Virginia Executes Man for 1997 Rape, Slaying

[Muddleoftheroad]

Warner Declines to Act In Augusta County Case

By Maria Glod
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, July 23, 2003; Page B01


Bobby Wayne Swisher was executed by injection in Virginia's death chamber last night, six years after he kidnapped and raped a young mother before slashing her throat and tossing her, still alive, into the frigid waters of the South River.

Swisher, a 27-year-old high school dropout, was pronounced dead at 9:05 p.m. at the Greensville Correctional Center in Jarratt, as members of his victim's family looked on, according to Virginia Department of Corrections spokesman Larry Traylor.

"I hope you can all find the same peace in Jesus Christ as I have," Swisher said in his final statement, according to Traylor.

Swisher's execution had been scheduled for July 1, but Gov. Mark R. Warner (D) delayed it by three weeks to give defense attorneys time to argue before the Virginia Supreme Court that the jury used a verdict form that the court previously found to be defective in a separate case. As defense attorneys and legal experts predicted, the court said it had no authority to consider the claim because Swisher already had exhausted his appeals. Warner had said he would not intervene again if the court did not resolve the issue, and he declined to get involved yesterday.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A32048-2003Jul22.html

[Muddleoftheroad]

1. Death penalty

Just following up on the many death penalty threads. What a wonderful piece of work was this guy. Boy, I am saddened.

OK, not saddened at all actually.

[ShaneGR]

2. Not exactly the best argument against the death penalty

He got off easy with lethal injection.

[DUreader]

3. What a joke. You must think anti-war people love Saddam too. (Reply Error)

pathetic false argument

on edit this was meant to reply to muddler

[Muddleoftheroad]

4. No

But this is what you are defending. Defending that this creature had a right to continue to live, to continue to harm others in prison and maybe, eventually, out of it.

Virginia, my current home, saved us all a lot of potential pain by doing the right thing here.

[DUreader]

6. More bullshit arguments muddling the waters, I don't want Govt. killing.

[Muddleoftheroad]

7. Sure

Just let this immoral scumbag keep killing -- in or out of prison.

[DUreader]

8. You got nothing

[Muddleoftheroad]

9. Thorough

What a thorough, detailed rejoinder.

[DUreader]

11. You've impeached yourself, here for all to read

You've still got nothing

[Muddleoftheroad]

12. You are quite funny

Perhaps all that humor will lead to a point.

[DUreader]

13. Squirm all you want, your technique is transparent, you blew it again

Nobody believes your bogus crap around here

[Muddleoftheroad]

14. LOL

You have yet to make a point other than to attack me. Very impotent debating technique.

[diamond14]

19. you are right....there's transparency to the hate shown...KILLING

is wrong...and it saddens me that there are DU posters who encourage KILLING and actually get thrilled by KILLING...

and you are absolutely right, I think everyone has become very aware of the 'bogus crap'....it's very pathetic, but you shouldn't expect a lot out of those who encourage KILLING and are thrilled with the KILL...such lack of conscience shows that the ability to become a hitler or a pinochet or a saddam, if given power...lucky for us, no power has been given...

[Superfly]

20. What ARE you talking about?

I'm sorry, but you're going to have to run that one by me again.

[Muddleoftheroad]

29. Hate

I don't hate groups, but I hate those who do harm to the innocent. I've lived around too many of them in my life -- gangbangers mostly. Horrible, malevolent souls who take and take pleasure in harming others. No organized society has a place for them.

[joshcryer]

36. What about all the harm that the war on drug has caused?

To arguably innocent people not participating in any violent or destructive behavior?

For some reason I figure you're behind it.

[Muddleoftheroad]

49. Then you don't follow my posts

I am MASSIVELY against the waste of the drug war. Sure, lock up the dealers, but put the rest of the drug criminals (90+%) in mandatory drug treatment. Then work to fix the cities and increase opportunity to end the cycle of failure and depression.

