces, where all the oil, gas and minerals are, to prevent the poor--who now have power in the central government, and an advocate of the poor, Evo Morales, as president--from benefiting from their country's rich natural resources.

Jerks.

But, unlike here, Venezuela has truly transparent elections, and a very politically savvy population. They know all about "divide and conquer." I trust their judgment. I don't worry about them being fooled. There is a great deal to admire in the Venezuelan citizenry. And one thing I know, after having studied events in Venezuela as closely as a non-Spanish reader can--it is laughable to believe that these people would put up with a "dictator." They threw the dictators OUT of Miraflores Palace--the rightwing "opposition" who suspended the Constitution, the National Assembly and the court system and kidnapped their elected president--and told them what they could do with their goddamned coup! Chavez owes his power to the people of Venezuela. And he knows it. So I think we should understand that these Constitutional changes are coming from THEM, from the people. They all read their Constitution down there (unlike here). They carry tiny versions of it around in their pockets. It's printed on the grocery bags! They know what they are doing. It is the height of arrogance to gainsay them--we, who have such a great democracy here.

[On the Road]

26. Unfortunately, Given the History of the Venezuelan Opposition,

the voters are not going to listen to them even when they have a legitimate point.

I would want to more about the referenda from another source, because sometimes the accounts in the press are unrecognizable. However, it would appear that the following are a bad idea:

- Rolling back property rights
- Giving the government control of the central bank
- Forcing a block vote on the entire referendum.

I don't have a particular problem with repealing term limits. But it, along with some of the other items, should be voted on separately.