[joshcryer]

61. Um, they do "lock up the 'dealers.'"

The war on drugs just defines 'dealers' widely. Anyone with 'more than so much' pot or whatever gets taken down. 'Drug rehab' is already mandatory, in that if you don't chose it, you get an undeserving sentence (and you'll be stopping the drugs anyway, just without the weening). I suspect you wouldn't want redefine what the definitions for drug dealers are, because there are too many 'dealers' caught with drugs on them and they're not in the process of actually 'dealing' (they're currying).

The war on drugs needs to disappear. If people want to fucking deal, make it legal and force them to take a license and deal ammounts that are deemed 'safe' (ie, no OD unless you misuse it) by studies.

And totally LEGALIZE POT, for starters. It's no more dangerous than alcohol.

[morstyranni]

15. Screw this scumbag - i'm with thorough.

"I don't want gov't killing" - so you want what? crazy rapist killing?

So long, sucker, i'm with you, throrough. And in this most people are too, including the victim's family. Or do the victims not count here.

To quote Jane's addiction "Some people should die, that's just unconcious knowledge, Baby!"

[Sirius_on]

59. I dont want rapists alive

[diamond14]

16. many of us in Virginia believe that KILLING people does nothing

to show others that KILLING is wrong....it would have been cheaper to leave the guy in prison for life, than to KILL him.


it is a reprehensible artifact from the old slave south...

although I now live in Virginia, and have worked hard to stop the killing (Virginia is second behind Texas for killing)...I was born in Michigan, where there NEVER has been a death penalty...

The main difference is that there are people in Michigan who believe that "Thou shall NOT kill" should be obeyed.

But, Virginia remains a racist state, encourages killing while showing off their "Christian" values at their segregated churches on Sunday...

Virginia has killed children, people with very low IQ's... people who are innocent have recently been freed from Virginia death row due to the hard work of Catholics...and the state-sponsored KILLING costs too much money....

(link)

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?did=108&scid=7#financial%20facts

-snips-

Over two-thirds of the states and the federal government have installed an exorbitantly expensive system of capital punishment which has been a failure by any measure of effectiveness. Literally hundreds of millions of dollars have already been spent on a response to crime which is calculated to be carried out on a few people each year and which has done nothing to stem the rise in violent crime.

[Superfly]

18. Not THIS Virginian...I support the death penalty

I don't care what it's deterrent value is, having the death penalty means I don't have to share the same planet as these rapist, murdering shits.

It's not state sponsored murder. It's a state sponsored recycling program.

And, when the DC sniper trial adjourns here in Virginia Beach, I hope they kill those 2 shits over and over again.

B

[diamond14]

23. you seem so proud to KILL a child, and you even convict him

before a trial...haven't you heard of the American value:

"innocent until proven guilty"

or the commandment:

"thou shall NOT kill"

or that Jesus forgave those who were executing him, and a thief and a prostitute and other criminals...

are you just one of those "Christian" southerners ? the ones who believe that KILLING shows people that KILLING is wrong ??? and are THRILLED WITH THE KILL !!!

[Superfly]

24. OK, you are all over the place

1) If either one or both of the sniper suspects is found guilty, then I support executing both of them. The second somebody pulls a trigger, beats somebody to death, whatever, that person is NO LONGER A CHILD.

2) Don't preach bible shit to me. I am very secure in my morality and in this world, execution is a) Legal b) Just and c) The responsible thing to do.

3) I am not thrilled with the kill as you keep on trying to point out. But, I will say that I will be much happier when convicted murderers and rapists no longer share this earth with me.

4) I am a Christian. And I am a Southerner. Got a problem with that?

B

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Muddleoftheroad]

30. D.C.

Funny, handguns are illegal and there is no death penalty in D.C. Yet, thugs have more firepower than a small army and they kill with abandon. Perhaps there is a reason why crime is so rampant in our nation's capital.

[Haole]

31. I'm curious.....

When did VA kill a child?

[diamond14]

32. Virginia KILLED Dwight Wright in 1998, Steve Roach in 2000 and

Christopher Thomas in 2000. All were children at the time of their crimes. Virginia takes the record for the execution of 16 year old Percy Ellis (see list below).....

http://www.law.onu.edu/faculty/streib/juvdeath.htm

yes, Virginia KILLS, outranking even Texas in total KILLINGs of our own citizens...over 1300 total KILLINGS, enough to make bush* proud...

____________________

"Evidence of innocence is irrelevant!"

--Mary Sue Terry, former Attorney General of Virginia (replying to an appeal to introduce new evidence from a prisoner sentenced to death)

_______________________


History of the death penalty in Virginia:

-Virginia allows the executions of the mentally retarded, the severly brain damaged and the mentally ill. At least 7 such mentally handicapped prisoners have been executed in Virginia.

-Virginia introduced the death penalty to the "New World" by hanging George Kendall in the early 1600's

-Virginia has carried out over 1,300 executions in its history, more than any other state.

-Virginia has executed more women and the youngest children of any state in the nation.

-Between October of 1908 and March of 1962, Virginia used the electric chair to execute 236 people. 201 of those were black males, 34 were white males; one, Virginia Christian, was a 17-year-old black female. During that period, the youngest, Percy Ellis, was executed at the age of 16.

-In February of 1951, Virginia executed 8 men in a 72-hour period. All 8 men were black and 7 were executed for the rape of one white woman. These seven were known as the Martinsville Seven.

-Virginia's single year record for executions is 17 in 1909.

http://www.vadp.org/

[Haole]

34. hmmmm...seems like maybe you should have mentioned

the fact that VA didn't kill children.......but the condemned was less than 18 at the time of the crime. Pretty big difference, you're not practicing a little "intellectual dishonesty" are ya?

[joshcryer]

38. If Muddle's 'streamlined' death row existed...

...they would have been children. What's the fucking difference? Intellectual dishonesty is pretending like the person who commited the crime in their childhood is somehow magically 'more responsible' after they've reached adulthood.

[Haole]

39. I don't recall.....

ever "pretending like the person who commited the crime in their childhood is somehow magically 'more responsible' after they've reached adulthood"

but certainly you must agree the statement that "VA is killing children" is misleading at best.

[joshcryer]

63. Of course you are.

You're suggesting as though it's no different to kill an adult who commited a crime as an adult than it is to kill an adult who commited a crime as a teenager. It is different. A childs responsiblities are less than that of adults, and thus, the consequences ought to be less. Yet you're clearing taking the position that a child is no different.

[Haole]

77. I've clearly not stated my opinion on the topic.......

You can assume all you want, and you could be assuming correctly.

Now, back to the topic....

The statement "VA is killing children" is blatantly false. If you are going to use propaganda, at least make it good. This is so easily seen thorugh, it's shameful.

[diamond14]

40. Percy Ellis was 16 years old at the time Virginia KILLED him...

you must be another of those "southern Christians" who enjoy KILLING children...or do you simply like to keep the children incarcerated until they become adults, and THEN execute them...to prevent the suggestion that Virginia KILLS children, in violation of International Laws...you need to keep up that Sunday church "morality" that plays so well here in Virginia, but many of us see as the sham that it is...

how about this young black man, operating with the mental age of 8 years old:

Morris Mason, a young, black man from the Eastern Shore with a lifelong history of paranoid schizophrenia and a mental age of 8, was the first severely mentally handicapped prisoner executed by Virginia post Furman . Morris was killed on June 25, 1985. The most recent execution of a mentally retarded prisoner was that of Walter Correll, Jr. on Jan. 4, 1996.

--------------------

http://www.infozine.com/news/stories/op/storiesView/sid/832/

Amnesty Executive Director William Schulz said it is illogical of the United States to accept that juveniles are as capable as adults in committing premeditated murder, but not mature enough to vote, serve on a jury or drink alcohol.

"When it comes to crime and punishment, we conveniently throw overboard everything we know and believe about adolescents in the rush for retribution," Schulz said.

[Haole]

41. I'm still waiting.....

Person less than 18, that was executed in VA??


BTW....I'm not sure when Agnostics started a Sunday church here in VA. Do you know what it's called??

[diamond14]

42. so, you are a "Christian" and a "southerner" with the strong

belief that "I will be much happier" when the CHILD sniper is executed...

you even rave that the CHILD is "NO LONGER A CHILD", so you can feel comfortable in executing that child....

there are twelve states and the District of Columbia that do not allow the KILLING of their citizens....


http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?did=121&scid=11

[Superfly]

45. OK....

these 2 shits drove around DC, sat and waited at schools, gas stations, parks, places where we feel safe. They went to those places with the express intention of shooting and killing somebody each and every time.

This CHILD, as you put it, had to consciously think to pick out a target, aim a weapon at him/her, and pull the trigger. That is first degree murder. And the punishment for first degree murder in Virginia, besides life incarceration, is death by lethal injection.

This CHILD preyed upon millions of people. People were afraid to fill their gas tanks. People were afraid to bring their non-murdering CHILDREN to school. All because this CHILD, as you put it, want to feel the thrill of murdering innocents.

This person is not a child. Any child who consciously makes a concerted effort to commit murder is worthy of the death penalty.

There are 12 states and the District of Columbia who would rather take your tax dollars and lock a murderer in a cage for the rest of his or her life. You commit murder, your life is forfeit...."CHILD" or not.

And this "CHILD" is not a sniper. He's a murderer.

Brian

[diamond14]

51. there hasn't even been a trial yet...and you want to KILL a CHILD

no trial, this CHILD is already guilty in YOUR opinion, and deserves to be KILLED...

guess you don't believe in "innocent until proven guilty"

as you have noted, you are a "southerner" and a "Christian"

it shows...

[Superfly]

52. I'll tell you what

if this "CHILD" is proven innocent, I'll retract every single comment I made. I'll even take up the fight against the death penalty, fighting side by side with you.

But, somehow, I don't thaink that's going to happen.

And quit calling him a CHILD. He's a murdering thug.

[demdave]

22. I find it sad that you would have monetary concerns.

Most people decide this question on moral or personal opinion grounds, you seem to give disturbing weight to how much it costs. I guess if it was cheaper it would sway your opinion?

"it would have been cheaper to leave the guy in prison for life"

"the state-sponsored KILLING costs too much money...."


"exorbitantly expensive system of capital punishment"

"Literally hundreds of millions of dollar"

I also noticed your backhanded insult to Christians, until you just happened to mention it was Catholics that did the hard work to help the innocent.

You are all over the road, perhaps you need a designated typer.:)

[diamond14]

25. you seem to only care about REVENGE, paid for with my taxes...

rather than argue on substance (how much it costs, or whether it is more or less), you pull the typical reTHUGlican argument:

change the subject and lead people into a mush of garbage...hey, the White House and shrub desperately need people like you right now...

you could spin for them...attack the messanger, change the subject, evade the issue entirely, insult everybody, spew hate as policy....seeking revenge is SO much more important now, isn't it ????

[Freddie Stubbs]

43. But appernently many in Virginia favor the Death penalty

As it has not been removed from the books. Governor Warner is carrying out the will of the people. Isn't that what Democracy is all about?

[diamond14]

47. some do ENJOY the KILLING, some don't (link 58% don't)

What do Virginians say about a moratorium on the death penalty?

In a poll conducted in October 2000 by the Richmond Times-Dispatch and WSLS-TV, Roanoke, 58% of 735 registered Virginian voters favored stopping executions until issues surrounding the death penalty can be resolved. (Richmond Times- Dispatch, Nov. 6, 2000)

http://www.vadp.org/moratorium.htm

[Superfly]

48. Wow!! 735 respondents

out of millions. Yes, that's an accurate cross-section of the true beliefs of Virginians.

[Haole]

50. and yet....

http://www.vadp.org/poll.htm

according to your own source here, in 2001 "support for the death penalty declined to 69.5%"

the numbers don't quite match up do they??

[Freddie Stubbs]

53. I suppose if Virginains feel so strongly about it

they will vote the pro-death panalty politicans out of office. I wouldn;t hold my breath if I were you.

[5thGenDemocrat]

66. Small point of order about Michigan

The death penalty was abolished in 1847 -- ten years after Michigan became a state. Still, Michigan was the first government in the English-speaking world to abolish it.
John
Also, the feds executed one Tony Chebatoris at the Milan Federal Penitentiary after he killed a guy during a bank robbery in Midland c.1938 -- despite the pleading of Governor Frank Murphy to either spare the guy's life or, at least, execute somewhere outside the boundaries of our fair state. But you know how state/Federal relations work. They hung him anyhow.

[rman]

70. potential pain

there's still a lot of killing to do if you want to eliminate all potential pain.

besides, "sadness" or lack thereoff is hardly the point of the death penalty.

[Michael Daniels]

5. A flaming as*hole to the last breath

"I hope you can all find the same peace in Jesus Christ as I have"

Self righteous bastard. You have to wonder if the murdering slimeball gave his victim one last chance to find the same peace before slicing her throat.

People like this make me glad I gave up my unconditional objection to the death penalty.

[joshcryer]

33. A whole lot of death rowers 'make their peace with God.'

So I don't know what you're bitching about. Tax-payer money probably paid for the minister to 'get him saved.'

[muchacho]

10. State murder

It's a blight and undermines our moral relevance in the world,

[Blecht]

17. Support for the death penalty in this country ...

... is part of what made PNAC and G. W. Bush possible.

If you view the government killing its own citizens as acceptable, then it's a small jump to invade another country and start killing people there. All the jubilation in the deaths of this rapist or of the Hussein boys is nothing short of ghoulish and sick.

Whenever I see strong support for the death penalty coming from otherwise responsible people, I realize that I do not belong in this country.

[underpants]

21. You can see the florist's shop strip mall from my mother's house

Very small community and needless to say it scared the s**t out of everyone around there. I am still against the death penalty.

[diamond14]

35. stand by your values, underpants...especially in these dire

times for OUR Nation...it is always wrong to KILL, in every culture, for all times...it's really a simple timeless statement of civil societies...

Thou shall NOT kill

[joshcryer]

37. Except in defense.

I'm just saying that because I know some asshole will respond to you and conflate your position or whatever... I know what you're saying. I'm not personally 'against the death penality' (if something happened to one of my loved ones and I was allowed to be face to face with their murderer I can't guarantee his safety, etc), but when it comes to tax-payer, government sanctioned, death-penality, I desire it to be as accurate as possible; that costs money, and I believe that's how it should be. So obviously the death penality isn't preferrable from the tax-payer perspective. And that's how I look at it.

[Set]

44. SO, a police officer...

who shoots somebody getting ready to shoot the officer or somebody else is morally wrong?

I'm not a big fan of the death penalty, but DO support acts of immediate self-defense and the defense of others, even if it results in a killing. Your blanket statement that it is always wrong to kill is very strong, and IMHO, not terribly well thought out.

I also find it interesting that you'd apply a religious credo (one of the 10 Commandments) to government actions. What about people who don't share your religious views? Why should they be forced by law to live by YOUR religion??? You're not "Pro-Life" by any chance, are you?

[underpants]

46. I believe British common law is the foundation for American common law

and both are based on the Ten Commandments (does not apply in Louisiana which is based on the Napoleanic Code).

Uh-oh someone took a business law class.

Welcome to DU :hi:

[Set]

54. Yup...but "based upon" doesn't mean "identical"...

Take, for example, penalties. Under the original common law, all felonies (there were a lot fewer then, 7 total, IIRC) had one punishment....death.

BTW, if they tried to codify the 10 commandments, care to guess what the result would be on appeal? ;-)

[joshcryer]

62. I knew someone would say that.

See my post above yours. I doubt that's his position at all. A lot of people like to make this shit up though.

[JNelson6563]

55. we don't have the death penalty in Michigan.

If we would quit screwing up our kids there'd be a lot less reason to be having discussions on the death penalty. Nobody was born a horrible monster.

Julie

[Muddleoftheroad]

56. Nurture or nature

Actually, I'm not sure if anyone knows whether that is true or not.

[diamond14]

58. those who insist on KILLING others lead their children to violence

those who revel in KILLING others, insist on KILLING children, and claim the right to KILL, even before a trial, are just showing their children that violence is an accepted solution....

[Haole]

78. who's killing children??

±

[rman]

71. so, screwing up kids has no effect on the kids?

upbringing does not matter?

you'r "not sure"?

[diamond14]

57. born and went to college in Michigan, proud that there is no

death penalty there...and working now in my adopted state of Virginia to STOP THE KILLING, here....

It seems to all come from that old time southern racist religious "morality" that continues to this day in Virginia...

also, congraduations on winning the Affirmative Action case in the Supreme Court...I knew it would take a state from north of the Mason-Dixon line to stand up to bush* and his racist tactics...cheers to Michigan...good people stood up and cheered as I wore my Wolverine shirt in Virginia, but mean nasty racists spewed foul hate that was very disturbing to hear...

[Sirius_on]

60. I am glad you admit reality

Horrible Monsters deserve no pity.

[Aaron]

64. Article makes no mention of restitution being made

Anyone know if there was?

[private_ryan]

65. no tears shed for this one

"he kidnapped and raped a young mother before slashing her throat and tossing her, still alive, into the frigid waters of the South River"

sorry to say but the death penalty sometimes is warranted especially if her family asks for it. My biggest thing on the death penalty is getting the right guy....

[evildoer]

67. If you oppose the death penalty…

If you oppose the death penalty…
How about turning your residence into a halfway house and invite all the rapists, molesters, and killers in to meet your family. The guy would have never made it to court if he did that to a member of my family. He is NOT human, not deserving of humanity. As for the minors, they are only considered minors by law. If you are Christian, you should know that one becomes a man at thirteen. We are just a soft, sloppy society these days… People have no respect.

[Aaron]

68. Why should DP opponents have those people in their homes? (n/t)

[joshcryer]

69. Being opposed to the death penality...

...isn't the same as being opposed to any penalities at all.

[rman]

72. why invite those criminals to your home?

is it a choice between death penalty and having them over for diner?

no it is not.

your argument is a logical falacy: false dilemma.

And who the heck are you that you judge anyones' humanity?
Africans and native Americans were once considered not to be human, as an excuse to abuse them.

[ze_dscherman]

73. Stop freeping around

This guy is/was still a member of the human race, as are those in high places responsible for the cruel death of thousands.

In almost any other society except the most barbarious ones executing minors is frowned upon. In the past ten years, minors were executed in Pakistan, Nigeria, Saudi Arabia, Yemen and in Kongo. Yemen and Pakistan since then have abolished death penalty for minors.

Please, tell where the bible states that one becomes an adult at thirteen and how you come to the conclusion that someone who is not considered mature enough to vote, sign contracts, or even drink alcohol is deemed mature enough to be executed.

And where do you read here that there should be no punishment/protection to a society from criminals?

If you can't answer these questions, SHUT UP!

[arwalden]

74. In Other Words... He Only Got FIVE YEARS Punishment...

He got off light. Others have spent FAR MORE YEARS IN PRISON for much less serious offenses.

This is just wrong, wrong, wrong.

-- Allen

[joshcryer]

75. Hehe, I like that POV. Good point.

And the scary part is that if we were to believe the Redemptionists, the guy got to go to heaven! So 5 years punishment and wonderful everlasting life in heaven! Way to go, guy.

[Muddleoftheroad]

76. NO

It's not about vengeance, it's about protecting the rest of society from this monster. I don't care if he got a week and a half and then got executed -- as long as due process was followed.

This guy was horrific and the world is better off with him long gone.